| Author |
Message |
   
Justsayno
Member
Post Number: 521
Registered: 10-2009
| | Posted on Thursday, March 28, 2013 - 08:19 am: | 
|
Hi Matt, back in the '50s Dr. Abram Hoffer was able to cure schizophrenia in a weekend using niacin (vitamin B3). It is also coming to the forefront (finally) that lack of Vitamin D is a cause of depression. In Canada by the end of winter people are so damn crabby because vitamin D is made in the body from sunshine and we don't have enough sunshine here to last us all year. It's important to take multivitamins because our food no longer has all the nutrients we need. If we want to know what's going on with humans, we only have to look at animal health and see what they are supplying for supplements, as chances are we are lacking the same nutrients. Speaking of a veterinarian section...has anyone noticed the skin problems both animals and humans are currently going through?
Good, better, best. May you never rest, until your good is better, and your better best.
|
Indi
Moderator
Post Number: 715
Registered: 06-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, March 28, 2013 - 10:26 pm: |
|
Please keep this discussion in line with topics to do with FIGU material.
As Justsayno has mentioned, yes, there have been some positive responses to certain diagnosed mental disorders using therapeutic doses of nutritional supplementation, but this is not mentioned in the FIGU material, and so best to discuss only what is presented in the FIGU material for the varying states as mentioned by Matt.
This is not to say that there is no value in other treatments, but just that it is not in the scope of this forum to focus on them.
Thank you
Salome
Robyn
Denken Sie für sich selbst!
|
Newinitiation
Member
Post Number: 626
Registered: 07-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, March 28, 2013 - 09:44 pm: |
|
Hi Ferbon
For the truth as far as I have come to know despite it being very little through the teachings taught by the Plejarens and Billy, since we are essentially talking about ideas, ideas that everything consists of and is the most important because everything that exists in our universe and beyond is thought and idea, I wanted to reconcile the spiritual teachings which is itself in essence idea and thought with psychological problems and illnesses which is itself also ideas and thought.
The inevitable conclusion that I can only arrive from this fact is that cures for psychological illnesses and disorders must start with thinking and thoughts.
But one arrives at a dilemma because part of the piece of the puzzle happens to be feelings that keeps propping up whenever any subject is brought up.
For instance with no insult intended, during our discussion and out of the blue I said to you "you are an immature little imbecile who doesn't know what he is talking about let alone what he is doing but pretend to knows something to impress other forum members to alleviate your chronic inferiority complex", I am certain that there must arise certain negative 'feelings' the instance you read these words even if no insult was intended, certain pride had been diminished therefore the natural reaction is to either go on the defensive by reacting in kind or do some face saving by saying that whatever I say about you doesn't mean anything to you.
Either way this is not a crass mind game I was playing but to bring to light the importance of how much feelings play a role in human being's life it matters little whether its negative or positive in kind feeling do play a central role and cannot be ignored.
So where it concerns those who suffer from psychological disorders and illnesses negative feelings happen to dominate their life with ideas and thoughts they harbour inside their minds that exacerbate the problem by creating more of it.
So if I could call it that 'Cure by Creational Spiritual Thoughts' there must be a way of method specifically catered to those who suffer from psychological illnesses with a train of certain Creational spiritual thoughts that is easy for a chaotic mindset suffering from psychological disorders to implement and to understand so that they can create the kind of positive neutral thoughts which creates the corresponding feelings that overtime replace and discard the illogical and irrational thinking and resultant feeling arising out of them which no longer confines them to a life of misery, arrested development, unfreedom and suffering.
I think this is something worth pursuing
What do you think Ferbon?
cheers
matt |
Newinitiation
Member
Post Number: 627
Registered: 07-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, March 28, 2013 - 09:01 pm: |
|
Hi Ramirez
Gee Ramirez, Come to think of it religious delusion may also be classified as psychological illness or rather be the cause of psychological disease.
It does put into perspective just how many people around the world are either insane, psychologically damaged, crazy, schizophrenic, mad, abnormal, out of mind, and nuts (no puns intended) if we take religious influence into consideration but ultimately I think that myself included everyone except for maybe very few people on earth are all compromised one way or the other.
I don't think you can have normality living in the current world that we do.
Speaking of thinking and thoughts I wanted to concentrate specifically on the feeling aspect of psychological illness and how Creational spiritual teachings can help alleviate the symptoms, maybe cure it or at the very least enable a person to manage their everyday life with some semblance of normality who specifically suffers from psychological disorders or rather have sustained damage to their psyche, whether it's due to organic in origin, religion or for that matter from whole host of other reasons.
Since everything originates from thought, is the idea and can only be known through thought or thinking, the human being must navigate this terrain that we call reality with perception, thinking, being aware of, have cognition for, knowledge, recognise, memorise, learn, imagine, identify, experience and most important of all feel.
The container or prism in our heads we call consciousness that everything passes through or must so during the human beings existence, then thoughts and the process of thinking is the vehicle for us to make happen everything that happens in our lifetime therefore it is inescapable fact that as it is said, we can either make hell for ourselves or alternatively heaven, this means that feelings comes into it in every aspect of our lives and being therefore this crucial aspect of existence as a human being cannot be ignored.
Since human beings are emotional creatures governed in many instances by feelings and emotions more often than we would like to admit, people who suffer from psychological disorders must be overwhelmed by feeling related forces within themselves that oppress, suppress, repress, depress, compress, force, compel and gnaw at them whether in the form of heightened guilt, remorse, resentment, anger, hatred, jealousy, fear, insecurity, doubts, discontentment, emptiness, meaninglessness, confusion and disorientation.
So in having further discussion and discourse on this subject, I hope to unravel and get at the truth of this matter as the onion is peeled one layer at a time as I do feel that the subject of 'feelings' deserves much more attention and is the central force or rather the important piece of the bigger picture that ultimately is the 'impulse' that created this world as Semjase talked about.
regards
matt Lee |
Ferbon
Member
Post Number: 255
Registered: 05-2012
| | Posted on Friday, March 29, 2013 - 02:39 am: |
|
Newinitiation
"...since we are essentially talking about ideas, ideas that everything consists of and is the most important because everything that exists in our universe and beyond is thought and idea, I wanted to reconcile the spiritual teachings which is itself in essence idea and thought with psychological problems and illnesses which is itself also ideas and thought..."
Here's fundamental problem. (I don't want to violate natural laws by disclosing it to you). You can solve it yourself if you want in very short time.
"...cures for psychological illnesses and disorders must start with thinking and thoughts... "
They should be own/self generated/realized thoughts of a "sick" person.
Salome |
Michael_horn
Member
Post Number: 662
Registered: 07-2009
| | Posted on Friday, March 29, 2013 - 10:05 am: |
|
> Matt et al,
A newly translated book, Might of thoughts, by Billy will address a lot of what you are discussing here…and more.
Also, I have a DVD of my Standing in Spirit workshop that specifically addresses the internal process of thoughts and feelings, as well as how and where in the body they may manifest, be dispersed, etc. |
Newinitiation
Member
Post Number: 628
Registered: 07-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, March 28, 2013 - 10:41 pm: |
|
Hi Robjn how have you been
I just wanted to extend a greeting to you after some lengthy absence from this forum and to congratulate you on the founding of FIGU Australia.
Wish you, your family and everyone all the best
As always I am on the sideline but if circumstances permit I would like to assist when and where I can.
Sorry I no longer have your email and in a rush to write this, I didn't attempt to search for it on this forum.
So I am off topic.
Anyway good to feel your presence again.
kind regards
Matt Lee |
Newinitiation
Member
Post Number: 629
Registered: 07-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2013 - 12:04 am: |
|
Hi Ferbon
In a chaotic world that we are currently living where it can be cold and unforgiving at times without much empathy and genuine care for those who suffer from psychological disorders, the negative stigma and stereotyping of people who suffer from some type of mental illness especially depression adds extra burden on those who end up resorting to suicide as the final solution to their suffering.
By thinking about and exploring this subject with the intention of learning through such a forum as this and sharing ideas on how Creational spiritual teachings and truth can help those who are suffering from psychological disorders is I think a well founded endeavour.
You cannot find anywhere in the scientific, professional, academic and corporate literature that deals with Creational spiritual truths and psychological disorders but then again how could it be otherwise.
We are breaking new grounds here.
It is my feeling that because the greater masses of earth people are ignorant of the Creational spiritual truths and this is definitely becoming a cliche, psychological problems which should not under normal circumstances arise indeed does although there are of course multitude of causes for psychological illness and disorders.
So instead of leaving it up to those people with psychological disabilities to figure it out for themselves and feel justified in our stance based on Billy's words that everyone should take responsibilities for themselves, their thoughts, feelings and actions which is difficult for those who aren't self sufficient to do so it would be more appropriate to http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/Doing_Something_for_the_Neighbour
Of course we don't want to face the danger of doing more harm than good even with the best of intentions by playing amateur psychologist and pretending to have the ready made solution for those who are suffering from psychological disorders but by creating a dialogue where people may chance upon it that they may get some useful help out of would be good as a byproduct.
As Billy said consult a health professional for those asking about mental illness.
This doesn't mean that we can't explore this topic on this forum or to talk about it.
After all, all the solutions to mankind's problems are all contained in the Creational spiritual teachings including solutions for psychological disorders but speaking for myself I tend to think that since my capacities for understanding the teachings is limited, through discourse I may enhance my learning by myself being compelled to think more deeply about the issues but on the other hand it may also help people to read about the words of thought coming from the perspective of someone who is at their same basic level.
Anyway getting back on topic since certain spiritual thinking, thoughts and ideas generate specific impulses, values, vibrations and feelings resulting in it's equivalent experience, effect, consequences and state of consciousness in people's world of thoughts and world of feelings it would be helpful to devise a specific train of thought words which generates the maximum impulses, frequencies, vibrations and feelings that if repeated overtime much like the 12 point prayer, may neutralize the feelings generated by illogical and irrational thinking that people with psychological disorders harbour within themselves which is at the heart of their mental illness.
Irrational thinking and thoughts generate irrational and illogical negative feelings, ideas, thoughts, experiences and perception therefore it would be fantastic if we can generate a Creational spiritual thought formula which could shatter the vicious cycle that people fall into, help them to build enough will power to be able to concentrate and focus on the here and now in the present, where the future meets the past and be able to see reality for what it actually is rather than what they have been conditioned to think.
what do you think?
regards
Matt Lee |
Newinitiation
Member
Post Number: 630
Registered: 07-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, March 30, 2013 - 10:46 pm: |
|
Hi Michael
Thanks for the tip Michael
I will endeavour to get a hold of the materials that you have recommended.
cheers
Matt |
Indi
Moderator
Post Number: 718
Registered: 06-2006
| | Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2013 - 03:13 am: |
|
Hi Matt
Nice to see you back here. You could contact our Landesgruppe via our website if you want to find out about our activities.
au.figu.org
Glad you knew you were off topic so I won't have to point that out :-)
Salome
Robyn
Denken Sie für sich selbst!
|
Ferbon
Member
Post Number: 257
Registered: 05-2012
| | Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2013 - 06:48 am: |
|
Newinitiation
utter rubbish
Degenerated existence ( "de - generic" as in separated from origin/generation) is the only reason existence can function and better itself. Affecting thinking processes of others is form of tyranny. Make sure patients are well and have means to live - that's all you have to do. Leave their thinking alone unless they ask you for advice.
Salome |
Redbeard
Member
Post Number: 257
Registered: 04-2006
| | Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2013 - 07:35 am: |
|
Hi Matt,
I liked your post, as I recall there was mention of Billy helping people that came to him that needed help with something of this, the mental problem. Not sure where it is in the mass of teachings or stories and contact info..
I always surprised at the frequent use of the word "schizophrenia" in the Meier material referring to those that are religious or just thinking that something is true either about themselves or someone/something else. This is a real problem as it relates to someone thinking and/or believing that something is true when it is not....
There must be a process of decay or degradation, so to speak, in one's ability to perceive truth and reality if said person thinks something is true, which of course is not true, for an extended period of time, and perhaps even several life times. Sort of like metal being exposed to salt or other corrosives for a while and eventually it becomes near useless and very difficult to repair.
I lends to a bit, if not a lot of caution in this regard as we process things around us and seek to prove out the real from Imaginary! This is certainly and interesting idea or topic to discuss on Easter Sunday.... |
Newinitiation
Member
Post Number: 631
Registered: 07-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2013 - 11:05 pm: |
|
Hi Redbeard
Thank you for taking an interest on this vital topic Redbeard.
As the saying goes 'what a man thinks he becomes', 'I think, therefore I am' etc
Lately for some reason I had this urge to bring this topic to light as I also have a vested interest in this.
As far as I am aware the UN, secret service, US government, Vatican, MUFON, Ufologists of all shades and colours, professionals, charlatans, frauds, general public, and many others are keeping a tab on Billy and I would suspect they are also keeping a tab on this forum too.
This forum is therefore an incredible tool to harness the power of suggestion if used to positive ends could influence by subtlety people out there who could help others.
The dire need for helping people with psychological disorders is more important than ever before.
I think that this forum thread Thinking and Thoughts is the ideal place to do it as everything revolves around thinking and thoughts.
What better tool than through Creational spiritual teachings.
With the ultimate truth and through the power of truth (monstrous power of thoughts) there must be a way to facilitate healing even just for the rest of the public who aren't necessarily suffering from mental disorders and psychological illnesses.
Suffering and pain is everywhere and people make it so and because they don't know any better they hurt others around them which perpetuates the vicious cycle of victims creating more victims.
As the full circle closes on itself as with many other things in our human life as well as all events, history, circumstances and situations everything ends up coming back to thoughts and thinking.
I can't stress the feeling aspect to thinking either as they are inextricable intertwined and connected with one another.
I therefore would like to receive more feedback in general on how other forum members think about this topic of Creational spiritual thinking and psychological disorders and what their unique perspectives are on this matter.
Redbeard I have a question, you as a long time member of this forum, what patterns repeat itself over and over again with the various forum posts where it concerns the human psychology?
Thanks
Matt Lee |
Newinitiation
Member
Post Number: 632
Registered: 07-2005
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2013 - 12:21 am: |
|
Hi Ferbon
You said "Degenerated existence ( "de - generic" as in separated from origin/generation) is the only reason existence can function and better itself" unquote
One of the seven fold laws state that 1) To become and Wither away, in another words becoming and passing.
Ausartung as opposed to degeneracy
by Mariann Uehlinger Mondria (Switzerland), published in the FIGU Bulletin No. 73, March 2011
Translated: May 2011 by Vivienne Legg, Dyson Devine, (Australia). Assisted by Mariann Uehlinger Mondria (Switzerland)
Right from the start, Billy has not liked the translation of ¡°Ausartung¡±; namely, ¡±degeneration¡° or ¡±degeneracy¡°. However, for a long time, we could simply not find anything more sensible. When ¡°Ausartung¡± is spoken of in ¡±Kelch der Wahrheit¡± ("Goblet of Truth"), no degeneration, that is to say, no disintegration of the genes, is meant. It is rather the human being¡¯s good nature badly falling away, that is to say, falling out of control. So, for ¡°Ausartung¡±, we also decided to leave the German word in place in the English, and to provide a corresponding explanation.
On the 27th of August 2010, Billy, via Ptaah, received the following description for ¡±Ausartung¡° from the Plejaren linguists, in the English language.
Ausartung = a very bad get-out of the control of the good human nature
Translated back into German that means something along the lines of:
Ausartung = ein sehr schlechtes Ausgehen von der Kontrolle von der guten Natur des Menschen
Harbouring degenerate thinking will not improve a persons well being nor is the whole purpose of Creational spiritual thinking geared towards degenerate thinking. When you are degenerating, you aren't exactly going forward are you.
Degenerate (negative) thinking and positive degenerate thinking is the opposite side of the same coin as far as I have come to understand the teachings therefore positive neutral thinking must be strive for, learned and applied.
As the capacities for intellectual thinking in most instances is not necessarily diminished in people with psychological disorders they are always free to exercise their freewill and take from whatever words are on these numerous posts and do with it as they please.
Words alone or rather pixels in computer monitors representing words don't jump at people with force and demand recognition.
Having said that and in recognising that there are now more audience, I assume, on this English forum than we care to imagine, providing a framework for
people to understand Creational spiritual thinking and in conformance with the spirit of the teachings to be more specific from the mountains of materials to make it more understandable is I think not a bad idea especially where it concerns the teachings, the thinking and thoughts from the teachings in reference to psychological disorders and mental illnesses.
It is worth pursuing I think.
What about you.
cheers
matt |
Newinitiation
Member
Post Number: 633
Registered: 07-2005
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2013 - 12:26 am: |
|
Hi Redbeard
Gosh where is my sense of humour
I am behind the eight ball today
Your Easter Sunday joke just flew me by
Ha Ha good one red beard that was Good
Thinking about thinking, what about the Easter Bunny ;-)
cheers
Matt |
Newinitiation
Member
Post Number: 634
Registered: 07-2005
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2013 - 01:23 am: |
|
Hi everyone
Continuing on the subject of mental illness and Creational spiritual thinking, in the teachings it states that concentration is a very important factor.
I can't agree with it more.
I think vivienne wrote a great article about concentration some years back
It is a fact that those suffering from psychological malady find it very difficult to concentrate.
Their ability to pay attention, concentrate and focus on an object or a particular subject is severely compromised as the distractions generated by their material subconscious pulls them to and fro in all directions towards a fractured inner existence in their world of thought and world of feelings.
So I would like some suggestions by members here on particular passages from the spiritual teachings that directly addresses on how a person suffering from psychological disorders can recite, repeat and pay attention to, to improve their willpower to be able to concentrate.
It may not be enough to suggest meditation or concentration exercises using candle light to focus on or imagining a flower or waterfall to meditate on.
We have to consider that the state of consciousness even for a supposedly a normal person is unstable at best of times as everyone can attest to with similar experiences where they were frantically searching for their car keys whilst unbeknownst to them, they were holding it in their hands.
So you can imagine the severe restrictions and difficulties faced by people with mental illness.
Tied to this is the unending oppressive forces and bad feelings experienced by people with depression who are constantly harassed by feelings of intense guilt, remorse, regret, sense that there is something terribly wrong with them and low self esteem.
By these negative forces generated by bad experiences of the past which they have internalised and their thinking transformed towards such a direction, they are socially, professionally, and familially severely restricted
With this hellish disability of the consciousness and psyche, feelings generated by certain negative idea, belief, thoughts and imagining plays a crucial role.
I think that with effort people could somewhat reverse these effects with Creational spiritual thinking and thoughts so that at some point in their lives they can free themselves from unfreedom and from their inner prison.
The what and the how's is the important factor here.
regards
Matt Lee |
Edward
Member
Post Number: 2709
Registered: 05-2002
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2013 - 03:00 am: |
|
Hi Redbeard, Matt and All....
Personally, I do not think it is per se a decay or degradation, etc., but,
more a 'blockage' of certain terminals to the brain lobe, which, processes
Common Sense, Logic and Reason. It is located some where at the front of our
forehead.
We have to still, keep in mind, that, 'yes...here we go again', that our
Global Overpopulation is also, the CAUSE, here. Certain, Spirit-form's
(Consciousness), are NOT FULLY installed with the needed Software, if you
will, which will result, as it is mentioned, here, and as we look around us;
and reflects on the Material Consciousness/Brain.
So, the 'gaps' in the Consciousness Software, should be 'filled in', with the
needed, applications, etc., so to speak; for the individual to function more
in the way (s)he, should; as if Fully Installed. Which, is quite a challenge.
Thus, it is very difficult, to break through that Blockage, which, stagnates
and individuals to THINK (s)he, should. Trying all sorts of Psychological
Treatments may of course help, but, to some point, I would think. We, first
have to 'break' through this 'barrier' before we can proceed further with
other procedures.
And, concerning CULT Religion, well, must of us know, that this is
Hereditary, and thus, in is IN the GENS. And, can only truly, be removed
through removing that GEN from the DNA. Here, too, to some point,
Psychological Treatments may help; for the time being. Until, we are able to
remove the concerning GEN; widely.
Thus, Psychological Therapeutic Treatments, CAN help. And, as Billy
mentioned, certain medications, to add.
Something to think, about....
Edward. |
Newinitiation
Member
Post Number: 635
Registered: 07-2005
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2013 - 11:54 pm: |
|
Hi Edward
Its nice to be able to converse with you again Edward after a long time.
Great analogy I think in reference to the example you have given above.
It's interesting how you came up with the words blockade and barrier to describe the state of mental and psychological dilemmas and illnesses.
I gather that if a person cannot function with naturally given prerequisites it must mean that some 'thing' inside of themselves is stifled and does not flow naturally according to his/her given nature so to speak.
Its a very interesting phenomenon how especially with traumatic childhood experiences, the material consciousness generalises the fear of 'something' and project it onto other objects similar to the initial fear producing source.
Example of this would be when a child is bitten by a dog and from this traumatic experience of having experienced fear, pain and apprehension, his thoughts would naturally form in such a way that the sight of all dogs including harmless puppies would invoke the same feelings.
This is probably where, if left untreated, the irrational fear, panic and anxiety would in many instances lead to avoidance syndrome, anxiety attack, panic attack and even dissociative disorder.
The child or even an adult must cope somehow and the natural instincts of self preservation would drive certain defensive mechanism to kick in and produce ways to deal with the situation even ways that are self defeating.
So the thought of fear of 'something' would unconsciously happen automatically in the instant the sight of the source of the learned fear is perceived then naturally from that panicky and anxious feelings would arise also.
In the Creational spiritual teachings, the neutral positive thinking is stressed. (Thanks to Robjn & Elizabeth) http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/Thoughts_about_neutrality_in_everyday_life
Neutral positive thinking and the state of consciousness produced by it would be an ideal therapeutic method but if only it was as easy as said.
Not always but since a person suffering from psychological disorders have a skewed perception of reality and in most instances, not unlike religious thinking, they base their sense of reality on 'beliefs' rather than what actually is, as I stated before it would be helpful to device a Creational spiritual thought formula or passages of words that would stimulate within the person the idea of 'how things really and actually are as truth' and derive the corresponding sense, experience, feeling, cognition, knowledge, awareness and recognition from them.
Other therapies such as Cognitive behavioral therapy, Humanistic therapy, Behavioral therapy and psychoanalysis, although may work so some people, misses the critical point of Creative spiritual truth, meaning the undeniable truth to treat patients and must rely on half truths as the basis for transitioning patients from extreme irrationality to mild illogicality to base their ideas about reality in eliminating their conditions.
Regards
Matt Lee |
Honorcode
Member
Post Number: 16
Registered: 03-2013
| | Posted on Monday, April 01, 2013 - 08:33 am: |
|
Matt Lee,
Your intentions are proper and helping in your post but some people are so severely impacted by mental illness that it will take them thousands of lifetimes to get well. I know that this is the case with me.
I'll second your request for the information you specified, and will read it, but it will be of little use to people that are suffering with extreme cases of mental illness and will only be a minuscule start. One lifetime is simply wishful thinking for these people suffering with extreme cases and has no basis in reality for a more "consolidated" reality within their mind in his/her One Lifetime.
JM
Why would I want to change what I've built so Far? Look at me now I'm a *SuPeRStAr* ~Jay (Jpm) :-)
|
Honorcode
Member
Post Number: 17
Registered: 03-2013
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 02, 2013 - 09:25 am: |
|
I wrote to Matt Lee and it wasn't posted.
50% of my posts are not posted even though they are worthwhile.
I don't get it.
Honorcode, it takes time for some of the posts to see the light of day, please allow at least 24 hours, Thanks Scott
(Message edited by scott on April 02, 2013)
Why would I want to change what I've built so Far? Look at me now I'm a *SuPeRStAr* ~Jay (Jpm) :-)
|
Newinitiation
Member
Post Number: 636
Registered: 07-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 02, 2013 - 09:28 pm: |
|
Hi Justsayno
Sorry Justsayno there must be a massive blind spot in my eyes or something, I missed your post which was neatly tucked away up there.
It's a common courtesy to respond promptly to posts where you are personally addressed and so my apologies.
What you have suggested is a good idea as has been confirmed by Billy on several occasions that nutrition is an important factor in keeping the psyche healthy and he suggested that people take mineral and vitamin supplements due to our modern day foods lacking vital nutrients.
But I guess together with good nutrients and proper thinking, Creational spiritual approach would be the order of the day.
cheers
matt |
Ramirez
Member
Post Number: 837
Registered: 06-2008
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 02, 2013 - 09:47 pm: |
|
Thinking and thoughts .....
Let's examine the catholic premise of transubstantiation where they claim a wafer biscuit probably obtained from either a supermarket of private supplier such as a bakery and wine probably obtained from a liquor store are respectively the body and blood of Christ .... literally not symbolically.
What are the problems with this ?
1. At which point in the baking process or thereafter did the wafer biscuit transform itself into part of the corpse of a 2,000 year old dead man ?
2. At which point did the wine transform itself into the blood of a 2,000 year old dead man ?
3. Isn't that ritual cannibalism ? .... consuming the remains of a dead person ?
4. How does the consumption of wine and or a cracker biscuit facilitate a connection with a 2,000 year old dead man who never existed ? because there was no historical Jesus Christ which is a fictitious name invented by others which gradually found it's way into various texts particularly in 325AD at the Council Of Nicea under the orders and direction of Roman Emperor Constantine.
5. In order to have transubstantiation become real it would require the presence of the actual corpse of a 2,000 year old dead man at every location where the so called holy communion is given and even then what sort of magic would be required for altering rotting flesh into cracker biscuits and probably dried blood into wine ?
Over many centuries the catholic church has persecuted, tortured, murdered and confiscated the property of many people claiming they were heretics, witches, in league with lucifer or satan or whatever other thought crime was invented yet those same persons in the catholic church expect others to believe a cracker biscuit is the body of a dead person and wine is blood then expect temple visitors to consume those ..... who are the sick persons in this scenario ?
---------
please repost in the Relgion/Relegeon topic.
No replies in this topic area.
(Message edited by indi on April 02, 2013)
Cheers.
|
Newinitiation
Member
Post Number: 637
Registered: 07-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 02, 2013 - 11:09 pm: |
|
Hi Honorcode
Thank you for your suggestion honorcode
It would indeed be a very difficult life for those who are suffering from some type of psychological illness whether it be a mild condition to a severe one.
There is a broad spectrum of mental and psychological illnesses that are mind boggling in scope and number.
If you've read the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM) you will see just how extensive it is.
I dare say though and this is just my own opinion but there is a certain underlying conspiracy going on to broaden the spectrum of mental illnesses by the pharmaceutical, medical and mental health industries and establishment to profit enormously from selling it's plethora of useless and often dangerous drugs or medication where often incidents such as Sandy Hook massacre occurs.
But this is another topic for another discussion.
Anyway getting back on topic I wanted to delve into the perceptual aspect of psychological disorders and how the thinking and thoughts of those who are suffering from mental illnesses creates the conditions in their consciousness to perceive certain people, circumstances, situation and events that triggers bad feelings and a whole host of other detrimental psychic effects including euphoria.
According to how I understand perception to be from my own experience as oppose to the straight out definition of perception from the dictionary and the encyclopedia, it is that 'I see' as in 'I understand, observe, take in, accept, sense, feel, be conscious of, and know through me and by being me' instead of through 'the looking glass self'.
So it is purely neutral 'seeing sensing observing' as opposed to being subjective or objective.
I could be way off of course and I stand to be corrected.
But we get to the inevitable question, 'who am I', What am I', What is thought', 'Who is this me, myself and I doing the 'seeing sensing' (perceiving) and thinking and standing in the background judging the very me, myself and I that is doing the perceiving'.
So it does get very complex after awhile
Anyway in the context of the normal understanding of perception, the thinking and thoughts of a person suffering from psychological illness, they would think and then perceive what is out their in their environment not according to how it actually is in truth and reality but by the tainted perception of how they have learnt to understand 'something' to be.
So you have a case here of beliefs about 'something' or 'someone' overriding the perception of things as they truly are.
To use as an example, in the case of people suffering from social anxiety and panic attacks from being in crowded places, the often oppressive feelings and thoughts occupying their minds such as 'what if I make a fool out of myself in front of people', 'they are talking about me behind my back', 'what will they think about me', 'Oh God what if I get rejected', 'what if they thought I was stupid' etc, It is from these self defeating thoughts learnt through prior experiences which compels the individual to perceive the other people as the source of discomfort, pain, humiliation, suffering, insults and rejection that overtime like the snow ball effect keeps on negatively reinforcing itself with more illogical, irrational and negative ideas and thinking which further effects their perception of people and their subsequent behaviour towards them which then leads to this effect creating a self fulfilling prophecy where other people do act towards them in ways that produce bad feelings and thus one feels justified in their current thinking and beliefs.
So to break this vicious self fulfilling and negatively reinforcing cycle certain Creational spiritual truths must be introduced into the person's thinking process to help them perceive the reality as they truly are so that self defeating attitudes, thoughts, understanding, perception, feelings and action can be made redundant replaced by a more healthy and productive thought processes that brings about the healing process.
Thanks for your patience it ended up a long winded post.
regards
Matt |
|
