| Author | Message | ||
    Kiwiseeker Member Post Number: 148 Registered: 08-2006 |
Hi All-An article which may be of interest: "Swedish Official Admits Toxic Chemtrails Are Real & NOT Conspiracy" From WorldTruth.tv: "Those long, white streams of persistent, cloudy haze commonly blasted into blue skies by unmarked airplanes are not your typical contrails, says Swedish Green Party leader Pernilla Hagberg. As reported by the Swedish paper Katrineholms Kuriren, Hagberg, the first major political leader to come forward on the issue, has openly admitted that these unusual cloud trails, which fail to dissipate like normal contrails do, are actually a toxic mix of chemicals, viruses, and metals that she has collectively referred to as “Chemtrails.” According to Hagberg, the sprayings are a joint endeavor by the U.S. Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) and the U.S. National Security Agency (NSA), as well as the Swedish government in her own country, to modify atmospheric conditions via deliberate aerosol spraying efforts. And included in this “dangerous” mix of aerosols are various chemical components, viruses and viral fragments, and metals such as aluminum and barium, which have already been shown to be accumulating in water supplies and soils around the world. (http://chemtrails.cc/) Normal contrails, which are composed of mere water vapor that quickly dissipates after emission from jet engines, are far different from chemtrails, which gradually blanket the entire sky in a sea of white." Chemtrails are not Contrails Charles | ||
Danieliwilliams New member Post Number: 1 Registered: 11-2010 |
Hi Luz. I just wanted to say a few things about your posts about chemtrails, and to issue you with some explanations based on logic, a little education aswell as real world factors. It maybe quite a long message so please bear with me as this can't really be explained in short. When these are known, considered and deliberated aswell as put to practise, you find that there is far too much blacked out ignorance (excuse the offense) to warrant such claims such as chemtrails. First of all i just need to make sure you know about the impossibility of chemicals being sprayed on people on the ground. There is a contradiction with many chemtrail believers, by how they try to justify exactly how people are actually being harmed on the ground by chemtrails. Because the distance between a jet at 35'000ft flying at 500knots to a man or woman on the ground, is a distance of several miles and incredible speeds. Within that altitude distance exist winds that are almost mild hurricane force at ground level. At different atltudes winds can flow in different directions, at in this curent era, solar winds are playing a part because of the penetration of solar radiation leaking through the protective layers of the earth. If for example, a 747 tanker was spraying a 200 mile strip of chemtrails filled with aluminium, barium etc. those chemicals would be sprayed like an aerosol. Those aerosols are going to freeze on impact with that immensely cold dense air at that height. This is going to lead to one problem. Those winds are going to take every particle present in the direction of that wind. This means that it is absolutely impossible to plan let alone accomplish a aspray of chemicals from 35'000ft and have them land on people below. By the time they even fall 5000ft, those powerful high altitude winds would have distributed every particle miles away from the intented target. This now falls into the realm of impossible possibility where the equivalent, is like dropping a feather from 30'000ft high and trying to land it on a sixpence. There can never be perfect accuracy in assessing which way the wind will flow and to what velocity. That primary strip of chemtrail, in 30 minutes could drift 500 miles east if that was where the wind was heading and each particle broken apart. If it is close to the sea, they winds would have drifred over the ocean and then it's pretty much a completely pointless exercise. This adds to another problem. Billions of aerosol particles in close proximity act like a large cloud, the sun can burn the surface but never the entire cloud, it's collective mass is too large to dissolve. But, when those particles are spread out and thinned, those particles are then at the mercy of that solar radiation. When a cloud loses its strength, it breaks apart and all the smaller clouds, are evaporated. Anthing chemical based destroyed by the sun will become a gas, which goes up, not down! In this regard to natural forces, in an hour, those particles could have drifted over 1000 miles and yet to fall below 30'000ft aswell burned off into potentially harmful gases. But, throughout this time, these chemtrail chems and metals, are laying dormant in the direct flightpaths of other aircraft. All aircraft engines engulf fresh air and transfer it into breathable oxygen for passengers onboard. If an aircraft flew into a large plume of poisonous metals & chemicals, they would enter the cabin of every aircraft and literally poison everyone onboard. In the next breath, the story says that the chemtrailers are geo-engineering. Yet geo-engineering is performed by light aircraft, not large four engines jet aircraft tankers. If they were flying overhead dropping chemicals out, they would be shot down in minutes. So we move onto the next part. The question as to why aircraft of the 60's 70's and 80's never made these white lines and why they are all over the skies today. This is a simple but important factor that not a lot of people are going to know unless they have knowledge of aircraft. You see, old aircraft from the 60's to 80's used turbojet engines that did not allow for by-pass. They were small, loud, highly polluting soot chugging engines. Those aircraft not only had many restrictions but also major differences to the new technology that arrived in the mid to late 1980's. The old turbojet engines were very small and not very powerful at all. Every ounce of air they took it had to be discharged through the combustion exhaust. But they threw out so much burned oil, soot and other pollutants that all you ever saw coming out from their exhaust was thick black smoke. Because of their small size and lack of ability to discharge air at high magnitude, it meant they did not fly as fast and thus, could not fly above 30'000ft if that. This played a part in the almost non-existent presence of contrails, because for todays airliners, 30'000 is the average threshold for where temperatures change and fluctuate to freeze the exhaust particles. Plus, with how much plumed soot and smoke coming from those old engines, water was all black and bound to oil. That kind of oil doesn't freeze below -100 to -150f. In the mid to late 80's engine manufacturuers created the "High by-pass engine. These engines had outer sections where the fan blades would force the air and water through the sides of the engine to alleviate the large mass of engulfed air and water. This pulverised air and water into a fine mist and distributed it through the rear as waste exhaust but still as thrust. But it never engulfed the engine itself which meant they were very powerful and far less polluting. These new engines enabled aircraft to fly above 35'000ft and at greater speeds. And because their high by-pass distributed water, these pulverised water particles were spraying out of the back and freezing in the same way aerosols sprays freeze in the cold. If you look closely, you will see that all contrails are spiralled, because with aircraft design from the late 80's, aerodynamics played a apart in adding thrust and power. This added to the velocity of the contrails by the manipulation of air in the form of vortexes coming from the wings and wing tips. As aircraft got better, bigger and more powerful, so did their engines and their aerodynamics. The Boeing 777 for example, in the mid 1990's was fitted with engines so large they matched the circumferance of the fuselage of a Boeing 737. You could fit a 1960's 737 engine inside the 777 engine probably 20 times and still that 777 engine is more powerful. With wider intake, more weight, more power and more aerodynamics, come bigger and thicker contrails because the engines are dealing with a far grater maximum gross weight than anything built in the 60's and 70's so the addition of horse power cannot be compared. The A380 for example, pumps out the biggest contrails i have ever seen. Yet the engines are the same size as an Airbus A340. Why? Because the sheeer weight those 4 engines are operating at is enormous and thus their thrust is far higher than other aircraft. And, the A380 can fly at 42'000ft. Most newer airliners today can now. That is 12'000ft higher than any aircraft flying 40 years ago! That means, colder air, denser air and larger persistant contrails. Now, in regards to those lines, criss-cross etc. In the sky pilots must, by law, use flightplans. Before any pilot steps foot inside a flightdeck, he and his fellow officer map out their flight. They do this by using charts. We'll ignore the departure and arrival charts, and concentrate on their low altitide and high altitude plates. These are charts that are roads in the sky that are all connected by VOR'S, NDB's, airports and intersections. Like roads with streets names and junctions, aircraft have them too. Every flight MUST by law follow these routes, each flight plan is filed and sent through to every air traffic controller along that route. The USA for example, has to be split into sections and each section has its own code. As soon as a pilot moves into one of those areas he/she changes chart. Because the USA is vast, airlines use multi-stop flights several times a day. Many airlines do this from many airports and many hubs and they fly back and forth on every corner of the compass. When you see the checker board effect, it means several aircraft are flying on the same route. The USA airspace is like a ball of tangled woool, there are literally so mnay routes that you can hardly make out what is what. But look with a map and you find everything makes perfect sense. If there are winds moving in a certain direction, as soon as that aircraft leaves the contrail, the wind takes it like it would any other cloud. If 4 aircraft in the space of 30 minutes lfy that same route, 4 lines are going to distributed across the sky. If there is an intersection nearby, there could be at least 30 aircraft flying through it in one day, even more if its a busy flightpath. People from all over the world can observe those flightpath routes by visiting http://skyvector.com/, and as i have done with many people, given them the exact routes that fly over their homes and they can see them flying along those routes everyday. We have currently 23'000 civil airliners flying around the world right now. A far cry from that number flying in the 60's and 70's. This is by far all of it but i hope you get some idea now as to why the chemtrail conspiracy is illogical in terms of what is possible and why you see what you see in terms of engineering etc. The one thing i ask all people who believe in chemtrails, is to ignore what they have been given or found online. But t spend just 1 week or even a month, with a fairly decent quality HD camera that can zoom in close, and film aswell as photogrpah every aircraft flying overhead, live at that moment. Then, while they do that, check skyvector and also, flight tracker. These 3 simple steps will give every person what they need to ensure and verify that what they are observing is a legitmate civil aviation airliner full of paying passengers flying overhead following all the rules, protocols, laws and plans, taking people either on their holidays, to visit family or on a business trip. Regards DW | ||
Michael_horn Member Post Number: 1051 Registered: 07-2009 |
> BRAVO! | ||
Scott Moderator Post Number: 2546 Registered: 12-1999 |
Danny, I think we have talked about this before and I am very aware of what Billy/Plejarens have stated in regards to Chemtrails. In the contact in which this is mentioned Ptaah mentioned changes in the atmosphere which causes this affect to be observed. What are those changes? The majority of these chemtrails became very visible in the late 90's , what occurred in a very short period of time which caused this sudden reaction to jet exhaust? I have taken my own videos like many people and witnessed this first hand as others. I have observed these trails on occasion to make 90 degree turns which doesn't conform to most flight plans that I'm aware of. The thing about this, is that I am a private pilot and what I am observing now from a meteorological standpoint doesn't appear to be a natural phenomena compared to normal contrails that I have also observed. I took the enclosed picture which originated over the pacific ocean, can someone please explain what I am looking at? It doesn't appear to be any type of cumulus or stratus clouds that I used to observe?  (Message edited by scott on June 07, 2015) | ||
Msmichelle Member Post Number: 80 Registered: 02-2010 |
After reading what BEAM//Plejarens have stated in regards to Chemtrails, as a lay person, I too agree with their explanations of the changes in the atmosphere , I mean, let's be clear, If one area is receiving poison via airplanes, etc, sooner or later, all will experience the same effects. In Florida I've observed similar clouds and conditions...also don't forget HAARP may also have an effect. MsMichelle | ||
Michael_horn Member Post Number: 1053 Registered: 07-2009 |
For reference to what Meier and the Plejaren said about chemtrails 10 years ago: http://www.theyfly.com/The_Chemtrail_Conspiracy.html | ||
Scott Moderator Post Number: 2547 Registered: 12-1999 |
hmmm Why in the World are they Spraying? | ||
Kiwiseeker Member Post Number: 149 Registered: 08-2006 |
Well DW you have set the ball rolling again and I note that you have been cheered on by Michael.I suggest that those who are really serious about getting a greater insight into chemtrails (aerosols)should view (listen to)these You Tube videos. Of course you will have to sacrifice some valuable time. *Leuren Moret- HAARP.Chemtrails,Psyops,Hurricane Isaac,foreshadowing California Megaquake *Chemtrails and Chembombs Cause Hurricane Isaac to Change Course *Extreme Cold in USA, Melting Arctic Methane, on 01 08 2015 *What in the World Are They Spraying *Why in the World are They Spraying "Chemtrails are not Contrails" | ||
Kenneth Member Post Number: 144 Registered: 04-2013 |
This ~73 minute documentary on "Why in the World are They Spraying?" is very well done and very convincing to the uneducated or uninformed. Personally working in the aerospace industry for over 20 years; there has never been a smoking gun. In other words, it would take an army of personal to pull this off if true, including those that make this so called chemical to inject into these Chemtrails; where are the pilots, co-pilots, flight engineers; loadmasters etc., etc. All the information we are receiving is theoretical; this appears to be a massive conspiracy theory. This all appears to be atmospheric contamination from multiple sources; mainly do to over population. What we are seeing is “Cause & Effect”. Kenneth | ||
Cpl Member Post Number: 763 Registered: 08-2004 |
All kinds of things get up into the atmosphere only to travel in various ways and then come down again some place. Winds and atmospheric conditions, which can change in an instant, make for all kinds of phenomena. Chris Use to the full both your heart and your head; and never lose either. | ||
Kiwiseeker Member Post Number: 150 Registered: 08-2006 |
My apologies.In my post above the first video reference was in error (only at about 12 min was it relevant!).It should have been: "Desiree Rover with Leuren Moret-Chemtrails,Cloudseeding and Project Popeye". Overpopulation certainly has a leverage effect on atmospheric contamination,but it is too simplistic to blame everything on 'overpopulation',just as it is too easy to label controversial viewpoints as 'conspiracy theories'.After 911,we were bombarded with videos of the demise of the twin towers and we were told again and again that they were falling or collapsing,so people started to believe that they were indeed collapsing.Any opposing viewpoint or explanation was considered as a 'conspiracy theory'.In the end it is up to us as individuals to seek the truth-some will find it,some will not.So be it. Charles | ||
Kenneth Member Post Number: 145 Registered: 04-2013 |
This is from a friend that is referred to as G-Man who said: I don’t think this Chemtrail issue will ever be resolved to anyone’s satisfaction. In all of my years with OSI, I never worked on anything even remotely related to Chemtrail's. Kenneth | ||
Kiwiseeker Member Post Number: 151 Registered: 08-2006 |
Well Kenneth,that's got me guessing.OSI?! I had to google it! As if this lends some credibility to your friend's statement.Anyway,I will gracefully withdraw from this discussion.As they say, "There is no point in flogging a dead horse"![but you never know!].Also there are worse environmental pollutants -the continuing outpouring of radioactive isotopes from Fukushima spreading across N.Am and beyond.e.g. 824 CPM at Bakersfield, CA-gamma and beta radiation combined -prior to last May 30;about 40x background.But that is another topic which Billy & Ptaah have previously discussed. Charles | ||
Kenneth Member Post Number: 146 Registered: 04-2013 |
Charles, I should have added "U.S. Air Forse" OSI for a more complete definition. This G-Man is on our side. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Air_Force_Office_of_Special_Investigations You're an excellent investigator leaving nothing un-turned to find the final conclusion; right or wrong. Radioactive isotopes from Fukushima; now you're onto something! I'm with you 100%. Kenneth | ||
Kiwiseeker Member Post Number: 152 Registered: 08-2006 |
Thanks Kenneth for your update on G-Man and also for your kind words.There is much information out there on most topics and it is a matter of searching,sorting out the wheat from the chaff and coming to a valid conclusion in our minds which we hope is close to the truth.The knowledge I have gained through Billy often enables me to shortcut this search for the truth,but this has to be done with caution,since it depends upon the translation and interpretation of that which Billy has written. Charles | ||
Saimon Member Post Number: 12 Registered: 08-2013 |
Hi, THis picture taken in Sabah Malaysia. After the deadly earthquake. The clouds formation is strange. People also can hear the weird sound from the sky before and after the earthquake. Was HAARP used here?  | ||
Saimon Member Post Number: 13 Registered: 08-2013 |
Hi, Here the sound from the sky after the deadly earthquake in Mount Kinabalu Sabah Malaysia. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTFnIi1CMZw | ||
Saimon Member Post Number: 14 Registered: 08-2013 |
This is the video about strange clouds formation at Mt.Kinabalu in Sabah after the deadly earthquake on 6 June 2015. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J6r3S1HvjC4 | ||
Tat_tvam_asi Member Post Number: 238 Registered: 04-2011 |
US Air Force Admits to Using HAARP For Weather Modification in Defense Hearing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x2O-DVgcvWQ | ||
Hugo Member Post Number: 26 Registered: 04-2015 |
Saimon, there was an anomaly in the sky half an hour before the 2008 Sichuan earthquake in China. I do not know if that or the Malaysian one was caused by HAARP. If it was I could see why the US would do it to China but not Malaysia. As long as HAARP is out there I do not blame people for being suspicious. 30 mins before the 2008 Sichuan earthquake in China. H.A.A.R.P?? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSANDv13_00 | ||
Davidmg Member Post Number: 184 Registered: 03-2008 |
Remember in science class all those with refracting light with crystals? What could be seen here is either water refracting the light or there could also be containments that are present with in the air that are causing a "Prism" effect which can be seen. Davidmg | ||
Savio Senior Member Post Number: 781 Registered: 07-2000 |
I am of the opinion that HAARP is not a secret weapon that can be utilized without being noticed or detected. The whole world will know when someone pumps thousands of megawatts of radio energy into the air. Once utilized, that means war .... http://billybooks.org | ||
Michaelhelfert Member Post Number: 550 Registered: 09-2011 |
Just an FYI, odd sounds (esp. infrasonic), spontaneous cloud formations, and other anomalous phenomenae have for centuries been noted in association with earthquakes, both preceding them and following. There are Earth energies at play about which we are still completely in the dark. We can't blame that on HAARP, nor on smaller analogues in the contiguous 48, nor on planes spraying chemicals. Dr. Eastlund did propose using HAARP as a sort of multi-purpose tool, among other things capable of causing earthquakes, yes, but that doesn't mean that HAARP is to blame for all natural earthquakes. We are entering a period of greater natural geological instabilities, this the result of various linked changes in the environment. Earthquakes will be more frequent, and more damaging. We can't blame the government for everything. IMHO, the most insidious aspect of HAARP (if you are looking for it) is found in some of the frequencies it is capable of pumping out, in much the same manner as the 'missile defense' system we installed. Curiously, just coincidentally mind you, those same frequencies correspond to the frequencies known to confuse mammals, put people to sleep, etc. Stunts like that make me want to build a faraday cage in the basement. Certainly we are capable of spraying into the atmosphere aluminum or barium or other some-such particles, but do keep in mind that everyone breathes the same air on this planet, even those who are doing the spraying. More indicative of a problem is how much genuine science (and other knowledge) is withheld from us. My quick stream-of-consciousness rant to add to the pile... : ) Life |
