| Author | Message | ||
    Edward Member Post Number: 991 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi Shawn..... This is the usual New Years poll, in which such research is done. It was one of those Spontaneous polls, from the streets, which interaction on all sorts of individuals, and of all races; which is a very perceptive manner into obtain a first-hand (honest) true answer. But, of course, your community, reflects quite different than, the cities this poll was processed. This, obviously: results will/can differ. Thus, again: it is just a POLL. But still, with surprising results! And the results have been like-wise in that past, also. There is just - Too Much Material - Deceit, going, which influences such individuals. But logically speaking: such results would differ in any city. Our country used to be a very Social country, but it has gone "DOWN Hill" thanks to - Capitalism - which is illing the minds of many. Our country is becoming very - Anti-Social -, thanks to the Right and Ultra Right Parties. And as result: many females would like to wonder on this path, instead of thinking, of a true relation(ship)...which has meaning. And thus: there is No Balance; only Selfishness! But still, we can/must take heed to such results: which will only clarify as is mentioned by the Prophets; the Materialism amongst Man as well as Women. And Women obviously, wanting to surpass Men, due...to their past history, of lacking behind; which I see very clearly; having to have worked with both throughout my life experience. Thus, it IS a result, One should/would expect; Logically...speaking! Edward. | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 312 Registered: 07-2004 |
One more question Edward, did you get a chance to actually read the questions as they were asked to the responders. Word-'smithing' can create illusions to the mind, they do it here regularly. I sense either way you've got a pretty good take on what's happened since the extreme right has become more noticeable where you live. The 'Haves' always stick out with shiny new toys and big houses. What woman wouldn't want to live comfortably rather than just getting by. Unfortunately for the wealth chasers, real spirituality is nearly always vacant, even when someone is living in that big house. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 997 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi Shawn..... It was all on film, as it usually is every year. And done by a number of television broadcasting stations. Yes: Word-'smithing' can indeed be very deceptive. Edward. | ||
Matthew_deagle Member Post Number: 51 Registered: 08-2007 |
Dear all Forum-readers, "Zuechtige nicht deine Gefuehle ahnender form, sondern lebe nach ihnen und befolge sie so, wie du es gelernt hast." "Do not chasten your own feelings of presentiment*, rather live according to them and obey them , as you have learned to do." - Ptaah, Contact Notes Block 2, page 350, Contact # 65, 23 October 1976 * Eine Ahnung is a feeling of presentiment or foreboding, as researched by e.g. Rupert Sheldrake, or a notion, a general sense about something. Billy describes Ahnung as a process in which an Empfindug from the fine-material sense is translated by the "sense" faculty into a fine feeling. There is a spirit-picture of Ahnung in "Symbole der Geisteslehre", page 15. "...Besser sind alle jene dran, welche nach aussen zu weinen vermoegen, um ihren Gefuehlen in dieser Form Ausdruck zu verleihen und sich dadurch zu erleichtern." "Better off are all those who are able outwardly to weep, so as to impart expression to their feelings and therethrough to alleviate themselves." - Semjase, Contact Notes Block 2, page 476, Contact # 79, 6 July 1977. "...Du laesst dich haeufig nur durch deine Gefuehle leiten." "You frequently let yourself be guided merely by your feelings." (said of Billy) - Semjase, Contact Notes Block 2, page 369, Contact # 66, 10 November 1976 (Consider that Billy often allows his feelings to guide him, and that he is by far the most spiritually evolved person on Earth (and therefore the most intelligent). Currently his spirit-form stands at level 4.6 on the scale of evolutionary steps, whereas the average Earth-human being stands at level 2.6, the educated between levels 3.1 - 3.4, and only a few "Grenz- und Geisteswissenschaftler"/fringe- and spiritual-scientists stand at level 3.7.) Salome, - Matthew | ||
Hector Member Post Number: 354 Registered: 04-2006 |
"(Consider that Billy often allows his feelings to guide him, and that he is by far the most spiritually evolved person on Earth (and therefore the most intelligent)" ¿?¿?¿? Just say that the "spiritual intellect" is absolutely not proportional to the capabilities of the material intellect.For instance, many sci-fi writers like Carl Sagan or Isaac Asimov's IQ were way beyond 160, but their comprehension of the creation and it's laws was rather poor. And what makes the difference is the following: The material intellect can be harmed and deteriorated even since birth (loss of oxigen) or later by drugs, injuries.... but the spiritual intelect CANNOT BE INJURED OR DETERIORATED.His worst scenario is stagnation.Therefore you can find people who could be considered "retards" more spiritually evolved then so called "geniuses". Please tell us where you have read Billy or the P's saying he is the smartest person on Earth.NOWHERE. | ||
Matthew_deagle Member Post Number: 59 Registered: 08-2007 |
Dear Hector, I understand your reaction here, but it is merely due to a semantic miscommunication. Semjase states in Contact 6 that general "Intelligence" should be gauged based upon the spirit-form's evolutionary state, while Quetzal states in Contact 208 that there are many various forms of intelligence relating to individual skill and abilities, etc. Furthermore, the only IQ tests with any sort of consistent results, such as the Wechsler Scale, are more effective as personality tests than as gauges of overall intelligence--although it does show tendencies to use one or another 'model' if you like to describe it that way. The Wechsler Test allows psychologists to determine whether a person has an Externalising or Internalising tendency, whether they are more Regulated or Flexible in their behaviour, whether they are more likely to adapt to social situations or repel others through non-adaptiveness; and also possibly how much 'drive' or 'psychic energy' they have--as well as a number of extrapolations, correlations, tensions, and relationships between these personality-factors. Some people, due to their psychological upbringing/development, become tense during tests and close up some of their abilities, such as their empathetic/mirror-neuron capacity, which relates to recognising similarities, for instance, in the event that they have repressed this faculty in order to have a more 'concentrative' attitude. This is just one example of many possibilities. Therefore, IQ tests are not valid measures of general intelligence, but they may be valid measures of personality type, and a high IQ score may correlate to versatility, &c. I doubt that Carl Sagan had an IQ of 160, based upon this theory of personality, since he did not exhibit very versatile behaviour in some ways. Isaa Asimov was quite spiritually-evolved (probably around level 3.4), in any case, and he appears to have been influenced by Plejaren impulse-transmissions. Back to Billy being the most intelligent man alive--this follows quite simply from his spiritual evolutionary level. Even though he suffered brain-damage in the 1980s, he is still leagues ahead of the average person. He was also extremely balanced and versatile before the injuries, and displayed phenomenal ability in nearly every area of human thought and behaviour, both internalising (e.g. he was the greatest philosopher alive) and externalising (he was a virtuosic master of techniques of all kinds)--for just a little 'trinket' from among these abilities, he was reportedly able to photographically cite exactly from which page he had read something, no matter how long ago in his life...his intelligences were all elevated to the heights only seen in Autistic savants and other one-sided persons in the general population--all of them. By Semjase's scale of general intelligence being solely due to the spirit-form's evolution, he is billions of years ahead of most Earth-humans in that respect, too. To debate whether Billy is the most intelligent man alive, therefore, is really quite silly, and reflects, again, a false, quasi-heroic intention to make common his profound teachings and to demean his superiority to the Earth human as an example for what we may become (and not an idol to be worshipped). It should also be noted that, at the spiritual level, while in this series of reincarnations he is at level 4.6, his spirit-form also maintains direct contact with and continues to evolve in the Arahat Athersata level, which gives him a number of other extraordinary capabilities. In this sense, his spirit-form is well over 80 billion years old. Salome, - Matthew | ||
Hector Member Post Number: 355 Registered: 04-2006 |
My comment or correction was only destined to remind the Geisteslehre students that Billy renegates vehemently of any kind of glorification or enthronization like it happened in the past. I recall him saying the sentence " jetzt kommt all die Anhimmelei", which means, in an ironic way, now comes the cultic ceremony in which he is to be canonized, beatificated like all those christian nonsense ceremonies in the Vatican.That's to be avoided. Billy deserves credit for doing his job, but honor and praise can only be directed to the creation.He repeats this constantly.Do not thank me, thank creation. Thank you. | ||
Matthew_deagle Member Post Number: 66 Registered: 08-2007 |
I found this in Block 5, Contact 208 from 8. April 1986, 5:27 a.m. (only one year after Wayne Payne published his doctoral thesis on "Emotional Intelligence". Also consider that he is speaking of conversations with Sfath, which of course took place decades before there was any wide-spread discussion of 'emotional intelligence' among psychologists, &c.) "Billy: Meinerseits hat mich Sfath belehrt, dass die Intelligenz des Menschen vielfaeltiger Form und also nicht nur einer Art ist. So erklaerte er, dass es eine Emotions-Intelligenz, eine Gedanken-Gefuehls-Intelligenz und eine Kreativ-Intelligence gibt, und zwar nebst einer Musik-Intelligenz, Intellektual-Intelligenz, Einzel-Intelligenz und Allgemein-Intelligenz. Weiter nannte er noch die Idee-Intelligenz, Phantasie-Intelligenz und Charakter-Intelligenz sowie Bewusstseins-Intelligenz, wobei dies aber noch nicht alle Erscheinungsformen sind. All die Intelligenzformen zusammengenommen, und zwar in ihrem gesamten Wert, ergeben den eigentlichen Intelligenz-Quotienten. Je hoeher der Quotient sei, desto intensiver und hoeher sei die Gedankensgeschwindigkeit, wobei Hoechstgeschwindigkeit der Gedanken Lichtgeschwindigkeit bedeute. Und je hoeher diese Gedanken- und Kombinationsgeschwindigkeit des Menschen sei, desto hoeher sei auch seine Intelligenz anzusetzen. Das ist mir alles einleuchtend und erscheint mir auch logisch, ganz im Gegensatz zu den sogenannten IQ-Tests, die durch hochtrabene irdische Psychologen usw. gemacht werden. Dazu die Frage, was von diesen Tests zu halten ist?" "Billy: From my side, Sfath had instructed me that the intelligence of human beings is of manifold form and thus is not of only one kind. He explained that there exists an Emotional Intelligence, a Thoughts-Feelings-Intelligence, and a Creative-Intelligence, and in fact also a Musical Intelligence, Intellectual-Intelligence, Individual-Intelligence and General-Intelligence. He further named an Idea-Intelligence, Imaginative-Intelligence, and a Character-Intelligence, as well as a Consciousness-Intelligence, whereby these are still not all of the manifestations. All of the intelligence-forms collectively, and actually in their entire value, result in the actual Intelligence-Quotient. Ever higher be the Quotient, all the more intensive and higher should be the speed of thought, whereby the highest speed of thought would mean light-speed. And ever higher this thought- and combination-speed of the person should be, all the higher should her intelligence be estimated to be. All of that makes sense to me and appears to me also to be logical, quite in contrast to the so-called 'IQ-Tests', which are made by grandiloquent terrestrial psychologists. To that the question: what is there to make of these tests?" "Quetzal: Die Handhabung dieser Intelligenz-Quotientstests bei den irdischen Psychologe-Ausuebenden sind mir bekannt. Leider muss ich diese Tests als aeusserst mangelhaft und gar ebenso als falsch bezeichnen wie auch die von den Psychologen angewandte Psychologie, die wahrheitlich zum groessten Teil keiner solchen entspricht, sondern nur Einbildungen und Fehldiagnosen, wodurch sehr oft voellig falsch Analysen und Atteste erstellt werden." "Quetzal: The use of these intelligence-quotient tests by practising terrestrial psychologists is known to me. Unfortunately must I designate these tests utterly defective and even likewise invalid, as also must be said of 'Psychology' as it is used by psychologists, which truthfully for the most part corresponds to no such thing, but rather merely presumptions and wrong diagnoses, through which very often false analyses and attestations are authored." (I didn't bother ironing out/Anglicising this translation, so it is kind of raw in some parts.) | ||
J_rod7 Member Post Number: 120 Registered: 10-2007 |
Greetings All, A MOST interesting article is to found at this website. This has profound implications relating to the effects of the Peace Meditations. As a VERY GOOD reason to get greater numbers of People to participate. www.projectcamelot.org/lugovenko.html This is an excerpt from the introduction: If, as mystical tradition tells us, the Earth is a living system, how might she be doing that most fundamental process of life known as breathing? Might evidence for the Earth's breathing not be witnessed as oscillations in the flow of subtle energies through and between the Earth and the Cosmos? This was the thinking of Russian astrophysicist Vladisvlav Lugoveko. And in the course of a lifetime of research, he has devised experiments that detect and measure just such an oscillation in this flow. Moreover, his experiments have been replicated. During the past decade, Lugovenko's experimental data has revealed not only that the Earth breathes - with striking similarities to the breathing patterns of human beings - but that her breathing is dynamically affected not only by events in the Cosmos but also by human thought. Saalome Gam Naan Ben Uurda, Gan Njjber Hesporoona.! Someone Shared Their LOVE Today. Was It YOU? J_rod7 | ||
Indi Member Post Number: 154 Registered: 06-2006 |
Hi Rod I am pretty sure Billy answered a question about the earth being alive, and the answer is 'no'. And I seem to remember him saying it doesn't have therefore a consciousness. The earth though is receiving Cosmic electromagnetic energy, or rather, all the objects that make up the earth are. If this is the case, then the oscillations that Lugoveko has measured must be something else other than 'breathing' -- although a better term may be respiration, if giving an analogy to movement in and out. My guess would be that it would be a sum of the vibrations of the parts -- as each object has a vibration. Interestingly, as we the humans evolve and become finer in energy, and our vibration becomes higher in frequency, so will the planet vibrations change along with us. This in some ways fits the New Age concept of ascension, which many naive persons think is going to happen to the lucky few and the planet at any moment  Re your article about angiogenesis, I came across that as well the same day you posted about it...... Am pleased to hear that you decided to to the Holosync program -- I don't think you will be disappointed -- then that is not maybe a correct thing to say, as each person's experience is unique. So, what i should say is I hope you have at least a good experience from using it as I have. Robjna | ||
Matthew_deagle Member Post Number: 87 Registered: 08-2007 |
Indi, The Earth doesn't have a human-like self-consciousness, but the Earth is a conscious and living system. Even rocks and other 'inanimate objects' have a sort of consciousness as components of the universe, but this is not equivalent to human self-consciousness. Humans=Menschen=(all forms of life containing evolving spirit-forms) are the only organisms in the universe which are capable of evolving a self-consciousness which then develops. According to the theories of Julian Jaynes, humans did not evolve self-consciousness and will until around 2000 BCE in most areas of the world. Some exceptions might be the Minoans and the ancestors of the ancient Chinese, for example. The Earth is, in fact, 'alive', but not in the sense of a biological organism. It is alive in the sense that it has a homeostatic equillibrium, responds to influences/stimuli, etc., although it does not contain DNA, nor does it evolve or produce offspring in the biological sense (it evolves in the sense of change and adaptation over its lifespan, however). The Gaia hypothesis is really just a model for the Earth as an organic system, and not a 'belief' about the Earth being 'alive' in the biological sense. When people speak, generally, of the Earth being 'alive' or of bodies 'being' machines, etc., these are really just metaphors, like the rest of human knowledge, and any discussion over what 'is' or 'isn't' is rather confused in this context; yet, a large number of scientists today do 'debate' answerless questions like these. It's like debating a tautological, subjective statement like "the sun looks like an orange to me right now". We must think metaphorically in a conscious way in order to really grasp the spirit-teachings in their multifaceted symbolism, metaphors, and language, because this language is logicallys structured in such a way as to reflect the abstract epiphenomenon of the consistency of 'objective' reality we call 'truth', and naturally metaphors cannot be said, in themselves, to constitute 'truth'. e.g. if Billy says that the universe really "is" a system of twin spirals, just as ancient Daoists said, and says that "it is no metaphor", he means that something syntactically analogous to a twin-spiral system actually constitutes the basic structure of Creation, and not that Creation literally 'is' a twin spiral configuration as we picture it in our minds, or even as we picture it in mathematical models, using symbols, metaphorical structural relationships, etc. Rather than a metaphor in the 'purely' semantic sense, such as "the sun looks like an orange", it is a syntactically valid analogy in the sense of "the sun appears round" which means "the sun has a structure such that its mapping on my retina transformed in my brain appears analogous to all other circular objects". The confusion about the metaphorical, transformative, abstract-connecting and syntactically-relating nature of human consciousness does seem to cause a lot of confusion in the dualistically-based Western cultures these days. Western persons must free themselves of simple, one-model, black/white, this/that, etc., views of reality and become conscious of their thought-processes in order to actually adapt to the Age of Aquarius/Wassermanzeit. Billy sometimes 'dumbs down'/'stark vereinfacht' his language when answering questions, etc., although he doesn't tend to do this in his writings. He's afraid that he'll confuse or mislead someone, it seems, although it does seem that his having not mastered the English language results in this quite often, anyway. This topic does relate to translations, although it is much broader than that. Salome, - Matthew | ||
Peter_brodowski Member Post Number: 391 Registered: 01-2004 |
hey there matthew "Humans=Menschen=(all forms of life containing evolving spirit-forms) are the only organisms in the universe which are capable of evolving a self-consciousness which then develops." from where did you get this information? | ||
Indi Member Post Number: 155 Registered: 06-2006 |
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J_rod7 Member Post Number: 121 Registered: 10-2007 |
Hello Peter and Matthew. Salome Warmest Greetings to All, In Peace Peter, you have asked, in respect to Matthew: >> "Humans=Menschen=(all forms of life containing evolving spirit-forms) are the only organisms in the universe which are capable of evolving a self-consciousness which then develops." >> from where did you get this information?" << Matthew, of course, may speak for himself on this. However, I have information which will give you some direction. I have the original books: "Message From The Pleiades, The Contact Notes of Eduard Billy Meier", volumes- I & II, privately published (1979), Limited First Edition(s). I don't know of this (these books) has (have) ever been re-published, but there is (are) DVD's available with this same title from TheyFly.com. In conversation between Billy and Semjase, during their 23rd Contact meeting June 1975, is the following: *-> Billy- "Still another question, Semjase. How great by number is your mankind?" <= *=> Semjase- 104-106/ "I can only answer you this question when I explain that we are connected to an alliance (of planets) which extends itself far into the Cosmos. To this alliance belong different solar systems, and the total amount of inhabitants of the human kind of life amounts to close to 127 billion. There are still innumerable other intelligent forms of life of non-human character and standard, besides forms of human (and other) beings who are unknown to us or with whom we simply are in no communication." <- ** It becomes obvious to me that this universe is FULL of intelligent life, both in human AND non-human form. You may not be able to recognize another INTELLIGENT Non-Human, should you meet one. You may not always recognize a true human from other stars, when you have the privilege to meet them either, as they might not be as you expect them to appear. Yet, have no fear, they are not here to eat you. Salome Someone Shared Their LOVE Today. Was It YOU? J_rod7 | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 1053 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi Indi and All.... Indi: you said Billy gave an answer which was 'no', and which I have not come across, ever since I have been a forum member, here. I would agree with some others here, with not having a - self consciousness -, in the format of that of a human being, though. But naturally, has her OWN Consciousness definition; but...more in relation to (The) Creation, itself. We must keep in mind: that when we die our own Consciousness will Dissolve and Fuse within the Consciousness Layer/Dimension which Surrounds/Occupies Mother Earth (just as our Spirit, to It's destinies). And with the Knowledge, that Earth plant life are also in possession of a Spirit-like (Force); thus, may need....a Conscisousness-like mechanism, to further let Mother Earth function properly (etc...). Thus, when the above mentioned occurs: there must indeed, be some sort of Consciousness-like mechanism present within/around Mother Earth. Because our Consciousness' are destined, to Fuse into this phenomenon: becoming ONE in Oneness, again. Till further utilization.[i.e. new reincarnations] Edward. | ||
Thomas Member Post Number: 458 Registered: 03-2004 |
Edward, in one of the bulletins or maybe it was a wissenwerte issue, BEAM said directly that EVERYTHING is a lifeform, including what we normally call inert matter and this goes down to even below the level of individual atoms, so in one sense you are correct because he also said that all lifeforms have their own type of consciousness. Humans have a conscious consciousness, animals have an instinct consciousness, and so on. So the Earth does have a sort of consciousness but it is in no way conscious as in a conscious consciousness. The layer you spoke of is not a result of the Earth itself but is a result of there being human life etc on Earth. Your reasoning is incomplete and incorrect in this sense. This is just according to my understanding of what BEAM has written and is subject to ME having misunderstood as well. | ||
Trevor Member Post Number: 31 Registered: 05-2007 |
Is everything in the universe a lifeform because everything derived from stardust which itself was created by Creation/Consciousness? | ||
Peter_brodowski Member Post Number: 393 Registered: 01-2004 |
hello j-rod, thanks i read about how there are many types of lifeforms in the universe etc. it would be interesting to know how some of these different species start out. | ||
Scott Moderator Post Number: 1416 Registered: 12-1999 |
After reading numerous posts in this section, and then going back to the original posts when this section was created, I don't see anything close to the discussion of human relationships. Please lets get back to the topic. | ||
Thomas Member Post Number: 459 Registered: 03-2004 |
No Trevor, everything is a lifeform because everything is alive and has a consciousness in some form though it isn't necessarily the definition of alive that people are used to. | ||
Matthew_deagle Member Post Number: 90 Registered: 08-2007 |
Thomas (a response to your post in the Numbers and Symbols Section), It should be clarified, also that there are 2 different forms of what persons on this planet regularly refer to as 'emotions': namely, in German, "Emotionen" and "Gefuehle". "Gefuehle" are what persons normally call 'feelings' or 'emotions', 'sentiments', 'understanding' (in an emotional sense), 'impressions', etc., in English. "Emotionen", however, are sudden losses of control due to thoughts which have been meditated upon consciously or unconsciously, which can be highly destructive and utterly uncontrollable. "Gefuehle" are modified constantly by a person's thoughts (of all kinds, which includes all forms of patterns and information acting within/located within the human consciousness), form holistic perceptions based upon these, are also related to the nervous system's evolved self-preservations mechanisms, and can be considered part of the sense of consciousness. "Emotionen" are simply the result of thoughts which are concentrated upon, such as, quite often, illogical or false thoughts related to jealousy, revenge, etc. "Emotionen" also account for all manner of belief-related automatic reactions to information of specific types without reasoning, etc. The fundamental difference is that one can control one's feelings/sentiments/Gefuehle through thoughts (as discussed earlier with regard to talk therapy, etc.), while "Emotionen", which might be called "movements of the consciousness" or "outbursts", etc., cannot be controlled once they break loose. They can only be controlled through meditative elimination of false thoughts. Salome, - Matthew | ||
Thomas Member Post Number: 469 Registered: 03-2004 |
Hi Matthew, I am aware of the difference in the German words and I am familiar with the use of these German words in the spirit teachings as I have studied them so far from BEAM's various works. However I will reiterate that EVERY SINGLE ASPECT of EACH AND EVERY EXPERIENCE of a human being is recorded in the storage banks, including feelings, emotions, thoughts, movements, actions, etc etc etc. This is mentioned in no uncertain terms by Mr Meier in multiple places in the spirit lessons and his books, some of which I have read myself. Thanks for the response though :-) | ||
Phi_spiral Member Post Number: 283 Registered: 03-2007 |
Bianca: "When you say '...a temporary Illusion that serves a purpose' do you mean to say that even though we live in this material environment as incarnated spirits we can sense and feel that there is more to this life than meets the eye...? and we have to learn the knowledge to see the wisdom of it all?" Yes, there is that. But mainly, I meant that the illusion of separateness seems to be a necessary component in the fabrication of learning scenarios within the physical realm. This is facilitated by our physical senses which develop first, telling us that we are physically separate, before our higher sensing develops and tells us that we are spiritually connected. This is reinforced in our language, where partitions are created: "I and YOU" or "I and IT". I can not exist without a YOU and vice-versa. Egos appear by setting themselves apart from other egos. Persons appear by entering into relation to other persons. A unity becomes a multiplicity. And the observer and the observed can co-exist. Without the "I and YOU" form, we could not have the dynamics of interpersonal relationships or the development of different points of view. Semjase: "As with us and others elsewhere, all life forms are different in their evolution, just as two ‘like’ poles will never be found together. This would signify a degeneration and termination of evolution. Therefore, two opposing poles must always meet for an evolution to take place. Both of these opposite ‘poles’ will inevitably grate against one another and different opinions will clash. So, for the purpose of evolution, differences in opinion must arise. This is an irrevocable law of evolution which we and all other life forms of the universe must align with." The duality of the I-YOU form as opposed to WE, allows for: encounter, meeting, dialogue, exchange and the polarity of male & female relationships. Regards Bob |
