| Author |
Message |
   
Matt
Member
Post Number: 121
Registered: 04-2006
| | Posted on Sunday, February 07, 2010 - 05:39 pm: | 
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Dyson's not perfect. I forgive him for that mistake. I'd rather not see a flame up (or rub in) over it either but I also appreciate Gaia pointing it out to us too. Peace all. |
Markcampbell
Member
Post Number: 368
Registered: 10-2008
| | Posted on Sunday, February 07, 2010 - 07:54 pm: |
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'Love is a temporary madness' by St. Augustine is one of my favorite verses , quite true , as well as a tonic for many of life's troubles .
mark |
Bennyray37
Member
Post Number: 5
Registered: 01-2010
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 10, 2010 - 02:52 pm: |
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Greetings, everyone.
Recently, I came across a section in the 233rd Contact where Meier appears to use a rather harsh word. I don’t think that this word has a direct English counterpart, but I tried my best to come up with something that seems to be very close. The word that I came up with is rather harsh, and I don’t want to put a harsher word into Meier’s mouth than what actually came out of it. For this reason, I was hoping that others might look at this word and its context and let me know if they would have a better way of translating it. Below is my translation of the respective section in the Contact Report, followed by the section in German.
Regards.
_________________________________________________
Billy:
You probably mean the designation of “dog-cunt?”
Ptaah:
68. Yes, that’s the word.
Billy:
Well, the value of this word is actually grounded in a vile devaluation of the character of the person who is given this designation. By this, it is meant, if I may put it gently, that the character of a person who is designated as a “dog-cunt” is mean, despicable, worthless, without any decency, cowardly, dirty, morally reprehensible, intolerably bad, and extremely pathetic. The word itself is a composition of “dog” and “cunt,” which refers in a derogatory manner to the sex organ of a bitch, which is then used in the aforementioned manner as a swear word for a lousy, sleazy character.
_________________________________________________
Billy:
Du meinst wohl die Bezeichnung “Hundsfott”?
Ptaah:
68. Das ist das Wort, ja.
Billy:
Nun ja, der Wert dieses Wortes fundiert eigentlich in einer üblen Abwertung des Charakters jenes Menschen, der mit dieser Bezeichnung bedacht wird. Gemeint ist damit nämlich, wenn ich das in gelinder Form ausdrücken darf, dass der Charakter eines Menschen, der als “Hundsfott” bezeichnet wird, gemein, niederträchtig, nichtswürdig und ohne jeglichen Anstand ist, feige, schmutzig und moralisch verabscheuungswürdig, unerträglich schlecht und äusserst erbärmlich. Das Wort selbst ist eine Zusammensetzung von Hund und Fotte, das sich in abwertender Weise auf das Geschlechtsteil der Hündin bezieht, was dann in genannter Weise als Kraftwort abgewandelt für einen miesen, schmierigen Charakter Benützung findet.
--
Benjamin Stevens |
Sanjin
Member
Post Number: 113
Registered: 06-2009
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 10, 2010 - 03:23 pm: |
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Imperfection is what makes us all perfectly human. That's why it is important to forgive mistakes.
36.The human is another person, when, surrounded by the rays of the heavenly creational sunrise, the pure delight of awakening nature streams through him.
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Bronzedesk
Member
Post Number: 66
Registered: 01-2009
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 10, 2010 - 07:22 pm: |
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“The question why there is imperfection in existence is the same as why there is evil... But this is the real question we ought to ask: Is this imperfection the final truth, and is thinking as a human species ... absolute and ultimate?”
First you forget names, then you forget faces. Next you forget to pull your zipper up and finally, you forget to pull it down. George Burns
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Indi
Member
Post Number: 393
Registered: 06-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 10, 2010 - 08:09 pm: |
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:-) Benjamin
for 'Hundsfott' I think 'mongrel' or 'cur' would do the job.
In vulgar terms, it means --> f* scum, or a pile of sh*
Robyn |
Bennyray37
Member
Post Number: 6
Registered: 01-2010
| | Posted on Thursday, February 11, 2010 - 06:42 am: |
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Hey Robyn,
Well, here’s my dilemma. Originally, I was going to use the word that is found in online German to English dictionaries, which is simply “scoundrel.” But then, when Meier explains the meaning of the word and how it is created, neither “scoundrel” nor “mongrel” nor “cur” would make any sense. He says that the word is comprised of two words, “dog” and the German word “Fotte,” which none of the above English words have in themselves. He then says that “Fotte” is a derogatory term for the sex organ of a female dog. Now, I am aware of derogatory English terms for the female sex organ, but not of any that are specifically used for female dogs. The word I chose is certainly a derogatory term for the female sex organ and one that, in English, does stand alone as a derogatory term that is applied to people of bad character. It's just that this is also one of the harshest English words that can be used, and I’m not sure if the German word “Fotte” is as harsh as my word of choice.
Thus, if Meier didn’t go through the explanation, I’d probably just leave it at “scoundrel,” “mongrel,” “cur,” or the like. But because of his explanation, I’m not sure if I should attempt to translate the word into English with best choices (and what those “best” choices would be) or if I should just leave the word untranslated and, perhaps, include a Translator’s Note about it.
Regards.
--
Benjamin Stevens |
Gaiaguysnet
Member
Post Number: 932
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, February 11, 2010 - 06:56 am: |
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Dear Benjamin, (et al)
(I often think of the hew and cry which would ineluctably ensue, were Billy to attempt to be an anonymous contributor to this forum. I think he'd very quickly be shown the door for his (misconceived) very unwise, tactless and unloving behaviour.)
I can't quite remember how Vivienne and I ever dealt with THAT one publicly - or if we ever even got so far as to publicly translate that word, but we certainly have discussed the problem, and continue to share a laugh about it from time to time. We might have copped out and written something demure and G-rated like "scoundrel" in the places prior to this contact, to which Ptaah now refers. Euphemisms would have been possible there, but this one specifically discusses language and word-meaning, so it's got to be "dog-c--t" here, I'm afraid. Or, better, "dog's c--t".
So you have got the literal translation relatively perfect, in my long-considered opinion.
Unless you wanted to be even more literal, at which time, it would be "bitch's c--t", but of course, of canines, only bitches, not curs, have vaginas, so dog's c--t would be best, to avoid the tautology. And it's more mellifluous - closer to the source in tone and intent - the intent being to impugn the masculinity of the recipient of the curse as well.
So, with great friendliness, I don't agree with Robjna's more figurative suggestions, (but they're pretty good euphemistic hyponyms, which simply don't apply in this setting) which go wide of the mark here because both terms convey strong connotations foreign to the intent of Billy's specific term. "Cur", because it carries an unjustified masculine and aggressive connotation, and "mongrel" because it introduces an element which has too strong a subjective and cultural component. Certainly in the W.A.S.P. Australian culture where Robyn and I live, it's great, and maybe Ptaah's call for "English English", with all it's racist and elitist background, demands "filthy mongrel". But I still don't like it, because, I think a more advanced consciousness would understand - at a deep intuitive level - that mongrelisation equates to hybrid vigour, so it imbues the recipient of the insult with too much in the way of positive traits. That is - unless the translator goes into that narrow British world-view. Vivienne and I try to avoid the more cultural aspects of "English English", and stick to the grammar and spelling, since I'm hypothesising that Ptaah and the other Plejaren would rather not have Billy's work perturbed in that direction any more than the language forces it to anyway. I know that's a very long-winded dissertation for "dog's c--t", but that's what a thorough translation demands. Any less is unworthy of Billy's work, which demands to be taken as seriously as possible, and translated as accurately as possible.
Robyn and us (Vivienne and I) have taken diametrically opposite approaches to the issue of learning German and translations, and - in private correspondence - she (Robyn) and I have had long discussions about our different views.
Maybe Robyn (instead of me) would explain, for us here, her method, which is more like yours, Benjamin, (because I want to be fair and do it justice).
And in the moderator capacity: I'm not sure what Sanjin's and Bronzedesk's above contributions have to do with the theme of the thread, nor am I sure that I understand them. I take it that Sanjin is diffidently admitting his mistakes and asking forgiveness. Presumably Bronzedesk is being somehow supportive of this?
(quote) The question why there is imperfection in existence is the same as why there is evil... But this is the real question we ought to ask: Is this imperfection the final truth, and is thinking as a human species ... absolute and ultimate? (unquote) Who is being quoted here? What does this mean? The first conjecture is simply wrong (according to the teachings) and I don't understand the question.
About two weeks ago, somehow Sanjin obtained my private email address (he did not tell me how he got it when I asked him) and he had a number of mis-guided and erroneous things to say about how various German words had putatively been wrongly translated by Vivienne and me - among other things. I did not want to spend more time on it. But his resurfacing here now prompts me to paste in this very brief excerpt from him, dated February 3rd, "Mariann has kindly advised me to stay away from the Forum, and I will follow her wise advice. Meanwhile, if you think that it is necessary, do forward this to the other people on the list." I didn't previously think it was necessary, and hoped it wouldn't be.
I agree with Mariann wholeheartedly, but I don't think that Sanjin has done anything that requires "forgiveness" if that's what he wants, in the sense of "waiving negative feeling or a desire for punishment", because the only negative feelings I have are connected with his woeful ignorance of German - and the teachings, as they relate to making mistakes, which are nothing to "forgive".
But don't keep making them.
Learn from them.
First learn, then teach. Not the other way around.
So I personally implore him to stay away, as he promised he would. Mariann and I have corresponded at some length and depth about this problem. We have better things to do with our precious time.
As an exercise, search the TJ for the keywords, "forgive", "forgiveness", etc.
Salome,
Dyson
P.S. Benjamin, "satellite" is fine for "Trabant", IMO. How are you going, OK?
P.P.S. Vivienne's official FIGU translation of Mariann's introduction to Billy's new book, (God-delusion and God-delusion Insanity), the draft of which we sent off some time ago, has finally had Billy's eyes on it and has had some of the terms nailed down enough for it to surface shortly. |
Gaiaguysnet
Member
Post Number: 933
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, February 11, 2010 - 07:00 am: |
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Note: When I posted my above contribution, Benjamin's had not yet appeared. DD |
Ramirez
Member
Post Number: 382
Registered: 06-2008
| | Posted on Thursday, February 11, 2010 - 07:35 am: |
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Hi Benjamin,
Dog vagina would probably suffice to get the meaning across.
I doubt the average reader of contact reports is actively hunting for salacious sensationalism or absolute perfection regarding translations so there seems no point in providing ammunition for controversy seekers.
For sure in contact report 233 they are getting quite "hot under the collar" during the conversation. 
Cheers.
|
Smukhuti
Member
Post Number: 200
Registered: 06-2009
| | Posted on Thursday, February 11, 2010 - 07:46 am: |
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If Meir has used a harsh word, diluting would be like work done by gospel writers who based their work on TJ and made a superman out of Jmmanuel. Exaggerating it would also be wrong.
Keeping the German word with a translator note is what I would have done unless someone comes up with an "exact" meaning.
Salome.
Suv
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Phi_spiral
Member
Post Number: 494
Registered: 03-2007
| | Posted on Thursday, February 11, 2010 - 11:55 am: |
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Hi Benjamin
There is already an official English translation of Contact 233 from FIGU and it appears in their pamphlet, “Those Who Lie About Contacts, Cheats and Deceivers…” available at the FIGU Shop online, so you might use the precedence already established by FIGU. Here is how they handled the same passage:
Billy: You probably mean the word "Hundsfott"?
Ptaah: Yes, that's the word.
Billy: Well, the significance of this word is based on a severe contempt for the person's character bestowed with that term. The meaning, if I may express it in a modified form, is that the individual's character called a "Hundsfott" is mean, vile, infamous and without any decency, cowardly, rotten and morally detestable, unbearable bad and extremely contemptible. The word itself is a combination of "Hund" (dog) and "Fotte," which refers in a derogatory way to the genitals of a female dog, and is used as a swearword for a nasty and filthy character in the manner mentioned.
Regards
Bob |
Phi_spiral
Member
Post Number: 495
Registered: 03-2007
| | Posted on Thursday, February 11, 2010 - 01:21 pm: |
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Hi Benjamin
I sent this in earlier, but it did not get posted for some reason. There is already an official FIGU English translation of Contact 233 and it appears in their pamphlet, “Those Who Lie About Contacts, Cheats and Deceivers…” available at the FIGU Shop online, so you might use the precedence already established by FIGU. Here is how they handled the same passage:
Billy: You probably mean the word "Hundsfott"?
Ptaah: Yes, that's the word.
Billy: Well, the significance of this word is based on a severe contempt for the person's character bestowed with that term. The meaning, if I may express it in a modified form, is that the individual's character called a "Hundsfott" is mean, vile, infamous and without any decency, cowardly, rotten and morally detestable, unbearable bad and extremely contemptible. The word itself is a combination of "Hund" (dog) and "Fotte," which refers in a derogatory way to the genitals of a female dog, and is used as a swearword for a nasty and filthy character in the manner mentioned.
Regards
Bob |
Gaiaguysnet
Member
Post Number: 938
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, February 11, 2010 - 01:31 pm: |
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Dear all,
I wanted to broach a very serious topic regarding the vile falsified teaching which has been so successfully spread in this forum for the last few years. I post this here becasue it stems from inadequate understandings of German and English language words and the ideas to which they point.
When I returned to the forum I stated that I wasn't going to play the cop and chase people around. So I've waited patiently for something to be said about "humility" from someone - anyone - here who had the slightest understanding of the basis upon which the teachings of the truth rests.
I expect to be away for a while, since it looks like Volume Ten has arrived (I'll be back with highlights), so would someone (who is in a position to do so) please make the effort to deal, one more time, with the "humility" problem in my absence?
Thanks.
Cheers!
Dyson
P.S. Ramirez, Suv's right. Language is language. In it's purest essence, it's just a mouth-sound, but, very ugly to see, maybe Benjamin (and editors) can do what I do? ("x..x") ? Let's try to keep the forum's G rating (which has suffered lately). |
Bronzedesk
Member
Post Number: 67
Registered: 01-2009
| | Posted on Thursday, February 11, 2010 - 05:00 pm: |
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When I was very young I was chided and put down for not knowing the difference between a male or or a female dog!
Well now that I am older, I have come to realize that you should have your cat or dog Spade or Neutered in order to keep the pet population down. Now I find my self somewhat an activist for Billy's fervor for the abstract in order to just prove a point!
My words were not stated as a quote but my own, as in a general axiom of neutrality through words poorly chosen!
I meant no harm, I am new here and my voice and position as of yet are still not well placed or established!
So sometimes, I fear placing things wrongly in an area or areas where they should not be, so please absolve me of the blunder of this poorly placed riddle that I have so slovenly given you!
However, may I add although not so much on a TJ Translation issue but on my own point of view over to the whole thing of misunderstanding in the below added quote:
"Johnson's [<---could be me!!] aesthetic judgments [<---or, any for that matter!] are almost invariably subtle, or solid, or bold; they have always some good quality to recommend them except one: they are never right."(<--Ta Dah!!! that's me in a nutshell!)
-Strachey, (Giles) Lytton
On Samuel Johnson. Books and Characters,'Lives of the Poets'.
Please forgive me for not being a little bit more Pacific rather than Atlantic!
To you all... In the most Gentlest of Words - Thanks to you my friends, I am and always will be behind and for you all. You are my beacons of hope and truth... choose wisely and with truth loved ones, because we must always live and breath with peace and discernment faith and love !!! ~~ A Fallen one.
First you forget names, then you forget faces. Next you forget to pull your zipper up and finally, you forget to pull it down. George Burns
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Indi
Member
Post Number: 394
Registered: 06-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, February 11, 2010 - 06:29 pm: |
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Re Benjamin's translation of 'Hundsfott':
on reflexion of my previous comment about it, which did not really adequately answer the query, to which I am sorry, (and shows the need for less haste and more contemplation of what is in fact being asked) I will say that:
when translating the word in the sentence Du meinst wohl die Bezeichnung “Hundsfott”? it would be incorrect to translate it as 'Dogs-c' as that is the break down of the word to its source, and not the meaning of the word.
It might be better as others have suggested to keep it as "Hundsfott" in this instance, as in the next sentence the source and meaning of its use is clearly described.
Re the use of the 'c' word in the next sentence, I suppose it could always be exchanged for 'twat' instead, which to my senses has less impact to it although meaning the same thing.
Dyson
re my translating and learning German approach -- I have mentioned it before on the forum I am sure -- but yes, it is more like Benjamin's in the sense that I use various programs to help me choose what I consider the best of the choices for the meaning to be conveyed. I rely more on a transliteral approach first though, to get the 'nuts and bolts' of the actual words presented, before looking at the more interpretive offerings of the translation programs. However, I have also read most of Billy's books and have studied the Geisteslehre for over 3 years now, and so hope that when translating I am guided more in the direction that is intended.
My translating skills are changing as time passes, and my understandings change in the same way as I too am changing and evolving, and it all melds to form the final result. I rely on logic and common sense based on my knowledgebase. That is all anyone can do.
I have not had time for nearly 9 months now to devote to translation for others, as the process is very different timewise for my own personal reading than that necessary for public reading. My translations must be ok, as Figu has accepted and authorised my work as a translator, even though I am not fluent in the German language. I can read German quite well, but have no need to speak it at this point in time but could if the need was there and I had the time.
Dyson, you and I have different views on translating issues in some areas, and that will not likely change, however, I am sure we can all comfortably work alongside eachother with our respective offerings, as there is a worth in all the offerings. I have noticed that even when reading an official translation many people interpret differently, and this can lead to disagreements that can get quite out of hand --
Even simple statements made by people on this forum, who come from so many different language backgrounds get confused with what someone means.
An example of a recent confusion generated by the use of 'the same' with regard to spirit/spiritform was mainly due to lack of qualification when people speak and those that think more literally get caught up in the words. These kinds of problems are always going to exist, with people having their own unique level of understanding. People on English forums not having the complication of translation issues, still argue over meanings. It will always be that way. I remember having quite a heated discussion in my youth, with someone who insisted that a colour was green when to me it was blue. That is what we are up against in our native language, so, it just intensifies when we are translating because words are not just words, they paint pictures, and our interpretation often involves our senses and our experiences in life as well. It is a very complex situation.
Re my moderator capacity -- I have not yet begun my duties in that regard, and do not have access to the system. It will happen shortly though, and I will then have to put on my moderator cap!
Robyn |
Eric
Member
Post Number: 6
Registered: 06-2009
| | Posted on Thursday, February 11, 2010 - 09:13 pm: |
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Hi Benjamin, Dyson, Robyn
That part of Contact 233 has been already translated in the booklet "Those who lie about contacts, cheats, deceivers, .... and questions about Mohammed". (p. 28) Have a look! I just wonder who did the translation then. Was it the woman who got a cerebral attack (Heidi) by any chance? Does someone know? ....
Does someone know what happened to her also?
(Good to see some of you back on the forum, i am tempted to more active too. )
Salome
Eric Drouin |
Bennyray37
Member
Post Number: 7
Registered: 01-2010
| | Posted on Friday, February 12, 2010 - 08:36 am: |
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Thanks, everyone, for the contributions toward the word “Hundsfott.” I think that I’m going to have to agree with Dyson on this one and leave the word as I presently have it. I also agree with the sense of Smukhuti’s comment, in that if I were to use a less precise word, especially one that didn’t come across as harshly as the word that actually came out of Meier’s mouth, then it would basically be “censoring” Meier, and I don’t have any intention to censor any parts of the Contact Reports at all. If any English words that I have chosen so far aren’t as harsh as the German words that Meier and the Plejarens have actually used, it’s only because the tools I’ve been using gave me “less harsh” words without me knowing it. In fact, if Meier didn’t explain the word as he did, I would have simply thought that it meant “scoundrel,” since the online dictionaries don’t go into such depth with the meaning of the word. I think all would agree that “scoundrel” and “dog-c**t” are on very different levels of harshness. If Meier desires to use such harsh language, I feel it necessary to convey it just as harshly in English.
Hi Phi_spiral and Eric. I actually have that pamphlet and didn’t even think to check it before making my own translation. If I had known that the passage had already been officially translated by FIGU, I probably would have just quoted their exact translation without putting any more time into it. After observing how FIGU handled the passage, I would have to say that their method does seem to approach it in a “nice” manner that obscures the harshness of Meier’s original term. I guess it is okay that they choose to do that, but that seems a lot like censorship to me. Thus, I’m glad that in this particular case, I didn’t know that the section was already officially translated and got to find this all out. Of course, this occasion will also remind me to check more of my materials that I own before starting a translation, so that I don’t waste time translating what has already been translated. I guess this will just be another time where people will be able to compare my translation with an authorized translation to see how mine measures up.
Regards.
--
Benjamin Stevens |
Baselineplayer
Member
Post Number: 56
Registered: 09-2007
| | Posted on Friday, February 12, 2010 - 11:57 am: |
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Dear all,
It is very interesting how to interpret a very strong and derogatory expression from German to English.
I can in an easier way translate this into Swedish which is more similar to German:
Hundsfott = Hundfitta, which is a very strong wording of choice. From the Swedish angle, I could call Hundsfotte to another English word: Hounds C--t. Hound is also an English word used for dog, which is more "Germanic".
In Swedish we usually only use the word f---a alone when it is used in a very derogative way. This harsh word is used for female sex organ in general, in a very strong and harsh way. This word is used commonly among soldiers, sailors in a more amused way, but it is considered as very rude and negative otherwise.
Ok, I do obviously need to wash my mouth after this message about nasty expressions.
Med Bästa Hälsningar / Mit Besten Grüssen / With Best Regards
/Baselineplayer
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Jonzie
Member
Post Number: 45
Registered: 04-2009
| | Posted on Friday, February 12, 2010 - 12:17 pm: |
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Excuse me, you are making this too hard by trying to literally translate the word. Billy is trying to explain that
'Hundsfott' is used in the same manner as America uses the word 'Bitch'.
"The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement. But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth."
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Gaiaguysnet
Member
Post Number: 940
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Friday, February 12, 2010 - 04:56 pm: |
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The (official) translation of Mariann's
Introduction to the new book by BEAM,
God-delusion and God-delusion Insanity
has just been sent off to James and Michael.
Cheers!
Dyson |
Lonnie
Member
Post Number: 299
Registered: 12-1999
| | Posted on Friday, February 12, 2010 - 11:20 pm: |
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Hello everyone,
I agree with Robyn:
"It might be better as others have suggested to keep it as "Hundsfott" in this instance, as in the next sentence the source and meaning of its use is clearly described."
This word, in my opinion, should not be translated into Forbidden Underground Carnal Knowledge type of language. The important thing is the MEANING of the term. We all know what this word refers to. Using such language seems to be going too far and taking away from our purpose.
In my opinion it is not appropriate to use expressions that corresponds to that which is fowl and derogatory when imparting knowledge of the teaching of the spirit and the teaching of a life of virtue. As long as you have the meaning or comprehension you are getting the effect of the code of the mission.
Lonnie O'day Morton
FIGU Passive Member
Hollywood, FL USA
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Gaiaguysnet
Member
Post Number: 941
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, February 13, 2010 - 04:15 pm: |
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Humility (Latin from humis[dirt]) is what's WRONG with this sorry planet, and is at the core of the false religious bulls--t from the Bafath.
Dear all, (I'll get back about Hundesfotte later.)
I'm all but finished with vol. 10, and it's got some bombshells in it, which I'd like to be sharing with you now, but for the "HUMILITY" problem remaining outstanding.
I've got to admit that I'm shocked, but a search of the archives for "humble" shows 60 hits, MOST of which portray it in a favourable light, so non-German-readers and/or newbies can be excused, to some extent. I forget how little is in English. Some of the unwitting perpetrators of this false teaching are, official FIGU (bad) translations, Michael Horn, Jim Deardorff (with some qualifications) Hector (which really puzzles me, given what Billy told him personally) Robyn (also with some qualifications) Benjamin (who demonstrates the translation problem. I KNOW he's on Billy's side!) and then all the forum's usual suspects. This false teaching (that being humble is not BAD) seems to have re-entered while I was away, or I would have jumped on it earlier.
As is, I mentioned this topic only a week or so ago, but we've still got people (who I think should know better) getting it backwards.
http://forum.figu.org/us/messages/12/10787.html
In short: HUMILITY (submissiveness) is BAD
MODESTY (not big-noting yourself) is GOOD.
Here's what I put together, in the order in which it surfaced. Some of the German is missing.
Let's get it right, everybody. It's really important.
Peace in wisdom,
Dyson
-----------------------------------------------
Hector
Member
Post Number: 393
Registered: 04-2006
Posted on Sunday, August 03, 2008 - 06:02 am:
I asked Billy about the Ego some time ago and this was his response at that time:
Hi Billy,
I want to ask about the "Ego" or the "I".Almost everywhere and everybody (Buddhism, Hinduism, psychiaty, new age sectarians) seem to advocate for the suppression, dissolution of the ego, the I.At first this seems to be a good advice, but the more i think about it the more i consider this ego-suppression a stupid advice/teaching.
I think Ego-suppression/dissolution makes you unsuited to live(lebensunfähig), transforms yourself into a servile, servant, obedient individual, just what religions want.Not to be active, but passive.A certain amount of Ego,I would be necessary to lead a decent life in these stages of evolution.
Am i more or less right? What about ego-suppression and meditation, should a meditator try to block his individual identity-ego-i, while meditating?
Billy:
If a person is suppressing his/her ego, the person becomes humble („demütig“ in German) or submissive and, in doing so, is harming himself.
The ego/I is the Self of the human being, and it represents that what he is.
The human being needs his self and, therefore, shall not destroy or suppress his ego or „I“.
http://forum.figu.org/us/messages/863/9261.html
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted [by gaiaguysnet] on Saturday, March 17, 2007 - 05:21 pm:
Dear Randy,
Why do you, in one breath, say, "It was never intended by me to do ANYTHING than share THIS amazing, astounding, exciting and pertinent (FIGU) material...", and then go on to say,"... some sort of change has to be taken by me. This may be Creations' way of showing me to be more HUMBLE.. " ????????????????????????????????
See? You give ignorant people the idea that you are actually informed about the material and then display (to those who are) that the MOST BASIC aspects of the teachings you do not only get wrong, you get 100% backwards. Why o why o why?
Humility (Latin from humis[dirt]) is what's WRONG with this sorry planet, and is at the core of the false religious bulls--t from the Bafath, who you serve very well, whether you, or anybody else here, knows it or not.
Then you say it doesn’t matter if you are wrong (even when TEACHING wrong) and insinuate that I’m merely ego-motivated. Get real, man.
Share it once you’ve got it to share, and not before. OK? What do I have to do? PLEASE learn it first.
I fight hard for the truth, Randy. You serially rape it. Nothing at all personal, just the hard truth.
Dear Markc,
My personal views are – happily – almost entirely consonant with Billy’s teachings, and largely were long before I found them, but I certainly do make my views known here, particularly when I disagree with FIGU’s particular (openly expressed) views on things like crop circles, www.gaiaguys.net/meier.puzzlesolution.htm and the Protocols of Zion. www.gaiaguys.net/protocols.htm
I'm naturally happy to have any and all personal views expressed here, but NOT when they are wrongly represented as the true spiritual teachings! I will oppose that as strongly as I have to.
If anybody wants to read more about what I do, please come into the front page www.gaiaguys.net. And you’ll see that Billy Meier is only a small part of our work here. We’re no shrinking violets! But if ego was our motivation, or personalities, we would not be as effective as we are. Creation does not work that way, and why would we be prepared to endure the ceaseless calumny?
Cheers!
Dyson
http://forum.figu.org/us/messages/12/6769.html
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65. You have come to teach oneness and unity, however not humility, subservience and bondage or enslaved servitude and fanaticism, and, however, also not disunity and dualism or trinity, as it is with certain religions.
http://www.theyfly.com/news2005/november06/Nov2006/sfth_exp.htm
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746. Friedliche farbige Menschenrassen wurden seit Jahrhunderten, und werden noch zur Jetztzeit, durch die weissen Rassen missioniert und unter die Demutfuchtel ihrer christlichen Religion gebracht.
746. Peaceful, colored human races were for centuries, and still are in the current time, missionized to by the white races and brought under their Christian religion’s sword of humility.
http://www.theyfly.com/lost/Archives/meier.aa76,91.htm
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OM says that neither the JHWH nor the prophet exercise force or coercion, nor
do they teach that force and coercion (power and force) should be exercised.
Neither are they punishing, nor do they order punishment. But gods and idols
demand subordination and humility before them, and they create force and
coercion, and therefore exploitation and enslavement through angst and fear
which results in the subjugation and breaking of the will in the case of
independent and self-determining thoughts and behaviour.
http://www.theyfly.com/PDF/The%20Jschwjsch%20is%20Human.pdf
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THE PROBLEM. Beare (pp. 375-376) observed that children are not usually considered humble. Instead, we all know that they are free of pretense and full of curiosity. As expressed by James Van Praagh,
A child is one of life's greatest teachers. Children's points of view are honest and free. Their minds have not become imprisoned and conditioned by fears and insecurities that grip adults. A child understands simplicity and views life as a playful adventure. There is no judgment or motive behind the words of a child. They know who they are and what they want and will tell you so without your even asking.[1]
If some children seem humble in the presence of adults, it is only because they are shy, or have been disciplined to remain quiet then, or taught to be wary of strangers. But this represents inexperience or obedience, not humility.
SOLUTION. By not being subject to this problem, while at the same time being meaningful and inspiring, the TJ passage can be seen to have been the source of the Matthean verses. Jmmanuel's emphasis on seeking knowledge and wisdom as the purpose of life for all people was considered by the compiler of Matthew to be heretical or threatening to the clergy and/or church. This compiler had earlier in his gospel promoted humility as a Christian virtue, and in repeating the theme here, he evidently failed to realize that fallaciousness crept in during his editing.
http://www.tjresearch.info/mt18.htm
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(bad official FIGU translation?)
Appropriate, however, are humility and a style of disseminating the teachings which is not aimed at gathering followers and attracting the faithful, and someone who functions in a way where the people who are genuinely on a quest for the truth feel themselves addressed by that person.
http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/Interview_with_Billy_%281998%29
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57. For as long as anyone can remember God demanded of humans blood and lives, and he demanded obedient humility. 57. Seit eh und je forderte Gott des Menschen Blut und Leben, und er forderte untertänige Demut.
58. Creation however intends not humility, but humanity and human dignity, and it determines love and life. 58. Die Schöpfung aber bestimmt nicht Demut, sondern Menschlichkeit und Menschenwürde, und sie bestimmt Liebe und Leben.
http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/OM
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“The KNOWLEDGE that Creation calls for, from every human, is not built on a blind trust in a humiliating creed. It calls for seeking, researching and recognition, because it grows out of the cognition of Creation's laws for the adherence to all laws and directives, thereby, however, also for wisdom and correct management.” From the book Arahat Athersata
50. Wahrheit fügt das Wissen zusammen, baut auf und bildet als Essenz die Weisheit; Glaube aber zwingt zu unbeweisbaren Ansichten, zu sklavischer Demut und Ergebenheit, so er zerstörend und trennend sich auswirkt in allen Belangen des Lebens.
50. Truth joins knowledge together, and builds up and forms wisdom as its essence, but belief compels to views which cannot be proven, to slavish humility and resignation, so it works itself out destructively and divisively in all matters of life.– from the book Arahat Athersata
42. But with the human, an account is made of the diversity, and skillfulness and cleverness, with which the weaker are oppressed and exploited. 42. Beim Menschen aber wird der Unterschiedlichkeit Rechnung getragen und der Geschicklichkeit und Klugheit, mit denen die Schwächeren unterdrückt und ausgebeutet werden.
43. But the one oppressed by the stronger wraps himself in a cloak of humility, of slavishness and acquiescence, and thereby loses any initiative to rebel against the unfairness and the desire for dominion of the one who is stronger, while the stronger one establishes himself in his position of might even more. 43. Der dem Stärkeren Unterlegene aber hüllt sich ein in ein Kleid der Demut, des Hörigseins und der Ergebenheit und verliert dadurch jegliche Initiative, sich gegen Ungerechtigkeiten und die Herrschsucht des Stärkeren aufzulehnen, während sich der Stärkere noch mehr in seine Machtposition hineinlebt.
http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/Arahat_Athersata_Overpopulation
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(bad machine translation - should be "modesty")
70. Also, the most diverse painted works, so the paintings that are attributed to Rembrandt, do not truly trace back to him but, instead, to his wife, Saskia, who lived in deep humility in relation to her great skill and left all the fame to her husband. 70. Auch verschiedenste Malwerke, also Gemälde, die Rembrandt zugesprochen werden, führen wahrheitlich nicht auf ihn, sondem auf seine Gattin Saskia zurück, die in bezug auf ihre grosse Kunst in tiefer Bescheidenheit lebte und den ganzen Ruhm ihrem Gatten überliess.
http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/Contact_Report_212
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57. Seit eh und je forderte Gott des Menschen Blut und Leben, und er forderte untertänige Demut.
57. For as long as anyone can remember God demanded of humans blood and lives, and he demanded obedient humility.
58. Die Schöpfung aber bestimmt ni cht Demut, sondern Menschlichkeit und Menschenwürde, und sie bestimmt Liebe und Leben.
58. Creation however intends not humility, but humanity and human dignity, and it intends love and life.
http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/meier/gaiaguys/OM.52.1-63.htm
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65. Du bist gekommen, um die Einheit und Eintracht zu lehren, nicht jedoch Demut, Unterwürfigkeit und Knechtschaft oder Hörigkeit und Fanatismus, so aber auch nicht Zwiespältigkeit und Dualismus oder Trinität wie gewisse Religionen.
65. You have come to teach oneness and unity, however not humility, subservience and bondage or enslaved servitude and fanaticism, and, however, also not disunity and dualism or trinity, as it is with certain religions.
http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/meier/gaiaguys/meier.v1p11-20.htm
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118) Es wird sich ergeben, dass die Menschen tatenlos sein werden,
mit leerem Blick umhergehen und nicht wissen, wohin sie gehen sollen, denn wenn die Religionen und Sekten verschwinden, werden sie keine Kultstätten und keine Kultprediger sowie keine Sektenführer mehr haben, die sie in die Irre und Wirrnis führen können, weshalb sie erst ziellos sein werden oder wie ein keimender Same, der noch keine Wurzeln schlagen kann, folglich die Menschen hoffnungslos, entblösst, gedemütigt umherirren und überall sinnlos einen Halt suchen werden, den sie aber erst finden, wenn sie sich der schöpferischen Wahrheit und den schöpferischen Gesetzen und Geboten zuwenden; erst jedoch werden sie sich selbst hassen und bekämpfen und ihr Leben hassen, ehe sie den Weg zur Wahrheit finden.
118.) It will come to pass that the humans will become inactive, going around with an empty look and not knowing where they should go because when the religions and sects disappear they will have no more cult places and no more cult preachers and no more sect leaders who can lead them in madness and confusion, which is why they will initially be without a goal, or like a germinating seed that cannot yet strike roots, so, as a result, the human wanders around without hope, destitute, humbled, and senselessly seeking everywhere for a foothold, which they first, however, find when they utilize the creational truth and the creational laws and directives; but first, they will hate and fight themselves and hate their lives before they find the path to truth.
127) Und es kommt die Zeit im Dritten Jahrtausend, da grosse Teile der Kontinente verschwinden und die Menschen auf die Berge flüchten müssen, doch ihr Sinn an die Katastrophen wird nur von kurzer Dauer sein, denn sie werden alles schnell vergessen und darum bemüht sein, vieles wieder aufzubauen, denn bereits schaffen sie sich durch Kino und Fernsehen sowie später durch eine weltweite Vernetzung von Computern und Elektronik Trugbilder, durch die sie sich selbst täuschen und Dinge sehen, die nicht existieren und nur visuell für die Augen bestimmt sind, folglich ihr Sinn für die Realität schwindet und sie zwischen Wirklichkeit und Fiktion nicht mehr unterscheiden können, wodurch sie sich immer mehr im Labyrinth des Lebens verlieren, während jene, welche die Trugbilder kommerziell sowie religiös und sektiererisch erzeugen, leichtes Spiel mit den gläubigen Menschen haben, sie in allen möglichen Formen betrügen und zu demütigen Wesen wie unterwürfige Hunde machen.
127.) And in the Third Millennium the time comes when big parts of the continents disappear and the people will have to flee to the mountains, yet their sense of the catastrophes will only be of short duration, because they will forget everything again quickly and therefore make an effort to do much rebuilding, because they are already creating phantasmagoria, through movies and television, as well as later through a worldwide netting of computers and electronics, through which they deceive themselves and see things that do not exist, and are only visually determined for the eye, subsequently their sense for reality disappears and they can no longer distinguish between reality and fiction, whereby they lose themselves more and more in the labyrinth of life, while those who produce phantasms commercially as well as religious and sectarian phantasms, have an easy game with the people of faith, who they deceive in every possible manner and make them into humble beings, like cringing dogs.
http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/gaiaguys/MEIERPROPHECIES1958.htm
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505. Earth Humans, quite especially, are ruled by the erroneous and dangerous view that a good announcer of truth, a good preacher or a good teacher of the true teachings, etc., and also a good prophet, must be full of humble bearing, only speak pleasing and elegant, chosen and diplomatic words, and must always be friendly.
http://www.theyfly.com/news2005/sept05/sept05.htm
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Eine alte Voraussage spricht davon, dass die Frauen im dritten Jahrtausend das Ruder in die Hand nehmen und Frieden, Freiheit, Liebe und Harmonie schaffen werden, folglich die Männer gezwungen werden, ihre jahrtausendealte Gewaltherrschaft abzugeben. Wahrlich eine sehr erfreuliche Voraussage, die aber vorerst in den Anfängen auch ihre Nachteile bringt, denn erstlich gelangen viele Frauen an die Macht, die so selbstherrlich und dämlich sind wie jene "Herren", die in ihrer Macht baden, Kriege heranzüchten, das Volk terrorisieren und in diesem jene ihnen demütigen, unterwürfigen Idioten suchen, die ihnen hörig sind.
An ancient prediction speaks of women who, in the third millennium, will come into power and will create peace, freedom, love and harmony; subsequently men will be forced to relinquish their despotic rule they have kept for thousands of years. Truly a very pleasant prediction but it will bring disadvantages in the beginning because at first, women will come into powerful positions who are just as overbearing and idiotic as those "gentlemen" who bask in their power and create wars, terrorize the people and look for humble and submissive idiots who will be in bondage to them.
http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/FIGU_Bulletin_46
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Gegensätzlich steht dazu die Dankbarkeit der Gläubigen, und zwar für die Verschönung des Übels, das nicht auf sie eingebrochen ist, weil sie sich gemäss ihrem Glauben demütig im Gebet an ihren Gott und in Verehrung seiner göttlichen Gewalt hündisch erniedrigt haben.
Opposing this stands the gratitude of the believers, namely for the embellishment of the evil that hasn’t broken in on them because, in accordance with their faith, they have humbled themselves like dogs in prayer to their God and in worship of his divine power.
http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/Faith_%28Belief%29_and_God
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Wahrlich, es ist weder ein Gott noch eine Religion, die dir wahre Liebe, Frieden, Freiheit und Harmonie bringen kann, und zwar auch dann nicht, wenn du dich noch so hündisch demütig in inbrünstigen Gebeten flehend in den Staub wirfst.
Truly, it is neither a god nor a religion that can bring you true love, peace, freedom and harmony, and indeed also not even if you still throw yourself humbly in the dust supplicating in a dog-like manner in fervent praying.
http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/Human_being_of_the_Earth
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505. Ganz besonders beim Erdenmenschen herrscht die irrige und gefährliche Ansicht vor, dass ein guter Wahrheitskünder, ein guter Prediger oder ein guter Lehrer der Wahrheitslehre usw. und also auch ein guter Prophet voller demütiger Haltung sein müsse, nur liebe und feine, gewählte und diplomatische Worte sprechen und allzeit nur freundlich sein müsse.
505. With Earth humans, predominates quite especially, the erroneous and dangerous view that a good announcer of truth, a good preacher or a good teacher of the true teachings, and so forth, and therefore also a good prophet, must be full of humble bearing, only speak pleasing and elegant, chosen and diplomatic words, and must always only be friendly.
http://www.theyfly.com/gaia/meierv6p379.htm
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Cult-Religion: Worship of gods, people, objects, things, sanctuaries, etc in a humble and very often fearful and fanatical form in combination with rituals, adorations and sacrifices.
http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/meier/gaiaguys/glossary.htm
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The human beings on Earth would rather donate – because they are religious,
sectarian, ideological, or philosophical believers – a lot of money to religions, ideologies and philosophies
as well as for wars etc., because they believe to be able to buy their salvation or security. They hope to enter
heaven in this way and be allowed to humble and worship in the heavenly dust at the feet of their imaginary
god; or they hope to be protected from terrorist attacks in their country etc., when supporting wars from
which they also hope to benefit when putting their money into them.
Lieber spenden die Menschen der
Erde – weil sie religiöse, sektiererische, ideologische oder philosophische Gläubige sind – sehr viel Geld für
die Religionen, Ideologien und Philosophien sowie für Kriege usw., weil sie glauben, damit ihr Seelenheil
oder ihre Sicherheit erkaufen zu können. Sie hoffen so, in den Himmel zu kommen und demütig und anbetend
vor den Füssen ihres imaginären, erdichteten Gottes im himmlischen Staube liegen zu dürfen, oder
in ihrem Land sicher vor Terroristenanschlägen usw. zu sein, wenn sie Kriege befürworten, von denen sie
aber auch zu profitieren hoffen, wenn sie ihre Gelder darein stecken.
http://www.theyfly.com/newsflash93/Regarding%20Translation%20of%20Meier%27s%20Newest%20Book.pdf
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(bad machine translation - should be "modest")
Really, it gives me great pleasure to see you once again. Be welcome in my humble abode. Wirklich, es ist mir eine grosse Freude, dich wieder einmal zu sehen. Sei willkommen in meinem bescheidenen Bau.
http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/Contact_Report_191
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Posted [by gaiaguysnet] on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 07:32 pm: Edit Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)
Dear friends,
We have put yet another 2005 unofficial translation through our wringer and ironed out some more mistakes and awkward wordings. Please see: www.gaiaguys.net/meierv6p379.htm
It should be a little easier to understand now.
Here are two of the translated sentences from Billy, which we corrected in this go-around.
505. Ganz besonders beim Erdenmenschen herrscht die irrige und gefährliche Ansicht vor, dass ein guter Wahrheitskünder, ein guter Prediger oder ein guter Lehrer der Wahrheitslehre usw. und also auch ein guter Prophet voller demütiger Haltung sein müsse, nur liebe und feine, gewählte und diplomatische Worte sprechen und allzeit nur freundlich sein müsse.
505. With Earth humans, predominates quite especially, the erroneous and dangerous view that a good announcer of truth, a good preacher or a good teacher of the true teachings, and so forth, and therefore also a good prophet, must be full of humble bearing, only speak pleasing and elegant, chosen and diplomatic words, and must always only be friendly.
506. Gerade so müsse es sein, denken die Erdenmenschen, wie z.B. der Papst sich benehme und also viele Pfarrherren und Sektenführer, die wahrheitlich jedoch nichts anderes tun, als ihr wahres Gesicht zu verstecken und freundlich-nächstenliebend zu erscheinen, um dadurch ihre Gläubigen über ihr tatsächliches Wesen irrezuführen und sie ausbeuten zu können.
506. The Earth humans think it must be just the same as, for example, the Pope comports himself, and therefore many gentleman ministers and sect leaders, who truthfully, however, do nothing other than hide their true faces and appear friendly and neighbor-loving, to thereby mislead their believers about their actual nature, and to be able to exploit them.
Cheers!
Dyson and Vivienne
P.S. I forgot to mention previously that, according to Billy, ALL the historical prophets' teachings have been badly distorted and falsified, so looking to "Babatschi" for spiritual guidance is logically less prudent than looking to our current prophet, whose precious teachings have not (yet) been badly mucked with. As least not on the scale that was done by Saul/Paul, Randy Winters, and various others in the so-called ufological community, and so forth.
http://forum.figu.org/us/messages/12/6890.html#POST28607
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