| Author | Message | ||
    Newinitiation Member Post Number: 89 Registered: 07-2005 |
dear hunter My goodness, how long do we have to wade through so much nonesense just to get our heads above the water, do you seriously think that people are going to take upon this when you know even the highly developed technologically and spiritually superior plejarens are still failing to get the truth across to such ignorant and degenerate humanity that we are. You really must be so overwhelmingly optimistic about our current human nature to the point where you are blinded by your own false hope, who is going to listen to you! peace be with you | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 179 Registered: 03-2004 |
Newinitiation, I'm fine. Hope you're doing well also...(LOL) What you're essentially doing is criticizing an attempt to spread truth to people. If you claim something I've said is "nonsense"--then please use reason, facts and evidence to disprove it instead of just claiming it's "nonsense". Would you have these same words for Billy? Is he not also trying to spread truth to people? Do you consider him to be "overwhelmingly optimistic" to the point that he is "blinded by his own false hope"? So who should listen to his attempts to change humanity? I am not overwhelmingly optimistic--so I can guarantee you I'm not blinded by false hope. I don't see much chance people will change enough to avert World War 3. However, I realize that it would be foolish to stop trying to persuade people, otherwise Billy would have given up on the mission long ago. You might want to ask yourself if you're overwhelmingly pessimistic. Namaste, Hunter | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 69 Registered: 07-2004 |
Newinitiation, What you don't take into account is the individual who's abilities and visions are such they move mountains( Martin Luther King, Ghandi, etc.) who haven't heard this information. So it may take only a single meeting with someone of that caliber to spark a movement that crosses the oceans in intensity. To point to the half empty glass is a negative starting point. There will be people who will react such as Michael Horn does and enlighten groups of people at a time. Ignore the big picture for now, it's too overwhelming for an average person, and do what you can do on the scale that is within your abilities. To not attempt effect has only one answer, do I need to say it? a friend in america Shawn | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 91 Registered: 07-2005 |
dear hunter Hi hunter, sorry for the obstruse arrogance on my part for it truly wasn't my intention to attack any genuine attempt by such likeminded person like yourself in contributing positively to this worthwhile endeavour. I was in a state of exasperated frustation knowing all that we know is happening in this world when I wrote my post, so if you can forgive me. The thoughts that belies what I wrote in my previous post however narrow minded, comes from the fact that often times the masses of individuals that make up a society and the whole humanity cannot affect any worthwhile change alone but must do so having appealed to the masses what it is that speaks directly to their hearts, Now the options left for us individuals are few and far between althougth we shouldn't seize to stop trying we are nonetheless limited, therefore we can only affect changes step by step collectively. Getting the numbers is the actual problem we face as you know in whatever method used for the undertaking, one such example is what you gave in your post. So you see where my frustration lies, it's not in the method, principle or the inherent desire to effect change but getting enough people who cannot see beyond their basic ego driven desires to take it up. Anyway you along with all others supporting the mission in whatever way however small are the bedrock that makes up the foundation which in it's place a grand castle will be built someday, my spirit is also unwavering in this, so I am happy to walk the journey in unisons together with such likeminded people :-) peace be with you | ||
George Member Post Number: 82 Registered: 03-2003 |
Hi Hunter,We had enough of tyranny and mind control from religious organizations or religion based charitable organizations we cannot go back for help to them. They are responsible along with the Fat Boys for the long reign of delusionary scenario on Earth(like God almighty reigned thing or you only live once… etc.). You need to start looking at real issues that will be facing us on Earth in our last 1500 years of stay on it. I recommend contact letter 251 talking about our past present and future. It should enhance your paradigm so that you realize That all the threats listed there completely prohibit us from turning back the clock and hiding back in our American shell. Salome George Ps. No matter how much money you can save by not paying the taxes you can be sure Fat Boys can make it worth for you equal to a cup of beans if they want to – like 1929 scenario. | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 92 Registered: 07-2005 |
dear froum members I wonder who will replace as the next prime minister of Israel given that Ariel Sharon has just suffered a massive brain haemorrhage and is likely to pass away. What would the future middle eastern political landscape look like and how will it shape up in the coming times once he is gone? Judging by the fact that he was one tyrant among many who was responsible for so much destruction and grief, I would gather his demise would be welcomed by many and yet the instability caused by change of hands means his successor would come from the same rank and file, epitomising the same similar policies of his predecessor in order to gain support from not only their respective political factions but that of the Israelis in general. The outlook isn't so promising one way or another. peace be with you | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 180 Registered: 03-2004 |
* "We had enough of tyranny and mind control from religious organizations or religion based charitable organizations we cannot go back for help to them. They are responsible along with the Fat Boys for the long reign of delusionary scenario on Earth(like God almighty reigned thing or you only live once… etc.)." While this is true, I would only recommend such a "union" in the present climate--on the verge of World War 3. WTP doesn't claim to want to impose their religious views on people--they're seeking to reign in the interventionist foreign policy and massive spending of Washington, DC. If they're successful, they only reduce the size and scope of the U.S. government, which in and of itself does not benefit Christianity or any other religion, and may help stop World War 3. I think the risk/reward ratio is acceptable--again, looking at it from the current world situation. * "You need to start looking at real issues that will be facing us on Earth in our last 1500 years of stay on it. I recommend contact letter 251 talking about our past present and future. It should enhance your paradigm so that you realize That all the threats listed there completely prohibit us from turning back the clock and hiding back in our American shell." Contact 251 is in fact on my desk right now. I was just reading over it the other day. If you'll note--religion will still be us for the next several hundred years, even through Billy's next prophetic incarnation. To think we can't work with religious people to try and bring peace is short-sighted in my opinion. If we ignore religious people, then we're going to be ignoring most of the people on this planet. * "No matter how much money you can save by not paying the taxes you can be sure Fat Boys can make it worth for you equal to a cup of beans if they want to – like 1929 scenario." Excellent point. I'm glad you see the government's power through being able to manipulate the money supply and print as much fiat currency as they need. Of course, there are ways we can "boycott" this system as well. One of them is to use the libety dollar: http://www.libertydollar.org Ultimately though (before the elimination of money) we'll have to bring reforms to government to bring back the gold standard or a precious metals standard to introduce more financial safeguards against deficit spending: Can Gold Stop Wars? http://www.gold-eagle.com/editorials_04/wallenwein103104.html I'll post another article on the fiat currency "swindle" shortly. Namaste, Hunter | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 181 Registered: 03-2004 |
License to Steal: http://www.strike-the-root.com/61/davis/davis1.html | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 182 Registered: 03-2004 |
* "I was in a state of exasperated frustation knowing all that we know is happening in this world when I wrote my post, so if you can forgive me." Newinitiation--no problem. I definitely understand how you feel. It's frustrating for those of us who know we have the means to change the world in a non-violent way, but we just don't have enough people who can see the truth. All we can do is keep working and try our best. | ||
George Member Post Number: 83 Registered: 03-2003 |
Hi Hunter – who is WTP I missed that one? Now you’ve noticed that the organized religions will be here with us for the next several hundred years or so. Did you stop to think why they would remain with us that long? Religions are in short the engines of control through deception for those who are in the control in the World’s governments. Deception(so called miracles) coming in the most part from the Bafath People or Gizeh intelligence that used to control World governments until 1995. The only way to resolve the religious mess perpetrated on us for the purpose of control is in fact an effort to keep telling the truth about religion from purely unreligious platform and that will not make friends among religious people. Working with religious people for peace will not work in my opinion. Entire Europe has been Religious for last 1000 years now and that did not stop any wars there. When you’re religious then you’re also trained to obey God then king recently your so called freely elected officials. When King/President needs men to go to war he gets men to go to war because religious people were well trained and conditioned to obey this way by the ‘church the controlling engine’. So how do you intent to work with religious people for Peace? That makes no sense – they have to be mind reconditioned first – right now they do whatever the ‘SIMON SAYS’ with very little questioning of his true intensions. Mind reconditioning means knowing Truth about how things really are and knowing your true purpose of being Here and those in control are not about to expose themselves for what they really are and what they stand for. Hence total isolation of Billy’s mission/message(same as with Emmanuel) and willful and deliberate campaign of misinformation by the World’s press and media for the last 30 years(same as with Emmanuel). I think the real progress will come when we work with the governmental structure and engineer it not to allow any abuses to take place in it. This is also an evolutionary process requiring for a well balanced changes to be worked in to the governmental system by well balanced people(this is the real deal). Take a good look around you - who are the people that you work so hard for? Do you Really know what their true intensions are? How can you be sure that this is not just another well organized political scam by those who want to become the brand new control people with very little change for those who are being controlled or proverbial ‘king is dead long live the new king’ deal? Simple and drastic changes will at best cause new abuse pop up in some other place taking the whole system even more out of balance. Salome George | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 113 Registered: 07-2005 |
dear froum members As it was said in the prophecies in contact 251, another has been fullfilled once again. Ellen Johnson Sirleaf has been elected as president of Liberia, first ever women to do so in Africa. Now we can expect more prophecised events to fullfill itself, one of them is the demise of pope benedict in a couple of years due probably to illness and then the last pope petrus romanus who will reside elsewhere besides rome will emerge which will then be a sure sign of worse things to come. I wonder who the 4 heads of state will be who will lose their lives within 7 days of each other be? maybe from Israel, Iran, USA, France? peace be with you | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 72 Registered: 07-2004 |
I've just read something to ponder regarding the general mindset of many Americans. You can read it here: http://www.nonesoblind.org/blog/?page_id=21 The simple clarity of it's statement speaks to the reality that has our country wrapped in the stranglehold of the power-hungry. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Jo_jo Member Post Number: 87 Registered: 04-2003 |
Here's one way of looking at things. Nostradamus scholar John Hogue has speculated that the sanctioned deaths of three middle eastern kings (Saudi, Iran, Syria?) would lead to the death of Mabus (GW Bush or his successor?). This would then lead to the start of the prophesized WWIII. | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 183 Registered: 03-2004 |
* Now you’ve noticed that the organized religions will be here with us for the next several hundred years or so. Did you stop to think why they would remain with us that long? George, that's what the Plejarens said, not me. | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 184 Registered: 03-2004 |
* Take a good look around you - who are the people that you work so hard for? Do you Really know what their true intensions are? I believe that they do seem devoted to the type of government outlined in the original U.S. Constitution--which if followed would greatly reduce our chances of getting into WW3--even if it's not perfect. Look, it's a long shot at this point, but I guarantee you, if you organize a political party based on Plejaren principles called the Extraterrestrial Party, you don't stand a chance of getting elected in 2006. MOST PEOPLE CAN'T GRASP THIS INFORMATION. That's a sad fact... so we MUST work with what's out there. You ask if I know their true intentions--do they know mine? Do they know I'm using them as a means to an end? Your criticism can be used against any group or any individual. Do we really know ANYONE'S true intentions apart from what they say? No--because we're not telepathic. We have to use trust at some point. | ||
Jo_jo Member Post Number: 88 Registered: 04-2003 |
Newinitiation, You said: As it was said in the prophecies in contact 251, another has been fullfilled once again. Ellen Johnson Sirleaf has been elected as president of Liberia, first ever women to do so in Africa. Contact 251 said: …while a woman gains a high and influential position among world powers through another group’s formation. I wouldn’t take it to the bank that the prophecy has been fulfilled by Johnson-Sirleaf’s election. First of all Liberia is a country of only 3.5 million people and is greatly in debt. It is not a country of much world-wide power. Secondly, Johnson-Sirleaf’s party, the Unity Party, was formed in 1985, 10 years prior to the issuance of Contact 251. My personal opinion is that the prophesized woman leader will come from the middle east, possibly Egypt. | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 115 Registered: 07-2005 |
dear Jo-jo Very good observation there Jo-Jo, come to think of it, the ambition by Hillary Clinton in her desire to become president cannot be ruled out although far fetched, seeing as it mentions world powers. Is Egypt considered among world powers? or could this indicate among G8 nations, say Japan or Germany. What about the results of the recent German election? anyway I know most of us on this forum will keep posted on the current and future events. peace be with you | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 751 Registered: 02-2000 |
You guys are forgetting the part that says that these first women leaders will be corrupt, its only later that the good woman leaders come forth. I'm of the belief that Hillary Clinton is not one of the good ones. She is the same mold as the men. She voted for the war in Iraq. So if she or Condi Rice get power it would fulfill the first part of the prophecy. | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 187 Registered: 03-2004 |
Canada's Major Media Predict Conservatives to Win Jan 23 By BETH DUFF-BROWN Canada's major media predicted victory for Conservative leader Stephen Harper in national elections Monday night, an outcome that was expected to push Canada to the right and lead to improved ties with the U.S. There were cheers at the Conservative Party headquarters in Calgary as the media predictions were announced. Harper was expected to give his victory speech later in the night. Shortly after polling stations closed, the country's major news outlets including the Canadian Broadcast Corp. and the Canadian Press news agency called the election for the Conservatives, who were winning seats for the first time in French-speak Quebec and making significant gains in the Liberal stronghold of Ontario. With only 36 seats still uncounted, the Conservatives had either won or were leading with 105 seats; the Liberals had 91; the Bloc Quebecois had 49 and the New Democratic Party had won or were leading with 23 seats. The Green Party and an Independents appeared to have the other seats. Based on the media prediction, the Conservatives will fall far short of winning a majority in the House of Commons and will have to form a coalition to rule. A Conservative victory ends nearly 13 years of Liberal Party rule and shifts the traditionally liberal country to the right on socio- economic issues such as health care, taxation, abortion and gay marriage. Relations with the Bush administration would likely improve under a Harper government, as his ideology runs along the same lines of many Republicans south of the border. Many Canadians had grown weary of the broken promises and corruption scandals under the Liberal Party and were apparently willing to give Harper the benefit of doubt, despite fears the 46-year-old economist was too extreme in his views opposing abortion and gay marriage. During the campaign, Harper pledged to cut the red tape in social welfare programs, lower the national sales tax from 7 percent to 5 percent and grant more autonomy and federal funding to Canada's 13 provinces and territories. He also wants to improve relations between Canada and the United States, which comprise the world's largest trading bloc and conduct $1.5 billion in business daily. The Liberals have angered Washington in recent years, condemning the war in Iraq, refusing to join the continental anti-ballistic missile plan and criticizing President Bush for rejecting the Kyoto Protocol on greenhouse gas emissions and enacting punitive Canadian lumber tariffs. Harper has said he would reconsider the missile defense scheme, move beyond the Kyoto debate by establishing different environmental controls and tone down the "war of words" over lumber. He also wants to spend more on the Canadian military, expand its peacekeeping missions in Afghanistan and Haiti and tighten security along the border with the United States in an effort to prevent terrorists and guns from crossing the frontier. Liberal Prime Minister Paul Martin, 67, had trumpeted eight consecutive budget surpluses and sought to paint Harper as a right- winger posing as a moderate to woo mainstream voters. The prime minister also has promised to lower income taxes, implement a national child care program and ban handguns. He claimed Harper supports the war in Iraq, which most Canadians oppose, and would try to outlaw abortion and overturn gay marriage. Harper denied those claims and said Sunday that Martin had failed to swing voters against him. "Canadians can disagree, but it takes a lot to get Canadians to intensely hate something or hate somebody. And it usually involves hockey," Harper quipped. Voters cast ballots at 60,000 polling stations amid unseasonably mild winter weather. Turnout from the country's 22.7 million registered voters was expected to be better than the 60 percent of the June 2004 election, the lowest number since 1898. William Azaroff, 35, voted for the left-of-center New Democratic Party but conceded a Conservative government was likely to win. "I think it's a shame," said the business manager from Vancouver, British Columbia. "I think the last government was actually quite effective for Canadians. I think a Conservative government is just a backlash against certain corruption and the sense of entitlement." Martin's government and the 308-member House of Commons were dissolved in November after New Democrats defected from the governing coalition to support the Conservatives in a no-confidence vote amid a corruption scandal involving the misuse of funds for a national unity program in Quebec. An investigation absolved the prime minister of wrongdoing but accused senior Liberals of taking kickbacks and misspending tens of millions of dollars in public funds. Just as campaigning hit full swing over the Christmas holidays, the Royal Canadian Mounted Police announced they were investigating a possible leak by Liberal government officials that appeared to have influenced the stock market. When the 38th Parliament was dissolved, the Liberals had 133 seats, the Conservatives had 98, the Quebec separatist party Bloc Quebecois had 53 and the New Democrats had 18. There also were four Independents and two vacancies. Laureen Browne, a longtime Liberal supporter from Calgary who hasn't missed an election in 40 years, worries a Harper government would kowtow to U.S. interests. "If the Conservatives win, we may as well become another U.S. state and let George Bush make decisions for us," she said. "If I don't vote, then I can't complain; and if the predictions are right, I will be complaining the loudest." http://www.breitbart.com/news/2006/01/23/D8FAQDAG4.html | ||
George Member Post Number: 85 Registered: 03-2003 |
Hello again Hunter, I’m afraid being Telepathic will not give you ability to know someone’s true intensions. This is not how that works. This ability comes from within you after you’ve cleared your mind from traditional falsehoods and false teachings about your self and who you are and what you’re supposed to do. After you surround yourself with correct set of values and step-on toward long journey of evolutionary Spirit development and start finally to comprehend everything according to the truth. Even right at the beginning of that journey(that’s where I am) you will start noticing that you will have no problem discerning anybody’s true intentions. And this Forum/Mission is all about providing you with that right set of knowledge. I would recommend to you truly remarkable tool to achieve that condition. It is called ‘Introduction to the Spiritual Teachings’. You can find it in this forum(do the search). Salome George | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 192 Registered: 03-2004 |
George, I don't believe your first statement is accurate. The Plejarens have used their telepathic abilities and or devices to "exit" a planned meeting with U.S. officials after they determined that the U.S. agents wanted to kill them and take their beamships. I believe that was mentioned in "And Still They Fly" | ||
Mjjkael New member Post Number: 4 Registered: 04-2003 |
Here is an interesting article highlighting the significance of March 20, 2006: the opening of the Iranian Oil Bourse. Well worth reading. http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article11704.htm | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 125 Registered: 07-2005 |
dear mjjkael very interesting indeed, the USA has so much to lose it seems and the neocons will do everything to stop it from happening. I wonder though, where does Russia come into this seeing as president Putin expansionist mentality will not stop him from negotiating a deal with the Americans thereby stiring that region with a possible attack on Turkey and Iran and gaining a foothold in that region in the pretext to the Americans of aiding in their agendas they both worked out secretly whilst behind the Americans back, exploiting the situation causing other nations to turn its backs on the Americans thereby starting WW3. anyway time will tell and everything seems so unpredictable. peace be with you | ||
George Member Post Number: 86 Registered: 03-2003 |
HI Hunter, they do have well advanced time travel& dimensional technology. They can just check the event in the future or observe proceedings leading to that event from higher dimension in the present time. Salome George | ||
Mgilbo1 Member Post Number: 31 Registered: 09-2002 |
a few months back some of us had a discussion as to the best way to take back our gov'ts. We had some good suggestions but I found this from Semjase in one of the contact notes on Theyfly.com. Billy: Dear girl, these are matters about which many people have thought about already themselves, but the big-wigs in the upper and uppermost range do not give a hoot about any of this. Semjase: 126. I am also aware of that. 127. For Earth Man, only the use of force remains. 128. For just too long, he has allowed himself to be fooled by the responsible ones, therefore, he can achieve nothing any longer in a peaceful manner. 129. The power on the Earth is embodied by politics, the religions and the scientists. 130. And exactly this power must be broken, otherwise Earth Man suffers a very evil end, not only through war and exploitation, but also by the atomizing of the planet. Even Semjase states that our ability to win over our gov't with peaceful protests is a waste of time. Any comments? Mark Gilbo Syracuse, NY Mark Gilbo | ||
Tjames Member Post Number: 134 Registered: 12-2004 |
Hello Mark, Here's a question I asked billy a couple months ago and it is pretty strait forward. Dear Billy, As I ponder different strategies and possibilities for preventing the 3rd World Fire, many effective methods come to mind. While I reside in the USA, I feel a pressing and neccessary manifold task to disect, comprehend and complete. I have a drive as many do to affect people in the most beneficial manner that I can, through prayer, example and advice. As these are always very effective methods for creating a positive/neutral change. Writing papers to news centers is another, where I've actaully made some changes, but, I know this is not enough, as we need something far greater to assist our evolution. What are your thoughts on gathering like-minded groups of people to rid my governments infestation of lying, warmongering criminals my so-called leaders, organized thorough plan with honest motives for peace, carried out in a balanced manner, but done through force? Ultimately I'm asking if a focus should be on a meeting of minds and educating through the power of a collective conciousness overthrow instead of a plan designed to "forcefully" remove our leaders, or both? Sincerely, Tim Answer Prayers, as long as they have a religious character, are useless. Example and advice are good. To forcefully remove criminal leaders etc. is not right, because changes must be executed by enlightenment/informing and on a peaceful way. Another possibility is taking the legal way, such as the process of removal from office. | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 201 Registered: 03-2004 |
* they do have well advanced time travel& dimensional technology. They can just check the event in the future or observe proceedings leading to that event from higher dimension in the present time. Yes, George, but they also have telepathic abilities. They transmit information to Billy this way sometimes. | ||
Jo_jo Member Post Number: 96 Registered: 04-2003 |
What are you suggesting? Anarchy like in Iraq? | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 135 Registered: 07-2005 |
dear Mgilbo1 So it shall be then Mgilbo1 that most of the degeneracies will disappear with 2/3 of humanity dying because the www3 has to happen for us now. Like it is the case with Noahdanken with 800,000 odd so of his people dying because they have ignored his warnings, history unfortunately is repeating itself. I am not a fatalist nor extreme in my assessment but I guess at the end of the day we have brought this cruel judgement upon ourselves, then we must suffer the consequences of our very degeneracies, so no matter whether you feel that I am giving up on this venture and possible hope which is not the case but there are hardly anyone out there who will listen despite so much cries especially from billy and others over the course of several decades. So let it be, maybe its better in the long run for our future generations and a new start will urge them to live more peacefully amongst themselves which our present generation still haven't learnt the hard lessons from history. peace be with you | ||
Mgilbo1 Member Post Number: 32 Registered: 09-2002 |
Hi everyone, To Jo_Jo, I'm not suggesting anything, I found this the other day and it does contradict Billy's response in a way. Why would Semjase say this, is my question, and then Billy have the opposite response? I'm always for peaceful removal and I agree with Billy and the response he gave Tjames, but as Semjase has stated, the people have let them get away with it for too long. Newinitiation.. I agree with you in many ways. How many times can Billy, me, you and others around the world point out that if we don't stop this insanity, WW3 will happen? I have to admit, I think the world is recognizing what is going on and now is the time to push harder, not give up. My reason for showing Semjase comments was to hopefully get some good ideas (again) to get the truth out. Can we all fax a press release to our local papers or write to the editors? Can we all chip in to buy ad space to display the truth. Can we all send 20 well written post cards a week to random people? What can we do to help Michael promote his material and station visits? I'm willing to do work if it means stopping a war. I have 2-3 nights a week to help out if anyone is willing. I talk to everyone about Billy's material, no matter who they are or how they look at me. I figure if I can change a few, its better than none. Well we need to do exactly that but on a larger scale. Today we can reach millions with just an email, why can't hundreds of us reach tens of millions? Mark Gilbo | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 141 Registered: 07-2005 |
dear forum members it's inevitable now www.prisonplanet.com/article/february2006/070206attackiran.htm march 28 on election day in Israel bilderbergers have won the day | ||
Mgilbo1 Member Post Number: 33 Registered: 09-2002 |
Nice post Newinitiation. I understand your frustration but nows the time to increase the message Billy has provided. If you read Billy's material, it is Russia, not America that will attack Iran. But maybe not... With the Muslims being mad as hell about the cartoon prints, maybe it won't happen. What can we do to help stop it? Mark Syracuse, NY Mark Gilbo | ||
Eric_drouin Member Post Number: 111 Registered: 05-2004 |
Hi Newsinitiation: not yet, if Europe, Canada, India, etc.. don`t fall in the neo-con propaganda trap Keep carrying on peace meditation, lieber freund Salome | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 144 Registered: 07-2005 |
dear Mgilbo1 Your devotion inspires me never to give up yet I am still stuck fast with good intentions with no outlet and no way to bring it to fruition simply because material problems dominate to the point of exasperation although I can try harder to free myself to some extent and search diligently from advice taken from billy and Jmmanuel, I nontheless feel limited. Your suggestions are very good and my own thoughts and ideas conforms to some extent with your suggestions. Lets help the cause by helping each other explore further on a more realistic grounds what we can co-operatively do to affect some changes so desperately needed right now. I've suggested many posts ago when I had some heated dialogue with phil638 about massive international hunger strike upon notifying the various meadia outlets as one possible way. looking forward to hearing from you peace be with you | ||
Mgilbo1 Member Post Number: 34 Registered: 09-2002 |
I completely understand how you feel Newinitiation. Even though I think that most people are in lala land, I still have to love them. They give me something funny to watch during my day. Are they going to wake up anytime soon? Absolutely not until a sledge hammer hits them in the head. Its an insane asylum with the patients watching the patients.. I couldn't fathom how frustrated Billy or the Plejaren's were or are with us at their spiritual level. It must be baby sitting with a bigger playpen. But as for getting Billy's word out, I'm going to put together a website and make up some postcards and flyers. Mine are going to be focused on the US since we have the most insane leadership unmatched by any in history. I will let you know when I have them up so everyone can review them. The more input the better. Keep going Newinitiation! What choice do we have? Mark Gilbo | ||
George Member Post Number: 88 Registered: 03-2003 |
Hi all, I think we need to focus ourselves on something that really works. The big break up of Communist Block with all the following political changes as we know was forced by many determined Peace Workers doing their Peace Meditation every month allowing the Akashic Force to program those changes by interacting with thought patterns of the Peace Workers and bringing those balanced thought forms to eventual fulfillment at the same time clearing a lot of dark energy that was building up to the WWIII boiling point. Let's keep it in mind that this is the very reason that we actually do not have WWIII for the last 20 years. Hey - nothing has changed that I know of since then - we still have this amazing tool and opportunity in our hands to get things going the right way. If you set your thought patterns right on harmonizing/improving your local, state or fed government while at the same time with regular determined effort you will do the Peace Meditation you will also notice changes for better at you respective local, state and fed level as you will also synergize along with the Force. So let's get smart here and get our thought patterns in focus and harmony with the Mission Goals and put out the best meditation effort possible with all available time that we got left and conduct ourselves as men/women worthy of this task. This is what will for sure bring the right change. PS. Are you getting the hint yet Hunter? SALOME George | ||
George Member Post Number: 90 Registered: 03-2003 |
Moderator, if you can could you please post for those who are interested: Mission/Figu Goals so the new and interested discussion participants have the opportunity to 'Tune In' and participate in our Power Event (Peace Meditation) in the correct and effective way. I perceive that they are waiting for some 'constructive filler' here on this thread. Salome George | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 585 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi All.... For those whom may have interest. Just this weekend I watched a News Reportage concerning a well known American Sociologist, which name I can not recall at the moment. He was asked his view of all that has happened since the first Gulf War and up till the Second Gulf War, and up on till today. He found it a shame what his now sitting president had done to the world. And that there has never been a president of the USA, that MISUSED his Power to all extent, and beyond. And that this MAN - Mr.BUSH -, MUST be taken down from his office, immediately! Because, he is "Inviting" even More Death and Destruction to all mankind all over the globe. The Sociologist, also explained, that the USA "Missed" a Power Structure... that has the ability to take down their Warmonger president. He pointed in main, to the Democrats. "Where is their Fire. The Same Fire...they used to bring down Nixon? Have the Democrats gone SOFT??", he noted in this sense. The Democrats in the Nixon era had good and healthy contacts with all sorts of elements in the media and else ware, and it was time for them to do the same once again, but than to Mr.Bush! So, it seems through this interview with the Sociologist, certain elements in the Democrat Party...will try and mobilize and utilize the same Contacts and Tactics they used during the processing again Mr.Nixon. But than, a Newer/Modern version. Just to state: An American General stated just last month...that since last year December, Resisting Insurgents' Revenge has INCREASED...to 30%!!!!! And all is NOT truly going as planned as Mr.Bush and Co. make it out to be! And the insurgents weaponry are now more sophisticated and: Armored Piercing!!! Which makes it even more impossible for US as well as Iraq forces to withstand the resistance. Joint Operations do not seem to work at all!! Once the insurgents are Flushed Out and demobilized, and the troops withdraw, the next couple of days after, the insurgents come back and strike anew but, even HARDER!!! So One would ask One's self: Who is running around the bush?? "CENSURE Is In The Order Of The Day", so to speak...as it seems. Thus, this is good reason to Pull-Out the US troops as fast as possible(and Allies!). As was concluded by some. Hopefully, the above mentioned scenario concerning the Democrats will come into fulfillment and Bear Healthy Fruits? Man's Future Destiny can Still be Altered for the Betterment of ALL Mankind!? But..if not? "Goodness Gracious...Great Balls Of FIRE!!" (as Jerry Lee would say....) Edward. | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 202 Registered: 03-2004 |
In Plane Sight is on the web in two parts: http://www.question911.com/linkout.php?filename=911%20-%20In%20Plane%20Site%20Directors%20Cut%20Part%201.wmv http://www.question911.com/linkout.php?filename=911%20-%20In%20Plane%20Site%20Directors%20Cut%20Part%202.wmv It's quite eye opening. The government is clearly lying (as if we didn't already know). | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 131 Registered: 03-2004 |
Hi Hunter! 9/11 In Plane Site was actually shown on Australian national TV last month! Australians like the US less than China, according to the latest polls, and the Leader of the (Parliamentary) Opposition said last week that our (vile) Prime Minister was turning Australia into America. ("Boo! Hiss! Throw the bum out! etc.") Times are changing! :-) Seen this? http://www.saunalahti.fi/wtc2001/military.htm (Michael Horn's tip.) Salome, Dyson | ||
Kiril Member Post Number: 63 Registered: 12-2005 |
Hunter: Gaiaguysnet - "9/11 In Plane Site was actually shown on Australian national TV last month!" Yep, I think it was shown in S.A on a friday night at about 11:30-12ish - I just caught the last part of it by chance after finishing work late. I wasn't very convinced of their final analysis, but perhaps its worth a better look - thanks for the links. Kiril | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 161 Registered: 07-2005 |
dear forum members I don't know how true this news is, but the UK and US troops are planning on withdrawing from Iraq by spring of 2007 as everyone would have heard from the mainstream media. As has been stated by the officials, they also recognise that having their troops in Iraq is the cause of continued unrest as opposed to securing peace fo that country. Is this a positive step or what, but if it happens then it may be just one of a number of steps needed for preventing the prophecy from fullfilling itself. Although everything is still open, it nontheless is one badly needed step. take care everyone | ||
Arie Member Post Number: 7 Registered: 02-2006 |
Good day Ladies and Gentlemen, As I am still becoming familiar with the Forum, I was not sure where to post these hyper links RE: September 11th and GW Bush related articles. I trust however that those participating in the FIGU Forum might have interest and use for these, assuming they have not already seen them. http://thepowerhour.com/ http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/060311/attacks_developer.html?.v=2 http://context.themoscowtimes.com/stories/2006/03/03/120.html http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=911revisited http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8260059923762628848&q=loose Warmest regards. Saalome, Arie p.s. To the moderator of this thread; my apologies if this posting needs to be relocated. Please advise where it should have gone if improperly posted. | ||
Pudd Member Post Number: 16 Registered: 02-2006 |
With regards to Bush and leadership of the earth, have a look at some of the awesome video's now showing on Guerrilla News Network(GNN).Specifically page B08004 where you will find video about freemason's of the world.The evidence is so overwhelming.Salome Pudd | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 169 Registered: 07-2005 |
dear forum members The protocols of the meetings of the learned elders of zion is a very powerful document in which victor e marsden's life blood it took to getting it out there in the world for us to see I thank Dyson for being so brave enough to publish this on his website www.gaiaguys.net/protocols.html This document is widely available in state libraries for those who's minds are ready to accept and come upon such powerful information for which after some really thorough inner searching and looking around, the pieces of the jigsaw puzzle fits in one by one. You forum members must read it for yourselves to see why all that incongruous, incompatible and the disdainful feelings which lingers on in our hearts from what is readily obvious before our very eyes as conditions upon which we are born and witness to came to manifest itself by the forces of the invisible guiding hands. Everything becomes ever more so clear once those lingering doubts, not by our self suggestion but by the evidence with which we can rest our very eyes and minds to, is shattered only to reveal how our minds had been hijacked and the sanctity of our inner domain simply imprisoned by those forces but also by our refusal to admit our own responsibility in letting them continue their evil enterprising, world dominating deeds. I came away much liberated and free having achieved an absolute link from what my subconscious knew as self evident but which my material conscious wasn't able to grasp in it's entirety. This document was the avenue for putting a lot of things into absolute certainty. Please be advised of dysons advice in the front section of the document before you read it. I hope you guys are able to piece together all the fragmentary parts that make up this society in which we are also part and parcel of and to observe the current happenings in the political arena, our obsession with sports, the declining interest by the young for religion, the monumental tussle and war of one religion against another, the world wide preeminent position in the political and economic affairs of the zionists and the jews, the image obssession of the young and the old, our insatiable appetite for material gain, the unquenchable thirst for accolades, stardom, fame and self aggrandizement, the selfishness so widely prevalent in our society, the tendencies to destructive querelling, the heightened litigious actions everywhere and the exploitation by the law industry to capitalise on peoples suffering as well as instigate problems for them. It goes on and on and on take care everyone | ||
Technod Member Post Number: 33 Registered: 07-2003 |
g-day all While trying to pallet the last dictatoral election we had in 04,i suggested that mabey having a infernaly stupid human{s} in the top slot may be a negative/positve situation. understanding the words that have been spokin of this war-monger u.s.a president bUSH jr.and also of the latest developments -war,outsourceing ports,pole numbers reaching ever increasing ligitamacy questions. The growing sensation of ,where is this team, led by donkeys that wanted to pull the cart in 04? I know the wise ones we know dont take part in political hogwash ,but does anyone heard of opinions from Billy or his friends of what the other side of the skull-n-bones coin looked like{Kerry/Edwards} . I want a sign that reads {slow down ,peace workers ahead}or be prepared to stop. for myself and others when the future looks bleak. peace-b}} brian | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 770 Registered: 02-2000 |
Newinitiation, The Protocols of Zion are a fraud! They are a Plagiarism of the booklet Dialogues in Hell Between Machiavelli and Montesquieu by Maurice Joly! http://www.freedomdomain.com/racism/protorefute.html "FIGU and "Billy" Eduard Albert Meier definitely dissociate themselves from all those abstruse conspiracy theories that are disseminated worldwide through books and the Internet. Books like those written by Jan van Helsing (alias Jan Holey), and especially writings like the so-called "Records of the wise ones of Zion" represent evil and defamatory machinations. Especially the latter is a concocted work of madness in order to defame and destroy those humans who are of Jewish faith. Practically all of these writings are a testimony of confused, religious and nazi-like fanaticism of the most degenerate format." http://www.figu.org/us/figu/short_articles/racism.htm | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 170 Registered: 07-2005 |
dear norm Norm I want to ask you then how you interpret billy's position regarding the quote you wrote. Does what he say mean that the freemasons, the bilderbergers, the illuminati, the tri-lateral commssion, the rosicrucians, the nights templar, the OTO, the zionists, all those masonic lodges around the world and other like organisations don't exist at all? My interpretation of what billy said on your 770 post is that although the document 'the meetings of the learned elders of zion' is a fraud, it nonetheless must have some basis of truth to which billy will not at present give a direct answer to, knowing his position and his awareness for the swiss law regarding defamation. Even if the document was a fraud to which david icke's book 'the truth shall set you free' mostly expounds as his theory for the ills that are happening around the world I cannot simply dismiss it as 100% hoax given the context in which it was written and what the purposes were for. Least of all billy did mention 'all those obstruse conspiracy theories', now we must determine exactly what they are and by whom, this is the crux of the problem, sifting the wheat from the chaff and the task would be quite daunting. The work of genius nonetheless, I have to say because you look around and see what is happening in this world. Couldn't you assume at least going from billy's information that the negative effects of the now deported gizeh intelligences still lingers on to this day and seeing as they have influenced with their telenotic devices hundreds of world leaders around the world to set the stage for destructive times, you could safely assume that these various world leaders must have ties to some other organisations besides their respective government posts. So getting back to the document, I don't hold it at face value but give it just enough credence as it deserves seeing as much of what is written in it would nonetheless be a genius blueprint for world domination, for whose benefit? the one's who are benefiting the most- the zionists, the americans and the british taken up from where the gizeh intelligences left off. anyway it's quite an interesting state of affair with all it's complexities. Thanks for the information and right now it requires no refudiating. take care | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 774 Registered: 02-2000 |
As I said the POZ are a proven fraud. The rest you will have to ask Meier about. I have asked many times. I just think its best not to link them all together. I think the majority of them are not even real & are used as a cover to throw people off. As in the case of British Intelligence using Knights of Malta heading when contacting W. Stevens by letter. when they were trying to get info on the Meier case. | ||
Mhurley Member Post Number: 119 Registered: 04-2003 |
People have a tendancy to assume something is true just because it is historical e.g. P.O.Z. same thing happens with the contents of the Da Vinci Code. Matt | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 171 Registered: 07-2005 |
dear mhurley I would say what you said do have a grain a truth in that then it requires the likes of us to lift the veil and penetrate to the very truth of any matter deemed worth discussing. As far as the POZ is concerned, I don't hold it as dogma and an end all be all holy grail that explains everything about our fractured society but then if you put the two and two together with other information from the works by machievelli, dante, chomsky and other such notable works, who is to say that the lessons of politics throughout the ages hasn't been learned by the very leaders of our time that reflects their current domestic and international policies for which if you read the POZ cover to cover, there exists no stark contrast other than conformity so glaringly obvious that it requires little effort in discerning the logicism of it's doctrines. Sure we must all think for ourselves in the end but with our limited capacities as individual human beings how can we know for sure exactly to how extensive the fraud is and how far the truth extends to other than rely on both sides of the argument from those who study it, to arrive at our own conclusion. It's never black and white. I guess the lesson here from such discussion as this one is in the end, learning about ourselves, about to what extent we are willing to face our own internal prejudices, self favouritism, ego driven stubbornness, our deeply held belief system whether it conforms to reality or not, our tendencies like you said to hold whatever to be true because of it's historical foundation, but then again this act of discussing is in itself a purging process, letting the cat out of the bag. I am trying in my own ways just like yourselves nonetheless. Thanks for taking the time fellas, it presents me with an opportunity to take in the mirror views of my own internal nature and I guess we all need a nudge here and there. Please do look into these websites http://www.savethemales.ca/000298.html http://users.cyberone.com.au/myer/toolkit.html saalom | ||
Anday727 Member Post Number: 17 Registered: 02-2006 |
...and history is often misrepresented to us, depending who present what, with what purpose. Matt, we are limited here with 5 stars only... but all stars in this universe are already yours, and also belong to all the people who can recognize the truth. Salome, Dejan | ||
Melli Member Post Number: 71 Registered: 06-2005 |
Is the American public waking up? Worth reading www.rense.com about M. Sheen and his assertion about 9-11. While you are on Rense, scroll down to read an honest article about the hidden truth of israeli mentality: "Israel one racist nation". I know the people, and I can truthfully say, they are proud to be racist because and I quote: "we are allowed to..." I often wonder what percentage of global population actually understands what is happening around the world, and WHY? But what I find most difficult to accept is the fact that- people don't care and choose to be oblivious, they don't even think to ask WHY am I in this situation? Seeing the grey clouds of misery slowly spreading around the globe, I can only just begin to understand the immense and burdensom task that Billy has been given and I often think that we earth humans do need help, and maybe the internet is not sufficient. If I am sounding gloomy, it's because I feel powerless as one person, so someone please cheer me up!!! | ||
Junior Member Post Number: 67 Registered: 12-2004 |
Dear Norm, Regarding your statment "As in the case of British Intelligence using Knights of Malta heading when contacting W. Stevens by letter." how did you find this out? regards, Peace to all, and one Love Junior | ||
Isabellacoca Member Post Number: 18 Registered: 10-2005 |
Hey everyone! Good to be back! I get email notices whenever someone posts something and this topic--Politics and Government seems to be hot! So, I guess, given the name of the topic, we can talk about the president of USA and such. Do anybody watch those boring speeches? Well, me neither, but last week, in the waiting room of a dentist place(i was waiting in line) and the tv was on low volume. Icaught a few words and then I realized that I was listening to the president. I turned up the volume and started watching it forthe 1st time. It turned out to be interesting, b/c I noticed he always cut off his colleagues questions(the reporters in the conference room) although he did laugh a bit out loud to make it seem funny or something and then he always avoided the questions. It's on the news about what his feelings and opinions were for the 11 million immigrants now residing in america, and of course i'm one(from romanian orphanages), so when a reporter in the room (live) asked him "Will the immigrants who have been here for a long time be considered permanent residents......?" I automatically sat up straight in my seat b/c i've been here in america since summer of '95. and i still have no green card, although right now, i'm finnaly getting a VISA. and all this is messing up with my college education. I was got mad at Bush b/c he completely ignored the question and in place gave a meaningless lecture on immigrants and the 2 seconds b4 he left for lunch he gave a vague answer, which i don't remember. Aside from our president, how many of you are still furious at the governments' slow reaction to Katrina? I was. I'm still mad they called the louisiana people refugees. they are not refugees but victims of a horrible hurricane. | ||
Isabellacoca Member Post Number: 19 Registered: 10-2005 |
Hello all, I forgot to mention, did anybody hear about what's going on now in the muslim world(politically). It seems as if their having their own liitle war. And then in that, their having a disagreement that has been going on for thousands of years! and that disagreement is about Ishmael and Isaac from the old testament, Abraham's sons. About who was older, and who really got the title having begun Muslim's history and such. I guess some people can never let go of an old grudge. | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 776 Registered: 02-2000 |
Junior, Its on the new International UFO Congress DVD that M. Horn is selling. http://www.theyfly.com/products/products.htm | ||
Junior Member Post Number: 68 Registered: 12-2004 |
Dear Isabellacoca, As I am living in a country with about 99% muslims I didn't hear about what you mentioned, where did you hear that. I know there are some dissagreements in general but not to a stage of even a little war. Regards, Peace to all, and one Love Junior | ||
Junior Member Post Number: 69 Registered: 12-2004 |
Thanks Norm, I actually only noticed the new DVD last week, but still didn't get around making an order. It seems to be very interesting... regards, Peace to all, and one Love Junior | ||
Isabellacoca Member Post Number: 24 Registered: 10-2005 |
hello junior, when i said "it seems as if their having their own little war" i meant disagreement. kind of like a known disagreement that's there that they can't seem to get over. i got it from my world history professor, but then again, i do tend to get things wrong when she talks because i'm not good with memory. whenever she gives us lectures most go from one ear through the other. next time, i'll make sure that i write down exactly what she said and intended to say because i could've made a mistake and got on the wrong foot with you and i don't want any bad blood anywhere on figu. i'm a novice, but time will eventually turn me in the right direction. thank you for correcting me. salome and love to all, issie(my childhood nickname, pronounced like izzy) | ||
Junior Member Post Number: 70 Registered: 12-2004 |
Hi issie, Its ok, you don’t have to feel bad about it. What you mentioned is existing but in small circles it not a very big issue within the religion, plus there are other things that are causing more problems or "little wars" then what you mentioned. Which could be recognized as old grudges. regards, Peace to all, and one Love Junior | ||
Vestri Member Post Number: 14 Registered: 02-2006 |
Bush declares war on freedom of the press: March 6, 2006 By DOUG THOMPSON Using many of the questionable surveillance and monitoring techniques that brought both questions and criticism to his administration, President George W. Bush has launched a war against reporters who write stories unfavorable to his actions and is planning to prosecute journalists to make examples of them in his "war on terrorism." Bush recently directed Attorney General Alberto Gonzales to use "whatever means at your disposal" to wiretap, follow, harass and investigate journalists who have published stories about the administration's illegal use of warrantless wiretaps, use of faulty intelligence and anything else he deems "detrimental to the war on terror." Reporters for The New York Times, which along with Capitol Hill Blue revealed use of the National Security Agency to monitor phone calls and emails of Americans, say FBI agents have interviewed them and criminal prosecutors at the Justice Department admit they are laying "the groundwork for a grand jury that could lead to criminal charges," CIA Director Porter Goss told Congress recently that "it is my aim and it is my hope that we will witness a grand jury investigation with reporters present being asked to reveal who is leaking this information. I believe the safety of this nation and the people of this country deserve nothing less." "This is the first administration that I can remember, including Nixon's, that said we need to think about a law that would put journalists who print national security things up in front of grand juries and put them in jail if they don't reveal their sources," says David Gergen, who served as President Regan's director of communication and also worked in the Nixon and Ford White Houses. Political scientist George Harleigh, who worked in the Nixon administration, says such use of federal law enforcement authority was illegal when Nixon tried it and still so today. "We're talking about a basic violation of the Constitutional guarantee of a free press as well as a violation of the rights of privacy of American citizens," Harleigh says. "I had hoped we would have learned our lessons from the Nixon era. Sadly, it appears we have not." "The significance of this cannot be overstated," says prominent New York litigator Glenn Greenwald. "In essence, while the President sits in the White House undisturbed after proudly announcing that he has been breaking the law and will continue to do so, his slavish political appointees at the Justice Department are using the mammoth law enforcement powers of the federal government to find and criminally prosecute those who brought this illegal conduct to light. http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/march2006/060306press.htm | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 182 Registered: 07-2005 |
dear forum members Yes it has become clear that despite the bush administration's denials that they have no intention of attacking Iran's nuclear facilities that they will concoct more fabricated intelligence to do so in the guise of protecting the US of possible nuclear attacks by Iran. There must be a feverish activities going on in the administration to design an ideal situation to do so. What better way to test their new hardware than at the axis of evil Such dangerous aspirations will not go unpunished. This year is a very critical year if this year 2006 is at all the determined accurate year. anyway fingers crossed and hope to the skies they regain some senses. peace to all | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 135 Registered: 03-2004 |
Hi everybody, I thought I should weigh in here after a bit of a pause. (Thanks for the flowers, Newinitiation.) CORRECTION: the URL for the Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion is NOT www.gaiaguys.net/protocols.html. It is www.gaiaguys.net/protocols.htm And Norm, I think if you actually believe that it is not genuine then you are one of the ones who underestimates Billy's intelligence, and has been gently misled. Billy's work is seemingly deliberately larded through with isolated loving pieces of work which seem to be VERY cunningly designed to keep those of us from psychic harm who would be "burned" by the truth. Naturally, I'm not going to list them here, but I guarantee that they will all turn up eventually, and engender the controversy that Semjase told Billy, 30 years ago, our planet desperately needs, so we can finally learn the TRUTH, and it can start to empower us. Salome, Dyson | ||
Eric_drouin Member Post Number: 121 Registered: 05-2004 |
Hello board: Hem hem... Perhaps you should read read this .... www.figu.org/de/figu/bulletin/28/zion.htm Note: Another reason to learn german ASAP!!!! Tschüss! | ||
Nestingwave Member Post Number: 17 Registered: 03-2005 |
Greeting Dyson and all. Even if the Protocols were written by some wanna-be world controllers who wanted to blame certain other peoples, that agenda is certainly being followed and has been followed by people in control of the worlds money and power structure. Again, the racial hatred that it has engendered is ALSO part of the very plan since chaos and sectarian strife are deemed necessary for world dictatorship. It espouses the old old formula of PROBLEM -- REACTION -- SOLUTION. "Solution" always means 1) less freedom, 2) reduction of civil liberties 3) more control over money and resources and 4) the arms merchants, the drug merchants and the human slavery merchants become more and more entrenched 5) society degenerates because the basic institution of the family is attacked and destroyed and 6) all kinds of sectarian strife pit every group against every other group for the sake of creating general chaos and unrest. The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion was discovered by mistake. Ever since then, the apologists for the evil contained therein have been trying hard to say that it is a "fraud." I have studied and read its history and discovered that the sanctions brought against it in history were quite spurious. The "legal" proceedings against it were a farse probably designed by the very people who wrote it in the first place. Is it "THE JEWS?" Absolutely not. Those "elders of Zion" consider the "Jews" to be "LESSER BRETHREN" who are to be exploited, used, trashed, murdered or whatever. Perhaps its like Jmmanuel/Jesus said, "those who SAY they are Jews but are not." It is clear, even from the content of the Protocols, that the writers (who call themselves Jews and are not) despise the Jews right along with the rest of humanity. I wouldn't blame anyone for NOT reading the PZ. it is undoubtedly the filthiest piece of insane garbage ever written -- and to read it makes one feel ... sick and highly polluted. Yet, just look at whats going on in the world today -- outlined clearly in the PZ. Regards, Roy | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 783 Registered: 02-2000 |
Eric_drouin, Can you summarize? | ||
Nestingwave Member Post Number: 18 Registered: 03-2005 |
Hi Newinitiation, I have the hope that some of the military men have seen through this bid for world control and will refuse to obey any order to use nukes or to stage another "war for democracy." But don't get your hopes up for impeachment of the King -- that won't solve the problem unless the puppet masters are exposed and the whole brood of vipers are thoroughly cleaned out forever. Look for another distraction as the showdown draws closer. It's high noon on planet earth and the controllers possess secret weaponry of immense destruction the likes of which none of us have yet imagined. That is possibly the reason why any opposing generals are proceeding with extreme caution. We have the real possibility of a coup and we have the real possibility of WW3 if a bad mistake is made. My, my the Plejaren prophecy is so correct about the year 2006 being a danger zone. Pray, meditate and send some good energy of peace, reason and sanity. WW3 can still be avoided. Not everyone in Washington is barking mad. Regards, Roy Smith | ||
Junior Member Post Number: 73 Registered: 12-2004 |
Dear Norm, Let me help you out on your request. I will make it in a point list. *THIS IS AN UNOFFICIAL TRANSLATION* -Antisemitisch-neonazistische Gruppen, Organisationen, Einzelfanatiker und sonstige judenfeindliche Kreise funktionieren seit 1903 offiziell mit den sogenannten <protokollen> herum. -Groups and organizations like Anti-Semitics, Neo-Nazis , individual fanatics and other hostile groups, have worked since 1903 officially with the so called “Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion”. -wie die Plejadier/Plejaren erklären - handelt es sich um ein ungeheures Lügenwerk, um eine ungemein üble Fälschung resp. um ein Plagiat, entstanden aus früheren Romanen, die nach Mitte des 19. Jahrhunderts entstanden. Gemäss den plejadisch-plejarischen Angaben schuf daraus der oberste Chef des russischen Geheimdienstes in Paris, Pjotr Ratschkowski, in den Jahren 1897/98 die endgültige Fassung des verleumderischen Werkes, das dann erstmals im Jahre 1903 in Russland in der Zeitschrift <znamia> (Das Banner) veröffentlicht wurde. -As the Plejarens explain it, with regards to the protocols there have been great acts of lies, there has been evil/bad falsification, also could be considered plagiarism, that originated from the early periods around the mid 19 hundreds. According to the Plejarens information, the head of the Russian secret intelligence in Paris (Pjotr Ratschkowski) around the year 1897/1898 completed the final version of the document. -the false allegations, that the protocols are true first appeared in the public in the year 1903 in a Russian newspaper called <znamia> . -Die eigentliche Verbreitung desselben fand jedoch erst im Jahre 1919 statt, und zwar recht explosionsartig als Werk russischer Gegner der Revolution von 1917. Zweifellos bestand dabei die Absicht darin, mit der Veröffentlichung der angeblichen Protokolle den Antisemitismus zu einer Waffe gegen den Bolschewismus zu formen. -The actual circulation of the document only happened in the year 1919, and was spread quickly as the work of the Russian opponent in the 1917 revolution. And it was mainly aimed to be a weapon against the formation or establishment of *Bolschewismus*. -Heutzutage werden durch die antisemitisch-neonazistischen sowie sonstigen rassistischen und rechtsextremen Kreise alle Regierungen und hohen Regierungspersonen sowie alle Banken und deren Bosse - an erster Stelle die Rothschilds sowie die Wirtschaftsmagnaten usw. - in die verleumderischen Machenschaften der <protokolle> hineinpraktiziert, um den Hass insbesondere gegen die jüdische Welt und deren angebliche Weltregierung zu schüren. -Now a days it is mainly used by Anti-Semitics, Neo-Nazis and other racist groups right extremists and all governments and high officials and banks and so on, but in the first position the Rothschilds and economies, etc. The aim is to practice the machinations and to defame, especially targeted at the Jewish world and to stir their alleged world government -Die <protokolle> sind nichts anderes als Lüge, Betrug und Schwindel in wahrhaftig völkerverbrecherischer Form. -The “Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion” is nothing but a lie, a scam and a deception; it’s a criminal act against peoples. Please note this is my first attempt to translate Billys work, Dyson if you could please point me out on any mistakes that you might notice. I didn't want to translate and post all of the page, mainly for copyright reasons.. I hope this will help understand abit of what is mentioned on the page about the protocols. Peace to all, and one Love Junior | ||
Pudd Member Post Number: 27 Registered: 02-2006 |
Freemason's know as bones-men praise the goddess Eulogia.Any-one know who she is?Also the goddess of the underworld Persephone located on top of the white house.Hoping some members can give me some in-sight here.Harmony & salome Pudd. | ||
Christian Moderator Post Number: 109 Registered: 02-2000 |
Hi Dyson, By displaying the "Protocolls ...Zion" on your website you are disseminating an infamous pamphlet of lies. You are walking on the wrong track! The translation above by Junior displays the truth. Best regards, Christian | ||
Isabellacoca Member Post Number: 49 Registered: 10-2005 |
Hello everyone, It's been a while since I came to this topic. Does anybody know anything about the state of Maryland and other states concerning gas prices? The prices are skyrocketing! But lucky me i don't own a car.  But unlucky for those who do.  I recently found out that a five year old african american called 911 because his mom had collapsed due to an enlarged heart. the call taker didn't believe him and told him to stop playing with the phone. he called 3 hours later with the same response, but this time he said his mom died. poor kid. how could that call taker think he was playing? now the boy has no mom and a family member has steeped up and sued for a million dollars! so much for trusting 911. anyway, i wonder what Bush has in mind right now as far as with the immigration issue. his decision could hurt me or save me for i'm one of those immigrants, but i've been here since 1995. 11 years. Salome and love to all, Isabella Coca | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 784 Registered: 02-2000 |
Isabellacoca, Are you legal? If you are it has nothing to do with you. Its about ILLEGALS! There's a difference, don't let the News Media confuse you! They are very good at it. If they had their way they would legalize billions of people & ship them to the USA. Its what Billy calls false humanitarianism. | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 136 Registered: 03-2004 |
Hi Christian, What logical evidence do you have to support your contention? I have heaps to support mine. http://www.savethemales.ca/000298.html http://users.cyberone.com.au/myers/toolkit.html. http://users.cyberone.com.au/myers/hiding.html I'm afraid I can't take Billy on faith in the accuracy of 100% of the information provided, and I think that is what he'd want from us too. “The ’Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion’ is nothing but a lie, a scam and a deception…” And “crop circles” (a similarly sensitive topic) were also, “a despicable hoax”, if I got that quote right, until it was suddenly discovered – rather LATE in the piece I might add – that indeed SOME of them were indeed being done by time-travelers now, is it? www.gaiaguys.net/chilbolton.htm As sickening as the "Protocols" of course are, an objective reading (if possible!) and a comparison to the inner (formerly secret) workings of the Freemasons produces a compelling series of logical arguments for its genuineness. But - like anything valuable we learn about occult organizations - there is quite a lot of digging involved before the truth starts to emerge, and of course I'm happy to admit I'm wrong as soon as I can be logically convinced with reasonable evidence, which I assume BEAM has access to, which is not yet in the public domain. I had a bit of a look through Junior's (welcome) translation and spotted an error of one century. Not "a display of the truth" in this isolated but important instance. Of course in English, "19. Jahrhunderts" is translated as the 19th Century, (the 1800's) not the 1900s. (A big lesson for all translators and readers of translations!) Perhaps I should make FIGU's position clear on our site, in order to keep people from thinking that the ideas expressed by gaiaguys somehow are also Billy's. That’s a shocking idea! :-/ Thanks to Roy for making the VITAL distinctions about the authors also victimizing real Jewish PEOPLE, who are more the innocent victims of the Powers That Be than the even the gentiles, in my opinion. (ref: Holocaust, pogroms, etc.) Salome, Dyson | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 785 Registered: 02-2000 |
I'll admit I was sucked into conspiracy research heavily until Billy woke me up. I even went beyond the POZ & was reading those Neo-Nazis books that claimed 6 million Jews didn't die. It got to the point where I didn't trust anything. Of course the News Media couldn't be trusted & anything they said I would think the exact opposite. Until Billy brought me down to earth & shattered some of those conspiracies. Its then that I realized that there wasn't the type of total control over everything has I had been led to believe by my conspiracy reading. I do believe the Secret Gov't Intelligence Groups plant seeds of disinfo very easily in conspiracy research. Just look at David Icke he's so fooled he believes in Reptilians now. But to hear him talk he's convinced he's figured it all out, when I exchanged emails with him many years ago about Billy he had no interest, because in his mind he already knew the truth. The conspiracy info got me reading in every direction to the point where I to thought I had it all figured out when in reality I was no where closer to the truth than before. At this point the only conspiracy I'm willing to bet on is the UFO Cover-up, that's the only one I'm 100% still convinced of. In the end I'll stick with Billy, even though its been hard for me to accept everything he says sometimes, especially when it shatters my belief in something that I swore was the truth, but I have found out that over time he ends up being right in the long run. | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 185 Registered: 07-2005 |
dear forum members My apologies dyson A simple error can and indeed have negative remifications. htm instead of html Lets step away for a moment the argument concerning whether the POZ is true or deception and focus on what is happening right now as we speak. From the articles on rense.com, it is alleged that 13 families own all the major banks in the US which also have ties to freemasonry. It is also explicitly clear that the wealth of the vatican is so enormous that it surpasses all the market capitalisation of 5 biggest US conglomerates put together. Now the association and infiltration of freemasons in the top echelons of the vatican is also clear and the details of the vatican officials who are freemasons is explicitly given. Put all this information together coupled with the fact about freemasons holding top positions in the government, business, education and what do you have but a glaringly obvious picture that a single organisation in conjunction with other similar organisations has preeminent position to decide the affairs and direction of not only each respective countries but that of the whole planet in a massively coordinated execution of its own agendas. Correct me if I am losing the plot here but what I wrote above in conjunction with many other facts coming from whole lot of other different sources tells me that what billy is refering to as obtruse conspiracy theories regarding the POZ must also be dissected and not take his expressed language given as it did at face value, there has got to be more or even less but simply 'conspiracy to what'? and if you take away the word 'jew' from the POZ and replace it with 'freemasons' then how truer would it be? Yes I recognise that all this could just be a ride around a mad encircling loop that is in danger of imploding on itself but regardless of who wrote it, if there is a mind that spawned such concepts and ideas then its more than likely it would have also have been enacted. just a thought take care everyone | ||
Isabellacoca Member Post Number: 50 Registered: 10-2005 |
Norm, Thanks. I feel better. Because being an illegal immigrant means that you broke the law and is hiding in this country without permission, right? but i didn't do anything. i'm like a regular american kid. all i did was go to school and play with kids my age. now is that a crime? politicians and media of all people! ^^ @ Salome and love to all, Isabella Coca | ||
Memo00 Member Post Number: 224 Registered: 03-2004 |
hi Newinitiation as far as i know not all freemasons (or members of other societies) are evil minded persons who want to rule the world most are simply common people like you and me who are searching for the truth priests, politicians and persons from a thousand different professions more, join mainly not because they are searching for world domination, but because their religion doesn´t give answers to their questions, and so you have persons who are christian and at the same time freemasons, rosicrucians, that study kabbalah, yoga, alchemy, astrology, etc etc and they go from one to the other because in none they find the truth of course there are sick persons among them, but it is the same than with any other religion or sect as i see it, a group who is really searching to rule the world cannot be so big, because their motives are always selfish, when problems arise then they split, and so today we have a thousand different christian churches, and the same with any other cult millions and millions of sheep while the ones who control all are very very few, and they are not together even if they have the same objectives but fight among each other (sometimes they may "cooperate" but only to achieve their purposes like today the US and Israel) and so you have the cardinals of the church, secret government agencies, secret groups of neonazis, the men in black, etc etc and all of them are working for themselves their tools are the lies, the confusion, the false beliefs and the murder, and their motivations are hatred and the egoism taken to the extreme, and so even when being part of the same group they can kill each other, and so the cardinals have killed popes, and so members the Gizeh intelligences killed their leaders (their fathers), and so in their little and confused minds it is them and only them who must rule above all . . . fortunately their own ambition will be their own doom. . . take care | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 786 Registered: 02-2000 |
Right, Do worry anyway the ruling elite of the USA will grant amnesty anyway. Their corporate masters love an endless supply of slave labor. Plus they are so afraid they will be called racist if they don't bow down to these special interest ethnic hustlers. Who are the real racists! | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 137 Registered: 03-2004 |
C'mon, people! Do your homework! Freemasons are - like most of these occult organizations - made up of very secret organizations hiding deep inside onion-like layers of diminishing secrecy, thus protected by dupes. That's VERY obvious once you STRIVE to find out the truth. That includes reading the (YUK!) PoZ, which describes the FM role well enough. MOST Freemasons, Knights Templar, etc. etc. etc. still have no idea what they are protecting at their core. OK? In spite of the endless lies told about us on the www, we NEVER EVER claimed that ALL Freemasons are criminals/pedophiles, and that disinformation, along with all the other in our adversary’s most recent media release, is designed to discredit us. Like the statement that we assert that crop circles are done by the Eastern Templar Freemasons! (?!?) http://www.otoaustralia.org.au/iframe_dec05_press.htm At the very center of all this complex dung you will find an unattended (since 1978) answering machine deep under the Giza Plateau. Norm, Icke DOES have the bigger picture, I'm pretty certain, (although Vivienne disagrees with me) but - for many reasons - has cloaked the truth in METAPHOR, as is historically common for authors of dangerous material in troubled political times, al la Cervantes, Swift, etc. He plants the idea that there is an untouchable ruling pedophile elite in the form of reptilian shapeshifting ETs, so everybody goes, "Sure", and then as the horrible TRUTH emerges, folks are a little more clued up and all that has to be done is, "cancel the reptoids". David is certainly often more trouble than he is worth to us here with his misunderstood tactic, but it was David Icke, in 2003, who was the first to publish the story from Dr. Michaelson which we then picked up from him and have made such great progress with. www.gaiaguys.net/victoria.htm Some people HAVE to avoid Meier, it seems, in order to fulfill their own (arguably misguided) scheme in the fight for the TRUTH about the Supranational Pedophile Elite. www.gaiaguys.net/vic.links.htm BTW, I just found this interesting summary http://melbourne.metblogs.com/archives/2005/11/persistent_rumo.phtml Salome, Dyson (“loudmouthed fool”) P.S. Neonazis are not the only people who claim that 6 million Jews did not die in Hitler's abominable Holocaust, but that figure was grossly exaggerated. So do the Plejaren. In Contact Book #6, 238th contact, May 18th, 1991, page 335. Ptaah says, “Wahrheitlich, wurden nicht 6 bis 8 Millionen Juden ermordet, sondern nur deren 4,06 Millionen, wenn hinsichlich gemordeter Menchenleben von NUR sprechen darf.“ = “Truly, six to eight million Jews were not murdered, rather only about 4,070,000, if, in hindsight, one is permitted to speak of murdered human lives with (the word) ONLY.” While we’re about it, on June 5th, 1985, in the 200th contact (Vol #5, p.149) we are told that Hitler was Jewish, by - of course - the same source that also says the PoZ is a hateful racist fake. | ||
Eric_drouin Member Post Number: 122 Registered: 05-2004 |
Hi: Thanks to Junior for your translation attempt! (I am still not there yet with German, i just finished one course. ) I think on terms of the influence of the Zionists, you don't need to look for conspiracy theories, whose origin are really questionable No later than 3 weeks ago, the neo-crazies in power(Cheney, Bolton and co) gave very bellicous speeches at the AIPAC convention , the most powerful lobby in the USA at the moment (Dr Goebbels would be proud of them!!). This lobby has even paid ads in major newspaper to influence American public opinion in favor of an intervention in Iran. So, no need to rely on some obscure protocol, just read news to convince yourself! This is not a secret conspiracy!!, you have the pro-Israel lobby influencing the US government, allied with fundamentalist Christians, before the public and the world! As Memo00 pointed out wisely, those people craving for world domination will destroy each other very soon, probably from NOVEMBER 2006 AND ONWARD, or the "enormous revenge campaign" that may follow. Isn`t that a creational rule that what is degenerated tends to auto-destroy, so that life in Universe is preserved, in the long run? Salome to all of you, like-minded people. Eric | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 788 Registered: 02-2000 |
"Hitler was Jewish" There's plenty of evidence of that. Hitler wasn't allowed to join the Thule Society because he couldn't prove racial purity. "Hitler was not sure who his paternal grandfather was, but it was probably either Johann Georg Hiedler or his brother Johann von Nepomuk Hiedler. There have been rumours that Hitler was one-quarter Jewish and that his paternal grandmother, Maria Schicklgruber, had become pregnant after working as a servant in a Jewish household in Graz." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hitler | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 79 Registered: 07-2004 |
The devious and demented ruling elite must constantly believe that their equals and cohorts they collude with are also secretly conspiring towards the others demise. The idea that a consolidated organization with members in the most powerful positions are reeling in the remaining loose power points for the domination of our planet, is weakened for the fact these personalities will/are continually trying to eliminate each other. Trust, which would be highly necessary to build a network to undertake the control of our world, is not a polished trait of these traitors of mankind. But, the connections that are overlapping and traceable to certain groups seem to point to a stitching together of the various power brokers. Dyson, you seem to frame your views with the basis being your logic processor. That works for me! Your ability to clarify your findings with a straight to the point statement serves this forum well. As well as the truly deepening dedication you burden yourself with, uncovering what could someday change the course of our civilization. Thank you for being a caring human. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Memo00 Member Post Number: 225 Registered: 03-2004 |
hi Dyson i will not question the authenticity of the POZ because the truth is that i don´t really care, but i will make this questions to you: 1- what positive (or at least neutral) effects do you think that reading the POZ can have? (taking in count that all kinds of people use the internet and obviously most ignore many important facts) 2- dont you think that you are just stimulating the hate against millions of innocent human beings, only because of a few sick persons? 3- ok, lets say that there is a secret group of persons who follow this "protocols", how are they affected (even slightly) by the publication of them? (if after all nobody knows who they are [if you say freemason or jew its like if you say christian or muslim]) 4-are you conscious that the hate and the desire to exterminate the jews will grow immensely if a disturbed mind reads the POZ? 5- are you ready to be responsible if someday a person (or many persons) are killed by the worldwide dissemination of that info? if you put all of this in a balance to which side it moves? aaaah and i just remembered, where it is said that crop circles are made by time travelers? i only remember reading that they VISITED them take care | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 789 Registered: 02-2000 |
"While we’re about it, on June 5th, 1985, in the 200th contact (Vol #5, p.149) we are told that Hitler was Jewish, by - of course - the same source that also says the PoZ is a hateful racist fake." Dyson, Let me get clarification from you, are you saying you don't believe these statements as fact? On the Holocaust, I think you missed my point about the 6 million. It wasn't about numbers, it was about whether the event even happened. The books I read said it didn't. | ||
Adam Member Post Number: 10 Registered: 03-2006 |
Hi Dyson, It is possible that David Icke has cloaked the truth in metaphor, however, in his books, documentaries and presentations he has gone to great lengths (especially initially) to present a case supporting his view of a reptilian ruling elite by interviewing individuals, providing historical references and so on. It seems he has not even hinted that this concept is a cloak for the truth. Even if it is a smokescreen, it is doing more harm than good as it is a cue to all the nut cases, channelers, delusional persons and so on to come out of the woodwork, confusing the issue even further. It seems to me he has his own agenda and what he considers to be the truth is somewhere on that list. I think you are right saying he is more trouble than he is worth. Regards Adam | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 186 Registered: 07-2005 |
dear forum members Look fellas, I think I also have something to answer for seeing as I sparked off the topic even though the POZ was posted by dyson on his website. Now I gathered that by dyson posting the POZ along with many many others, I didn't naturally take it in isolation but how it was relevent to the broad spectrum of materials that is also on his website. Now we as responsible citizens (or maybe not) dyson is merely the messenger of such powerful document for which I thank him, because if the intended purpose was so that people think for themselves, rarely do you come away after reading the POZ hatefilled against the jews but that by putting it in the right contextual basis with other information, you naturally try to fit the pieces of the jigsaw puzzle and try to corroborate with other materials and from your own power of discernment for the wider world to see how the POZ fits in. Of course there may just be those that unthinkingly take it at face value and do some harm but on the strength of letting us think for ourselves and decide what the conclusions are, why, we are also led to the materials from other sources from both sides of the argument to verify what the truth entails. All in All, I think its a positive thing to inform people of what is going on and if for one moment you put yourself in Dyson's shoes (not that he needs anyone to defend him), its definitiely a thankless task with many possible misfortunes and perilous journey ahead knowing the possible dangers that comes with walking that fine line, but also we need to consider what his intentions and motives are? why does he bother at all? why does he enter into the devil's lair when there are less treacherous grounds? That my dear friends will only become much more evident the more you know billy's teachings because I believe if I am not wrong Dyson is one rare breed of people in our society that dares to confront head on the cloak of stench that riddles so many a minds, and why, it happens to resides mostly in the minds of the powerful and the greedy, as if this is one prerequsite trait to be really 'in the brainwashed laymen's terms' SUCCESSFUL around here. So you see fellas, its not wrong to question against it and certainly I am no authority on 'Dyson', 'The POZ', or even whatever. But if we dig a little deeper within ourselves for answers instead of floating around just scratching on the surface of things, maybe just maybe we will truly achieve what true understanding really is, 'hey I am putting my hands down because I don't want to be a hypocrite'. So really, as far as I am conerned, there is much that we can learn from all this, about dyson, about billy's influence, about the creationals laws and principles, about our minds by the way we react and about the wider world and all the interplayed factors that shape it into the form that its in right now. Ask not what the world, dyson, and billy can do for us but what we can do for them. peace in conscience | ||
Der_beobachter Member Post Number: 44 Registered: 05-2003 |
Quoting the Poz... "Protocol No. 2 DESTRUCTIVE EDUCATION Article 3 3. Do not suppose for a moment that these statements are empty words: think carefully of the successes we arranged for Darwinism, Marxism, Nietzsche-ism. Please now CONNECT the missng links by reading this webpage is a must read to understand: http://www.globalfreemasonry.com/global_freemasonry_05.html CHARLES DARWIN THE FREEMASONS AND ROSYCRUCIANS ALTOGETHER. http://www.globalfreemasonry.com/global_freemasonry_05.html "Erasmus Darwin, Charles Darwin's grandfather was a "Master Mason." Erasmus Darwin was the true pioneer of the theory we know of as the theory of evolution that has been propagandized throughout the world over the past 150 years. Where did Erasmus Darwin discover the idea of evolution? Where did his interest in this subject come from? After a thorough search for the answer to this question, we discover the interesting fact that Erasmus Darwin was a Mason. Though, Erasmus Darwin was no ordinary Mason, he was one of the highest ranking masters in the organization. He was the master of the famous Canongate lodge in Edinburgh, Scotland.102 Moreover, he had close ties with the Jacobin Masons who were the organizers of the revolution in France at the time, and with the Illuminati, whose prime cause was fostering hostility to religion.103 That is, Erasmus Darwin was an important name in European Masonic anti-religious organizations. Erasmus educated his son Robert (Charles Darwin's father), who too had been and made a member of the Masonic lodge.104 For this reason, Charles Darwin received the inheritance of Masonic teachings from both his father and his grandfather. Erasmus Darwin hoped to have his son Robert develop and publish his theory, but it would be his grandson Charles who would undertake the enterprise. Although it came some time later, Erasmus Darwin's Temple of Nature was finally revised by Charles Darwin. Darwin's views did not have the weight of a scientific theory; it was merely the expression of a naturalist doctrine that accepts that nature has creative power."  Real Face of Freemasonry "The real secret of masonry is the suicide of Freemasonry as an organization, and the physical suicide of every important mason." } Der Beobachter Edelwei? _________________________________________________ "Lernen, ohne zu denken, ist eitel; denken, ohne zu lernen, ist gef?hrlich..." "Learning without thinking is vain. Thinking without learning is dangerous..." | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 80 Registered: 07-2004 |
Well said Newinitiation. When we speak of the things that have gotten us to this point in our civilization, we need to relate those topics to what the spiritual teachings offer as a contrast. The practice of always including elements relating to the teachings in our postings will re-enforce the knowledge and create constant opportunity for more discourse and growth of the goal to spread the truth of the mission. It seems like my postings are formed to be spoken to the general public. Does that feel impersonal and somewhat cold as a posting here? I'm thinking I'm not really adding much as such. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 791 Registered: 02-2000 |
William Cooper claimed he had it all figured out & that the Protocols of Zion where real, and the secret missing connection was the Priory of Sion. Which he got from the book Holy Blood Holy Grail which is now used in the Da Vanci Code. Which he then changed to the Protocols of Sion in his book. As anyone that follows Billy's teachings knows that the whole Priory of Sion is a fake. Pierre Plantard even admitted he created the fake Secret Society before he died. So please tell me how all this adds to our understanding? When in reality it adds more confusion, by adding more MYTH! | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 139 Registered: 03-2004 |
Dear friends, I wanted to get back and try to deal with the questions and comments that have resulted from my last posting, and I’ll try to go through them in strict sequence, for the sake of simplicity. - First, Eric, nicely put, I think, but what is it about November exactly? Did I miss something? Seems to us here at gaiaguys.net that the baddies have been doing their level best for quite a while to destroy eachother/themselves! Certainly providing help in the form of www.gaiaguys.net/Bersson.htm and the leaked OTO membership details (on our opening page) strongly suggests that whoever or whatever was coordinating things for all those centuries is no longer on the job. www.gaiaguys.net/AYTF-giza.htm But I think that degeneracy won’t stop by its own accord. It has to BE stopped, by the agents of Creation …us. In the last FIGU bulletin, Ptaah bemoans the fact that Dr. Rice knowingly lies to the public about torture, and WHEN (he wonders) will the USAmericans finally wake up and remove these dishonest psychopaths from power?! - Dear Shawn (post 79), thank you very much for your (over-the-top) complements, and your insightful and articulate contributions here. Much appreciated. I’ve no doubt that what we are working with is already changing the course of civilization, but let’s not confuse cause and effect. We are an effect of the New Times, and the dawning of the Age of Aquarius, not its cause. We are nothing more than an idea whose time has come. (Finally!) Please see: www.gaiaguys.net/meier.sww.p186.htm - Dear Memo00, you write, “i will not question the authenticity of the POZ because the truth is that i don´t really care.” This is a terribly revealing remark, and is quite counter to what I have learned from the renewed teachings to be important. The TRUTH is indeed a powerful and elemental force in and of itself that has to be revealed in order to work. It empowers and protects in a way that seems very weird and spooky until you learn a little more about the real nature of Creation, which is unimaginably loving, righteous and JUST. It is in this spirit that I decided – after a long and very hard slog of research and soul-searching – to publish the disgusting PoZ on our site, and Vivienne agreed, given my stated disclaimers. I await further clarification about the information that FIGU has about this. To answer your questions: Q: 1- what positive (or at least neutral) effects do you think that reading the POZ can have? (taking in count that all kinds of people use the internet and obviously most ignore many important facts) A:1 – It makes people aware of whatever the truth is so it can be appropriately acted upon. It helps spark much-needed controversy/debate among people who are inadequately informed otherwise, and assists in hastening the inevitable acute phase of our planet’s chronic illness. Billy contends (and I agree 100%!) that only when a festering problem can be brought to an intense stage can it be adequately recognized by most people (as a real problem) and then appropriately solved. Q2- dont you think that you are just stimulating the hate against millions of innocent human beings, only because of a few sick persons? A2 – No. I obviously don’t think that we are “just” stimulating hate, but we are naturally aware that this upshot will be an unavoidable side effect in some misguided ignorant racists. Let’s put this in perspective, please. A serialization/dramatization of the PoZ has already (to the best of my knowledge) been the most popular TV program in Egypt for some years. It’s already a well-known document outside of the US and her whores like Australia, where the Zionists’ cold dead hand steers the mass-media. Please see: www.gaiaguys.net/mediacorruption.htm and do your own research. Q3- ok, lets say that there is a secret group of persons who follow this "protocols", how are they affected (even slightly) by the publication of them? (if after all nobody knows who they are [if you say freemason or jew its like if you say christian or muslim]) A3- “secret”? Hardly. Please have a good read of (former UN weapons inspector) Scott Ritter’s book WAR ON IRAQ, which I laboriously OCR’d and is now available free on line linked from here: www.gaiaguys.net/armageddon.htm How are these doomsday freaks affected? How is a little boy caught with his hand in the cookie jar affected by the arrival of his mother? Better yet, how is a rapist at work affected with the arrival of a paddywagon full of cops? In a (putative) democracy, we - the people – are the authoritative force. As we say on our opening page, “A new superpower is emerging called the grass roots.” And I never said nobody knows who these PoZ people are. The Freemasons seem to call them “The Princes of Jerusalem.” Q4-are you conscious that the hate and the desire to exterminate the jews will grow immensely if a disturbed mind reads the POZ? A4 – Of course, Memo00. We’re not stupid. I think that ONLY when the true truth sees the light of day about the wire-pullers behind the scenes, will the innocent Jewish people be exonerated in the eyes of the world as the REAL victims of the insane ET who “chose” them as his people all those centuries ago. Imagine if you were kidnapped by criminals when you were a tiny child and led into a life of crime and horror. Would you not be a VICTIM? We are ALL victims of this ancient lie and the time for setting the record straight has come. Q5- are you ready to be responsible if someday a person (or many persons) are killed by the worldwide dissemination of that info? A; 5 – Yes. Absolutely. Vivienne and I are already acutely aware that – although other kids’ lives have undoubtedly already been saved – there will have been (and will be in the future) little children horribly ritualistically tortured to death by these 666 people in their sick and insane religious belief that the occult forces released at their awful murders will somehow or other work to remove our whistleblowing website. Please do your research, and the scales will fall from your eyes. Q: “if you put all of this in a balance to which side it moves?” A: It moves to truth in an agonizingly slow and very non-linear fashion. Three steps forward and two steps back. The spiritual evolutionary ladder is climbed a rung at a time, and we’ve only just begun our ascent. Q “Where it is said that crop circles are made by time travelers?” A I can’t remember! Help, anyone? We’ll add it to www.gaiaguys.net/ptaacropcs.htm - Dear Norm, you write in your 789th posting,(quoting me) ‘While we’re about it, on June 5th, 1985, in the 200th contact (Vol #5, p.149) we are told that Hitler was Jewish, by - of course - the same source that also says the PoZ is a hateful racist fake.’ “ Dyson, Let me get clarification from you, are you saying you don't believe these statements as fact?” “Believing”, per se, has nothing to do with it, Norm, and that’s a very central point to all this. I can’t simply “believe” our friends the Plejaren (& Co.) and Billy. I was never a “believer” and I’m too old to start now. I THINK, based on simple logic that Hitler was a Jew and the PoZ is genuine. Not that I think that makes a difference. Would Hitler have been less a monster had he been a gentile? What difference would it have made to those he murdered? OK. I misunderstood your point about the toll of the Holocaust. Having lived in Germany for three and a half years myself, if someone were to come up to me now and tell me that the Holocaust never happened, I think my first reaction would be to break his damned nose. - Dear Adam, the fact that David Icke is slowly drawing away from his reptoid foolishness while maintaining the push of real info about the (Earth human) Untouchable Pedophile Elite, suggests to me that he is gradually coming clean as the climate changes and becomes more accepting of the truth. Certainly he’s been a thorn in our side, and a mixed blessing, but – again – full marks to David for being the first with “Sarah’s Story” www.gaiaguys.net/victoria.htm It was David who supplied all the false names long before he met me. “Sarah Connor” was the protagonist in the “Terminator” movies. Who was the mad scientist? Some guy named “Dyson” – not a common name in the USA. Weird! - Dear Newinitiation, please! Enough with the personality cults, OK? You have a distorted view of my role in things I think! But I accept your kind words in the honest and loving spirit in which they are given. Thank you. But please understand that some things just creep up on you until you suddenly realize that you have a tiger by the tail. I always thought that we all have a MORAL OBLIGATION to stand up for what is right, even when we stand alone. A few years ago I thought of a corollary: “ESPECIALLY if you are standing alone!” Circumstances conspire to place us where we find ourselves sometimes and the fate we forge for ourselves is sometimes not as we might have imagined it when we still innocently thought Earth humanity was not rotten at its core. But Vivienne and I are not BURDENED by the yoke we choose to bear, because “truth is a yoke that does not burden” (OM). Think of it as having a huge helium balloon attached to your shoulders that lightens your step and seems likely sometimes to lift you right off your feet and up into the clouds. It is no exaggeration at all to say that we have never been happier, and we are naturally pretty cheerful people anyway. Fight the good fight and the rewards will come. I’m glad you pointed out that the context in which the PoZ is embedded is important for its adequate understanding. (It’s NOT “the Jews”. It’s the damned BAFATH.) But you are wrong about our need of personal defense on the part of others. We can only expose the facts to the public. If they were to ignore them, then it would be only a matter of time until both Vivienne and I will be serving six month prison terms for our open contempt of the (corrupt) Victorian Civil and Administrative Appeals Tribunal, (with whom we refuse to cooperate) who are prosecuting us this November 20th for religious vilification and victimization of the devotees of the insane religion which publicly identifies itself with 666 and an erect male sex organ. Don’t defend us for our sakes. Do it for the tiny voiceless victims of the ancient ritual religious torture and human sacrifice that has gone on TOO LONG. - Lieber Beobachter, mein Bruder! Thank you for wading into the battle! You are a brave comrade in arms! I hope to do more with the Darwin business a soon as I can. Thanks for finding it. - Shawn, re your 80th posting ... It is a forum designed to be published and I know I speak for many when I encourage you to contribute your wise views for the benefit of all FIGU’s readership. Imagine my frustration at not being able to provide more of the renewed teachings in the English language! But I’m learning how very important striving for this treasure is, in order to build up your spiritual muscles (so to speak) first so we are equal to the task of absorbing them adequately. Please keep up the good work! Your warm love gleams out of you “cold” words, I assure you. - Dear Norm (again), re your 791st posting, please understand how disinformation works. www.gaiaguys.net/DP-DDT.htm Pease do not throw the baby out with the bathwater. As was recently written about me and Australia’s pedophile ring here, “If a fool says it’s raining, that doesn’t mean the sun is shining.” And don’t forget that a favorite tool of the High Cabal is reverse psychology. Look how they’ve got good people howling about a mythical “New World Order” when obviously (& according to the Plejaren) ONLY when we unite as one planet with one common language will we know peace at last and become fully human. I’ll drink to that! Thank you all for the privilege of your valued company and thanks to FIGU and its moderators for the bully pulpit. Cheers! Dyson | ||
Isabellacoca Member Post Number: 53 Registered: 10-2005 |
Der_beobachter, are those egyptians' skeletons real?! GROSS and SPOOKY! Salome and love to all, Isabella Coca | ||
Der_beobachter Member Post Number: 44 Registered: 05-2003 |
Dear Isabellacoca, Nope ma'am THE SKELETONS are not real ones. The real Skeletons and dusty Mummies are located in Vatican/Rome.  Worshipful Master BENEDICTUS and the Mummies in the Lodge. This is JUST one single sample of the hundreds of ROYAL CRAFT er... art I have. Only their er....'faces' are the same as Freemasonry faces itself....  The "BOZO SIGN" er.. apprentice Boaz/Booz...gutural Sign, for real..as it is made in the Lodges... "The real secret of masonry is the suicide of Freemasonry as an organization, and the physical suicide of every important mason." and so it IS!!! Der Beobachter Edelwei? _________________________________________________ "Lernen, ohne zu denken, ist eitel; denken, ohne zu lernen, ist gef?hrlich..." "Learning without thinking is vain. Thinking without learning is dangerous..." | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 187 Registered: 07-2005 |
dear dyson Our english language is definitely a poor substitute for our thoughts, a tool at best but which can never unravel our complete thoughts with intended meaning but something you cannot do without, ironic though. Dyson you have my highest respects and with it my gratitude not because I know by having met you in person but by the thoughts you carry with you and the deeds you achieve through your work. Maybe I've over done it on the praise thing and the positive spin I unintentionally made you feel uncomfortable in a way and yes this time I think I will need to articulate myself accurately as I possible can so that there is no such misunderstanding on my part as well as yours. Often especially regarding such materials pertaining to something as radical and out of this world as billy's, I've often had to ask myself simple but hard questions as these, 'Am I going nuts here'?, 'Am I going too far with this'?, 'Am I letting this consume me out of proportion'?, 'Could this be dominating my life without myself knowing that I am falling deeper and deeper instead of being unlifted higher and higher'? and many many more other questions that needs to be asked and answered fully so that I stay objective, rational and sane. I think this will have to be the second time that I have to disagree with you on what you said and I feel it needs to be resolved without leaving any doubts lingering on so that there is no misunderstanding in the future. By clarifying things and speaking our minds honestly, it leaves little doubt along this journey of discovery. I don't feel hard done by in any way nor do I feel the need to defend anything but I just want to state the fact of truth as they are. I think out of respect I may have come across as leaning too positively out of proportion of assessing what you do or what you've said. I thought you as more of a person not unlike those benevolent people who've decided to abandon comfortable life and travel abroad to poor countries helping poor people, sick and abandoned childrens on the streets and such. These people don't do it for the glory, praise, self interest, out of guilt conscience, or what not but do so because they genuinely care, truly deep down caring for their fellow human beings and their plight, feeling the same pain and agony, living among the hardship with them and just doing as best as they can for a worthwhile cause and deriving happiness and satisfaction in the process for giving some happiness back. Obviously there exist too much pain and suffering in this world that one is compelled to do something about it. I've discovered billy officially through vivienne's article on your website and never regretted one moment of it. It was definitely a road to discovery but much effort was required as well. So in light of having done my own whole nine yards but obviously not enough yet, there are somethings that never leaves my mind and that is when I did comprehend enough of billy's teachings I realised what my responsibilities as a human being were, one of them was 'you shall have no idols and gods', now it didn't matter whether is was refering to religion or not but its nonetheless applicable to everyday life, But throughout my whole life even raised as a catholic, I never truly idolised anyone or anything although I would feel reverential for people I deem worthy of respect. So you see Dyson I know somethings are best left unsaid but on this occasion somehow saying nothing wouldn't do any justice to you or to myself, there are many sticky situations we encounter in our lives and we deal with them. So my position regarding your position is matter of factly speaking, as you said, a yoke that does not burden. In regards to using billy to understanding you as a person, I don't think this was understood well although my fault for being too obscure with my language, you are your own person driven by your own free will of course and simply the values and directives taught by billy, being very comprehensive, I am sure your life does reflect its philosophies to a greater extent, so if you know much about the teachings I gather you can use those understandings to see what you are about and what motivates you. So all in all, cult is definitely lunacy, idolisation is definitely feeblemindedness, excessive praise stings the ear drums, and the real business end is definitely about the wellbeing of the victims. I do care but I should care even more but I know I'll get there Dyson because in the end its definitely not about us or billy but about them. truly yours | ||
Christian Moderator Post Number: 110 Registered: 02-2000 |
Dear Dyson, I'm a bit late in this discussion but like to include three comments: 1) FIGU Switzerland doesn' t want to be connected to claims of an alleged truthfulness and accuracy of hatred-producing pamphlets like the infamous POZ (to our knowledge they are pure invention). Even if there do exist groups and agencies etc. on this planet who are working towards dark and criminal goals, you cannot take all of those countless conspiracy claims as truth. Many people show more imagination than is good for their psyche, and they see something where there is nothing, or something else. If you want to continue to display FIGU's material on your website, please include a clear note on the POZ pages that FIGU Switherland clearly dissociates from claims that the POZ is authentic. 2) Regarding the crop circles, the Plejaren did not say that they were made by ET's or time travellers, but that there are some extraterrestrial influences (non-personal at that). In other words: So far, the so-called crop circles are man-made (by terrestrial human beings), and the ET influences are "simply" universal-creative forces which have some influence when the creators of those crop circles are developing/creating them on their computers. You could compare those forces to inspiration in the case of artists. 3)Of course you shall not "believe" what I say, but you should "know" that what I wrote at the end of paragraph 1) is a requirement. Besides: I think that Memo00 and Norm made some sensible remarks. Salome, Christian | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 141 Registered: 03-2004 |
Dear Newinitiation, Thank you very much for your quite touching clarification. I think (for what that may be worth) that you are on the right track, but I just wanted to make a brief point about feeling other people’s pain, which could be called Mitleid (lit. "with suffering")/pity, as opposed to Mitgefühl (lit. "with feeling")/compassion. Billy teaches us that the former is brief and unproductive, as when we view starving Africans on the TV news for a moment, whereas the latter is a more lasting and effective response. BTW, Vivienne is glad to hear that her articles are doing some good. And regarding “Introspection and Insanity: A Gödelian Problem”, please scroll down to the bottom of www.gaiaguys.net/happy.htm Cheers! Dear Christian, Thank you very much for your reply to my contributions, and I have added the below disclaimer (in red, bold, highlighted, near the top of the page) @ www.gaiaguys.net/protocols.htm (FIGU Switzerland clearly dissociates itself from any claims that The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion is authentic.) Of course we are concerned that there are people who do not understand the idea of taking responsibility for one’s own work and not applying it to others, and believe that because Vivienne and I try to support FIGU to the best of our ability, somehow all the thousands of items on our gigantic website are somehow also 100% endorsed and supported by FIGU. Of course this is very illogical, but that is also only human. Our friend José was kind enough to dig out the more detailed FIGU material about the PoZ for us, and we will try to get it translated as soon as we can so FIGU’s position on this important matter is crystal clear to the English-speaking world. I think I understand the position you are in. Certainly those of us who have become serious victims of criminal conspiracies among the so-called responsible ones are more sensitive to them, but it does not mean that we have become gullible. Quite the contrary. At least there was apparently only one serious attempt on my life, not tewnty-one! (Our neighbor was murdered - shot in the back of his head - apparently in a case of mistaken identity!) As advanced by FIGU, we heartily welcome constructive criticism of the views we hold and recognize the need for logical argument devoid of any acrimony. I’m going to try to avoid much further detailed debate about the PoZ, at least until I’ve studied more carefully (and maybe translated) the abovementioned FIGU material, but I’d love to pursue the crop circle matter with someone someday who can provide more technical/mathematical information about these phenomena, which most lay people do not fully appreciate for what they very demonstrably are. I have many questions for you, Christian, but of course we are both very busy men, so I’ll simply ask you: Do you actually think that the explanation you have provided about crop circles is true? The reason I ask is because that position defies sensible logic, in so far as my deep research into this field (pun) has revealed. There is a new graph at the top of www.gaiaguys.net/Disclosure&cropcircles.htm that suggests that whoever is doing these field forms is nothing if not globally coordinated! Not to mention PROFOUNDLY technologically and (geometrically!) advanced, and (evidently) NOT on the side of The Ruling Elite! We live in interesting times! Thanks again for your tireless efforts to promote the truth, Christian, and all the best to all the other FIGU folk too! (AHHH! April in Switzerland!) :-) Love/wisdom, Dyson | ||
Eric_drouin Member Post Number: 126 Registered: 05-2004 |
Hi: Interesting article: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060420/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/brazil_nuclear Any comments Jose (Barreto)? Salome! Eric | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 151 Registered: 03-2004 |
Hi again everyone! Further to the above "Protocols" controversy, we've been digging some material out of the 136th contact which is sure to stir the pot. It will be linked off www.gaiaguys.net/meier.htm Salome, Dyson | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 847 Registered: 02-2000 |
"Republicans prevented more than 350,000 voters in Ohio from casting ballots or having their votes counted - enough to have put John Kerry in the White House." http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/10432334/was_the_2004_election_stolen Confirms Billy! My Website | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 253 Registered: 03-2004 |
Dear Matthew_ajy_b, "There is evidence that the Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion were written by Freemasons in Russia to obscure their own agenda." etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. WHERE is your evidence, please? This does not correspond with what we understand to be true. I detest these unsupported and defamitory statements of yours. We do not work this way. Do you understand? Please do not waste my valuable time. Salome, Dyson | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 848 Registered: 02-2000 |
The upcoming issue of UFO Magazine features a cover story on Gary McKinnon a hacker who hacked into Nasa UFO info. He may go to jail for 60 years. Here's the article, http://www.ufomag.com/public/21.5.32-37.mckinnon.pdf My Website | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 851 Registered: 02-2000 |
Gaiaguysnet "Further to the above "Protocols" controversy, we've been digging some material out of the 136th contact which is sure to stir the pot." When will this be done, I can't wait! My Website | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 254 Registered: 03-2004 |
Dear Norm, Let me just quote from OM, and assure you that we are doing all we can, while patiently awaiting promised advice from the CEO at Head Office. "Blessed are those who have learned to wait joyously" And remind you that we are all - to some extent - seemingly subject to "circumstances beyond our control." Salome, Dyson | ||
Hector Member Post Number: 49 Registered: 04-2006 |
Let`s try to follow Disclosure Project thread here. I never gave my opinion about Steven Greer and DP,because i never ever felt atracted by their material.I felt it to be quite superficial,boring and superfluous once i had heard of Billy Meier. To compare Billy Meier material with Steven Greer`s is like comparing three dimensions to one.While Billy satisfies your spiritual needs,DP for me is just a political journey,with aliens and the universe as electoral promises. Billy never talked about politics,and when he does,is negatively,because politicians rob the citizens responsability to use it for their own benefit.To adress the nations governments and politicians ,and to ask them for help to disclose UFO material,that`s useless,because nations don`t have any interest in UFOs.UFOs do not add votes,maybe they rest political parties votes.So DP is flawed from its conception.They are going nowhere. As we have the ecological party " the greens", we would have the alien party " the greer`s( <== no pun intended),and if the mars faces are explored,their secrets unveiled,this guys would portrait themselves as our saviours,spiritual guides and prophets (they would say "we spent much time and efforts researching and waiting for this to happen,this means nothing new to us,we were ready...etc.."). Mankind would concentrate on the hidden technology,on "visitors from outer space",but would skip what matters,to divulge spiritual contents. Fortunately,Figu,Michael Horn and Gaiaguys did not forget that task. | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 263 Registered: 03-2004 |
Dear Matthew_ajy_b, Your statements are defamitory of OTHERS, (Hatch, Sitchin, etc.) who I have a moral obligation to defend even if I don't agree with them. You can defame ME all you like! Go right ahead! :-) Your statements about the PoZ are breathtakingly ignorant. Find it on our site or the discussion board here and follow the links I provided. YOU have a LOT to learn. "But the idea that 'Jews' control the Freemasonic organisation is indeed unfounded. The Freemasons are run by the British royal family. This is quite official." Ha ha ha ha ha ha! What a sense of humor you have! (How old are you anyway?) Cheers! Dyson | ||
Pudd Member Post Number: 43 Registered: 02-2006 |
Dyson,,is the head of the OTO Frater Superior Hymenaeus Beta,and does he infact live in the states. | ||
Pudd Member Post Number: 44 Registered: 02-2006 |
Matthew_ajy_b,;;you have definately brought some vigor to the forum my friend. Now your questions,which is a very commonly known site,(one which Dyson was unfortunately banned/removed from)ATS (Above top Secret forum)and let me add it is full of proud masons,who are primitive and convinced of their mentalities. Moderators their are indeed masoic;;gaiaguys material frequently erased. More detail on you question,,I noticed discussion between masons known as Masonic light& Cug, Mlight would deny OTO was infact in berlin, Cug confirmed that it infact was but only because of the secretary general resideing in berlin. The thread title their was Aliester Crowly the father of Barbara Bush. Look forward too and quite simply enjoy assessing your posts.Salome Pudd | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 267 Registered: 03-2004 |
I was never banned, dammit. I cannot get onto ANY discussion boards but this one, for mysterious technical reasons beyond my control, and I just QUIT this one, like I quit $alla's P4C list. Salome, Dyson | ||
Pudd Member Post Number: 45 Registered: 02-2006 |
Thread title::Your question to Meier. Matthew_ajy_b,,,you appear to have vast knowledge or a massive imagination,,and at the very least, you are an interesting character. If you had a question for Meier and could ask him directly,;What would your question be?Salome to all Pudd. | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 622 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi All... Criminal Schemes of the Bushes! Mr.Bush made his concern of the media bringing to light the fact the his administration has been collecting information of all the money traffic going back and forth, around the globe. And the Central(data) Bank is in Belgium. And it seems that the Central(data) Bank head staff were up-to-date with this action and let Mr.Bush's administration proceed. But it has come to light, that not many government officials were up-to-date with this (Criminal) scheme...and thus want 'Clarification'! So, it has become a 'Debate' in Belgium! As we now can Acknowledge The Bushes are - Like Father...Like Son - ! When Mr.Bush senior was in power, the same-sort mentioned went in the processing! What I gathered at the time, from the Papers and the News was: that the NATO had new computers with all its Dings and Dongs...that go with, let be installed. Some way or another, someone in NATO found out that the concerning Computer Installing Company was "Copying/Downloading" personal data of every person they could get hands on which were in the NATO Personal Files Data Bank! It seems that it went on for some 2,5 to 3 years, or many more!? And what was - The Icing On The Cake - : was that.. THAT installing company had relations with the CIA and the Pentagon! (Couldn't get any better!) The then sitting prime-minister in my country wanted clarification to the matter, and if this was not to be explained: WE will just not pay the bill, he said! And while the NATO are Buddies to Washington! The copying/downloading of such data, was in those day 'out-of-the-question', but we all know HOW the Bushes in Washington work! Do we not!? Have never heard the feed-back to this above mention (Criminal) Scheme, anymore. Perhaps they may have made personal agreements BEHIND the backs of The People!(As usual!) So, as One can Acknowledge, from the above Criminal Scheme: WHY Osama Ben Laden took "Revenge" against his once Allied Buddies! Edward. | ||
Adam Member Post Number: 25 Registered: 03-2006 |
Hi Everyone, Stephen Colbert's appearance at the White House Correspondent's Dinner. http://www.dailymotion.com/sensemilia/video/143459 Regards, Adam | ||
Language_of_the_birds New member Post Number: 3 Registered: 06-2006 |
Enjoy it and spread it.  The Sage... THE BIG Freemasonic BOSS  Bush and Masons at a Texas Public School. G.W.B: The blind leading the not so blinds which are leading and enslaving the blinds.  A man of 'vision'...a bright example. Observe the binoculars... (Go online to Figu Forum to see images on this posting) www.gaiaguys.net/666.htm www.gaiaguys.net/herodesmason.htm http://www.gaiaguys.net/666.htm http://www.gaiaguys.net/herodesmason.htm Diejenigen, die das Mysterium erfahren, reden darüber nicht. Diejenigen, die darüber reden, haben das Mysterium nicht erfahren Versuche nicht, über das Unaussprechliche zu reden, "Those who have experienced the Mystery don’t speak about it. Those who do speak about it have not experienced the Mystery." Lao Tse | ||
Alan Member Post Number: 9 Registered: 06-2006 |
Why did they choose St. Petersburg for G-8 meeting? [img]http://www.ikzm-d.de/abbildungen/51_map_of_st_petersburg.JPG[/img] [b]St Isaac's Cathedral, St. Petersburg, Russia[/b] [img]http://www.saint-petersburg.com/images/museums/st-isaacs-cathedral.jpg[/img] [b]Capital Hill, Washington DC[/b] [img]http://www.ilv.ucl.ac.be/ILV-US/modules/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/normal_Capitol.jpg[/img] St. Isaac's Cathedral was originally the city's main church and the largest cathedral in Russia. It was built between 1818 and 1858, by the French-born architect Auguste Montferrand, to be one of the most impressive landmarks of the Russian Imperial capital. One hundred and eighty years later the gilded dome of St. Isaac's still dominates the skyline of St. Petersburg. Although the cathedral is considerably smaller than the newly rebuilt Church of Christ the Savior in Moscow, it boasts much more impressive fades and interiors. SAINT PETERSBURG St Petersburg - is the second largest city in Russia and one of the world's major cities, which has to offer more than simply the Hermitage Museum and the Kirov Ballet of the Mariinsky Theater. Officially proclaimed the "Cultural Capital of Russia" St. Petersburg is a place, where you need weeks just to see all its major landmarks. "The Venice of the North" has played a vital role in both Russian and European history. Founded by Peter the Great in 1703 it was the capital of the Russian Empire for two centuries. He crafted the world's most fascinating city on the numerous islands (44), modelling it in a French style and involving the world's greatest architects. There are 342 bridges in the city, of which 21 open at night. [img]http://petersburgcity.com/city/photos/rivers/bridges/egyptian/petersburg.egyptian1.jpg[/img] [b]Saint-Petersburg. Egyptian Bridge[/b] Among the majestic and poignant memorials, one can feel a breathe of intellectual life, which was also brought into St Petersburg by Peter the Great. The most famous professors, such as Leibnitz from Germany, worked on a project for the creation of Science Academy and other institutes. Now St Petersburg is ranked alongside Paris and Rome as one of the most beautiful cities in the world. City has changed its name three times: St Petersburg (1703-1714), Petrograd (1914-1924), Leningrad (1924-1991) and St Petersburg again from 1991. During 200 years St Petersburg was the capital of Russia. It is one of the biggest cultural centres in the world, the city with very rich history, traditions and promising future. Almost all basic trends in world and Russian architecture of the 18th-20th centuries are represented in St Petersburg. That's why the city called "A Museum in the Open Air". Its architecture is fantastic. There are about 120 museums, 40 theatres, 50 universities, 400 research organizations. [img]http://petersburgcity.com/city/photos/rivers/bridges/bankovsky/petersburg.bankovsky4.jpg[/img] [img]http://petersburgcity.com/city/photos/rivers/bridges/bankovsky/petersburg.bankovsky2.jpg[/img] Saint-Petersburg. Bankovsky Bridge [img]http://petersburgcity.com/city/photos/theatre/aleksandrinsky/petersburg.aleksandrinsky2.jpg[/img] Saint-Petersburg. The Aleksandrinsky Theatre [b]Believe it or not but this is St. Petersburg Russia:[/b] [img]http://www.st-petersburg.ru/common/photogallery/feodorova/egypt/12.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.st-petersburg.ru/common/photogallery/feodorova/egypt/7.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.st-petersburg.ru/common/photogallery/feodorova/egypt/4.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.st-petersburg.ru/common/photogallery/feodorova/egypt/15.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.st-petersburg.ru/common/photogallery/feodorova/egypt/16.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.st-petersburg.ru/common/photogallery/feodorova/egypt/19.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.st-petersburg.ru/common/photogallery/feodorova/egypt/21.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.st-petersburg.ru/common/photogallery/feodorova/egypt/20.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.st-petersburg.ru/common/photogallery/feodorova/egypt/23.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.st-petersburg.ru/common/photogallery/feodorova/egypt/24.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.st-petersburg.ru/common/photogallery/feodorova/egypt/25.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.st-petersburg.ru/common/photogallery/feodorova/egypt/26.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.st-petersburg.ru/common/photogallery/feodorova/egypt/11.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.st-petersburg.ru/common/photogallery/feodorova/egypt/2.jpg[/img] [img]http://www.st-petersburg.ru/common/photogallery/feodorova/egypt/1.jpg[/img] The lands along the Neva River have belonged to the Ancient Russian state since at least the 9th century. However, throughout history these lands have had a mixed population of Slavs, Finns and other ethnic groups. From at least the ninth century this area was part of of Novgorod. Novgorod was an important center of international and domestic trade and craftsmanship. Novgorod merchants traded with Western and Northern Europe and later with the towns of the Hanseatic League. All that trade went through the Neva River and through Lake Ladoga. In 1240, when most of Southern and Central Russia was fighting the Mongol invasion, a Swedish force landed at the banks of the Neva River. The Founding of Saint Petersburg During the course of the Northern War with Sweden the Russian forces have gradually moved from the Lake Ladoga region down the Neva River to the Swedish fort of Nienchanz. After an 8-day siege on May 1, 1703 the Swedish garrison surrendered. Map of Saint-Petersburg 1713 year" To protect the newly conquered lands in the Neva delta Peter the Great needed a fortress, but Nienchanz was small and badly damaged. Looking for a site for his new fortress, Peter the Great chose the island of Enisaari, which was known to the Russians as Zayachii Ostrov. On May 16, 1703 (May 27 by the modern calendar) the St. Petersburg fortress (St. Peter's and Paul's Fortress) was founded and that day became the official birthday of the city. Peter the Great look at plan of Saint-Petersburg" Several days later a wooden Cabin of Peter the Great was built, becoming the first housing structure of the new city. The original clay walls and bastions of the fortress were completed by the end of the summer of 1703 under the careful supervision of the tsar and his close associates. The builders of the fortress (mostly soldiers and peasants) worked in very primitive conditions, since the climate was very damp, good housing non-existent and food in very short supply. Working from dawn to dusk, they died in great numbers, but the war still went on and the fort had to be completed as soon as possible. Source -- http://www.st-petersburg.ru/en Interesting... isn't it? | ||
Technod Member Post Number: 46 Registered: 07-2003 |
Hi Does any one think Jesse Ventura,(who was a governer for Minnesota )would be a reasonable person to support if he would run for the 08 presidential election? brian | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 933 Registered: 02-2000 |
I vote for all third party candidates when possible. Anyone is better then Dems & Rebs. My Website | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 132 Registered: 07-2004 |
Hi Brian, Leaders such as Jesse Ventura are rare. His ability to remain unattached to corporate affiliations, and the true beneficial services he oversaw for his constituents serving as a governor, are indicators that he does qualify as a more promising choice as a presidential candidate, if he was to run. Regardless of the name of the political party that a candidate runs under, a choice for president should be examined on what they've done and not just because they are a third party candidate. That would be unwise. Sometimes the best way to change a bad situation is to enter the problem area to erect a new center of ideas that can draw away from the focus and resources of the negative factions, to create the start of a more positive foundation. The political parties are not 100% filled with all undesirables. Currently a broad stroke of the brush in the world of politicians is the unfortunate norm. We should strive to search out the true individual traits and track records of candidates and let that be a better starting point for consideration than just being a third party. Logical thinking is the best tool for your decision. It's been known that a third party has been offered as an attempt to dilute a competitors base. A third choice that offers similar campaign promises to one of the other candidates, sugar coating their versions, can swing the outcome and thus becomes an effective tool for the opposing candidate at election time. These people who wish to unfairly control our leadership. Unlike some people, I believe in researching to obtain better results. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 244 Registered: 07-2005 |
Hey everyone As you all know, a propective candidate with great qualities, on the strength of those qualities alone, cannot maintain and realise their vision without prematurely meeting their demise, if they don't conform to party standards. Politics is a dirty word and the realities are, any potential hopeful, be he a well intentioned person with the right qualities will enter headlong into an arena already established by the one's that came before him, who have already established the kind of culture, norms, expectations, inferences, protocols etc that the upstarts must conform with or he'll be eaten alive by the establishment without so much as making his personal mark and any legacies he would loved to have proffered his constituency. I don't think any established institution such as politics will ever change for the better as it appeals to the man's insatiable lust for control and power and for those that cannot thrive in such atmosphere seem to be the ones who have a stronger sense of conscience and scruples. Change happens really slowly, drop by drop, step by step but if I was granted one wish from the plejarens, it'll be the drastic inculcation, like a master program of Creational truth and principle to every living person's psyche imprinted ironclad into every faric of their DNA to prevent them from degenerating, thus living their lives in Creational harmony with peace, love freedom and harmony, this will surely make some positive impact though, if it wasn't for that free will issue. But obviously seeing as people should be free to self determine their fates, I guess my wish is no different to the Big Brothers of this world who wants to subjugate and control the will of the masses into bondage where true freedom is curtailed, that's why I guess good intentions are never satisfactory. Anyway back to the point, if we want changes, I can't think of a way to do it at the moment, but a drastic changes or riddence of all prior establishment and all the players involved must be carried out, the problem is definitely with the system and also with the people that create the kind of system that reinforce each other in an endless loop without oversight or progressive evolution. Politics appeals to the lower sense of our nature, it's a jungle where everyone is in it for themselves in a mutual symbiotic need basis relationship that are more utility oriented but never is self interested motive far away from any politician's mind. Treachery, back stabbing, charade, make-believe is a given and the norm, so any great ideas you fellow member have offered is ideal if the world and most people in it truly understood the Creational truth, who strive to live their lives on spiritual standards rather than ambition, self profit, self aggrandizement etc. But nontheless great ideas fellas Cheers | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 937 Registered: 02-2000 |
"Regardless of the name of the political party that a candidate runs under, a choice for president should be examined on what they've done and not just because they are a third party candidate. That would be unwise." I guess this is directed to me. "I vote for all third party candidates when possible." Meaning I voted for Kerry in the last election because a vote for Nader would have been a wasted vote. It was more important to get rid of Bush. So I settled for the "lesser of two evils". I have voted for Perot twice & Nader once. My votes are more of a protest than anything. Of course I hoped each person I voted for would win & I thoroughly research everyone I vote for, & I never vote for Communists & Nazis just to protest!!! I hope thats clear enough! My Website | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 136 Registered: 07-2004 |
" Communists & Nazi's " ? Where did this crawl out of? I guess this is directed to me. "I vote for ALL third parties when possible" My comments reflect off the post I've read. The name attached to the post is not an issue. Surely you don't think your being shadowed, do you? I apologize if I made you think you were that important. The messengers are not the reason why people post here. I only insert my thoughts into any discussion if; A) I am interested and want to learn about such, or, B) I have information about such discussion I think may help. My interests here are A and B, ONLY. Never the less, I did get a momentary chuckle out of this and laughter has always made life easier for me. Thanks. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 939 Registered: 02-2000 |
"I apologize if I made you think you were that important." Shawn, Yawn  My Website | ||
Wall2wall Member Post Number: 9 Registered: 03-2006 |
The problem with the American electorial process is that the only persons able to compete in elections are the richest and wealthiest of us. Which attracts greedy and the connected. Until money is excised from our government process, corruption and pandering will be the toll of the day.....everyday in washington. | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 141 Registered: 07-2004 |
W2W, We need to eliminate the corporate cash, minimize the allowed donation per donor, create a public matching fund, allow only equal media time, and require a sequence of public debates for the candidates. A equally standard format that must be adhered to for a candidate to qualify for the election ballot. No one can overwhelm with their backing with media blitz's. I know it's a long shot. Politics are the open festering wounds of our society. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 946 Registered: 02-2000 |
Wall2wall, I agree. My Website | ||
Rarena Member Post Number: 57 Registered: 10-2005 |
Politcal Science... kind of like Jumbo Shrimp... an oxymoron... approximately equal Brave politician apathetically urged almost safe border control Beaucractic efficiencies Congressional oversight clearly ambiguous direct circumvention Executive decision fairly obvious graphic language Government assistance House Ethics Committee holy land hopelessly optimistic Internal Revenue Service Marion Barry Quotes. Aside from the murders, DC has one of the lowest crime rates in the country... | ||
Matt Member Post Number: 56 Registered: 04-2006 |
This is an interesting article i found at Moscow news.com website - Ukrainian Parliamentarian Suggests Jailing Freemasons: Ukrainian MP Taras Chornovil has suggested that the country’s parliament, the Supreme Rada, introduce criminal responsibility for Freemasonry He has submitted to the Rada a bill entitled “On amendments to the Criminal Code of Ukraine”, according to which, membership of Freemason organizations, or any other organizations that require rituals and oaths of higher priority than the current law, must be punished by a jail sentence of up to three years. The bill also reads that the members of Masonic organizations who are Ukrainian civil servants, law enforcers or military servicemen must be jailed for three to seven years. Ukraine’s president, members of parliament, civil servants of ministerial rank, military servicemen and law enforcers of the rank of major-general or higher, if discovered to be members of Freemason organizations, may face up to 10 years in prison. http://www.mosnews.com/news/2004/12/07/masonsukraine.shtml | ||
Junior Member Post Number: 97 Registered: 12-2004 |
Dear Edward, You caught my attention with your post in the Learning German Section of the forum regarding the “Declaration of Independence - IN GERMAN”, I decided to continue the issue in this section just to respect the moderator request to stick to topics, anyway after checking around on the net I got to this website http://www.dhm.de/magazine/unabhaengig/decl_index.htm It seems that it was translated from the English version but only distributed in Pennsylvania… but the date it was distributed the first time is unknown… A couple of excerpts from the website… “the printing in 1787 of 3500 copies of the translated Constitution of the United States in Pennsylvania alone - document that the one third of Pennsylvanians who in 1776 spoke only or also German could well participate in the period's great political debate in their mother tongue. It is, however, a nineteenth-century legend that there ever was a referendum or vote on making German the official language of Pennsylvania, let alone the United States.” “On May 15, 1776, Virginia's legislature instructed its delegates in Philadelphia to vote in favor of declaring independence.” Regards, jr. Peace to all, and one Love Junior | ||
Technod Member Post Number: 47 Registered: 07-2003 |
Hi does any one have a couple of cents worth on the peace keeping mission that the French are said too be leading? Was it said by Billy that it will be interesting to see what kind of outcome will happen with this? Peace Brian Best | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 645 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi Junior.. Yes, I am familiar of what you have posted. I can understand it from the point of view that the majority speak English and the minority German, and thus logical printing it for the majority, which speaks for itself. There has been all sorts of controversials and versions on this, as I have noticed. Whom are we to accept?? But I must agree, the dates do make the difference. As I understand it: the 'script concept', that..was in English, which was than translated into German, thus...printed/pressed in German(distribution copies - Franklin's input/influence) and then, again the official (English) version with the earlier date on it(concept date, or what ever), than that of the German date. So, it is a bit confusing, not? So, did The Chicken Come First...Or The Egg... My information was from a divers of biographies of Benjamin Franklin, and his influence to the mentioned above, whom had many ideas to change America for the better; thus, in language(German), and even a much Social Welfare Structure country; monetary..etc...etc. But than again, many ideas of his could not be realized in his days. He just did not have the power...and position. Even in documentaries I have seen of him, the German language was mentioned by him. He was really serious about it, as what I understood. So, it seems we are caught in a "History Dilemma" made into realization by Historical Scholars and writers...etc; which have their own ways of interpreting what has happened in the past, with many things...in America. Some times it comes down to: Whom is telling the Truth - The Democrat or the Republican....so to speak - ?? Thus, it becomes very Politicized...? Thank you for your input. Edward. | ||
Michael_d Member Post Number: 132 Registered: 03-2003 |
Technod, I share your concern with the French leading any UN peace-keeping mission in Lebanon. The French have an enormous Muslim population, the largest in Western Europe at over 6 million. Their problems with rioting last year show that population to be easily triggered and somewhat organized. What might happen if French troops commit Abu-Ghraib or Fallujah-type offenses in Lebanon? Wouldn’t want to see the French Muslim population get out-of-control and seize their nukes like Henoch prophesized. | ||
Technod Member Post Number: 48 Registered: 07-2003 |
Hi Michael_d yes ,that senario would suck but i wonder what is to be gained by whoever is leading a peace mission in that the success of being neutral and actually creating peace between the to partys and how that could lead to a less obstructive future.I dont know much about the french except that they dont lock step with our unstable goverment,at least thats how i understand it. Also i think i heard news reports say the E.U are send large amounts to the peace effort.I would think it is better to have one command leader organizeing the mission then spliting it up so long as that leader represents the peaceful majority.g-day Brian Best | ||
Kiril Member Post Number: 107 Registered: 12-2005 |
Topic : The formation of a Natural Politics Is it possible and if so, what are the basic principles and practical consequences of such a system. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Definitions: a - Politics: The principles of ethics applied to groups of humans - principles that guide their interactions, whatever they may be. b - Natural Politics: A political system which derives its principles from a creational or natural ethics. c - Ethics: The science which aims to discover mans proper mode of action in the universe - to simplify further: all endeavours in the field of ethics are governed by one question - "What should I do?" (I welcome disagreement of the above definitions, with reason) I wish to generate discussion on the topic of politics, as I have defined it above - more specifically, in the context of the 'spiritual teaching' of the Meier case. To this end I propose the following points of discussion: - What would be the defining principles of a culture that is governed by a 'natural politics' - in other words, what are the fundamental moral values of such a society? - What might be some of the laws and norms/customs that emerge, as a consequence of those principles? The main reason why I wish to discuss this topic: Although there are many posts and articles relating to this topic on the internet. it is very difficult to reach any concrete conclusions on the subject. This is because they relate to various different aspects of politics, in different contexts(therefore it is difficult to relate them) and sometimes in what seem to be contradictory terms. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thanks, Kiril | ||
Psycloud Member Post Number: 46 Registered: 06-2006 |
Well when it comes to 'natural politics' as what the peoples funadamental morals are, that would differ between different people, which leads us back to the gray area that we are in. A solution to the situation would be to put people into power who have higher standards then the average person when it comes to fundamental morals, the problem comes when there are people who are in power with lower standards, as an example, the US president, who make bad descisions based on his morals, and not all the peoples. We should re-examine this one. I am truthful to the extend at which I know the truth. | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 171 Registered: 07-2004 |
Taking a planet wide role of education that stress's more than the basics. Education aimed at creating a critical universal understanding of the planets ecological system and preservation across all borders and peoples. The need for each and every student to have a clear knowledge of what the dangers are of exploiting our world. If all schools of knowledge instituted the proper knowledge of how to care and properly exist in a resourcefully balanced cycle, our immediate chances for survival into the far future would become most assuredly greater than the polluted destiny that lurks closer each day for us now. Instilling a solid ecological concern and logic that demands from all people that a near zero destruction or depletion of the Earth's delicate ecosystem, has at its heart a purifying motion when such a level of educated involvement becomes complete. I see the mission becoming more accessible to the people that see this Earth as part of themselves and their children's future. A natural focus of preserving our world would also preserve our fellow human beings as part of this planet. As we raise each new generation, conscious in the preservation of all of Creation, our spiritual bodies could begin growing again, catching up to our technological knowledge. I can only think that the unbalance that present humans operate in as a norm, to be a nearly insurmountable challenge due to the over-population that will continue to race out of control. The planet would need to be wiped virtually clean of its human burden. The fresh start cleansing to rebuild our society within the Creation Laws. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Kiril Member Post Number: 108 Registered: 12-2005 |
Psycloud, I wish to focus this discussion on exactly what those "high standards" actually consist of and how they are to be applied to groups of people. some notes: "...the US president, who make bad descisions based on his morals, and not all the peoples." What are the morals of all the peoples? - there exists no such thing! As to the solution you've put forward: I find it difficult to comprehend how such a leader would help, particularly in our current 'climate'. Ultimately the success of groups of people is dependant on the quality of each individual in that group - or more exactly, the quality of their ideas. No amount of force from a dictator or a dictator state(that is, a democratic state, one in which there exists unlimited majority rule) can bring any long-term progress. Kiril | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 270 Registered: 07-2005 |
What has already been laid out by Billy in terms of the conduct of every man, women and children that must be achieved if there is to be a permanent peace, harmony, love and freedom in this world is the very politics that governs the relations between the human and the society. Society is created by the expressed actions of people from within and from without, likewise the prevailing attitudes, tendencies, characteristics, behaviour, lifestyle, aspirations, norms, expectations and beliefs that people express are also to greater extent, influenced or rather reflected by the nature of the society in which people are born from. Billy meier teaches us that, no matter what the nature of the political, religious, philosophic, economic, sociological systems that governs and dictates how the human relation to one another will be, unless the expression and alignment towards Creative Natural Laws are achieved, the persistence of the root cause of all the ills in society will remain. Therefore, if one talks about Natural laws and commandments, out of being aligned to it, the natural progression and crystalisaton of a politcal system that is just, fair, righteous and dignified will be the indirect effect out of the cause of every person assuming full responsibilities for their own thoughts, feelings and actions, thereby if each member of society recognised what is good and what is bad, then one of the recognition that there is a worldwide population problem, out of control, tipping the balance of the nature, would spur them to follow the guidelines set forth by the plejarens. http://www.figu.org/us/overpopulation/index.htm Not only that but also follow www.theyfly.com/PDF/PlejarensWish.pdf www.theyfly.com/PDF/SpiritualDevelopment.pdf http://www.gaiaguys.net/49Directives.htm http://www.gaiaguys.net/meierv1p150-157.htm http://www.gaiaguys.net/Humandoesnotknowlove.htm There lies in the timeless teachings of wisdom contained in these short articles and other books from FIGU, what mankind must do to change the world for the better. Now, how much more that a president of a nation, especially from the G8 can achieve if they'd sacrificed their reputation, position, thirst for power and so forth, to muster the courage to say, "Yes, we have a major problem and the only way that we can turn back the tide is by recognising Creational Natural Laws and Commandments", would not this symbolic action albeit at the behest of one powerful person's reputation achieve so much for the cause of genuine freedom, love, harmony and peace in this world. Wouldn't this act create so much publicity and momentum that will shake the foundation of civilization in an instant, no matter how bad the publicity and outrage. But then again, the question is, who among the G 8 presidents will sarifice so much that they've desired so much for, to risk life and limb and anounce to the world about Billy Meier? That is why, expecting a miracle is futile and so is any change for the better in the short term. Change is slow and so is people's willingness to accept the truth. So basically, it is left to us small folks who represents the tiny spark that'll one day light up the chauldren which will burn indelibly to light up the whole arena for the world to be salvaged from abyssmal darkness still reigning for some time to come yet. | ||
Scott Moderator Post Number: 900 Registered: 12-1999 |
Hello Newinitiation, I don't think man will understand the purpose of Creation and its Laws and Directives, until they come to realize the existence of Creation and the Spirit within. OM Canon 40 41: Man of Earth shall finally awake, so that he sees the Truth and recognizes it in all its glory. Regards Scott | ||
Indi Member Post Number: 5 Registered: 06-2006 |
Hello Newinitiation and Scott and all I was watching TV last night, and was saddened show after show, as I witnessed the evidence of where 'we' have gone wrong on this planet and ended up. The sentiments Newinitiation has expressed I resonate with. What I am interested in, would be how other Humans on other planets, have come through this and turned it around? It all seems too much to resolve by individual means -- that maybe some disaster needs to befall us before people stop and look --- Have the Plejarens or others given us info on this kind of thing -- apart from the guidelines for individual growth and influence? I am aware that the Plejarens history was not always one of peace etc.... so how did it change to what it is now? Robyn | ||
Scott Moderator Post Number: 901 Registered: 12-1999 |
Hi Robyn, No doubt other worlds have gone through similar trials and tribulations, some successfully, others not (Malona)....in some ways we are at an advantage due to Billy's and the Plejarens help, but the damage done by Religion and Politics has not helped things....Even when races have reached the level of evolution where space travel is possible, that does not mean they have evolved to the point where they are living in peace and compliance with natures laws..Planet Akart with its sudden overpopulation problem suffered massive loss of life, even though they have developed space travel... Scott | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 1016 Registered: 02-2000 |
String pullers, WTC, Apollo 11, Kennedy, Roswell, etc etc etc. Have we ever gotten a name for the people that pulled off these acts? Is it one group? What is their ultimate goal? I don't think Billy has ever said. My Website | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 271 Registered: 07-2005 |
G'day Scott I totally agree with you If people don't know what Creation is let alone the Creational laws and directives, how the heck can we expect them to follow it. So I guess everything starts at the grassroots, people who have comprehended the truth, who feel the obligation to spread it which is a natural progression from having understood the vital elements and why that is so. cheers matt | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 657 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi Norm.... As Billy has mentioned many times: it is a variety of government branches - not only the government itself. Many known and unknown secret agencies. It could as well be the 'Hidden' Rich Elite, which would execute their own Agendas, for their own Greedy Gain; and so forth. As Mr.Gadaffie once said: that some 400 Rich Elite Families make out what we Eat, Drink, what we watch on TV...and what should be published...and so forth. I would agree with him. Even back in the mid 70ties there was an American or Canadian writer, who wrote a book about how our Youth...is being 'Manipulated and Influenced' through MUSIC! To suppress them, by the so-called Modern Music...was a way to Brainwash them and keep them occupied...from becoming (Too) Knowledgeable to the (True) Facts Of Life, and so forth. So, according to the writer, Secret government agencies were behind this all, to some point. When an English head of the Secret Service once saw Elvis, and the power and influence he had on the Youth, he said: Now, that is what we should have here in England! A good way to keep the Youth: Under The Thumb! And not to becoming to Intellect and Knowledgeable. In Other Words: Mind Control! And before you knew it: There was a one Cliff Richards! Which had the same impact as Elvis! So, it seems, that head of the Secret Service...did get his way. So, Norm, as you can notice: there is a variety of forces behind such schemes. There are POWERS out there we can not see, but they are truly there! And each, want their 'Piece Of The Pie'! And as Billy once said: 'The Ones with Open Eyes'...can acknowledge this. Edwatd. | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 1017 Registered: 02-2000 |
Edward, There are a ton of theories out there but I would love to hear Billy's complete explainaton on how this whole secret system works. My Website | ||
Mgilbo1 Member Post Number: 44 Registered: 09-2002 |
Edward, I don't look at Elvis's history as being a bad one for people. I personally believe he helped get young people(who are brainwashed early) away from the church and start questioning it and their authority, which in those day's was way out of control. Even though he was a religious man himself, he never preached to anyone or forced his opinions on anyone. His legacy today proves what a giving man he was. As for his music, I think you'll find he sang very loving and harmonious music after the 50's.. An amazing talent. Mark Gilbo | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 659 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi Norm and Mark.... Norm: Well, you can ask Billy on the next Questions round? Mark: Yes...of course, Elvis was one of my favorite singers..of all times. I do agree with you. I am not saying what that writer wrote in his book is True, or Not True. But he makes One think, so to speak. It only leaves a 'Possibility'. Governments(even back in the fifties and even up to today) would do anything to keep their Power, and in such a manner by 'Manipulating' the Mass's Minds; as we know from Billy and the Plejarans concerning Media and Film Influence/Manipulating....etc. Edward. | ||
Tony Member Post Number: 75 Registered: 01-2006 |
Elvis was a freemason. I am very suspicious of anyone that is a freemason. What good has Elvis ever done? | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 173 Registered: 07-2004 |
I think that the two earliest methods of controlling our society in general was the production of alchohol and the formations of religion. On top of that, now it's the TV/film/media marketing sector and the political/military crony cabals competing against the financial elites who themselves only have control/power as their last desired goal. From the incredible amount of prepared stimulus we most certainly have become oblivious to in our daily living, we have, as a human race, created an acceptable tolerance level that we continue to allow to expand. The already becoming very cheap cell phones in our hand, will be so packed with attention grabbing options, that the cell phone carrying masses across the planet, will be simultaneously vulnerable to the all powerful news flash bit packets that will flow into any applications the user is operating, that the resulting human emotions for the really powerful events, will be off the scale as the most powerful tool/weapon used to form our thinking. Even a President with the lowest I.Q. in history and terrible social skills is able to sway the numbers that help maintain his megalomania grip on power through the amplification of his words around the world. Now just imagine if he was really charming, a polished statesman, world educated and still believed and worked towards his dark agenda. Not a desirable thought! a friend in america Shawn | ||
Future_cats New member Post Number: 2 Registered: 09-2006 |
Hello there, One thing I really, really agree with in the Meier Contacts is the lesson of taking personal responsibility. According to this logic, any person who claims an outside force for his/her success or failure is acting religious. In Figu’s Manifesto posted on this website it says: “Religion, as the embodiment of the backward link (ED: giving responsibility) toward a god or a creator (ED: or anybody, or anything for that matter), is equivalent to stagnation…a clinging attachment to prescribed thinking practices…The dogmas…deny and disallow man his inherent right to research and fathom…the truth…” So now we are all going to blame cell phones, TV, rock ‘n’ roll, Cheetos snacks, the government, and U.S. President George Bush? A few weeks ago, I was involved in the middle of a conversation between two friends discussing the subject of politics. My friend Bee contended that the U.S. wars (Iraq, Afghanistan, etc.,) are totally wrong and very passionately defended her ‘evidence’ that George Bush is -- this and that-- and America needs new leadership from these ‘bad’ people who are destroying the world. On the other hand, my friend Dee pronounced that the U.S. war on terrorism is just and that America needs to stop criminals who are set out to destroy America; and he also very passionately contended that Bush has done -- this and that—good and that America is the “shining nation on the hill” which has brought forth her share of freedom and science and technology and peace and opportunity to the world. Which of these two people is right? Maybe the truth lies more in the middle? To avoid being religious, like Figu says to “a clinging attachment to prescribed thinking practices,” I would think that one must continuously labor to consider all points of view rather than sticking the blame or credit on anyone or anything. Anthony J. Alagna | ||
Sonik_01 Member Post Number: 88 Registered: 03-2006 |
Hi Future_Cats Something is terribly terribly wrong if you can't see for yourself that what Bush is doing will ultimately lead us to a third world war. Both you and your Bush-loving friend have a responsibility to think for yourselves and penetrate to the bottom of the lies you see on the tv, and think of the motives behind them for yourselves. That is ultimately what figu is talking about when it says that everyone has a responsibility for world events going on right now. Yes, Bush is responsible, but even more responsible are people who elect him and don't want to think for themselves about things. | ||
Markc Member Post Number: 379 Registered: 06-2000 |
Tony ; I never heard that Elvis was a freemason , but I know that famous entertainers often get degrees from Universities without ever attending class ; as an honorary member . If he was accepted into their organization , it might have been like that . How dedicated to their order do you really think he was ? He was Elvis , after all . As for what good he's done , is all relative , don't you think ? Maybe he gave people a sample of what humans can do when they're passionate about music , and unafraid of what backward people might think and say about physical enthusiasm and enjoying life . Maybe you don't think that's anything , but alot of people could and still can focus on something that they enjoy that someone else created . I am a musician , so of course I find more relevance in works of music than some . Mark Campbell | ||
Miraj_raha Member Post Number: 7 Registered: 09-2006 |
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1016720641536424083&q=PRESS+FOR+TRUTH For those of you who still think that bin laden was alone responsible for the 9/11 attacks. | ||
Mgilbo1 Member Post Number: 45 Registered: 09-2002 |
Tony.. May I ask the proof of Elvis being a Free Mason? I know people who are Free Mason's and they are good people. Since Zionists are Jews, does that mean all Jews are bad? Its comments like these that have no basis and tend to start rumors. You should re-read some of Billy's info and realize your mishap in stating such a comment. If you can't find anything good to see about Elvis and what he brought to many around the world, you are obviously too young to know. Mark Gilbo | ||
Rarena Member Post Number: 75 Registered: 10-2005 |
Hi everyone, Am in agreement with Kingman that the media does control us somewhat. Having been in the entertainment industry and learning about media ads, these people that make them are pHD psycologists who know about frequencies and rhythms to make people buy "C*ca-C*la" for example... and we are programmed to buy it. It is very subtle and subliminal and many do not notice they are being programmed/sold while watching the flashing on the TV or telephone handset. We create our own reality and we have to know the stumbling blocks and pitfalls along the way in order to avoid control by others. Our capitalistic system is nowhere to be found according to the Plejaren and that is their warning to us: it is probably not a system conducive to peace and spiritual growth. Like the movie Enemy of the St*te, there is tremendous power wielded by the most powerful governments of the world and they try to dystroy our credibility if we don't conform to their self serving goals. "We have to dystroy his credibility, we want the Americ*n people to know he's lying even before he says anything..." As to this most recent debacle... the so called War on Terrorism, we were pushed by 911 and we pushed back the Afganistani and Iraqi people and killed almost if not, a million people! Most if not all were innocent people and their families are really pissed off at us... Not being involved in the 911 plot in any way. That's a couple of million people mad at us. We have to learn non violent negotiation, peace above all, and at all costs. The media has not reported the most henious of crimes perpetrated on these countries in the name of stamping out terrorism. Children and families run over after the American soldiers were given the order to do so with their trucks. July 8th Lynn Woolsey http://woolsey.house.gov/SMARTfloorstatements.asp There is a large percentage of the population that lives in a bubble and thinks George W(ar) Bush is doing a good job. And like George W, they have not had to face war in any way shape or form and have no concept of it nor the terrible attrocities and screaming horrors associated with it. To them it is a mark on a ballot form. Fear based retoric and lies sooth them until the next election. But our children are fighting this war, not theirs, they... are very safe, protected by bodygaurds, sitting in air conditioned offices with impenitrable walls and bullet proof glass. We are not only responsible for ourselves but others as well. And the quickest way to help ourselves, is to help others. Education given peacefully... is the way. Marquis of Queensbury rules do not work in the back allies of any major city, if you use them you will get your head knocked off. We have to educate those who think they are our enemies and bring them up to our level of civility before killing them outright and really giving them a reason to want to fight. For example, the Iraqis do not go by the Geneva Convention and surrender by the American soldiers is a death sentance to the Iraqi who lets him live or, most likely the soldier who surrenders, termination is their way. Surrender to the Iraqi is weakness and a death sentance. With the money that is being spent knocking these people around with "shock and awe" we could give every man, woman and child a translation program, computer, electricity and food and lodging for three months. Killing is not the way. The following mentality is from the last celestial zodiac sign Pisces (hidden): "You can get more from a kind word and a gun than just a kind word." Al Capone (A Pisces) We are now in Aquarius, this will be the most educational of signs. Use the power of Creation. Knowledge turns to wisdom which turns to power. Tschüs... Love to all... rarena ôżô Ancient Lyrian coded to Earth peace meditation: Saalome gam naan ben uurda, gan njjber asaala hesporoona. Please see here for correct pronuciation: http://www.theyfly.com/salome/salome.htm English: Peace be on Earth, and among all beings. | ||
Matt Member Post Number: 62 Registered: 04-2006 |
"As to this most recent debacle... the so called War on Terrorism, we were pushed by 911 and we pushed back the Afganistani and Iraqi people and killed almost if not, a million people! Most if not all were innocent people and their families are really pissed off at us... Not being involved in the 911 plot in any way. That's a couple of million people mad at us." I think that figure of people there is a great understatement of the true figure - Billy - "However that is not surprising if it is observed that an exceptionally great part of the world population hates US-America" http://www.gaiaguys.net/meier.p6-8.s27.htm I don't think we needed billy to let us know that, for us to know that there are hundreds of millions of people throughout the world that hate the U.S. American, and not just a couple of million. | ||
Future_cats New member Post Number: 4 Registered: 09-2006 |
Hi rarena, Dude you wrote a book, but I’ll comment on a few points. You said, “Our capitalistic system…is probably not a system conducive to peace and spiritual growth.” What is capitalism? A dictionary that I have handy defines capitalism as, “an economic system based on ownership…by private individuals who compete with one another…for a free market…” Notice it says competes, and competition is very visible in nature. ‘Survival of the fittest’ is very opposite to religion. You said, “There is a large percentage of the population that lives in a bubble and thinks George W(ar) Bush is doing a good job.” And I would say, yes I agree with you, but there are also a large percentage of the population that lives in a bubble and thinks GWB is totally bad. Are you really that naďve to think that the war in Iraq is about what we see on TV or read in the newspapers? It is only the weak minded (the lazy) that succumb to religion and get locked into being controlled. Anthony J. Alagna | ||
Tony Member Post Number: 79 Registered: 01-2006 |
Mgilbo1, I do not have any proof that he was, I just remember someone mentioning that he was. You could also do a search on google and see for yourself how much material and suspicion on the net he was. Apart from his music, what good did he ever do? Since when does producing music reflect a good person? Most of elvis's music was written for him and all he had to do was just sing it, wasn't it? | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 174 Registered: 07-2004 |
Hi Miraj_raha, Thank you for that post of the 911 video. Truly an empowering documentation for the citizens of the U.S., who have as yet not researched the implications that our elected officials are not only responsible for their lack of actions on Sept.11th, but as we dig deeper into the piles of quashed evidence, we find they have actually played a part in the events of that day. I was at first ready to say, " Oh great, another polished diversion of the accounts of 911 and the people around the event.", but, I decided to allow the complete story it portrayed to be told, as I know that has always gave me a better view than what is fed through the public filtering systems which control us. I knew about 60-70% of the material the video covered from my own extensive research I did regarding our governments involvement. To a doubtful observer it becomes obvious that insider control was necessary for this magnitude of an event to be even remotely successful and kept as a vague mystery. This video saves a great deal of time some of us have not been willing to give to the 911 questions that remain unanswered. Sure, the heavy questions are still not clearly answered, and thats the stories base, who's stopping the truth from being known. I will be surprised if there remains any amongst us in this forum at least, who will object to the realities that are exposed of the different levels of involvement from our government and it's agents. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Miraj_raha Member Post Number: 8 Registered: 09-2006 |
No Problem Kingman. By the way I am an Indian,and I am proud to say that I am sensible enough to understand the fact that it's not the American CITIZENS that started the wars but the Bloody Government,so its completely illogical to hate US Americans because they are not responsible for america's political status but the Government. For this fact I was totaly ignorant of the nasty politics from the beginning. However not every Indian thinks like me which is dissapointing. but what is more dissapointing is the fact that even after all these events the universal awareness of the CITIZENS of america is still low about their own government. I feel You are horribly complacent(excluding the exceptions,whose % is very low). I think its time you start doing some serious work on this,before its gets TOO late. Off -Topic:I think its also time we start proclaiming ourselves as "I am an Earthling",rather than I am an Indian,or American or Russian or whatever. Saalome. | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 177 Registered: 07-2004 |
You say the facts as it stands Miraj_raha, and may I add a few suggestions for proclaiming ones identity...how about, " I am one of us all ", or, " I am a Human Being" or the Mayan greeting, " I am another you". Also... The % of people waking up to this reality is beginning to expand exponentially, and with an election coming up, it's looking bad for the Republicans in office. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Rarena Member Post Number: 76 Registered: 10-2005 |
Hi folks, The Plejaren commented on the monetary system being conducive to war. As to nievte... do you think Billy Meier competes with you? One of the most advanced spiritual forms in our proximity does not seem prone to competition to me. He did mention it was a barbaric beginning and that competition is indeed a law of nature, even for the Plejaren... but as we get more advanced, this goes away. My whole point of the "book"... please forgive my prolxity BTW... was stressing NOT to pay attention to the media as a way of researching the situation such as... the war in Iraq. George W Bush is a spoiled rich kid who has never had a real job and is unable to do so without bankrupting everything he touches. Those who are familiar with receiving everything they want, tend to expect that all the time and are therefore ill prepared to go to work for it. Tschüs... Love to all... rarena ôżô Ancient Lyrian coded to Earth peace meditation: Saalome gam naan ben uurda, gan njjber asaala hesporoona. Please see here for correct pronuciation: http://www.theyfly.com/salome/salome.htm English: Peace be on Earth, and among all beings. | ||
Future_cats Member Post Number: 7 Registered: 09-2006 |
Hi Randy, right? Thanks for the reply. You said, "...do you think Billy Meier competes with you?" I thought Billy plays chess? I know I read, either this forum or M. Horn's site, that Meier likes to play chess with people who meet with him. Dude, chess is a competition between two people to win. So I guess if I met Billy I would try to beat him in chess, and I'm sure he'd try to win the game too. I've often wondered if the Plejarens play sports -- like soccer, or track, or bicycling, etc., or even exercise work out (competitiion with one's self to improve the body). However, I would agree that competition is related to a natural law or Creational law. But I might suggest, competition might be under the Law of Love. Where competition does or does not have to take place; we might consider fair competition a directive to avoid religious outcome due to "God's will" or whatever? Anthony J. Alagna | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 224 Registered: 03-2004 |
Rarena wrote: "The Plejaren commented on the monetary system being conducive to war." Fiat currency and central banking are indeed conducive to war. A return to the gold standard would be more helpful in preventing war. For more info see: http://www.gold-eagle.com/editorials_04/wallenwein103104.html | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 225 Registered: 03-2004 |
A new 6 part series by Richard Maybury: Why do they hate us and How do we end the war? http://www.chaostan.com/whydotheyhateus.html | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 179 Registered: 07-2004 |
Good post Hunter A great tool in assisting people to gather the truth of our countries role in the world's history, thus allowing for better discourse when important changes need to be created. It's a horrible sum total for our citizens to realize. Richard Maybury is off the mark when it comes to his belief that the use of the pronoun 'we' is a mistake. I disagree for the simple fact that we the people are responsible for electing and keeping them at their oath they are expected to uphold. The 'we' of the media is our most important aspect of a healthy honest democracy. 'We' the people need to hold our media responsible for keeping a light on the actions of our government. Mr Maybury's claim that the people of the US are not part of the 'we who are the government' is only applicable to the absolutely unknown 'Black Ops' type elements that have little if any connection to our main body of the democratic design. His cataloging of the known atrocities helps form a pattern that most Americans sense may exist, but most people fail to comprehend as a policy that has never waned in its intensity. 'We' are responsible as a whole. Individuals who have enough power to make decisions that effect us all, need to have a new public oversight created, along with an effective tool made available to correct, or remove the elements of power that are dissolving our ability to live in the world community as an asset to humanity, instead of a danger to the entire planets future. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Future_cats Member Post Number: 10 Registered: 09-2006 |
Hey Hunter, A return to the gold standard for the United States is impossible today. The whole point to central banking and the creation of fiat currencies is to expand the money supply. This is not necessarily a bad thing, especially if you wish to boost science, technology, and really expand the possibilities for a society. There are not enough gold resources above and below ground to go around to even cover the monetary system of the United States, let alone the rest of the world. This planet is suffering from a huge overpopulation problem, as I’m sure you noticed! The problem with fiat currencies and central banking are the abuses of the system that we see today, such as with the piling of debt. We cannot necessarily blame the programs. Not only does excess debt enslave families, but also entire nations. The “American hegemony” that Billy Meier talks about in his prophecies is the reserve currency status of the U.S. Dollar. As Billy says, the paper will only be good for rolling cigarettes if this ends. To keep the system going after the wheels have fallen off is the motivation to go to war, not the systems themselves. Anthony J. Alagna | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 226 Registered: 03-2004 |
* A return to the gold standard for the United States is impossible today. Anthony, you're wrong about that. For the following reasons: "Mr. Still claims that it would be a mistake to return to a gold-backed monetary system because most of the world’s gold now is held by the bankers. This is a deceptively appealing argument. First, it is not true. Central banks do hold more gold than any other single entity; but the total inventory of gold in the hands of private citizens, as bullion or coins or jewelry or known deposits in working mines, is much larger. If money were to be restored to a precious-metal base, this largely invisible reserve would be more than adequate to supply the demand. We must remember that the limited supply of gold as a monetary base is an advantage, not a disadvantage. If it were not scarce, it would not have utility as money. The smaller the supply, the more valuable it is. As pointed out in The Creature from Jekyll Island, any amount of gold or silver will work just as well as any other amount. The only difference is how valuable each unit of measure will be. The argument that “we don’t have enough gold in the world” is without foundation, and those who say this do not understand the fundamental mechanics of money." http://www.freedomforceinternational.org/freedomcontent.cfm?fuseaction=meetstill&refpage=issues Also, keep in mind that in the 251st contact, the predictions/prophecies there say that the world will establish a gold standard for currency and then eventually do away with money. | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 227 Registered: 03-2004 |
* The whole point to central banking and the creation of fiat currencies is to expand the money supply. Right, Anthony, and this is the sole cause of inflation, which hurts the poor most of all: Inflation is the result of the excess currency printed by the Federal Reserve, not any action of the private market place. Milton Friedman proved this before winning the Nobel Prize in Economics. "... a world monetary system has emerged that has no historical precedent: a system in which every major currency in the world is, directly or indirectly, on an irredeemable paper money standard . . . It is worth stressing how little precedent there is for the present situation. Throughout recorded history . . . commodity money has been the rule. So long as money was predominantly coin or bullion, very rapid inflation was not physically feasible . . . The existence of a commodity standard widely supported by the public served as a check on inflation .. . The key challenge that now faces us in reforming our monetary and fiscal institutions is to find a substitute for convertibility into specie that will serve the same function: maintaining pressure on the government to refrain from its resort to inflation as a source of revenue. To put it another way, we must find a nominal anchor for the price level to replace the physical limit on a monetary commodity." - Milton Friedman, "Monetary Policy in a Fiat World" The reason we've been able to avoid hyperinflation so far is because the income tax is used as a buffer against the fiat currency. If you repealed the income tax tomorrow and allowed the government to print money at the same leves they do today, you would see runaway hyperinflation similar to what happened in Germany in the 1920's. The Federal Reserve even admits Friedman's conclusions are correct: "The "Great Inflation" of the 1970's challenged and permanently altered economic theory. It vindicated the once-controversial analysis of Milton Friedman, then at the University of Chicago. "Friedman's monetary framework has been so influential that in its broad outlines at least, it has nearly become identical with modern monetary theory," said the Federal Reserve governor Ben S. Bernanke, at a recent conference at the Federal Reserve Bank of Dallas. (The full text of his speech is available at http://www.dallasfed.org/news/resear...c_bernanke.pdf.) Mr. Bernanke is not a former Friedman student. He did his graduate work at M.I.T. Someone reading Milton Friedman's monetary economics today is likely to miss its significance, Mr. Bernanke noted, much as an apocryphal student called Shakespeare's plays "just a string of quotations." "His thinking has so permeated modern macroeconomics that the worst pitfall in reading him today is to fail to appreciate the originality and even revolutionary character of his ideas, in relation to the dominant views at the time that he formulated them," he said. Against the conventional wisdom, Mr. Friedman argued that "inflation is always and everywhere a monetary phenomenon." Inflation had nothing to do with aggressive unions, greedy businesses or even oil cartels -- the bad guys who took the blame in the confusing 1970's. Prices shot up everywhere because the federal government made the supply of money grow faster than the real economy created value. Based on the historical record, he argued, the effects of monetary policy were fairly predictable. In a 1970 lecture, "The Counterrevolution in Monetary Theory," Mr. Friedman outlined 11 propositions about how monetary policy affects the economy. All were wildly controversial, almost disreputable, at the time. Most are accepted today." | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 228 Registered: 03-2004 |
* Richard Maybury is off the mark when it comes to his belief that the use of the pronoun 'we' is a mistake. I understand the point he's trying to make, but ultimately I would agree with you. We all share some responsibility. | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 229 Registered: 03-2004 |
More on fiat currency and central banking: "That paper money has some advantages, is admittted. But that its abuses also are inevitable, and, by breaking up the measure of value, makes money a lottery of all private property, cannot be denied. Shall we ever be able to put a constitutional veto on it?" — Thomas Jefferson "I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. Already they have raised up a monied aristocracy that has set the government at defiance. The issuing power (of money) should be taken away from the banks and restored to the people to whom it properly belongs."--Thomas Jefferson "History records that the money changers have used every form of abuse, intrigue, deceit, and violent means possible to maintain their control over governments by controlling money and it's issuance". -- James Madison "The Federal Reserve banks are one of the most corrupt institutions the world has ever seen. There is not a man within the sound of my voice who does not know that this nation is run by the International bankers." -- Congressman Louis T. McFadden (Rep. Pa) "Some people think the Federal Reserve Banks are the United States government's institutions. They are not government institutions. They are private credit monopolies which prey upon the people of the United States for the benefit of themselves and their foreign swindlers" -- Congressional Record 12595-12603 -- Louis T. McFadden, Chairman of the Committee on Banking and Currency (12 years) June 10, 1932 "These 12 corporations together cover the whole country and monopolize and use for private gain every dollar of the public currency..." -- Mr. Crozier of Cincinnati, before Senate Banking and Currency Committee - 1913 "The [Federal Reserve Act] as it stands seems to me to open the way to a vast inflation of the currency... I do not like to think that any law can be passed that will make it possible to submerge the gold standard in a flood of irredeemable paper currency." -- Henry Cabot Lodge Sr., 1913 "The Federal Reserve Banks are not federal instrumentalities..." -- Lewis vs. United States 9th Circuit 1992 "The regional Federal Reserve banks are not government agencies. ...but are independent, privately owned and locally controlled corporations." -- Lewis vs. United States, 680 F. 2d 1239 9th Circuit 1982 "The modern banking system manufactures money out of nothing. The process is perhaps the most astounding piece of sleight of hand that was ever invented. Banking was conceived in iniquity and born in sin... Bankers own the earth. Take it away from them but leave them the power to create money, and, with a flick of the pen, they will create enough money to buy it back again... Take this great power away from them and all the great fortunes like mine will disappear and they ought to disappear, for then this would be a better and happier world to live in... But, if you want to be the slaves of the bankers and pay the cost of your own slavery, then let bankers continue to create money and control credit." - Sir Josiah Stamp, Governor of the Bank of England in the 1920s and the second richest man in Britain in the 1920's, speaking at the University of Texas in 1927. "When you or I write a check there must be sufficient funds in out account to cover the check, but when the Federal Reserve writes a check there is no bank deposit on which that check is drawn. When the Federal Reserve writes a check, it is creating money." -- Putting it simply, Boston Federal Reserve Bank "Neither paper currency nor deposits have value as commodities, intrinsically, a 'dollar' bill is just a piece of paper. Deposits are merely book entries." -- Modern Money Mechanics Workbook, Federal Reserve Bank of Chicago, 1975 "The few who understand the system, will either be so interested from it's profits or so dependant on it's favors, that there will be no opposition from that class." -- Rothschild Brothers of London, 1863 "Give me control of a nation's money and I care not who makes it's laws" -- Mayer Amschel Bauer Rothschild "The best way to destroy the capitalist system is to debase the currency." — Nikolai Lenin "There is no subtler, or surer means of overturning the existing basis of society than to debase the currency. The process engages all the hidden forces of economic law on the side of destruction, and does it in a manner which only one man in a million is able to diagnose." — John Maynard Keynes http://www.freedomdomain.com/bankquot.html http://www.chaostan.com/quotes.html | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 230 Registered: 03-2004 |
And of course, fiat currency was unconstitutional under our laws. The powers that be had to lie, cheat and steal to implement such a system: "The only substances ever declared as money within the U.S. were gold and silver, in coin form, with copper/nickel serving in token capacity only. See: 12 USCA 152 re. "lawful money" and Coinage Act of April 2, 1792, at Sections 11, 16, & 20; re. copper/nickel tokens, see Sec. 9, and 31 USCA 460." Original U.S. Constitution Art. I Sec. 8 Cl. 5 [Congress shall have Power ...] To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, ...; Art. I Sec. 10 Cl. 1 [No State shall ...] make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts; ... Note that there is no such prohibition against Congress, or any delegated power to make anything legal tender. This is primarily because Congress was originally understood to have no power to make anything legal tender outside of federal territories, under Art. I Sec. 8 Cl. 17 and Art. IV Sec. 3 Cl. 2, but in 1868 a Supreme Court packed by Pres. Ulysses S. Grant, in the Legal Tender Cases, allowed Congress to make paper currency issued by the U.S. Treasury, backed by gold, legal tender on state territory, a precedent that remains controversial to this day, when courts allow paper currency not backed by anything to be considered "legal tender". http://www.constitution.org/cs_money.htm (For all the details of Grant's court packing scheme and their unconstitutional ruling see: http://www.fff.org/freedom/1100a.asp ) | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 231 Registered: 03-2004 |
The root argument over fiat currency is of course about freedom. The government passes legal tender laws and then forces you, at gunpoint if necessary, to accept worthless paper as money. It eliminates freedom in the market place. If the legal tender laws were repealed tomorrow, nobody with half a brain would use Federal Reserve Notes because they have no intrinsic value. They're absolutely worthless, except for the government's ability to force you to use them and accept them as money. | ||
Psycloud Member Post Number: 52 Registered: 06-2006 |
In contact 251 it says "For this reason, all related efforts will be undermined because gold, silver, platinum, palladium, and other valuable, still undiscovered metals, precious stones, jewelry and other items sold illicitly, which will ultimately lead to the collapse of the attempts to abolish money." Which to me seems like people will try to change to a system of precious metals, however it will ultimately lead to the collapse of the attempts to abolish money, meaning, maybe we could abolish money if people did not try to use precious metals as currency because they are so attached to the idea of money, when at this point in time nothing cost much to produce, as is stated in the surrounding paragraph of the 251st contact. I am truthful to the extend at which I know the truth. | ||
Future_cats Member Post Number: 11 Registered: 09-2006 |
Hello Hunter, I write a couple of small paragraphs to you and I get hit by a tital wave. Somebody throw me a surfboard please! My good man, have respect for the (limited resources of Figu) server capacity. Your whole deal could just have easily been served up in about three paragraphs. I get a lecture on inflation and intrinsic value, and more.... Yes, yes, yes -- okay I see your points. But did you really address my point? That war is the result of abuse of the system (failing to take personal responsibility within a non-perfect and flawed monetary environment). Don't ya think that a resource based, intrinsic monetary system (yes more sound and tighter -- but still far from perfect) would still be abused? Anthony J. Alagna | ||
Kiril Member Post Number: 112 Registered: 12-2005 |
"YEH......RIGHT ON HUNTER"! One thing to add : Ludwig von Mises is an outstanding political economist and one man who I think has a satisfactory solution to the problem. Regards, Kiril | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 182 Registered: 07-2004 |
As soon as man learned how to create worthless pieces of paper into a 'value', we also learned at that moment the famous shell game. The fancier the hand movement, the easier you could dupe your target. When you stand there in front of the gamemaster he allows your eyes to see where he has hid that pesky little pea. Each time you guess right. Until you put down your money and suddenly the pea is better at hiding and there goes your for-sure easy money. Monetary life in a nut shell( pun intended ). a friend in america Shawn | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 1021 Registered: 02-2000 |
Call the Federal Reserve & ask who owns your equity & manages your data bases? My Website | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 232 Registered: 03-2004 |
Psycloud wrote: "For this reason, all related efforts will be undermined because gold, silver, platinum, palladium, and other valuable, still undiscovered metals, precious stones, jewelry and other items sold illicitly, which will ultimately lead to the collapse of the attempts to abolish money." Which to me seems like people will try to change to a system of precious metals, however it will ultimately lead to the collapse of the attempts to abolish money, meaning, maybe we could abolish money if people did not try to use precious metals as currency because they are so attached to the idea of money, when at this point in time nothing cost much to produce, as is stated in the surrounding paragraph of the 251st contact." I guess it's another contact that I'm thinking of, because the Plejarens said matter-of-factly at one point that the world would revert to gold money before the abolition of money. Anyway, I don't have time to search for it right now. But now that I reread that section of 251, I really don't like the sound of the government abolishing money by force. It sounds that at the time money will be unnecessary due to the discovery of free energy and its use in food production. So what would it really matter if some people kept using money? Granted, it wouldn't be necessary, but I just believe in the freedom of people to arrive at that logic on their own free will. | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 233 Registered: 03-2004 |
* I write a couple of small paragraphs to you and I get hit by a tital wave. Somebody throw me a surfboard please! My good man, have respect for the (limited resources of Figu) server capacity. Your whole deal could just have easily been served up in about three paragraphs. Anthony, in all honesty, I summed up the fiat currency/central banking issue pretty succinctly. I could have left out the quotes I suppose, but I trimmed those down to the most explanatory, and regardless, I think people need to be exposed to these things. Look, I hate unnecessary complexity and I'm a big believer in Occam's razor, but some things require a little more in depth discussion. | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 234 Registered: 03-2004 |
* Don't ya think that a resource based, intrinsic monetary system (yes more sound and tighter -- but still far from perfect) would still be abused? It certainly could be, but not nearly as readily as a fiat currency system. Ultimately though, in either system, we need stronger punishment for government officials and tighter controls in the law. | ||
Psycloud Member Post Number: 53 Registered: 06-2006 |
The whole system needs to be reworked, however the players will not let go of the controller. I am truthful to the extend at which I know the truth. | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 183 Registered: 07-2004 |
"but I just believe in the freedom of people to arrive at that logic on their own free will." If our civilization last's long enough, this will be the only way we will overcome the money merchants. Hunter, you seem to be well researched on the history of money for the last few centuries. We need as many people as this site can handle who find it in themselves to look closer at the things in life we just accept as part of life. I think the servers this site use's can handle anything we throw at it. I doubt if we could ever have to much info when it comes to the issues of money and how the elite will always seek methods to dominate the people through the use of it. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Tjames Member Post Number: 218 Registered: 12-2004 |
Hi friends: Could you please listen to this when you get a chance. He makes some excellent points if you get the time. Thanks in advance for sharing comments or thoughts about this issue. http://www.breakfornews.com/audio/NextLevel061004a.mp3 Tim Salome gam nan been urrda gan njjber hasala hesporona! | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 235 Registered: 03-2004 |
* Hunter, you seem to be well researched on the history of money for the last few centuries. We need as many people as this site can handle who find it in themselves to look closer at the things in life we just accept as part of life. Shawn, thanks for the compliment and I am posting information about fiat currency/central banking, government corruption, and changing our foreign policy to international neutrality on several different political forums. That's why I'm not here as often anymore... | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 184 Registered: 07-2004 |
"Watch how child-killer zombies surface right on time as unbelievably evil (literally!) political distractions from Washington's most recent Elite Untouchable Pedophile scandal cover-up, or war-related massacre of undersupported western troops. (In that vein, please read (my old war-buddy) Rico Vicino's opinion piece: "DOGFIGHT" @http://ricovicino.tripod.com/a_second_opinion.htm) " This was Dyson's post in another topic. The Bush admin is strangely able to divert our attention with this coincidence at key points in it's hour of need... a friend in america Shawn | ||
Matt Member Post Number: 64 Registered: 04-2006 |
Fox warns over Russian military: The UK underestimates the threat to its future security posed by Russia, shadow defence secretary Liam Fox has warned. Addressing a fringe meeting at the Conservative Party conference, Dr Fox claimed Russia was increasing its defence spending this year by 25%. It was also testing more long range missiles and pouring money into two naval bases in Syria, he added. That, together with Iran's military build-up, justified replacing Britain's Trident nuclear weapons system. Dr Fox said the Tories were committed to replacing Trident nuclear weapons and, with so much uncertainty in the world, he warned against embarking on a "potentially lethal experiment in unilateral disarmament". He said Iran and Russia pose the most serious "potential threats to our interests". Missiles He said Russian President Vladimir Putin had spoken recently "of having armed forces capable of fighting a global, regional and, if necessary, a few local conflicts". The shadow minister said he had been "amazed" by how little coverage Russia's new military build-up has received in the Western media. He said the country was spending 25% more on defence this year than last year and is testing new inter-continental ballistic missiles, and ordering new frigates for its navy, equipped with cruise missiles. The Russians have also reportedly invested in two Syrian ports, he added. If they switch their Black Sea fleet there it would be their first Mediterranean base since the 1950s, said Dr Fox, who repeated his warning in a speech in the main conference hall at the Bournemouth conference centre. 'Influence' He also said that, along with North Korea and China, Russia had helped Iran to develop ballistic missiles with a range up to 4,000 kilometres which "could attack US and British forces in the region". http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/5403074.stm . | ||
Miraj_raha Member Post Number: 10 Registered: 09-2006 |
A little suggestion to Michael Horn and gaiaguys. In regard to the connection to recent global events. 1)N.korea successfully tests nuclear weapon. 2)Chavez warns of U.S coup plot to topple Bolivian leader Evo morales. and with the news events posted by my friend Matt just above me. To michael Horn, Hi Michael, It's a great step that you are doing a lecture on the Ontario Science Center on 21st of this month. So it will be a good idea to justify the Henok prophecies through these latest world events that have just taken place so as to convince the public the prophecy is unfolding right in front of us. To gaiaguys Hi gaiaguys, Thanks for the excellent aritcle "human beings should uncover the puzzle themselves." In this connection I suggest you can safely update the status of the Third World War in regards to what Billy has just recently said about the development of the war and also justify The henok prophecies in the same manner,quoting the recent global events including n.korea and Russia and Bolivia. Saalome. | ||
Technod Member Post Number: 52 Registered: 07-2003 |
Hello,FIGU friends With another round of elections coming,i wonder if anyone cares to discuss possible shortcomings with electronic voting machines that may or may not cast the proper vote. or if possible, advantages to this process, which i had heard of a few like helping the blind vote for themselves with these machines. Aparently,the last voting process was another criminal majic trick performed on the seeing blind. How can there be no recipts or papertrail for this simple act .Its real hard to take it seriosly when you see how corupt and perverted the majority of the politcians are. Brian Best | ||
Michael Member Post Number: 542 Registered: 10-2000 |
Hi Miraj_raha, Regarding your suggestion, specifically how do you see those events in relation to the Henoch Prophecies? Thanks. Michael Horn | ||
Miraj_raha Member Post Number: 11 Registered: 09-2006 |
Hi Michael, To answer your question, I am quoting the Henok prophecy itself and bold lettering the lines which has significance to these events. American politics will aspire to gain absolute control of the world concerning supremacy in economy. And this will point towards the possibility that a Third World War could develop from it.if this does not happen, many small and great nations will lose their independence and their cultural identity and will be beaten down, because the USA will gain predominance over them and with evil force bring them down under her rule. This part has some connection with the US coup to topple bolivian leader. Don't you think? Though not as clear cut has some fine connections if you read the full story of what The venezuelan leader chavez has to say about his friend Evo morales and the US government. Also N.korea claimed they did the test because the US stopped their offshore-banking and trying to stop their regimes so again we have a scenario where the US is trying to gain control, both through intervention of ones personal affairs and economically. | ||
Michael Member Post Number: 543 Registered: 10-2000 |
Hi Miraj_raha, Yes, this is consistent with the prophecies. I have noted that such policies are already (and have long been) in motion. These would be two more examples and there are others probably simmering beneath the surface. But these countries were not specifically named in the prophecies, in the same way as they make mention of the actions of specific countries elsewhere. Nonetheless, we are witnessing long foretold events, such as should be sufficient to encourage thinking people to wake up and help make the necessary changes in direction...before it's completely too late. Michael Horn | ||
Miraj_raha Member Post Number: 12 Registered: 09-2006 |
To that i fully agree. Already after the nuclear test,there has been a lot of activities going on between countries to resolve the problem. But I think because of these meetings the political powers are starting to note their differences in opinions and realizing each other that everyone has their OWN interests,so in that case the rivalry is increasing. That's not a very good sign. | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 187 Registered: 07-2004 |
We should begin to see clarity on who's got the 'ball in their court' when it comes to leverage in the North Korean issue. I can feel a strong shift in power on the world's perception of who controls the most. With our losing position we are at in the Iraq war and an illegitimate government controlling the US, the confidence other nations are showing in themselves will change what has been an easy playground for the bully USA(government). Things are heating up and not in a positive way. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Matt Member Post Number: 68 Registered: 04-2006 |
Bush has signed a National Space Policy on October 7th where the US from now on has the complete domination over space. No other country is allowed to go into space, except if its in the interest of US policy! New U.S. Space Policy Emphasizes Security President Bush has signed a new National Space Policy that rejects future arms-control agreements that might limit U.S. flexibility in space and asserts a right to deny access to space to anyone "hostile to U.S. interests." http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/asection/la-na-briefs18.2oct18,1,1385720.story?coll=la-news-a_section&ctrack=1&cset=true | ||
Jakes New member Post Number: 2 Registered: 10-2006 |
Thank you fellow Americans who voted yesterday for change. The new broom sweeps clean. Now it is time to concentrate on impeachment. For there is no way the US troops will leave IRAQ with Bush still in office. The worst criminal the world has ever known cannot go unchallenged. I know the Democrats don’t have a much different plan in IRAQ (they don't want to be labeled weak on terrorism), but now maybe there’s a chance over time that people will come to their senses and see that this terrible war has only made America weaker and more hated than ever and thus an even greater target for terrorist attacks. | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 190 Registered: 07-2004 |
What we can expect from the new political conditions are actions that will have accountability behind them, not like Bush's cabal which was in charge of making sure everything Bush did was checked out properly. The hen watching the hen house. We have an incredible woman as the Speaker of the House who is our best hopes for a truly new direction. Nancy Pelosi will become one of our greatest Americans we will ever know. Watch as she corrals this out of control Congress and lays the structure for true change that will repair the damage as it exposes all the rottin, stinking politicians who have nearly destroyed this country. I am once again able to say I believe in America as a country that will change the world, this time for the better. I hope we're all through sleeping on our watch. Never shall we allow criminals to get that close to the controls again. Jake, Bush most likely won't get impeached unless the people force the Democrats to do that. I have a feeling that the opportunity to create real change exists better in having Bush stay in office an be shown accountable for all the disasters and be part of the clean up crew. It will be terribly counter productive for the next two years if the two parties waste time fighting political battles when we are near several explosive world events that require incredible focus if we are to reverse our course safely. Now is the time to repair the hull before we take on any more water and sink a friend in america Shawn | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 239 Registered: 03-2004 |
* Nancy Pelosi will become one of our greatest Americans we will ever know. Please. Nancy Pelosi is just another typical prestige-seeking politician. It's good that the Democrats won to counteract Bush, but, as I've said before, the Democrats will not change America's interventionist foreign policy and will continue to support Zionism and give military support to Israel. This will only lead to more terrorism in the long run. The only solution is to declare international neutrality and withdraw our troops from the rest of the world. | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 240 Registered: 03-2004 |
The Antiwar Wave Voters repudiate interventionism by Justin Raimondo In the end, it didn't matter what John Kerry said or didn't say: it didn't matter that Saddam Hussein was condemned to death, and, most of all, it didn't matter that the White House fell back on its post-9/11 strategy of implying that a vote for the Democrats is a vote for Osama bin Laden – the antiwar wave that has been rising for months crashed and broke over the heads of the Republican Party, sweeping away all but the most entrenched incumbents. This election, in the broadest sense, was a referendum on the Iraq war – and the results are a dramatic rebuke to the War Party. No amount of Republican scaremongering and cheap demagoguery was enough to stem the tide. An electorate that was sick of a war that they thought should never have been fought in the first place rose up and swatted the neoconized GOP. Symbolic of the partisan divide was Virginia, where a Republican-turned-Democrat, Jim Webb, former Marine and somewhat paleoconish (at least in style), faced off against George "Macaca" Allen, whose stumbling, bumbling campaign was a model of Republican buffoonery. Allen is a down-the-line pro-war Republican, whose crudeness and insensitivity is practically the trademark of his party these days. Webb, on the other hand, is an intelligent and principled guy, stylistically the complete opposite of his opponent. Emblematic of the struggle between these two was Allen's attempt to smear Webb on account of some out-of-context passages from the Democratic candidate's novels: this tactic, characteristic of the Republican smear machine, was just plain stupid, at least in my view: most voters probably didn't know that Webb writes novels, and rather than put the focus on the raciness of certain passages it merely made Webb's resumé seem more impressive. This wasn't just redneck ignorance (feigned or real) on the part of the Allen camp: in their desperation to avoid the main issue – the war – they had no choice but to turn to such non-issues in the hope that they could divert voters' attention and draw their opponent into a quagmire, so to speak. It didn't work. Webb was an early critic of the war. Back in September 2002, when it wasn't quite so fashionable, he asked: "Do we really want to occupy Iraq for the next thirty to fifty years?" Few were raising this issue at the time; now, that question is on everyone's lips. Webb was motivated to run, in large part, because of his opposition to the war, and he made it a major part of his campaign. "I don't wake up in the morning wanting to be a U.S. senator," said Webb, whose reluctance as a candidate (he's never run for public office) is charming in this era of stagy, self-promoting politicians. "I wake up every morning very concerned about the country. We need to put some focus back in our foreign policy, a different focus." His victory over Allen is symbolic of what this election was all about: it was not only a rejection of the war and our foreign policy of global interventionism, but also a stunning repudiation of a party that has degenerated into an unrecognizable Bizarro World version of its former self. As secretary of the Navy under Reagan, Webb is hardly a pacifist, but his view of America's national interest is worlds away from the neoconservatives' enthusiasm for "regime change" at the drop of a hat. His trenchant warnings of the dangers of imperial overstretch are granted authority by his extensive military experience – and by a new realism that is spreading through both Democratic and Republican circles. The scene now shifts to the internal battle within the two major parties. The Democrats, having ridden the wave of anti-interventionist sentiment, are not united on what is to be done – and, remember, they are complicit in what Gen. William E. Odom calls the greatest strategic disaster in American military history. Most of them voted for it, in any case, and now claim they were deceived: but that isn't saying very much for their own judgment or their willingness to take an independent course. The Rahm Emanuel wing of the party – Democratic congressional campaign committee head Emanuel routinely opposed antiwar candidates in the party primaries – is determined to keep the party on a "centrist," i.e., objectively pro-war course, raising all the old canards about the alleged "weakness" of Democratic candidates on issues related to national security. But the reality is that the Democrats now have the advantage on that question: polls show voters trust the Democrats more on national security than the Republicans, a stunning reversal. And this has nothing to do with the feigned "toughness" of the "national security Democrats" – who are merely blue-state neocons – but with the party's perceived (albeit not actual) antiwar stance. The American people are waking up: they now realize that the war has increased the threat of terrorism and empowered Osama bin Laden and his cohorts, greatly increasing anti-Americanism not only in the Muslim world but around the globe. These election results set the stage for a Democratic antiwar presidential candidate to emerge. The problem is that the party leadership is decidedly centrist, i.e., pro-war, with Hillary Clinton being the exemplar in this regard. Her determined opposition to U.S. withdrawal, or even a timetable to begin phasing out our troop presence, has pretty much set the tone of her party's "mainstream" voices on the war issue. All that is now changed, however: the Democratic ranks are just waiting for someone like Webb to step forward. Someone who would meet with furious opposition from the staid party Establishment – from all the special interests, the foreign lobbyists, the self-appointed arbiters of the politically permissible – and finally break the neocon stranglehold on American foreign policy. The Republicans, for their part, will now become preoccupied with identifying the reasons for their stunning defeat – and making sure it doesn't happen again. What is clear is that the neoconservative principles embodied by this administration – not only a foreign policy of unmitigated aggression, but also a high-spending, big-government domestic policy that has thrown overboard the old conservatism of fiscal restraint and reflexive opposition to centralized power – have led the GOP down the garden path to disaster. The Iraq war was a gigantic albatross hung 'round the neck of Republican candidates on every level: even Lincoln Chafee, who had distanced himself from the president and did not approve of the Iraq war, was felled in the November massacre. The voters punished the Republican Party because they identified it with the War Party – and all Republicans suffered as a result. Republican moderates suffered such major casualties this time around that they appear headed for extinction: Rep. Jim Leach, perhaps the leading moderate figure with any national prominence, was also defeated in his reelection bid. Increasing numbers of conservatives are questioning the neocons' intellectual and political leadership, and the situation is ripe for a bloodletting in the GOP as the finger-pointing begins. There were, of course, those on the Right who opposed this war from the very beginning, and, indeed, oppose our interventionist foreign policy as the worst sort of folly imaginable, comparable in its disastrous scope to the failed social-engineering schemes of the former Soviet regime. For all their talk of "liberation," the Commies could no more make a New Soviet Man than the Bushies could create a New Iraqi Man – and the reasons for this are inherent in the human condition, as most conservatives recognize (or used to recognize). Now, it remains for the conservative movement to throw out the revolutionaries [.pdf] who have infiltrated their ranks, and cleanse themselves of any taint of neoconservatism – or prepare to pay the price at the polls. This election provides the antiwar movement with some reason for optimism, but we shouldn't put our trust in politicians. Once they are in office, they tend to forget the reasons the voters put them there. Unless we hold their feet to the fire, they'll get comfortable in their new Washington offices, and will soon accommodate themselves to the ruling bipartisan foreign policy consensus, which is that we are in Iraq (and the Middle East) in a big way for the long haul, and there isn't much anyone can do about it. Now is the time to put the pressure on: where are those long-promised investigations into who lied us into war? The Democrats, most of them, claim they were tricked into voting for the war resolution, yet there has been a distinct lack of interest on their part in finding out how this occurred. Was the intelligence about Iraq's alleged "weapons of mass destruction" faked – and, if so, by whom? What role did Vice President Dick Cheney's office play in the propaganda campaign that eventually succeeded in roping in most of the Democrats? What about those blatant forgeries that were somehow injected into the president's State of the Union address, the infamous "16 words" that turned out to have been quite wrong? Not to mention the machinations of Ahmed Chalabi, Iranian agent and the neocons' favorite to replace Saddam Hussein – surely his shenanigans, conducted at taxpayers' expense, cry out for a congressional investigation. With a majority in the House and probably the Senate, the Democrats now have it in their power to at least halt the escalation of the war. The War Party is calling for sending as many as 50,000 additional troops to Iraq. If the Democrats sent to Washington in the wake of the November Revolution fulfill their mandate, they'll put a swift stop to this – and take their opposition to the war one step further. Congress holds the purse strings and can cut off funds for the war whenever it likes: failure to do so will blur the differences between the two parties on this issue and betray the trust of millions who registered their opposition to the war by voting Democratic. The Democrats must either oppose the war and vote to rein in the president with their power of the purse – or else they must take their share of responsibility for the failed policy of this administration, and also share the blame. NOTES IN THE MARGIN Before I get letters about it, let me say that I'm perfectly aware that the Virginia contest is going to a recount. Yet it doesn't look as if Allen is going to make up the 8,000-plus vote margin, no matter how many times they count the votes. The GOP can delay the official proclamation of Webb's victory for weeks, but in the end, I believe, Webb will emerge triumphant. So my analysis stands. As for the victory of Joe Lieberman in Connecticut, this is the exception that proves the rule. Lieberman's Democratic opponent, Ned Lamont, made two major errors: (1) He veered off his emphasis on his antiwar stance and sought to "broaden" his constituency and didn't get back on message until it was too late, and (2) he went on vacation for a couple of weeks right after winning the Democratic primary against Lieberman and never regained his early momentum. In addition, his cool, patrician demeanor was not an asset, and Lieberman had a lot of help from big GOP donors and the War Party nationally, without a counterbalancing effort by Lamont's supporters nationally. So, yes, Lieberman's victory sticks in the craw, yet it doesn't mean that the voters of Connecticut endorsed the war: the exit polls tell a different story. http://www.antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=9981 | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 191 Registered: 07-2004 |
Hi Hunter, "The only solution is to declare international neutrality and withdraw our troops from the rest of the world." Like that's really going to happen. We know in the future that women are going to be key in preventing the warlike nature of man to continue destroying our progress. So as we move towards that time, we will witness the growth of the female skill in dismantling the war machine. I see Nancy Pelosi as an intelligent mother of 5, who knows what it will take to begin this process. I'm sorry if you can't look at the bigger picture and realize the difficult position she's in. To be able to place herself where she's at is a tremendous task. Favors are the source for all the power in Washington(once you arrive). As a politician, voters get you in the spotlight, after that, the performance is up to you, and Nancy has had plenty of insight into what it takes to get to the place where change can begin. To be able to fight a battle successfully, it's best if you know your enemy as best you can. Her being in the presence of the Israeli representatives is the same as being in the presence of Bush. It's necessary. I'm not placing some halo on her head, but I am aware that she is working towards the top and she has a lot more compassion in her than most politicians. Power corrupts, and absolute power absolutely corrupts. Nancy will be exposed to extreme levels of power and we should help guide her to the right decisions we need her to make. When I read you poo-pooing her as just another pawn of the secret Israeli agenda, I am compelled to make others aware of your bias towards this person as being uninformed or very short sighted. The change towards responsible government will be by election to election. How much easier each step along the way is for the people who will lead us to a better future will be because there are people like Nancy who actually gave a shit what the future of our civilization would be like. Nancy is doing the ground breaking for the real change to a better balanced make-up of governing types. Give it a chance and try and think neutral-positive towards someone who could shift an incredible amount of momentum towards ending the prophecies we are faced with. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Jakes New member Post Number: 4 Registered: 10-2006 |
Hello Shawn, I agree with your comment that the US will not withdraw its troops from the rest of the world. Certainly not voluntarily and certainly not with Bush in office. And I also agree that he will probably not be impeached. The Dems don’t seem to have the stomach for that. It would be the predictable, rationalized, over-reaction. And they need to keep themselves clean and well-positioned for a run at the White House in ’08. But in comparison, how is it justifiable for the Republics to get all frenzied up and impeach Clinton over a crusty, dried-up, white stain on a blue dress? Yeah, I know the point is he lied about receiving oral sex from that woman. Big deal. Didn’t Bush just admit to lying last week to a couple of reporters when asked about replacing Rumsfeld? And didn’t he lie about the reasons for going to war in Iraq? I hate to say it, but the American populace doesn’t have it’s priorities in order. | ||
Vestri Member Post Number: 67 Registered: 02-2006 |
Kingman "Nancy Pelosi will become one of our greatest Americans we will ever know....I am once again able to say I believe in America as a country that will change the world, this time for the better." Hi Kingman, no offence but i think you've got high hopes in things that will never happen in this century or possibly this millennium. do you honestly believe that these criminal people below are going to let one person (woman!) get in their way, or should i say, get them out of the way? Alan September 28, 2006 Hi Billy, what can you tell us about what the U.S. did in the (setup) 911 attacks that no-one knows yet, which may help the people investing the case bring the case and people involved to justice? Answer It is not possible to bring the case and the people to justice because this will be prohibited/prevented by the CIA and the most powerful U.S. secret sect “Skull and Bones”. | ||
Hector Member Post Number: 136 Registered: 04-2006 |
I don`t expect many changes in the next months in USA foreign policy.One of the worst presidents in USA history was the democrat Harry Truman, responsible for dropping nuclear bombs over Japan, once Japan was planning to surrender. The democrats have supported the infamous Patriot Act and did support also the infamous Mexico border wall.Are these politicians the ones that will take America to a new direction? Are these democrats ready to serve their country? Are you happy with democrat 2008 presidency candidate Hillary Clinton, who agrees so much with Bush "stay the course" policies? And what`s worse, the new secretary of defense is a former CIA director (read FIGU sonder bulletin 30).In my opinion, the democrats won`t listen to the voice of the people.In my country, Spain, the candidate to presidency promised an Iraq withdrawal in 2005 and once he won the elections he complied. Regards | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 241 Registered: 03-2004 |
Shawn, The fact of the matter is that both major political parties, Democrats and Republicans, are very corrupt. Billy's predictions for women rulers bringing peace are far into the future. And remember he also said that the first such leaders would be exactly like the men before them. You accuse me of bias, but you really should examine your own bias. You say "give it a chance" - and yet you decry neutrality and say "like that's going to happen." I'm not saying it will happen immediately, but I am saying if it doesn't happen within the next 20 years, the prophecies of World War 3 will most likely turn into predictions. We know we're headed towards World War 3 and that this is due to Zionist/Islamic fundamentalist conflict with a heavy does of U.S. intervenionism. Nancy Pelosi is better than Bush in regards to foreign policy issues, but being better does not mean one will be able to avert the prophecies of World War 3. Clinton was better than Bush on foreign policy issues, yet he just couldn't stop intervening everywhere he felt necessary. It does no good in the long run. Namaste, Hunter | ||
Jakes Member Post Number: 7 Registered: 10-2006 |
Hello Hunter, The best you can ever have in two-party system is the lesser of two evils. I agree there’s not much difference between the parties, but I don’t think we’d be in this awful situation if Gore hadn’t been cheated in the 2000 election. It’s doubtful he would have let the terrorist attacks on 9-11 happen, and there wouldn’t have been any neocon voices in his ear ginning up WMD in Iraq. But now that we’re there, we need someone to get us out, and it sure won’t happen on Bush’s watch. I still say impeach him. Okay, so nothing get’s done politically in the meanwhile (like they do much good otherwise?). Sometimes things have to get worse before they get better. America needs more introspection/reflection to see what it’s doing wrong and then to make course corrections. You won’t have that under the “we all must work together” mantra. That’s just complicity. | ||
Jakes Member Post Number: 8 Registered: 10-2006 |
Hi Hector, We’ve had worse than this bogeyman Gates in high places. A former CIA director has served as President of the United States: Bush, Sr., #41. They don’t seem to do so well when exposed to the sunlight. I see you’re from Spain. You probably know the Henock prophecies say France will attack Spain. Don’t mean to put you on the spot, but what will be the cause of that (attack) and do you think it can be averted? | ||
Hector Member Post Number: 137 Registered: 04-2006 |
Hi Jakes, Billy says the outcome of a prophecy always can be changed (i recommend to read Michael Horns 753th post, Books and Booklets Area » "The Talmud Jmmanuel" » General Area). From my point of view, prophecies must be taken as warning.A prophecy from 1975, for example, is a projection of the future based on the events which happened until 1975.If you make another projection of the future in 2005, that future won`t be the same as the 1975 prophecy. For me, the prophecy about Spain being conquered by France is far from being fulfilled.About WWW3, the prophecy said it would start in november 2006,2008 or 2010, after 4 heads of state are killed.I see no danger until 2008.That does not mean we have to stop with our appeacement policies for the planet. What is a certain danger is the creation of ultraradical muslim cells within european countries, this cells have to be tracked and surveyed so they dont begin developing terrorist activities (indoctrination and terrorism acts).15% of the frenchmen are muslims and many radicals live among them disguised as democrats, while they are not. European Union goverment, France or any other country must send a clear message to all those radicals who use violence as a vehicle to push their ideas/policies forward.Religious fanatics too...but i won`t waste my time talking about them.Democracy cannot tolerate radicalism, terrorists or religious fanatics(muslims or christian). If my country is in danger i will flee to South America to pay a visit to Hugo Chavez, for sure.. | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 1036 Registered: 02-2000 |
Hector, If you read the Bush / Democrat Comprehensive Immigration Plan I don't think you would support it if you care about overpopulation. It will add 100 million people to the USA in the next 40 years. There's no money to pay for it & I'm sick of it! This country is already the number 1 polluter just imagine what more people here will do. Plus I'm sick of Mexico not taking care of their own people, they are the third richest county in the America's yet they ship their poor north & prevent the immigrants coming up from Central America to their country! Can you say double standard! Mexicans needs to over throw their gov't not run like chickens to USA & start demanding everything so that the tax payer has to pay for them to get free health care, food stamps etc etc etc! Billy even said the same thing about immigration & it link to overpopulation! If they would lower their birth rate it would cut down on their problems. I'm sick of people being brain washed by the Media & presenting the facts wrong when it comes to ILLEGAL immigration! Infact they refuse to call it that they lump in Illegals with Legal immigrants to stir up the pot! My Website | ||
Alan Member Post Number: 77 Registered: 06-2006 |
it doesn't matter who is elected as president of the US because the US president is just a puppet on strings to the real US government - the CIA. | ||
Jakes Member Post Number: 9 Registered: 10-2006 |
Yes Hector, a prophecy is not a prediction, it can be changed … but not if the underlying conditions/causes don’t change. If France attacks Spain, presumably it won’t be an Islamic faction, but the government-backed military. Do you think it will be a retaliatory strike against Spain or pure aggression? Of course this is just speculation. Where did you read 2008 might be a year for the 3rd WW? I’ve only seen 2006 (hopefully passing), 2010 and 2011. | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 193 Registered: 07-2004 |
Ok Hunter maybe I paint a rosy picture and bias was equally shared between us, but neither of us can predict what Nancy will eventually account for. And it does stand that she did make history being the first female Speaker of the House. Can we agree that the door is cracking open and that more Americans are together in the idea that war is not something that we can allow to happen so easily. What's needed is these secretly controlling forces to be exposed little by little and help release the politicians that are compromised because of them. As far as change goes, lesser evil or not, it's a change for the better. Vestri... "Hi Kingman, no offence but i think you've got high hopes in things that will never happen in this century or possibly this millennium." No offence taken, and not from Hunter either... Can we at least look at this as a small moment that the direction we need to begin heading in is starting to turn for the better. The sad part is if we look back in our recent history we can find a strikingly similar chain of events. These two political parties only different in methods of fooling the public. Once they arrive it's hard to tell them apart. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Hector Member Post Number: 138 Registered: 04-2006 |
Jakes, since wikipedia has also its little space dedicated to the famous swiss farmer, i read it there: "Billy Meier has repeatedly warned of an impending Third World War beginning in November of either 2006, 2008, 2010, or 2011 if the USA and Israel continue their war crimes and international interference in the policies of other nation-states. This is part of the Henoch Prophecies, widely considered to be one of his most important Contacts, which also allegedly predicted the September 11, 2001 attacks on the WTC and Pentagon almost two decades before they occurred. He, and through him Ptaah, still hold that this disaster is imminent if Israel and the USA are not stopped on their rampage through the Middle-East. He has also denounced the terroristic activities and vigilante behaviours of various Muslim extremist groups, which he says only foments the possibility for war. At present, Billy's Contacts suggest that this November (2006) is the most likely time for the beginning of World War III, if measures are not undertaken to stop the USA and Israel. According to his latest reports, the 2006 Israel-Lebanon Conflict is very possibly only the beginning of what will eventually spiral into full-fledged World War by 2008, if the major first event begins this November. [6] He has said, specifically, that 4 world-leaders will die within 7 days of one another in November of some year (see above), and that this is the sign that World War III has begun". | ||
Hector Member Post Number: 139 Registered: 04-2006 |
Norm i agree with you that inmigration, legal or illegal, is a serious problem, and USA surely cannot integrate to the country 40 nor 100 million latin american inmigrants. What i criticize is the way they do it.First of all, to build a wall, an incredible technological structure with electrical fence, surveying via satellite, is a provocation in the eyes of Mexico and in the eyes of the international community.It means to go back to the times of barbarism.There are other ways to stop this inmigration flow.Cooperation politics.Although they are third richest country in the continent, living standards in both countries do not match.USA will always try to look Mexico as the poor neighbour where cheap workers can be found when desired.I mean the difference between rich countries and poor countries is increasing exponentially.That difference was 1:5 in 1900, now it is 1:15.It cannot keep to increase.That means disaster. I tell you, there has been a political shift in most of south american countries.Right wingers and dictators are being displaced by left wingers in almost all these countries.They are beginning to try to fight against poverty, coping with each other.Lula da Silva in Brazil, Evo Morales in Bolivia prime example. If we pay attention to Billy and the prophecies, it seems that south america would be " the guard of the treasure, the guard of civilization" after a hypothetical III world war.That could be possible because these latinamerican countries will associate based on social matters, not economical matters. Inmigration is caused by the monetary system and the abnormal distribution of resources, wealth.Remember, corporations like Nike, Reebok manufacture sports shoes which are built in indonesia, taiwan.They pay those workers 2$ for the job and then they charge you astonishing 100$ when you buy them.Where does the difference go? To try to remedy poverty? If the same shoes would be made in Mexico, they would pay the workers 20$.Where do the missing 80$ go? Investing in Mexico? No, for sure. Money, power and pleasures being the sole reason for our existence.Those are non-values, the plejaren say.I agree. | ||
Pudd Member Post Number: 60 Registered: 02-2006 |
Horn mentions 2008 in the 2006 update dvd,,but I have never seen 2008 in writing anywhere.Only 2006,also the 4 heads of state, from what I understand,die within 7 days of each other,however not sure if they are murdered or die naturally.Horn in that 06 dvd hinted(4 heads of state deaths) they were not sure if this has happened yet. 2006 have been mentioned by Florena,Quetzal,Ptaah,Billy,and not 2008.I'm not sure we are in the clear with regards to Nov.2006.Salome Pudd | ||
Jakes Member Post Number: 10 Registered: 10-2006 |
Hello Hector, Just checked the Henoch Prophecies as published in the book "And still they fly!" No mention of any years associated with WW3 nor any mention of Israel. Go figure! Also checked Contact 251 but no specific years are mentioned there either, and again, no reference to Israel. But here is a quote that comes from Contact 251: "The world war will begin in November of a specific year, after 5 years of intensive effort are spent reaching this goal which is preceded by 4 years of unspecified preparations." Four years after 9-11-2001 (unspecified preparations) followed by 5 years of intensive effort equals 2010. My speculation only. I'd still like to see a reference to the year 2008 coming from Bill or the Figu. You know how Wikipedia can be. | ||
Tony Member Post Number: 100 Registered: 01-2006 |
Hi Shawn, regarding Nancy Pelosi. Thanks to Fintan Dunne from Breakfornews http://www.breakfornews.com/ I don't see any movement within the US government as being something that just happened or came about through people voting for it. I see it all (movement) as something that was planned in advanced by the powers that be, for whatever reason there might have been behind that movement. Most likely to make a certain number of people in the US who are not happy with something that the current US government is doing (iraq) feel like there is someone there in their government that represents their interests or concern. But the true powers that be will always be controlling where this particular person goes or does and as such will never get anywhere. That person (or movement) has only been created or allowed to happen to make a certain number of people in the US feel better. They will never account for a change in guard to happen to that which holds the true power and control of the US government. | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 194 Registered: 07-2004 |
Tony, It's true nothing happens accidentally in politics. That doesn't mean that each politician is carried by unseen forces. So what really happened to Nancy Pelosi was not of her doing? She brought her self up to where she's at, unlike what happened with Bush. Your idea that, "They will never account for a change in guard to happen to that which holds the true power and control of the US government." Your pessimism is not what helps the, "change in guard", you speak of. The people who are ruled over will change the system eventually. It takes small steps and growing awareness of the reality of what's being done to us, and most importantly, the religiously controlled people to awaken and see the glaring lies they are fed. Once we are all awake, the chances of change for the good will be the only option. This will of course take generations. Until then we need more of us to awaken. Nancy is awake, your awake and I'm awake. If we can each strive to awaken as many as we each can with what we have been able to achieve in our lives, we will shorten the time we all spend here in hell. As far as Fintan Dunne is concerned, ok, he's helpful, but he thinks practically all the websites that expose the wrong of the world are gov. sponsered psy-ops. Some are, but he over does it in many areas. I filter his info like I do the rest. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Tony Member Post Number: 103 Registered: 01-2006 |
Shawn, your right about it not being a good thing to be always pessimistic about everything that happens in the U.S. government, but I can't help it ever since after reading what billy said in bulletin 30 about the CIA being the real U.S government. Knowing that makes you feel that everything we're seeing happen is a puppet playshow. "As far as Fintan Dunne is concerned, ok, he's helpful, but he thinks practically all the websites that expose the wrong of the world are gov. sponsered psy-ops. Some are, but he over does it in many areas. I filter his info like I do the rest." I feel and do the same thing as you do there too. | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 242 Registered: 03-2004 |
* Can we at least look at this as a small moment that the direction we need to begin heading in is starting to turn for the better. Shawn, we'd all honestly like to believe that things are getting better, but if you want another sobering dose of reality, just read the latest update on Michael's site: http://www.theyfly.com/newsflash4/blltn_30.htm The secret agencies behind our government are completely and totally out of control. And we have no hope of voting these evil people out of power. Our only hope is to spread this information to as many people as possible and start a movement for change. But right now, the bulk of people in this country are COMPLETELY and TOTALLY unaware of just how bad the problem is. Voting, in and of itself, is not going to save us. | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 243 Registered: 03-2004 |
From iamthewitness.com Nancy Pelosi is a Zionist Puppet "I've heard her say numerous times that the single greatest achievement of the 20th century" was the founding of the modern state of Israel, Friedkin wrote. "She has been a great friend of the U.S.-Israel relationship during her entire time in Congress and is deeply committed to strengthening that relationship." Sam Lauter, a pro-Israel activist in San Francisco, has known Pelosi for nearly 40 years. He was 5 years old when the Pelosis moved into his San Francisco neighborhood, he recalls. The two families lived on the same street. From: http://www.jewishtimes.com/News/6073.stm Her speech to AIPAC is here: "One thing, however is unchanged: America's commitment to the safety and security of the State of Israel is unwavering. America and Israel share an unbreakable bond: in peace and war; and in prosperity and in hardship." http://releases.usnewswire.com/GetRelease.asp?id=47885 | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 244 Registered: 03-2004 |
Another thing to address is that the CIA appears to have been created under FDR. Thanks again, Roosevelt! But the key is that this insane growth of government into a welfare state/warfare state could not have occured without the legalization of fiat currency, worsened greatly by the Federal Reserve, and the introduction of the income tax. For more info on both, please go check out the movie America: Freedom to Fascism Here is the full uninterupted Authorized Version on Google... http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4312730277175242198&q=america+freedom+to+fascism America Freedom to Fascism Authorized Version Please visit http://www.freedomtofascism.com to purchase the DVD. This is the "Director's Final Cut" authorized version of Aaron ...Russo's documentary, America: Freedom To Fascism (AFTF). It is being uploaded to Google Video for the first time during the evening of October 19-20th, 2006. Aaron has listened to everyone's feedback - volunteers, students, lovers of freedom & liberty, young and old alike - and, true to his word, he is putting this up "for free" on Google Video knowing that the hour has come for Americans to either be awakened to restore the Republic or be swept aside by the dark global forces of fascism that seeks to enslave mankind. AFTF's main focus comes in a statement with six very simple words: SHUT DOWN THE FEDERAL RESERVE SYSTEM!! After viewing the movie, please be sure to visit http://www.freedomtofascism.com where you will soon be able to view a much higher quality "pay per view" Internet version of AFTF, buy the DVD and sign up as an affiliate to sell/distribute DVDs to others. We also urge everyone to be sure to sign up as volunteer, register for email alerts and tell your family, friends and neighbors about this groundbreaking movie. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4...p;q=Aaron+Russo | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 1039 Registered: 02-2000 |
I wonder what Billy have to say about the fact that both Bush & Kerry were Skull & Bonesmen! My Website | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 1040 Registered: 02-2000 |
I thought it was Truman that created the CIA. My Website | ||
Melli Member Post Number: 189 Registered: 06-2005 |
Things are stirring up in the US and how lucky are you that people are waking up, not only in your nation but Europe too whereas this country of ours I call Prison Island is a modern day human social/economic/scientific experiment on all levels from CIA control of all governments politicians to society ability to express itself. Still everybody is quiet and disgruntled but typically waiting for the next person to stand up. I heard today the best saying about this people, and I quote: "Australians are like mushrooms, kept in the dark and fed b.......t". Cynicsm I hear you say? I say this is the reality here. | ||
Junior Member Post Number: 126 Registered: 12-2004 |
Salome Norm, Although this section is not one of my favourite ones, I happen to come across it and here are some comments regarding your post no 1039 “I wonder what Billy have to say about the fact that both Bush & Kerry were Skull & Bonesmen !” When I was at the centre one of the days was when Christian Frehner asked the forum questions to Billy. One of the questions was posted by Alan http://forum.figu.org/us/messages/12/6715.html?1162226623#POST23042 Billy then was talking a bit about the Skull and Bones, that although they try to deny that they are a sect, the truth is that they are one. Plus one of the main reasons Bush’s agenda is the way it is, is mainly due to the fact that he is a member of this sect, so was his father and his grand father. As mentioned in the above link, he also said that they are very powerful. Although he didn’t talk about Kerry, since it is known that he is a member as well, I would imagine his agenda wouldn’t be much different. Salome, Badr | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 690 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi All.... As what I once gathered from a documentary years back, concerning the 'CIA': is that it was 'thought up' by the very very Wealthy Families whom live in America, and whom have the Ultimate Power, there. They mainly made it come into reality because THEY - The Rich Of All Rich -, wish to be Secure in times of Peace and War...etc....etc. And thus, that THEY will never lose the power over the people and position...etc...; and again: THEIR Wealth. So, the CIA was not only financed with the American people's Tax Money, but also by America's Wealthy Elite Families; greatly for THEIR benefits and advantages! And of course - The Skull and Bones - would surely have a 'Fat Finger In The Porridge'...so to speak. - The Skull and Bones - THEY be Republicans or Democrats: They Can Be Lumped On The Same Pile! I am not really that surprised when Billy mentioned how powerful the CIA has become, now, and it's powerful arm - The Skull and Bones -! - The Skull and Bones - want to be a much more Powerful Body than The Freemasons. And because: - The Skull and Bones - ARE AMERICAN MADE! And America...can not stay behind! And it seems; even mentioned, that 'The Pentagon' was conjured up with the same recipe as the above mentioned! Can you imagine, that there is an American Elite Society of the wealthy.... that only accept Billionaires! One has to have at least '1 Billion US dollars' to enter! This is what you call: The Ultimate Power Structure! Edward. | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 245 Registered: 03-2004 |
* I thought it was Truman that created the CIA. You are correct. Sorry, my mistake. I was thinking '44 for some reason and it was '47. | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 246 Registered: 03-2004 |
The Origins of the Israel Lobby and Its Dominance of American Politics and Culture If you oppose anything Israel wants or does, you’re anti-Semitic, period. Which has been the Israel lobby’s policy and practice since 1948. The details are here: http://www.dcdave.com/article5/061108.htm As for the new Congress, it's the same as the old Congress: "Nearly every [newly elected] lawmaker, except the few stragglers hiding out in bathroom stalls or the cloakroom, was told he or she best tow the [American-Israel Political Action Committee] AIPAC line, or suffer short tenure in Congress. Part of this process is obviously the forced submission of a ‘position paper summarizing his or her views on U.S. Middle East policy,’ that is to say the targeted politico must state in writing that he or she will enthusiastically support Israel." And you voters thought you’d voted for change: http://kurtnimmo.com/?p=649 | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 1042 Registered: 02-2000 |
If you read Anthony C. Suttons great book America's Secret Establishment: An Introduction to the Order of Skull and Bones he says S&B are related to a German group he called the mother organization of S&B. My Website | ||
Jakes Member Post Number: 14 Registered: 10-2006 |
Hello Hunter, May I ask, what did you vote for, or did you bother to vote at all? Would you rather see the American public continue to support the neocon agenda or at least take a stab at change/improvement? The fact is, a Republican President got us into the war. I don't think it would have happened on Gore's watch, and I'm hoping it won't happen again (Iran) under a Democratic controlled Congress. Isn't the definition of insanity doing the same thing over and over but expecting a different result? I'm not thinking the Dems are better; just hoping they'll dampen the previously unchecked rubber stamp Congress. I would also like to seem Bush impeached (he's earned it), though don't expect to see that happen. Would we be better off if the Republicans continued to control the Congress? | ||
Alan Member Post Number: 80 Registered: 06-2006 |
hi jakes, after reading billys bulletin 30, i don't think it would have mattered which adminstration was in power, the cia would've have made them (democratics) too go to war with iraq. Also, the US administration does not control congress, the cia does because the cia is the real US government. | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 196 Registered: 07-2004 |
I think when you boil down all that Israel is in this modern age, you'll find that Israel is really our position in the Middle East. Our previous members of government and some of the more powerful secret societies here in America knew the only way to maintain some sort of control over the flow of oil is to be there with a committed powerful force at all times. Israel obtained nuclear weapons way to easy for it to be a start up country. They have because they are us and we wanted them to have the same powerful weapons here as they now have. Our leaders commitment to Israel has been unwavering, we're not going to leave our investment hanging. So for anybody to think that Israel controls us is missing the point, we control Israel. The day that we get off our need for oil is the day Israel will be a solo profile. Until then consider us the couple out at a club and one of them is talking to someone they would like to meet and says"but I'm with the old ball and chain". We're an item and until the energy situation changes "get used to it". This dangerous and poorly thought out situation probably has something to do with the Giza Intelligences and the fact that groups like the Skull and Bones were more than likely created from the influence of the Giza Intelligences. Anybody who thinks blood letting or adhesion to a oath by committing horrible acts to other humans or animals has been in some way acquainted with these horrible people who only want to control the whole planet. The churches and religious organizations and governments were the first to be controlled by them and when they realized that powerful organizations were forming around the control of oil, they went after that angle as well. Now that they are no longer with us we still can see the stupid results of their efforts at this. We need to destroy all the residue of the secret societies they created before we begin to expect better policies filtered down from the elite and their minions. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 247 Registered: 03-2004 |
* May I ask, what did you vote for, or did you bother to vote at all? I voted for Libertarian candidates. If there was no Libertarian on the ballot for a particular race, I wrote in a name. I did not vote for any Republicans or Democrats, and never would. That is a completely wasted vote. * Would you rather see the American public continue to support the neocon agenda or at least take a stab at change/improvement? There will be no true improvement though, unless you start electing third party candidates to scare these buffoons into proper action. The elections have already scared Bush a little, but again, with enough Democrats towing the Zionist line, Middle East policy won't change. Remember, Bin Laden issued the Fatwa for 3 reasons: (1) our support of Israel and weapon sales to Israel (2) our presence - i.e. military bases and troops in Saudi Arabia - ground they consider holy (3) our presence in Iraq The Democrats aren't going to change that. They may stop an active war in Iraq, but permanent military bases have now been built - why? - to control the oil, primarily. * The fact is, a Republican President got us into the war. Jake, this war is not the whole issue. Take the time to read the following. There is a long history of our involvement overseas by both Republicans and Democrats: http://www.chaostan.com/whydotheyhateus.html * I don't think it would have happened on Gore's watch, The conditions for Bin Laden's jihad would still have existed under Gore. Any terrorist attack on U.S. soil is going to leave politicians clamoring for "vengeance" - and the mass of people will buy into this emotion. * Isn't the definition of insanity doing the same thing over and over but expecting a different result? Yes, it is, so why do we keep electing Democrats and Republicans over and over again? Why do we keep intervening in foreign countries over and over again?????? * I'm not thinking the Dems are better; just hoping they'll dampen the previously unchecked rubber stamp Congress. I hope so too, but there is absolutely no concrete evidence to suggest they will. * I would also like to seem Bush impeached (he's earned it), though don't expect to see that happen. I don't expect to see it happen, and he certainly wouldn't be convicted by the Senate, which would require a 2/3rd's vote, but yes, he does deserve it. * Would we be better off if the Republicans continued to control the Congress? We will only truly be better off if American foreign policy is changed to neutrality and all our troops stationed overseas are brought back home. I am glad the Democrats won in this case, but it's like putting a bandaid on a wound that requires surgery. | ||
Michael Member Post Number: 546 Registered: 10-2000 |
Regarding unprovoked U.S. attacks: http://www.theyfly.com/news2005/aug05/aug05.htm#war Keeping the laws of cause and effect in mind, what should we expect? Expect the democrats to make sure that they appear "tough on terrorism", watch them not repeal the law taking away habeas corpus, watch them not only NOT secure our borders but make sure that the country is flooded with illegals, watch them not demand an immediate withdrawal from Iraq and, if a democrat is elected president - and we haven't bombed al remaining "evil" countries - look to him or her making sure that we do. For the most part, these are self-serving, power-seeking parasites who afford themselves all of the comforts and perks they possibly can, taking as much money from influence seekers and vested interests as possible, so as to prepare for a cushy retirement at our expense. Take heart if you wish in the fact that, at some time in the future, there is no longer a fedral government but rather several territories under looney bin religious rule due to the break up of the country folllowing civil war(s)...if Meier is correct. Michael Horn | ||
Eric_drouin Member Post Number: 148 Registered: 05-2004 |
Hi: Here is an article that supports Michael post: http://www.tompaine.com/articles/2006/11/15/falling_in_line_on_israel.php I recommend you all read it. Salome | ||
Jakes Member Post Number: 18 Registered: 10-2006 |
Hello Hunter, Yes, I agree the conditions for Bin Laden's jihad would still have existed under Gore. But the attacks on 9-11 could have been thwarted if the Bush administration simply acted on its intelligence instead of having ulterior motives, such as using the attacks to institutionalize further executive powers with the Patriot Act. Unlike Bush, Clinton successfully ignored PNAC overtures during his tenure, and Gore didn’t have necon bugs in his ear. (Those bugs were going into IRAQ regardless of the facts.) Of course this is just speculation, but I think Gore would have prevented the 9-11 attacks and IRAQ would have been contained, not invaded. But what might have happened subsequently on Gore’s watch is anyone’s guess. I’m hoping he would have gotten Bin Laden, but that’s not something either Clinton or Bush could do. (Don’t really think Bush’s heart was in it.) If the stakes weren’t so high I would also vote for more independent-minded candidates. But when a live grenade is tossed in your sinking ship, you better throw it out before bailing any more water. | ||
Tjames Member Post Number: 227 Registered: 12-2004 |
Hello Eric and all, I read the article, and as usual it is up to the people to make any significant positive changes. We need to slingshot immense pressure upon our Senators, House and Judiciary. However, this will hardly be useful because they are so overburdened already with tasks at hand they barely read bills before they get passed on. What the citizens of America need to do is get organized in a way that we have never seen. Just becuause the Dems have taken the house and Senate doesn't spell out any more security for Americans or Iraqi's alike. In actuality it spells the same word D.E.S.T.R.U.C.T.I.O.N. Remember the Democrats only won by a few seats so at the very best all this government can offer us is a STALEMATE. That literally is the best thing that can happen (realistically) out of the Democratic takeover. And as usual Michael you are absolutely correct most politicians want your money and only think and get creative when they are plotting ways to spend it. America needs reform, identifying with our roots, our herritage and learning from history or looking into other cultures predictions of the future like Nostradamous to see that our path of destruction only holds a path that is a bleek one riddled with slippery moss on the stepping stones our insane leaders have laid out intentionally before us with in hopes you slip and fall in the sharp thorns beneath. Is this view cynical? Perhaps, but I find it seems this is true when they don't have your best interests in mind, leading many astray with their speeches of false concern and hope. I guess the question is, How do we organize in a fashion that will capture the hearts and minds of our fellow brothers in a way that provokes thought instead of discrimination and fear. If I may quote my life long friend who writes "Political correctness is causing more segregation between races and cultures than racism itself. " I agree totally. We spend so much time not officially offending anyone we let the real crooks get away with mass-murder. As every human must fight to survive for what we hold true and dear to our hearts, we must regain what this is across the globe and make some tough decisions. The silent revolution of Truth. Salome gam nan been urda gan njber hasala hesporona! | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 197 Registered: 07-2004 |
I don't feel that religions are going to rule anywhere in America, at least not out in the open. They are constantly exposed for their hypocrisies and they aren't increasing in size. The religious element is shrinking in stature and it's becoming more and more extreme as their power source begins to shrink. We can only hope that the real truth that lays behind religious history continues to become more and more exposed telling us the reason it exists, to control the people. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 692 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi Norm... Yes, I know what you mean. It is familiar to me: the alleged German links, from the past. But it seems that in the end of the late 1800(can not remember the precise year) the elite wealthy in America baptized it to become their own. And wanted to be more powerful than the Freemasons, or any other body on Earth. I can not remember the name anymore, of the key-player whom played a leading role, in making it come into reality...alas. Edward. | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 250 Registered: 03-2004 |
Sophie Scholl - The Final Days This movie was released on DVD last Tuesday. EVERYONE should go rent this film. It's an unbelievably powerful story of the youth of Germany taking a stand against the fascism of the Nazis! Here's a great review: http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig7/rosinger2.html | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 251 Registered: 03-2004 |
Kissinger: Military Victory No Longer Possible in Iraq By Tariq Panja ASSOCIATED PRESS 8:07 a.m. November 19, 2006 LONDON – Military victory is no longer possible in Iraq, former Secretary of State Henry Kissinger said in a television interview broadcast Sunday. Kissinger presented a bleak vision of Iraq, saying the U.S. government must enter into dialogue with Iraq's regional neighbors – including Iran – if progress is to be made in the region. “If you mean by 'military victory' an Iraqi government that can be established and whose writ runs across the whole country, that gets the civil war under control and sectarian violence under control in a time period that the political processes of the democracies will support, I don't believe that is possible,” he told the British Broadcasting Corp. But Kissinger, an architect of the Vietnam war who has advised President Bush about Iraq, warned against a rapid withdrawal of coalition troops, saying it could destabilize Iraq's neighbors and cause a long-lasting conflict. “A dramatic collapse of Iraq – whatever we think about how the situation was created – would have disastrous consequences for which we would pay for many years and which would bring us back, one way or another, into the region,” he said. Kissinger, whose views have been sought by the Iraqi Study Group, led by former Secretary of State James Baker III, called for an international conference bringing together the permanent members of the United Nations Security Council, Iraq's neighbors – including Iran – and regional powers like India and Pakistan to work out a way forward for the region. “I think we have to redefine the course, but I don't think that the alternative is between military victory, as defined previously, or total withdrawal,” he said. http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/world/iraq/20061119-0807-britain-iraq-kissinger.html | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 252 Registered: 03-2004 |
CIA Murder - high ranking ex-CIA agent says over 6 million people have been killed John Stockwell is the highest-ranking CIA official ever to leave the agency and go public. He ran a CIA intelligence-gathering post in Vietnam, was the task-force commander of the CIA's secret war in Angola in 1975 and 1976, and was awarded the Medal of Merit before he resigned. Stockwell's book In Search of Enemies, published by W.W. Norton 1978, is an international best-seller. "I did 13 years in the CIA altogether. I sat on a subcommittee of the NSC, so I was like a chief of staff, with the GS-18s (like 3-star generals) Henry Kissinger, Bill Colby (the CIA director), the GS-18s and the CIA, making the important decisions and my job was to put it all together and make it happen and run it, an interesting place from which to watch a covert action being done... I testified for days before the Congress, giving them chapter and verse, date and detail, proving specific lies. They were asking if we had to do with S. Africa, that was fighting in the country. In fact we were coordinating this operation so closely that our airplanes, full of arms from the states, would meet their airplanes in Kinshasa and they would take our arms into Angola to distribute to our forces for us.... What I found with all of this study is that the subject, the problem, if you will, for the world, for the U.S. is much, much, much graver, astronomically graver, than just Angola and Vietnam. I found that the Senate Church committee has reported, in their study of covert actions, that the CIA ran several thousand covert actions since 1961, and that the heyday of covert action was before 1961; that we have run several hundred covert actions a year, and the CIA has been in business for a total of 37 years. What we're going to talk about tonight is the United States national security syndrome. We're going to talk about how and why the U.S. manipulates the press. We're going to talk about how and why the U.S. is pouring money into El Salvador, and preparing to invade Nicaragua; how all of this concerns us so directly. I'm going to try to explain to you the other side of terrorism; that is, the other side of what Secretary of State Shultz talks about. In doing this, we'll talk about the Korean war, the Vietnam war, and the Central American war. rest of the lecture is here: http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article4068.htm | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 253 Registered: 03-2004 |
Japan PM Says it’s Time to Renounce Pacifism and Rebuild Military Capabilities http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/11/14/AR2006111400522.html?nav=rss_email/components | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 1046 Registered: 02-2000 |
I guess they fear N. Korea. My Website | ||
Nestingwave Member Post Number: 37 Registered: 03-2005 |
Hunter -- You said, "I found that the Senate Church committee has reported, in their study of covert actions, that the CIA ran several thousand covert actions since 1961, and that the heyday of covert action was before 1961; that we have run several hundred covert actions a year, and the CIA has been in business for a total of 37 years." There have also been quite a few hearings on the CIAs illegal mind-control activities. Hunter, perhaps you have heard of "Operation Paperclip." After WW2 the United States brought top echelon nazi scientists and intelligence people over to the U.S. They underwent a program called "denazification" which was a joke. Eleanor Roosevelt objected strongly to the U.S. bringing the "ex" nazis over and setting them up in business here. Our government silenced her through ridicule. They wanted the intel information that the nazis had concerning Russia -- and they also wanted to continue and expand the secret technologies of the 3rd Reich which were later enhanced by the technologies stolen from Nicola Tesla upon his death. Well, in 1947 along comes the "National Security Act" and in that same year the CIA was formed. (Yes, Roswell took place in that year too -- coincidence?) At the first, the CIA was loaded with "ex"-nazi gestapo and SS. Today, the cult of intelligence has grown like a cancer into a "secret" government that has absolutely NO moral ethics whatsoever. They strictly go by the principle that "the end justifies the means." They do not answer to the Congress nor to the American people nor to the President but only to their own hidden "puppet master." They have subverted our whole government and have their eyes on world control. They are connected to and work with every other "intel" organization on earth including the very oldest -- the Jesuits. They use terrorism to manipulate. That's what Al Qaida is -- a huge manipulation machine. According to one of the leaders of MI6, Al Qaida is A CIA DATABASE. Our government TRAINED them in Afghanistan and SPONSORED them. They are subject to mind-control by experts from the time they are children. Look up the history of Wahhabism -- the radical Jihadist branch of Islam that enshrouds Bin Laden (Bush's business partner). Wahhabism WAS INVENTED, SPONSORED, ENCOURAGED and FINANCED originally by BRITISH INTEL. The Brits USED the radical Islamic terrorism against the Ottoman Empire -- and yes, the cult of intelligence is still at it today. Someone has their eye on world-wide control over the minds and souls of men and, unfortunately, is quite far along in that pursuit. Here's the good news. Their only real power is in their SECRECY. Bring 'em to light and they're finished. I'm not saying it will be easy. So, thanks be to the few corageous intel people with a conscience who BLOW THE WHISTLE. But, there are many many layers to be unraveled. Salome, nestingwave | ||
Jakes Member Post Number: 19 Registered: 10-2006 |
Has anyone noticed how, since the mid-term elections on 11/7 (2-1/2 weeks ago), gasoline prices are increasing, the stock market is declining and the US dollar is plunging? And did anyone notice how, in the run-up to the elections, just the opposite was occurring? Coincidence, manipulation or are we being punished through cause and effect for the poor judgment of keeping Bush in office? (Our poor judgment diminishes the world’s confidence in our country, its markets and currency.) I am on record at work with my colleagues as saying that these things were possibly being manipulated (artifically improved) prior to the election and that they would reverse shortly afterwards. I have no direct evidence, mind you, just observations. But the saying in politics is that what matters most on Main Street is the price of gas. | ||
Nestingwave Member Post Number: 38 Registered: 03-2005 |
No kidding Jake! Yes, my friend, we are being manipulated by propaganda and mind-control experts. It is ALL controlled and unfortunately, most folks still do not have a clue. It's just too hard to believe. They scratch their heads and say, "why, SURELY they wouldn't do THAT, would they?" Oh yes they would -- and more. In fact, they'll do ANYTHING for the sake of their criminal agenda and they do not care how many lies they tell nor how many bodies they walk over. And -- it's been that way for a LONG TIME -- not just since 911. I'm for EVERY SINGLE member of the government being REQUIRED to take a comprehensive state-of-the-art LIE DETECTOR test -- and -- ALL the results MUST be made completely public. Let's have some REAL transparency instead of rhetoric. Some will say, "oh but lie detector tests are not reliable." Tell that to the lie detector experts who offer a #25,000 reward to ANYONE who can beat one. They've NEVER yet had to pay off according to my fiend who is in that business. What would the results of that be? Probably the complete collapse of the present government who are the most notorious liars in history. Salome, nestingwave | ||
Jakes Member Post Number: 20 Registered: 10-2006 |
Hi Nestingwave, In addition to the lie detector test, perhaps all persons seeking to run for office should be required to take a test measuring their knowledge and wisdom in things related to the office they seek, such as finance, economics, law, ethics, current events, history, geography, etc. You would also want to know how they go about making decisions, how objective they are, how susceptible they are to negative outside influence, etc. People with a failing grades would not be permitted to run for office, and all scores would be made public so the electorate would have some objective data upon which to judge the candidates. People in public office should also be permanently banned (lifetime) from ever working in a position where their prior governmental position could be used for personal or commercial gain. That would eliminate the greedy ones from government and the good-ole-boy network. Then only people that truly want to be of service to their government would apply. | ||
Jakes Member Post Number: 21 Registered: 10-2006 |
Hello Hunter, I didn’t want to say before that I think any vote for a third party candidate is wasted, but apparently it’s much worse than that. If enough people that were thinking NOT BUSH or NO MORE REPUBLICANS IN CONGRESS had voted for third-party candidates instead, Bush and his cronies apparently would have had the influence/power to start a war in Iran and we’d be further down the path of the third world fire. When a live grenade gets thrown into a sinking ship, better to get rid of the grenade before bailing water. Or as Steven Covey says, first things first. P.S.: I guess with the Republican loss of Congress, the plan to invade Iran was shelved (the Dems wouldn't support it), and no more need for Rumsfeld to oversee the implementation of that plan (hence he was resigned). A new direction (Plan B), perhaps more covert, with Bates (former CIA) at the helm. | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 255 Registered: 03-2004 |
Nestingwave, thanks for the info - some of it was new to me. Jake, Again, it doesn't really matter. The CIA is at the helm and they probably have numerous operatives in Iran already seeing what nefarious schemes they can concoct. They'll just stir up trouble, but they can't start an all out war unless they get the go ahead from the higher ups - and, win or lose, I don't think Bush had enough political capital left to pull it off. As for the grenade analogy - yes, it's better to throw out a grenade, but if the water is rising at such a rate that your boat will sink anyway in less than an hour - your action ultimately did little good. I hate to be so pessimistic about it, but our politicians give me little choice. | ||
Hector Member Post Number: 148 Registered: 04-2006 |
The thing is if WWW3 starts november 2008 or 2010 ( in the case Billy`s prophecies are accurate) it won`t be moronic Bush the war criminal that would start it, but some other (supposedly) democrat president. Does anyone imagine Hillary Clinton starting a world fire? She has repeatedly given her aproval to the repugnant "stay the course" strategy. But let`s not forget that the moron in chief has much time left until Nov 4 2008 to promote his insanity and stupidity around the world. | ||
Jakes Member Post Number: 24 Registered: 10-2006 |
Hello Hector, The US President remains in office until his successor’s inauguration, which is January 20, 2009. If you remember, former President Jimmy Carter was working feverishly (correcting the typos in his memos) on the release of the Iranian-held US hostages up until the minute of Reagan’ inauguration. Alas, the hostages were released just hours after Reagan’s inauguration. If four heads of state die in November 2008, you’ll have an idea who is responsible. There is no guarantee Ms. Clinton will win her party’s nomination. She’s not skull and bones.  | ||
Pudd Member Post Number: 64 Registered: 02-2006 |
Where do I find 2008 in billys prophecies? Peace | ||
Nestingwave Member Post Number: 41 Registered: 03-2005 |
Hi Hector, When the first nuke falls and vaporizes a city, it will be difficult, if not impossible, to divert a world-wide conflagration. Yep, you are right. Hillary is as good a candidate as any to be the one to wipe out civilization as we know it. Does anybody realize that we've ALEADY been involved in nuclear warfare with the use of DU weaponry since Bosnia? A few years ago there was a conference of physicians from all over the world. They tried to warn us and bring attention to the horrors of DU, since in some countries the doctors encounter the horrible effects of DU every single day. The government (as usual) says depleted uranium weapons are "safe." Hello? That "moron in chief" is a very dangerous man now that he is loosing support. In my opinion, he needs to be arrested immediately and put behind bars along with all his lying minions. But -- as you can see, that's not happening. The dems are AFRAID to stand up for what's right and thus we will have "more of the same" until, like Vietnam, our soldiers in Iraq make their last stand on a rooftop and are evacuated by helicopter. Who knows how many will die before then -- for nothing, as many have already. The ONLY answer I know of is the Peace Meditation and similar efforts of good people around the world. And -- I do think that politics has a large dose of exopolitics going on behind the scenes and, indeed, exopolitics may be the governing factor. Peace be upon the earth and among all beings. nestingwave | ||
Jakes Member Post Number: 26 Registered: 10-2006 |
Hi Pudd, Good question. | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 257 Registered: 03-2004 |
* Does anyone imagine Hillary Clinton starting a world fire? Hector, I don't think this will be the case based on a passage from contact 251: "Likewise this holds true for an enomous revenge campaign directed against the war precipitators, which will be initiated and directed by a bloodthirsty man who is (omitted) a pope." What this tells me is that the world "war (3) precipitators" are the Muslims - otherwise, there would be no need for a revenge campaign led by a Christian Pope. So, I don't think Hillary will start the war, but the election of a woman as President would probably be seen as a sign of weakness by the fundamentalist jihadists, and might incite them further. | ||
Jakes Member Post Number: 29 Registered: 10-2006 |
Hello Hunter, Aren't there already precipitators on both sides, Muslim and Christian (or Western)? In one scenario, the CIA or Israel attack Iran's nuclear facilities. China then vaporizes Israel. What the US does next is crucial. And I though the pope after Ratzinger was to be the last, and that this last pope (petrus romanus) he would be driven from office. Will he be the one to lead the revenge campaign? Hunter, I'm not questioning you. Just scattered ruminations about Contact 251. You don't need to answer them. | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 258 Registered: 03-2004 |
Jake, yes there are precipitators of the kind of violence that will lead up to a World War on all sides, but from the Henoch prophecies and contact 251, the information contained therein seems to point to a Muslim invasion of Europe with China as a possible ally. An invasion of multiple countries, or a WMD attack on Israel, would be seen as the beginning of an all out war - from the standard historical viewpoint. As for the pope, no, I think the implication is that Petrus Romanus will die in the Muslim invasion of Italy. I think this new "revenge" pope will emerge later. The few members of the surviving Catholic hierarchy will obviously go into exile, as the Buddhists did when China invaded Tibet. They will save their traditions and announce the election of a new pope from a safe place and try to gather others to their cause. | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 306 Registered: 07-2005 |
G'day hunter Just for some clearing up on what you wrote although it's just your opinion. *****As for the pope, no, I think the implication is that Petrus Romanus will die in the Muslim invasion of Italy. I think this new "revenge" pope will emerge later.*********** I thought according to the prophecies After the turn of the millennium, the papacy will exist only a short period. Pope John Paul II is the third from last in this position. After him, only one additional pontificate will follow. Then a Pontifex Maximus follows who will be known as Petrus Romanus. Under his religious rule, the end of the Catholic Church will come, a total collapse becoming inevitable. That will be the beginning of the worst catastrophe that will ever have befallen the human beings and the Earth. Many Catholic clerics, priests, bishops, cardinals and many others will be killed and their blood will flow in streams. But also the reformed version of Christianity will become just as infinitely small, as does Catholicism. I may have read you wrong and the possibilities exists where turn of events will shape up in the form that we least expected but given the information it seems Petrus Romanus will be the last pope before the catholic churches demise. cheers Matt | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 260 Registered: 03-2004 |
Matt, Yes, I'm reading a little something into it. In my opinion, when the Plejarens speak of absolutes - it doesn't actually mean all or nothing. I don't have time to check right now, but I believe they also said the Northern hemisphere will be uninhabitable and that all plant life and animal life will die. But then there are later mentions of civil wars in America and the combining of pig-human DNA. If no one can live in the Northern hemisphere, how can there be civil wars in America? If animals have been wiped out, where did we acquire genetic material from pigs to make these hybrids? It would also seem like a logical assumption to conclude that humanity simply could not continue to exist on earth without ANY plant or animal life whatsoever to sustain us. So what I think the Plejarens are saying when they speak in absolutes like that is that the vast majority of these things will cease to exist or cease to be habitable, but there will still be some survivors in the region, although it will for the most part be considered rather desolate. As for Catholicism, Vatican City will be overrun and every carninal/pope/priest that can be murdered will be, but this doesn't mean that other Catholics in other areas won't survive and won't live to carry on the traditions. I see the "revenge pope" as one who will arise from a new Catholic order after the old one has been wiped out. Namaste, Hunter | ||
Michael Member Post Number: 547 Registered: 10-2000 |
The animal-human hybrid experiments have already begun to occur. Here is some info (there were some earlier experiments involving pig-human mixtures, as Meier predicted): Animal-Human Hybrids Spark Controversy Maryann Mott National Geographic News January 25, 2005 Scientists have begun blurring the line between human and animal by producing chimeras„a hybrid creature that's part human, part animal. Chinese scientists at the Shanghai Second Medical University in 2003 successfully fused human cells with rabbit eggs. The embryos were reportedly the first human-animal chimeras successfully created. They were allowed to develop for several days in a laboratory dish before the scientists destroyed the embryos to harvest their stem cells. Email to a Friend RELATED Fluorescent Mice Herald Gene-Transfer Breakthrough Scientific Pitfalls Complicate Cloning Debate Cloned Pigs Modified for Use in Human Transplants Mice Used as Sperm Factories for Pigs, Goats Anti-Aging Drug for Humans Hinted at by Worm Study Modified Mice Stay Super-Fit„Without Exercise In Minnesota last year researchers at the Mayo Clinic created pigs with human blood flowing through their bodies. And at Stanford University in California an experiment might be done later this year to create mice with human brains. Scientists feel that, the more humanlike the animal, the better research model it makes for testing drugs or possibly growing "spare parts," such as livers, to transplant into humans. Watching how human cells mature and interact in a living creature may also lead to the discoveries of new medical treatments. But creating human-animal chimeras„named after a monster in Greek mythology that had a lion's head, goat's body, and serpent's tail„has raised troubling questions: What new subhuman combination should be produced and for what purpose? At what point would it be considered human? And what rights, if any, should it have? There are currently no U.S. federal laws that address these issues. Ethical Guidelines The National Academy of Sciences, which advises the U.S. government, has been studying the issue. In March it plans to present voluntary ethical guidelines for researchers. A chimera is a mixture of two or more species in one body. Not all are considered troubling, though. For example, faulty human heart valves are routinely replaced with ones taken from cows and pigs. The surgery„which makes the recipient a human-animal chimera„is widely accepted. And for years scientists have added human genes to bacteria and farm animals. Michael Horn | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 261 Registered: 03-2004 |
Good article: Adolf Hitler: How Could a Monster Succeed in Blinding a Nation? http://naturalchild.com/alice_miller/adolf_hitler.html Also, I highly recommend everyone go rent the DVD "Terrorstorm" by Alex Jones. | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 330 Registered: 07-2005 |
http://www.figu.org/de/download/so_bulletin_31.pdf Dear forum YES YES and YES to direct democracy Great article from the no.31, nov 2006 bulletin Equality for all All men are created equal but some think that they are more equal than others. Can you believe the staggering 40% of humanity's wealth is in the hands of 356 richest families, no wonder most people suspect that the richest minorities had formed an alliance to further their own economic and political agendas through the elite network of:- black nobility illuminati committee of 300 freemasonry knights of malta and other societies skulls and bones various political institutions and ideologies banking and business religion drugs and arms trade intelligence agencies the military round table/royal institute of international affairs bilderberger group tax exempt foundations the club of rome trilateral commision council of foreign relations NATO OECD/G8 EU world bank IMF UN Media world health organisations, education and science UNESCO Eugenics not to mention others that aren't mentioned Looking back to the patterns that are so obvious in this society, those so called white collar workers espouse ideals that conform with the elite agenda and are rewarded handsomely. It's so common for an excutive CEO to earn millions of dollars with stock options who have other directorship to many different companies, who then help to recruit one of their own to other high positions, thereby jacking up the prices of excutive positions and thus the value of their own serivce to the company irrespective of whether they've made money for the shareholders or not. The commonly asked questions since time immemorial for any human is:- 'what makes you happy?' Most answer with a tinge of guilt, 'well I'd like to make heaps of money, buy a mansion furnished with all luxurious goods, go on a mad shopping spree, buy a ferrari or a lamborghini, go on a world cruise or a holiday to exotic destinations, hire a full time nanny, personal assistant and housekeeper, go to yoga and pilate classes, dine in fine restaurants, have a huge collection of art and wine and then think about donating some money to charity. It seems the elite agenda has hijacked the minds of many and have fuelled their lust for materialistic aspirations that in the end serve their own interests by converting many people into unthinking sheeples that consume, consume and consume some more as consumers of products that are interwoven with psychological meaning that serves the ego rather than the need. As long as the problems persists, the voices of dissent will only get louder and louder. cheers Matt | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 262 Registered: 03-2004 |
Why a World Power? by Steve Trinward The quest to be Number One is endemic to our American society, and perhaps to our species itself. Whether it's being the Alpha Male in your local social herd, winning an Oscar or a Grammy, or getting to play Ohio State in the Bowl Championship of college football, being recognized as the top dog in the game is prized almost above life itself for the vast majority of us. And even in our own private lives, we are taught and encouraged to excel – and to outrun, out-earn or just outlast the "competition" – as part of achieving "success" in the world. Even for most of those who claim to reject this paradigm, there's still a drive to do and be best at something, and for individuals there's really nothing wrong with that. Striving to better oneself is a valid goal, and it's only when we get into comparisons with the achievements of others (instead of the challenge of bettering our own previous milestones) that pathology may enter the picture. Wanting to be the best you can be is not only laudatory but life-affirming. The problem occurs when nations try to emulate this behavior. Whether it's the ancient empires ( Rome , Britain , Ottoman, et alia) or their more recent analogues ( U.S.S.R. , U.S.A. and the People's Republic of China , most obviously), the striving of the leadership of a nation tends to be more about domination of others than the betterment of its own citizenry. And the present mess the Limbaugh have dragged us all into is only the most obvious example today. The most glorious opportunity for letting go of this adversarial "member measuring" happened in 1989, when less than a decade after Ronald Reagan had urged Mikhail Gorbachev to "tear down this wall" . . . the latter's replacements did precisely that, as Berlin, Germany ceased to be a city divided by concrete and bricks. The cheers went up all over the world, as the possibility suddenly existed that Cold War politics had perhaps seen its last breath. Over the next several months and years, the so-called "evil empire" of Soviet oppression dissolved into its original member-states, as the specter of "Mother Russia" shrank to a single nation – still formidable geographically, at about twice the size of the U.S.A., yet with less than half of the U.S. population far less imposing than the former two-continent expanse of turf had been. In addition, the leadership of that considerably shrunken empire finally took a look at the status of its own people, saw it sadly lacking, and began to institute economic reforms with more free market than planned economy in them. The result was both greater prosperity for their own citizens and a lower emphasis on pushing offensive weaponry at the rest of the world. Although there's still some concern about "renegades" in one or more of the former Soviet satellites having access to missiles and such, the primary claims of the Cold Warriors were laid to rest for the most part. And what does this leave them? Well, they've tried to turn our attention to the "other Red menace" in China, correctly noting that country's Communist heritage, as well as its overflowing population in need of territory just to spread out their own holdings (though its population is well over one billion, China actually covers less territory than the U.S.). But recent events have led most pundits to admit that China is also too busy building an economic infrastructure, and promoting at least semi-free market options among its people, to focus much on world domination. Moreover, the latest official world from Beijing declares that China has no interest in engaging in an "arms race" with any Western nation, let alone the United States . So now, of course – having failed to piss off either of the current so-called "major powers" of the world sufficient to get them to threaten to "bury us" as Nikita obligingly did some 40 years ago – we've got the new Cold War, waged against some nameless thing called "terrorism." By definition this is not tagged to any specific national entity, but scatters itself among the countryside, so our imperial leaders can point in almost any convenient direction and claim that target-nation is "abetting terrorists" . . . and so it goes. The offshoot of this imperialist view of the world is, of course, the colonialist "nation-building" and "democracy nurturing" that gets used as the cover for the expansionism so favored by neocons and other oligarch elitists. And so in the name of "advancing society," these powermongering creeps push forward to dominate and destroy other countries, sovereign though they should be. The problem, of course, is that America was never intended to be a "world power." The Founders sought liberty, not conquest; the Revolutionary War was fought to achieve independence, not a new king; and even the Constitution, with all its warts, could not get past the ratification process without tacking on the Ten Commandments of Liberty, the Bill of Rights – each of these designed to circumscribe the power of the State itself, not to define the limits of what individuals might do. Were they merely looking to establish a new Imperium? No. They sought to create a wholly different paradigm and pathway to follow, one in which "that government which governs least, governs best" (with the rather logical conclusion that "least" might even equal . . . "not at all"). And part and parcel to that was that such a government would not be used as a cover for the exploitation of other sovereign nations, or to mask efforts to install our way of thinking in others against their will. It was also not in the plan for this America to become the world's policeman, intervening in local squabbles and trying to impose our way of being on other cultures. Above all else, it was not part of that grand design for a sovereign America to oppress its own citizenry, in the name of facing down other nations – whether in "arms races" or in any other kind of competition . . . except in the competition of free market commerce, and free transfer of goods and services among free individuals. By forgetting this, and buying into the fearmongering of the power brokers who purport to lead us, we have subverted the very meaning of words like "liberty" and "peaceful coexistence," replacing them with a constant condition of fear and apprehension, in which the next excuse for "going to war" (without so much as a murmur of Congressional approval, instead of its full sanction, as required by our own set of laws under the Constitution) could be as flimsy as "terrorists might be hiding there" or "they might be making weapons of mass destruction" (despite no evidence of either condition). If we ever choose to stop acting like America should be anything more than a nation of free individuals, living peaceably with others and trading voluntarily, we might finally have a chance to at least begin to restore that "American Dream" we keep hearing about. Until we let go of this pathological need to be "Numero Uno" – the biggest bully on the block – we'll continue to miss the point of Tom and Sam and Patrick and all the rest of those brave patriots who gave us this opportunity in the first place. Will it ever happen? Let us pray it is so . . . . http://www.strike-the-root.com/62/trinward/trinward2.html | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 263 Registered: 03-2004 |
THE U.S. DEPARTMENT OF OFFENSE - PROPPING UP THE EMPIRE By David Brownlow May 14, 2006 Many are unaware that at $500 billion a year, we Americans squander as much on our military as the rest of the world does on theirs - combined! This includes some of the (other) really cutthroat regimes, like China, Russia, and Iran. There is no one else even close. Could it be possible that American defense needs are so unique that it takes $500 billion just to protect our country? No, that is not possible. Defending a country is relatively cheap. Building an empire is not. Somewhere along the way, we seem to have confused our military with a Department of Offense. Without a doubt, we have created the most fearsome and ferocious military machine the world has ever known. Unfortunately, instead of being used as a defensive force, our military has become the global enforcement arm for the madmen who have seized control of our country - who wield this power like spoiled kids as they strut around the world, barking out intimidations and threats to any who refuse to bow down before them. It is time to take away their toys. Propping up the Empire requires a massive amount of firepower - which has left us with weapons systems that defy all logic. The new F-22 radar-evading fighter, at $280 million a copy, is a perfect example of how crazy things have gotten. Two hundred and eighty million bucks for an airplane, when a top of the line F-16 sells for about $20 million, is completely nuts. There will be no need for radar-evading fighters as soon as we start minding our own business - and quit trying to sneak around in places we do not belong. The F-22 is just one example of the insanity. There are dozens of others. We can be confident of this - if we keep building the weapons of war, our leaders will keep finding ways to use them. Even our Navy, which we have every right to maintain, has become an empire building force. Does it really take fourteen carrier battle groups just to protect our coastline? No, of course not. The same goes for most of the other 450 war ships in our fleet. Unless there is a foreign invading force lurking out there that we are not aware of, we could get by with a lot fewer ships. We just need to keep our sailors at home patrolling our own shores, instead of wandering around the world patrolling everybody else’s. Our active troop strength is also completely out of whack with our defense needs. Why do we need 1.4 million soldiers in uniform? They are certainly not being used to protect our borders. Maybe that is because nearly 400,000 of them being used to protect somebody else’s borders! On top of the 140,000 we have getting shot up in Iraq, there are over 200,000 American soldiers stationed in 140 of the worlds 192 countries. This includes 66,000 in Germany, 35,000 in Japan, and 30,000 in Korea. We beat those guys over 50 years ago, so what are we doing still hanging around in their countries? We even have soldiers stranded in some of the world’s most obscure places – 1,300 in Djibouti, 400 in Quatar, and 2,000 in Serbia, to name a few. It is unbelievable. It is time to bring every one of them home! Here is an interesting fact; if we add up the annual military spending for the entire western hemisphere, minus the U.S., it comes to less than $25 billion a year. How could it possibly take America twenty times that amount to defend ourselves? Well for starters, our neighbors tend to mind their own business and keep their armies out of other peoples countries. Canada, with a larger landmass to protect than we do, finds a way to defend their country for about $8 billion a year. Brazil, with a population of 186 million and 5,000 miles of coastline to protect, manages to defend themselves for only $15 billion a year. Mexico does it for only $4 billion. Our military spending is spiraling out of control not because our defensive needs are so much greater than anyone else’s – it is because our offensive needs are so much greater. What is the alternative to this huge military machine we have unleashed on the world? We could start minding our own business, and quit causing trouble in every corner of the planet. If we did that, a motivated, highly trained and well-armed (well regulated) militia could replace almost every one of our full time soldiers in the Army and Marine Corps. We just need to reset our priorities - and commit to keeping our men out of foreign entanglements. By simply obeying the law, and getting out of the empire building business, we could dramatically trim back the size and scope of our Department of Offense – while making the "homeland," and the world, a much safer place. http://www.newswithviews.com/Brownlow/david55.htm | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 349 Registered: 07-2005 |
G'day Hunter These are very good articles Hunter People who wrote them are very informed of the truth. Might I add another point though to what is stated in these articles. Military spending is also geared in the business side of cronyism, it's a huge vehicle for enriching the elite. Projects are unscrupulously concocted all so that they have a legitimate reason and cover for having spent those huge sums albeit in useless endeavours, to give it the air of it's legitimacy. But then again, everyone knows this. Cheers Matt | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 264 Registered: 03-2004 |
The Original U.S. Foreign Policy by Ron Paul It is our true policy to steer clear of entangling alliances with any portion of the foreign world. ~ George Washington Last week I wrote about the critical need for Congress to reassert its authority over foreign policy, and for the American people to recognize that the Constitution makes no distinction between domestic and foreign matters. Policy is policy, and it must be made by the legislature and not the executive. But what policy is best? How should we deal with the rest of the world in a way that best advances proper national interests, while not threatening our freedoms at home? I believe our founding fathers had it right when they argued for peace and commerce between nations, and against entangling political and military alliances. In other words, noninterventionism. Noninterventionism is not isolationism. Nonintervention simply means America does not interfere militarily, financially, or covertly in the internal affairs of other nations. It does not mean that we isolate ourselves; on the contrary, our founders advocated open trade, travel, communication, and diplomacy with other nations. Thomas Jefferson summed up the noninterventionist foreign policy position perfectly in his 1801 inaugural address: “Peace, commerce, and honest friendship with all nations – entangling alliances with none.” Washington similarly urged that we must, “Act for ourselves and not for others,” by forming an “American character wholly free of foreign attachments.” Yet how many times have we all heard these wise words without taking them to heart? How many claim to admire Jefferson and Washington, but conveniently ignore both when it comes to American foreign policy? Since so many apparently now believe Washington and Jefferson were wrong on the critical matter of foreign policy, they should at least have the intellectual honesty to admit it. Of course we frequently hear the offensive cliché that, “times have changed,” and thus we cannot follow quaint admonitions from the 1700s. The obvious question, then, is what other principles from our founding era should we discard for convenience? Should we give up the First amendment because times have changed and free speech causes too much offense in our modern society? Should we give up the Second amendment, and trust that today’s government is benign and not to be feared by its citizens? How about the rest of the Bill of Rights? It’s hypocritical and childish to dismiss certain founding principles simply because a convenient rationale is needed to justify interventionist policies today. The principles enshrined in the Constitution do not change. If anything, today’s more complex world cries out for the moral clarity provided by a noninterventionist foreign policy. It is time for Americans to rethink the interventionist foreign policy that is accepted without question in Washington. It is time to understand the obvious harm that results from our being dragged time and time again into intractable and endless Middle East conflicts, whether in Iraq, Iran, Syria, Lebanon, or Palestine. It is definitely time to ask ourselves whether further American lives and tax dollars should be lost trying to remake the Middle East in our image. http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul356.html | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 204 Registered: 07-2004 |
Excellent post Hunter! Our nose seems to be involved in so many parts of the world. Our needs at home have grown to create conditions that even our children will still be working to overcome in the future. It's time for people of the US to receive US Gov help. Taxpayer billions need to be spent on this soil for the benefit of the taxpayers. Until Iraq is solved, there won't be any help for the US Citizen. That's the reality we face from this messed up policy we find shoved down our throats. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 360 Registered: 07-2005 |
Dear forum The egregiously amoral 'The father of spin' that edward bernays was, he nonetheless unravelled greater insight and understanding of group behaviour and that of human nature in ways that were prodigious. Through his insights of human nature, we can get a better understanding of the mindset of the invisible guiding hands that direct the social forces which mould our individual and collective views that we are often unaware of. So truly who owns our thoughts, feelings and actions? Can individuals in todays's society be absolutely confident that 'They know thyself' and that any thoughts which has been formulated by themselves are really from themselves? Most people know that they are a product of their environment as well as their heredity and yet if people candidly observed themselves and others, they'll come to the sickening realisation that not all of themselves are free from the restraining forces of society as well as the irrational dogmas that drive it. It is often more with cruel intentions than with good intentions that you hear the term 'For the good of mankind or for all, there needs to be some curtailment of individual freedom in order to have peace and harmony', yet I beg to differ and this is why 1) Most people that I ever come across are often really lost deep inside without knowing the reasons why. They strive for worldly things like better physical image where girls today resort to plastic surgery at a very earlier age, You just have to look at the number of cosmetic brands for women in the department store to see the engine of public relations that drive adolescent as well as the adult population into feeling insecure and bad about themselves which these cosmetic brands will supposedly allay some of the insecurities and make them look and feel good, Victoria's secret cosmetics is one brand of nightly commercial that are shown ad nauseam towing this line or rather exascerbating the problem through subtle suggestions. 2) I mean, this society of ours has it's beautiful attributes but on the whole it can be a hellhole. Just look at the amount of prestigious expensive European cars rolling down the streets in this climate of economic downturn and heightened inflationary rate with unemployment rate still very high even though the mass media will have you think otherwise. Sure I am sure a lot of people including myself would love a porche or a lamborghini but this is not the point, people reason that if they can afford it why not buy one but is it the mere love for cars that sways their purchasing decisions or is there something deeper to which they know not but to succumb in the climate of social ideals and pressures such as wanting to impress. Thinking about it, there is more that compels us to behave incongruously to our better judgements because over the years, the way we judge another has taken on a darker twist, in that you can understand why many people are socially self conscious for the wrong reasons. So essentially, the questions that we need to ask ourselves are, 'How free am I'? http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Propaganda/Propaganda_Bernays.html Cheers Matt | ||
Rarena Member Post Number: 142 Registered: 10-2005 |
Hunter, It is our true policy to steer clear of entangling alliances with any portion of the foreign world. ~ George Washington Agree with the above policy of nonintervention as put forth in your previous example one hundred percent... It's not that we (as a whole) ignore Jefferson and Washington, in regards to their take on noninterventionism... it is that we feel detached from the correct and just process of voting for or against any action taken by our "leaders". Direct democracy is a better, more concise form of government. Action must be voted on by the public, NOT the waggish charismatic politicians with their hidden agendas and ulterior motives. This procedure of ambiguous voting (E.G. such as Yes on 87...) which really means: the exact opposite of what you intuit the bill to be about (without reading the prolixly fine print)... has got to stop. Give the politicos the right to advise. But any action, especially action that may mean the death of our children or anyone for that matter... must be voted upon by the people... give the public four hours to vote: yay or nay... whether that be by phone, computer or some other electronic instantaneous (cost free) means with a similar system as used by our extra secure telephone, banking and financial security systems. No long political arguments, bantering or gestures about the moral integrity of the opposing team etc... Yeah there may be hackers at first, but there is a system of pretty good privacy available such as PGP or DCPPS that can insure hacker safe voting. | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 265 Registered: 03-2004 |
"Neither Nationalist nor Socialist: How the Swiss Kept Their Freedom in World War II" (by Walter Olson of the Manhattan Institute, from Reason Magazine) An "island of liberty and harmony in a sea of dictatorship and discord" and "a citadel of peace through stormy centuries," to quote a 1938 New York Times analysis; "it is a land of hard work and frugal habits, of justice and cleanness and tolerance, of the very essence of live-and-let-live" -- and, not incidentally, the bulwark of free-market capitalism in Europe. To say that Switzerland enjoyed a favorable reputation in America until recently would be to understate matters. Today, after a relentless and astonishingly one-sided media campaign, there is scarcely a horror tale about the Swiss too extreme or absurd to be picked up in the press. The assault began with widely circulated allegations -- the truth is less clear-cut than news reports have made it sound -- that Swiss banks swallowed great sums deposited in private accounts by victims of the Holocaust. (At press time, Swiss banks had reached a tentative agreement to settle those allegations, and avert threatened sanctions, by paying more than $1 billion.) Picking up its own momentum, the indictment soon expanded into a depiction of the Swiss as a nation of heartless profiteers, "Hitler's silent partners," working to advance the Nazi cause without being shot at. In June the Los Angeles-based Simon Wiesenthal Center made worldwide headlines by issuing a report claiming that pro-Nazi activity "thoroughly saturated...the core of Swiss society." Teenagers now grow up hearing that the Swiss spent World War II rooting for the Axis powers. Now Stephen Halbrook, an attorney and well-known Second Amendment expert (he's the author of 1984's That Every Man Be Armed), has taken a much-needed look at the Swiss wartime record in a new book titled "Target Switzerland: Swiss Armed Neutrality in World War II." The book not only provides a starting point for all future discussions of Switzerland's military role in the war, but also makes an interesting contribution to the literature on both federalism and gun rights; according to Halbrook, Switzerland's traditions of extreme decentralization and of a well-armed populace played a key role in preserving its freedom in an hour of peril. As Halbrook reminds us, the American Founders often cited Switzerland as an example of the kind of nation they hoped to build on these shores. They admired its survival for centuries as a democracy amid tyrannies of every kind, following its birth in 1291 as the result of a peasant revolt in the remote fastnesses of the Alps. In 1774, during an unsuccessful attempt to urge Quebec to join the colonists' cause, the Continental Congress pointed to the Swiss federalist model, under which an unassuming central government let diverse cantons go their own way, with religious differences set aside: "Their union is composed of Roman Catholic and Protestant States, living in the utmost concord and peace with one another and thereby enabled, ever since they bravely vindicated their freedom, to defy and defeat every tyrant that has invaded them." Said Patrick Henry: "Let us follow their example, and be happy". Switzerland virtually invented the policy of "armed neutrality": It started no wars and sought no empire, but defended itself with ferocity when attacked. This policy committed it to staying out of other nation's quarrels and trading with all belligerents to the extent permitted by circumstance. The rise of modern nationalism, with its presumption that national boundaries should reflect commonalities of language and lineage, posed a direct challenge to the reasons for Switzerland's existence. Only historical accident, it seemed to nationalist thinkers, separated Swiss Germans (the majority) from the mass of Germans. By the same logic Swiss French clearly belonged with their fellow French-speakers and Swiss Italians with Italy. By the late 1930s, Nazi cartographers were provocatively including German-speaking Swiss cantons in their maps of Grossdeutschland. The Swiss Federal Council replied as follows: "we reject the concept of race or common descent as the basis of a state and as the factor determining political frontiers." The Swiss "national idea", said the council, rests instead on a "spiritual decision" to commit to certain values, of which the most important, it added pointedly, were federalism, democracy, and "respect for the dignity of the individual." Anti-Semitism, rife in much of Europe, found Helvetic soil far less friendly. In 1941 Contemporary Jewish Record, a publication of the American Jewish Committee, observed that "there is no anti-Jewish movement in Switzerland worthy of such designation." "Anti-Semitism is simply intolerance," declared an official 1943 pamphlet issued by the Swiss Army, terming it a form of "foreign propaganda" that "tears at the roots of our democratic way of thinking." Swiss authorities prosecuted and suppressed numerous Nazi-front organizations, arresting or deporting their leadership, who were often German nationals resident in Switzerland. The "bulk of news reporting in [Swiss] broadcasting and the press is anti-German," lamented one high Nazi official. "Germany has no good press in Switzerland." Dependent on coal from Germany, Switzerland went on trading with the Germans long after Hitler's evil had become apparent -- as indeed did the United States until Pearl Harbor. Much to the scandal of today's retroactive moralists, Switzerland also traded extensively in gold with both Axis and Allies. That led to some strange results, since in many cases the two sides were aware that, once the role of the Swiss as middlemen was stripped out, they were in effect trading with each other. Matters worsened when France fell in 1940 and Switzerland found itself entirely surrounded by the Axis, which exercised veto power on its exports and imports. Today's revisionists presumably blame the Swiss for not launching a futile attack on the surrounding Axis, or -- what is much the same thing -- pompously proclaiming sanctions against it. Yet the Allies had ample reason to be glad of Swiss neutrality, which provided many advantages for them -- especially given the alternative of simply letting the Axis occupy and plunder the Swiss economy, as it had done with so many small countries'. Switzerland never let the Germans use its roads or rails for military transport, which deprived Hitler of natural logistic routes for his Italian campaign. Luftwaffe planes intruding on Swiss air space could expect dogfights, and many were downed. The Nazis developed a full ideological critique of Swiss obstinacy. Nazi theorist Ewald Banse accused the German Swiss of "calculating materialism" and "unlimited self-reliance" and said their aloofness from their fellow ethnic Germans arose from a "belief, doubtless justified in the Middle Ages but long since obsolete, that liberty and equality -- those most sacred of human possessions -- are at stake." Hitler himself denounced the Swiss repeatedly as "despicable and wretched", "misbegotten", "renegades", "repugnant", "a pimple on the face of Europe" which "cannot be allowed to continue". (Stalin couldn't stand them either.) The Fuehrer despised their purely defensive military philosophy: "An army whose only goal is to secure peace" is craven, he said. "In addition to all the other characteristics of the Swiss that Hitler disliked," Halbrook adds, "he hated them because of their free market capitalism, which he associated with Judaism." The ever-abusive Voelkischer Beobachter resorted to the epithet "Berg-Semiten": mountain Jews. Again and again, Hitler ordered his generals to draw up plans to invade Switzerland -- but never followed through. Why didn't he? One reason was that military crises elsewhere kept intervening. But another was Switzerland's convincing, if purely defensive, military posture. German troops referred to Switzerland as a porcupine (Stachelschwein); the Swiss air force comprised 250 planes, none of them bombers. The most famous element of Swiss defense were the sabotage plans: At the moment of German invasion the Simplon and St. Gotthard tunnels would be blown up, as well as all bridges over the Rhine, power stations and air fields. Avalanches and landslides would be set off to block armor and infantry movement. Another key deterrent factor, Halbrook suggests, was Switzerland's tradition of a popular army -- "the people in arms." At one point an astonishing 20 percent of the Swiss population was under arms, a figure unheard of in a modern country officially at peace -- or even most countries at war. Every Swiss home had a rifle. Sharpshooting was and is the national sport; each weekend the hills are alive with the sound of gunfire, with fathers delighting in instructing their kids in proper technique. Swiss youths were trained to shoot at 300 meters, Germans at 100. German generals had to consider the example of the Finns, another small nation of skiers and riflemen who had recently held off a Russian invasion far more tenaciously than outsiders expected. Finally, Swiss defensive preparations drew strength from an unrivaled display of the spirit of resistance. Soldiers were ordered to hold their positions to the last cartridge and then fight on with bayonets. Secret munitions caches were distributed through the countryside, and the populace was trained in how to organize partisan warfare. Unlike any other country in Europe, Halbrook says, Switzerland proclaimed that any reports that the federal council or army high command had agreed to surrender were to be ignored as inventions of enemy propaganda. This remarkable policy tied the leadership's own hands for the sake of maximum deterrent effect, and was thinkable only in a nation where long decentralization had distributed the spirit of initiative far and wide. By way of contrast, "Hitler was able to conquer much of Europe by bluffing the central authority of various countries into capitulation," as when the Belgian king surrendered at a point where many of his countrymen would have preferred to fight on. "Switzerland was the only country in Europe that had no political leader with the authority to surrender the people to the Nazis." Halbrook's is not the only voice being raised to correct recent misreporting. When the Wiesenthal Center's report came out in June, Switzerland's own Jewish community dismissed it as outrageous and ridden with errors. The Basel-based Juedische Rundschau criticized its "exaggerations and falsifications", while the head of the Swiss Confederation of Hebrew Congregations found the report "one-sided and exaggerated." "The Swiss Nazis were weak in numbers," pointed out Zurich's Israelitisches Wochenblatt. "In the parliament in Bern they had exactly one seat for four years." Most embarrassingly, Simon Wiesenthal himself, the famed Nazi-hunter after whom the center was named, disavowed the report as biased and inaccurate. The book doesn't take up the controversy over wartime bank deposits, which deserves its own book (and column). And no one would deny that there are serious dark spots in the Swiss wartime record, including the actions of a wartime Justice Minister who tilted refugee-acceptance policy away from fleeing German Jews, and some defeatist pronouncements by the (fortunately, mostly ceremonial) Swiss federal President. But the more balanced view remains Winston Churchill's. "I put this down for the record," wrote Churchill to Anthony Eden in a December 1944 memo reprinted in Triumph and Tragedy. "Of all the neutrals Switzerland has the greatest right to distinction. What does it matter whether she has been able to give us the commercial advantages we desire or has given too many to the Germans to keep herself alive? She has been a democratic State, standing for freedom in self-defense among her mountains, and in thought, in spite of race, largely on our side." http://2asig.iqhost.net/2001/dec.htm | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 366 Registered: 07-2005 |
Dear forum http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/12/28/iraq/main2304318.shtml One way or another, there will always be outrage as well as mixed feelings. Absolute power corrupts absolutely and so the USA who had created this monster by giving him this avenue of absolute power will have blood on their hands when saddam is hanged | ||
Hunter Member Post Number: 266 Registered: 03-2004 |
Rarena said: "Direct democracy is a better, more concise form of government. Action must be voted on by the public, NOT the waggish charismatic politicians with their hidden agendas and ulterior motives." Actually, direct democracy has some flaws. That's why the Founders created a Republic instead of a Democracy. For all the details see: http://www.serendipity.li/jsmill/republic.html For one thing, there's no respect for individual rights in a democracy. Whatever the majority wants, the majoriity gets. If the majority is misguided, you're obviously going to get some very bad results. Is the problem just Bush? Or is the problem that millions of Americans continue to vote for and support the guy? But I agree that leaders shouldn't be given free reign. We need greater Constitutional protections to prosecute and convict our politicians if they violate ANY law or standard. And I wouldn't mind seeing a national referendum system whereby the public could veto legislation. | ||
Hector Member Post Number: 169 Registered: 04-2006 |
It seems that the moron in chief is just hours away from watching one of his wet dreams come true, i mean the coming execution of Saddam Hussein which the idiot in chief is going to use as material evidence to prove that "they are winning in Iraq" and they have found out "a way forward" spreading ethnical, religious and sectarian terror. What a shame your USA criminal government, and their international accomplices UN,G8,European Union, allowing such a flawed trial to take place where international observers and lawyers where deliberately banned. http://hrw.org/english/docs/2006/12/26/iraq14937.htm http://web.amnesty.org/pages/irq-281206-statement-eng And these MF's consider themselves to be christians? (Thou shall not kill). Saddam will be driven triumphally to martyrdom and it will generate more sectarian violence...it just doesn't make sense.... Now you can see the absurdity of this Iraq war:No WMD, no "Western Democracy", no cease of violence, no international consensus, no bettering of the living standard...wtf!!! This makes me really sick!!! Moderator, dear friends, excuse the tone, but this is so fustrating and infuriating.... | ||
Rarena Member Post Number: 146 Registered: 10-2005 |
Hunter, As to Direct Democracy the last (11/29/06 following) Sonder bulletin #31 has been converted to English by Christian Frehner and is about Direct Democracy. Thanks Christian. http://www.figu.org/de/download/so_bulletin_31.pdf The Swiss have been using it for years... wasn't that subject in one of the articles you previously quoted? Could not get your last link (serendipity.li) to work is that spelled correctly? | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 400 Registered: 03-2004 |
Here's what Australians heard on the TV news last night: SBS-TV Australia CLIVE WILLIAMS INTERVIEW [with newsreader Lee Lin Chin] We spoke to Professor Clive Williams, intelligence analyst with the Australian National University, about the execution, and asked him for his assessment of today's developments. LEE LIN CHIN: What is the likely response of the insurgency in Iraq to the execution? CLIVE WILLIAMS: I think it will be a relatively low level response because Saddam's support was quite small. He had a small power base in Iraq and 80% of the population is Kurdish and Shia, so they'll be very jubilant about his execution. LEE LIN CHIN: Internationally, though, do you expect that militant groups will attempt to exploit Saddam's death? CLIVE WILLIAMS: It is possible, Saddam didn't have links with terrorist groups, other than if you include Hamas, for example, but otherwise he didn't have links. I think the reaction will be one - particularly by Sunni Arabs - that he is a martyr because he stood up to the United States and Israel, so I think they'll respect him for that, but I don't think there'll be a violent reaction. LEE LIN CHIN: He was due to face a second trial and this one over the gassing of thousands of Kurds at Halabja. Why do you think the death sentence was carried out before that trial? CLIVE WILLIAMS: Many people will say that it was intended to silence Saddam before he could talk about his links to the United States and in particular to chemical supplies because during that period before 1990 he was a close ally of the United States and the US assisted Saddam in his war against Iran. http://www9.sbs.com.au/theworldnews/transcript.php# |
