| Author |
Message |
   
Sitkaa
Member
Post Number: 154
Registered: 10-2004
| | Posted on Friday, January 29, 2010 - 09:14 am: | 
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Dyson, I have seen you write with fervor regarding adherence to the truth. You don't want people led down the wrong path in your's or FIGU's or Billy's or the Plejaren's name. And that makes sense.
What is this truth we are talking about here? Is it truth about social institutions and historical events? Such as the whole Judeo-Christian-Muslim power struggle for dominance, as exemplified with the impact of the US/UK, Israel, and Saudi Arabia on world peace. The best we can do in this case is to develop an understanding of what has been and is really goin on, perhaps by using algorithms that determine relative measures of truth and reason to do so.
Or is this truth about how to best live life, such that everyone around you lives better as well, you know, that whole altruistic mindset. In that case, like it or not some people may still be exploring for themselves some aspect of life's definition that doesn't follow the universal or creational laws. The best we can in that case is present the universal or creational laws as we know them. and that's it.
We have to give people freedom to make mistakes. As long as the mistakes aren't going to hurt others, people should have the freedom to choose what they think is right. Certainly it is self-discipline to remind oneself that, within reason, all we can do is present what we know.
Love is always the way
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Elreyjr
Member
Post Number: 94
Registered: 01-2009
| | Posted on Friday, January 29, 2010 - 10:25 am: |
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Dear Dyson,
Thank you. Know you better now.
On learning German, agree, must be sooner than later, WOW!!!!!!! The two books by Billy in English are welcome challenges for me as yet.
Jun |
Earthling
Member
Post Number: 367
Registered: 05-2008
| | Posted on Friday, January 29, 2010 - 11:34 am: |
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http://blogs.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.view&friendId=386805075&blogId=527347525
If anyone's interested Queztal telling Billy about Roswell. Courtesy of Benjamin. Fascinating stuff. |
Sanjin
Member
Post Number: 107
Registered: 06-2009
| | Posted on Friday, January 29, 2010 - 03:49 pm: |
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Thanks Dyson and Gaia. I also agree that unchastity is the closest word for this. Now its just necessary to convey this to Mariann and the crew.
36.The human is another person, when, surrounded by the rays of the heavenly creational sunrise, the pure delight of awakening nature streams through him.
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Sanjin
Member
Post Number: 108
Registered: 06-2009
| | Posted on Friday, January 29, 2010 - 05:06 pm: |
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Dyson, here is the definition from the German Wikipedia:
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unzucht
quote:Der Begriff Unzucht bezeichnet abwertend ein menschliches Sexualverhalten, das gegen das in einem speziellen kulturellen oder religiösen Kontext empfundene, angenommene oder vorgegebene allgemeine Sittlichkeits- und Schamgefühl verstößt. Die hierbei vorliegende Kontextabhängigkeit kann sowohl von einem säkularen als auch von einem theologischen Umfeld geprägt werden und ist durch die Sittengeschichte hindurch nicht einheitlich definiert. Historisch gesehen steht Unzucht allgemein für eine aktive Handlung, die den Menschen vom Status der Reinheit in den Status der Unreinheit führt. In der Regel geht das Urteil über ein als Unzucht angesehenes Verhalten mit sozialer Ächtung oder Bestrafung einher.
Especially this one:
"Historisch gesehen steht Unzucht allgemein für eine aktive Handlung, die den Menschen vom Status der Reinheit in den Status der Unreinheit führt."
Seen historically, Unzucht in general stands for an active deed/act, which leads the human from purity/pureness into dirtiness/impurity.
36.The human is another person, when, surrounded by the rays of the heavenly creational sunrise, the pure delight of awakening nature streams through him.
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Gaiaguysnet
Member
Post Number: 847
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Friday, January 29, 2010 - 11:49 pm: |
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Dear Sanjin,
This is also my understanding of the use of the word, thanks. More on this below.
Dear Sitkaa,
You wrote, "What is this truth we are talking about here?" There is only one. And that's a fact.
You wrote, "We have to give people freedom to make mistakes. As long as the mistakes aren't going to hurt others, people should have the freedom to choose what they think is right."
I certainly agree 100% with what you say, Sitkaa. And people who come here should have the freedom to be presented with Billy's teachings without mistakes, in so far as that is humanly possible, so a free choice can be made between the ideas presented.
Here's what I wrote about 72 hours ago, on this very thread, "If the engagement fails, then what happens is we are presented with an excellent opportunity to learn from our mistake, which is why we make so many. Billy says (somewhere!) something like, “'In order to do great things we have to make great mistakes.'”
As I see it, this is the issue with false information here: "As long as the mistakes aren't going to hurt others,..." If and when an uncorrected mistake is made, for any reason, regarding the renewed teachings, or a translation, or a demonstrable historical fact, then that can and does hurt others who come here expecting to get the truth. In so far as that's concerned, I don't see that your second and third paragraphs are mutually exclusive. There are many many different threads on this forum and we are permitted to cover a vast range of topics, partly - no doubt - because there are a lot of people who read this forum in order to study us, and I'm not referring to Earth people. So we are given a lot of liberty. As you may or may not know, FIGU's many texts cover the topics in your two abovementioned paragraphs and none of these are taboo here. Similarly, we all have a moral obligation - if you will - or creational recommendation, to stand by and assist when called upon in honesty. This means getting the information correct, and it is not the place for making mistakes which go uncorrected. Do you agree? You also write, "all we can do is present what we know". Sadly this is clearly not the case, because this forum has a long unhappy history of various faceless people presenting very obviously what they DO NOT know, as fact, with great (pseudo) authority, in such a way that the sincere truth-seeking person is genuinely convinced that the know-it-all actually HAS familiarised her or himself with FIGU's texts, when that is obviously not the case at all. This hurts people, and I try to lovingly but directly correct these mistakes when I think I can. We ALL have that obligation, but of course we need to know the FIGU material quite well, and - since this IS the English language forum - almost nobody here has read very much of it. That's just the way it is.
Also, beginners' translations might look good to a non-German speaker, but I roll my eyes sometimes at the misunderstandings they must engender. Deciding that A = X and then dissecting X until it's minced does not assist in the understanding of A, if A does not equal X in the first place. As to Unzucht - I personally don't like "unchastity" because it tends to ignore the "being-badly-raised" component of Unzuct, and chastity, which tends to equate with virginity, celibacy, to some extent, seems to miss the mark. Look at it this way: how many people - (if "chastity" was the preferred hyponym for Unzucht) would correctly understand the meaning of that passage in the KdW? My guess? 0%. Maybe it would be better to simply throw up our hands and do with Unzucht what FIGU does with Gewalt, Gemüte, etc. I simply don't know. I'd have to give it a lot more thought and, as I wrote recently, I really don't want to get caught up in that degree of detail. I know what Unzucht means, even if I can't find a suitable hyponym. :-)
Cheers!
Dyson |
Indi
Member
Post Number: 387
Registered: 06-2006
| | Posted on Saturday, January 30, 2010 - 07:13 am: |
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I don't see that 'unchastity' fits in any way. And it is not a word used in current English, so why go there?
I think 'fornicate' is the correct word, in the light of the other use of the word 'Unzucht' in the KdW and also in light of various discussion on this topic years ago.
I agree with the sentiment Dyson expressed earlier (Hi Dyson, good to see you back) that sometimes if one spends too much time on one word here and another there, it detracts from the message or sentiment of the whole sentence or paragraph. That does not mean that one should not try and place the correct word there eventually, but just that one can get 'stuck' and miss out on the flow of information as a concept that influences the mind in a less conscious way.
From my experience, when there is a little confusion with a meaning, if one continues on, reads more of the material, eventually the meaning will become clear. At least that is my personal experience with Billy's material.
Robyn |
Sanjin
Member
Post Number: 109
Registered: 06-2009
| | Posted on Saturday, January 30, 2010 - 12:01 pm: |
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Indi, I think that it is quite important to know if premarital sex is right or not. Actually from my research I have determined that fornication is a false religious teaching, which brings detrimental effects to the societies/groups which practice this teaching. This counts especially in societies where divorce is permissible.
Well actually here's a good website which discusses an effect:
http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_dira.htm
They discuss an AP article and also a research study, whereby they found out that the highest divorce rates are found in the "Bible Belt."
"The AP report stated that 'the divorce rates in these conservative states are roughly 50 percent above the national average of 4.2 per thousand people.' The 10 Southern states with some of the highest divorce rates were Alabama, Arkansas, Arizona, Florida, Georgia, Mississippi, North Carolina, Oklahoma, South Carolina, and Texas. By comparison nine states in the Northeast were among those with the lowest divorce rates: Connecticut, Massachusetts, Maine, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New York, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, and Vermont."
The word chastity has become associated with abstinence. But that is because of the priests and others in power, who are sick in their world of thoughts, and think that the holy act of love is somehow dirty.
Would maybe unchasteness be better? Would it even make a difference?
36.The human is another person, when, surrounded by the rays of the heavenly creational sunrise, the pure delight of awakening nature streams through him.
|
Sanjin
Member
Post Number: 110
Registered: 06-2009
| | Posted on Saturday, January 30, 2010 - 12:15 pm: |
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Here is one more comparison:
Middle English chastite, from Old French chastete, from Latin castitas, from castus, pure
Latin-English
http://www.online-dictionary.biz/latin/english/meaning/castitas
1. castitas chastity, pure, morally clean, unpolluted
German - Latin
http://dictionaries.travlang.com/GermanLatin/dict.cgi?query=zucht&max=50
Zucht
1. castimonia, castitas
Again, sex is not dirty, if it is not dirty. And it's not supposed to be thought of as dirty.
36.The human is another person, when, surrounded by the rays of the heavenly creational sunrise, the pure delight of awakening nature streams through him.
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Gaiaguysnet
Member
Post Number: 855
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, January 31, 2010 - 03:34 pm: |
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Dear all,
Mariann (who, along with her husband Willem Mondria, is working hard with Billy on the Goblet of Truth) has kindly forwarded me her correspondence with Sanjin, in which she or he (sorry, Sanjin. I don't know which) has brought Mariann to the point of basically writing a "cease and desist" email to her/him, due to Sanjin's continual "harassment" of her regarding the English hyponym for the word Unzucht. Exasperated, Mariann (justifiably, in my view) felt the need to use red, bold fonts.
By way of important background, Mariann is a mature, intelligent and well-educated person who began her Geisteslehre at the very start, in the 70's, so she is very advanced in her understanding. Billy says that he alone can teach her. Billy has also written a lovely poem praising her. He also has explained that her spirit form does not relate to one of the "fallible ones", but - as an off-word, outsider who has recognised the need to assist the mission - is now invloved without being one of the core group.
Sanjin introduced her/himself here on the forum last year, if I recall correctly, as one of the team who was responsible for the correction of the professional translator's work on the Kelch der Wahrheit. I don't know what Sanjin's qualifications are, nor why s/he made that claim, nor whether that assertion was ever supported by any independent evidence, but I do know that - for someone who clearly presents her/himself as another authority in the translation of German into English - s/he is simply wrong in her/his insistence that Unzucht "=" unchastity (an archaic word at best). This displays a basic lack of ability, at the least.
Mariann has pointed out, in her emails to Sanjin, that the preferred hyponym for unchastity is not Unzuct, but Unkeuschheit, (as per English-German dictionaries). It's pretty straightforward.
Sanjin has evidently not communicated this important correction, by Mariann, of her/his mistake to us here on the forum. Why? I've waited for this, but it has not been forthcoming.
Regarding translations, one IMPORTANT consideration, in trying to come up with English hyponyms, is the word's CONTEXT. A single word in isolation is rarely enough to go on. Translation is an art as well as a science. There are good books on the subject.
Similarly, Billy, in particular, is concerned with a more accurate meaning of a particular word than is often currently the common (mis)understanding. The correct meanings will re-emerge over the coming centuries. That's why we get "teaching", instead of "teachings", for instance, in spite of all the current English dictionaries. Also, even the SOUND of a word has an importance that is not (yet) acknowledged by terrestrial translators. Similarly, even a word's ORIGINS are very important, which is why we read "human or human being" instead of "people", (Leute) which springs from "carrion eater".
And of course the Dark Order has been trying to ruin both English and German for a long time. Please see http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/gaiaguys/meierv5p50-52.htm
There's much, much more to all this translation business than meets the untrained eye.
It greatly concerns me that contributors here who DEMONSTRABLY do not display an adequate understanding of the source and target languages (translator-speak for the language to be translated out of, and into, respectively) pose as defacto authorities and then make erroneous assertions which go uncorrected. I've got more valuable things to do, and so do Mariann and Billy.
Sanjin and Gaia, if and when you learn 1.) the languages and 2.) the teachings and 3.) can display your capacity to adequately translate Billy texts, please 4.) do so and then you will 5.) be judged by your acts by those of us who have eyes to see, and, then and not before, you will become part of the solution instead of continuing to be part of the problem. (No offence intended. Nothing personal.)
Until then, kindly cease and desist. You are not helping.
By the way, Gaia, I asked you to provide references to the passages you said you were currently working on, so I could see what, of Billy's work, you were commenting upon. Could you please do that for us now? Thanks.
Also, I reiterate that it was once a good forum rule here that English passages pasted into these threads be accompanied by their original German, in order to nip these unnecessary misunderstanding in the bud. Let's all try harder to remember to do this.
Salome,
Dyson |
Scott
Moderator
Post Number: 1921
Registered: 12-1999
| | Posted on Sunday, January 31, 2010 - 09:54 pm: |
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Dyson,
Does Sanjin know you are discussing this on a public forum?
Scott |
Gaiaguysnet
Member
Post Number: 858
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, January 31, 2010 - 11:07 pm: |
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Dear Scott,
S/he will soon. S/he has not been privately communicating with me. S/he's been forwarding my postings here to Mariann in her/his (implied here by her/him previously) private communications with her. Is there a problem with publicly discussing a public problem, which would - I assume - also be the reason why you instigated this conversation of ours in public now?
By the way, I made a small but important typographical error (SORRY!) in my above posting when I wrote that Mariann's spirit form was one of the "off-word" ones. Ha ha! Naturally, I meant to write, "off-WORLD". (All this info has been long published.)
Salome,
Dyson |
Scott
Moderator
Post Number: 1922
Registered: 12-1999
| | Posted on Monday, February 01, 2010 - 05:34 am: |
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Dyson,
I have not instigated anything, I am responding to what you posted, please don't turn it around on me. I don't find it appropriate to discuss this in this section, that was my point.
Salome
Scott |
Gaiaguysnet
Member
Post Number: 862
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Monday, February 01, 2010 - 09:01 am: |
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Sorry, Scott,
A poor choice of words on my part, perhaps?
Perhaps you would have preferred me to have written "initiate" (begin, originate) instead of "instigate" (urge forward)?
I seem to have misunderstood. You addressed our problem about wrong translations on this thread here on the "Translations" thread, so this is where I responded to you. If you'd like to move your correspondence elsewhere, I'm happy to cooperate in any way I can.
I'm afraid I don't quite understand what the problem is.
Salome,
Dyson |
Earthling
Member
Post Number: 371
Registered: 05-2008
| | Posted on Monday, February 01, 2010 - 03:05 pm: |
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Dyson, Scott .. pardon me for budding in;
Dyson, perhaps you could have settled your concerns with the aforementioned parties privately, via email, instead of chastising and embarrassing them 'in public', here on this forum. If that avenue was tried and exhausted, then perhaps a public lashing would have been justified.
Regards,
Bruce |
Gaiaguysnet
Member
Post Number: 866
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Monday, February 01, 2010 - 05:55 pm: |
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Dear Bruce,
Thanks for your concern. I just reply in the media in which I'm addressed. Scott and I also have private correspondences. He and I - who go way back together, and understand each other pretty well, and have been exposed to the material for a many years - sometimes act in an unfamiliar way, since so much of what Earthlings generally believe to be correct actually isn't, and vice-versa. There is no acrimony between us.
Here's the motivation.
"If a guilty party must be given a justified reprimand, then it should be done in private and those not involved should be excluded. Nevertheless, it is, however, necessary to rebuke openly and in the presence of others if the others are effected, if, for example, communally determined rules are injured or degenerations which endanger the group succeed which require an open settling of scores in the group." - Billy, March 2007
http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/gaiaguys/meier.sdw142.DasGesichtwahren.htm
Salome,
Dyson |
Robert_p
New member
Post Number: 4
Registered: 03-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 02, 2010 - 01:25 am: |
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Dyson,
Glad to see you back. I hope all is well after your problems. Glad to have you back on the forum.
Take care,
Bob,
British Columbia, Canada |
Earthling
Member
Post Number: 372
Registered: 05-2008
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 02, 2010 - 02:30 am: |
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Dyson .. thanks, and understood. |
Bennyray37
New member
Post Number: 2
Registered: 01-2010
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 02, 2010 - 07:54 am: |
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Greetings to all.
Having been following this thread silently for a while, I am still not entirely certain as to what topics should or shouldn’t be discussed here on the “Translations” forum. I was hoping to find discussions where people would be asking others about what particular English words would be best choices to use in translations for particular German words. Lately, I have only seen Sanjin bring up this topic, and I must admit that he strongly seems to have been met with rather harsh words for what seemed to be a sincere desire to find out the right English word for a particular German word. I, too, would like to use this thread for such a purpose; I just hope that I am not met with such harsh words since I have enough stress in my personal life going on right now that I solely want the translating to be a means for uplifting and not a means to bring me further down.
Now, I am directing these next comments mainly towards Dyson, but it equally applies to all of those who are well-versed in the German and English languages and who regularly visit this section in the forum. Thus, any who belong to this category can take note. Dyson, I realize that you are a qualified German and English-speaking person. You don’t have to say or do anything to prove this to me since your work speaks for itself. I would very much like to receive any help from you that I can during my translation process. I’ve read in earlier posts that you said that my translations are “reasonably accurate gist translations” that can be cranked out like sausages. I also saw somewhere, at one point, that you feel that in some instances, my translations can be a little misleading. Now, it is true that I am not a German-speaking person at all. I don’t ever want to give that impression and certainly don’t want to be met with words like what Sanjin was met with, so I will lay that out on the table right at the start. The main thing, though, is that I don’t want my translations to contain any “misleading” words or phrases. It’s just that if they truly do, I really don’t know this unless someone qualified tells me. Thus, I was hoping you might be able to use this thread to indicate to me any German words that I might be regularly translating in a misleading way and hope that you could give me the best corresponding English words for such. I don’t know how often you might read my translations, but if you ever notice such things, please post them here, if that is truly what this thread is intended for. This way, others who translate using software programs and German-to-English dictionaries could also benefit from knowing such. By the way, I remember you mentioning a particular word that you found in my translations that you said could be translated better, but I can’t find it again. Could you please inform me of this?
Just a quick comment on the “cranking out like sausages” remark [I’m not offended by this remark, I just want to make things clear  ]: to me, translating 6 to 8 sentences an hour (which is about what I can do) using software programs and dictionaries doesn’t seem very fast to me. The way I see it, someone who knows the German and English languages well should be able to make translations at a much faster rate than I can. This is because he/she can simply look at a German word and then pull the corresponding English counterpart from his/her own knowledge. I can’t do that. I must carefully investigate every single word using multiple sources. If it seems that I am cranking out my translations quickly, it’s only because I devote so much of my time towards this project. Now, apart from using the software programs, I have also been trying to use FIGU’s Dictionary site, FIGU’s authorized and official translations (which have the English and German languages side-by-side), and even your (Dyson’s) and Vivienne’s translations, whenever there seems to be a difficult German word for the software programs, in order to find the best choices for English counterparts. Unfortunately, FIGU’s Dictionary site, more often than not, does not have entries for words that I am looking for, and while other authorized translations have helped me find a good amount of best choices for English words, still a good amount of German words that I encounter in the conversations can’t be found on FIGU’s or Future of Mankind’s websites yet. Thus, if this thread could be used as an additional means for me to find “best choice” English words, I think that this would be very profitable.
Regards.
--
Benjamin Stevens |
Earthling
Member
Post Number: 373
Registered: 05-2008
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 02, 2010 - 12:53 pm: |
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I would like to give a HUGE thanks to Benjamin for the considerable effort, work and diligence he applies in his translations. I am a HUGE fan and very very grateful.
Thankyou Benjamin !
Bruce
ps ... love you too, Dyson  |
Darren
Member
Post Number: 144
Registered: 07-2009
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 02, 2010 - 06:19 pm: |
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Benjamin, Sanjin hasn't replied back yet. I would wait before he does reply back before making a comment. Its suspicious the time its taking him to do so. Its been 3-4 days now. Why? |
Gaiaguysnet
Member
Post Number: 872
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 02, 2010 - 06:41 pm: |
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DEAR Benjamin! (Brother!)
:-D
How wonderful that you have finally decided to come in out of the cold! You and I should sit down together over a beer or three for a few hours and talk about all this, so we both get to understand each other better, because we’re both obviously rowing the same boat, (rather forcefully, I might add!) but it’s probably better that we can’t do that now because our dialog here in this public forum can be of great benefit to other potential translators of the astonishing texts from Billy Meier.
The topic of translation of the FIGU texts is as deep as the sea. I’ll try to keep it short as short as I can, but we have a lot of catching up to do.
First, I had hoped you were lurking out there (and I mean that in the nicest possible cyber way, of course!) and would read about my hope that you would join the party here, dear Benjamin.
Exactly what kind of a party we are supposed to be having on this thread is now a little confused because it was, I think, originally designed to be a place for translations, then it wasn’t, then it was supposed to be a place to discuss translations, and then (I’m not sure) it might not be. But we’re still here.
Just let me say again that I wish I had never used that misunderstood Australianism, “cranking out like sausages”, because it is in no way intended as anything but an expression of my high regard (of course, were I to say that someone was, for instance, cranking out lies or falsified teachings, etc., like sausages, that naturally would not attract my high regard, so common sense applies) for your vigorous production of a great deal of uniform work in an astonishingly short time. I – and others here – are amazed at the rate that you do this. Perhaps not having to drag word and expression usages up out of your memory all the time spares you the cerebral wear and tear the rest of us translators suffer. I know better than maybe anyone else here on this English-language forum how HARD you must work! (Big round of applause!) Wouldn’t it almost be EASIER to just learn German?! How can you AVOID it, doing what you do? You REALLY don’t speak it? I just gasp!
I really do not want to offend you (or anyone else here) with harsh words, but the renewed teachings are – in many areas – very different to the religiously poisoned ones we, here on Planet Suicide, imbibed and digested with our mothers’ toxic milk. And I cannot but live these cherished teachings here now. The teachings of the truth (Creation is truth) state that the truth MUST be delivered harshly in order for it to penetrate the average Earth human’s elephant hide. Of course it takes all kinds to make the world, and a lot of us who find BEAM have come to him because we are born sensitive souls who feel all too much, and bleed for poor, wretched, suffering, starving humanity. I can REALLY relate to that, and I’ve had to adapt to a hard life on Earth because of that, and grown thick scar tissue which is now quite difficult to wound, but still very, very sensitive to touch.
505. Ganz besonders beim Erdenmenschen herrscht die irrige und gefährliche Ansicht vor, dass ein guter Wahrheitskünder, ein guter Prediger oder ein guter Lehrer der Wahrheitslehre usw. und also auch ein guter Prophet voller demütiger Haltung sein müsse, nur liebe und feine, gewählte und diplomatische Worte sprechen und allzeit nur freundlich sein müsse.
505. With Earth humans, predominates quite especially, the erroneous and dangerous view that a good announcer of truth, a good preacher or a good teacher of the true teachings, and so forth, and therefore also a good prophet, must be full of humble bearing, only speak pleasing and elegant, chosen and diplomatic words, and must always only be friendly.
506. Gerade so müsse es sein, denken die Erdenmenschen, wie z.B. der Papst sich benehme und also viele Pfarrherren und Sektenführer, die wahrheitlich jedoch nichts anderes tun, als ihr wahres Gesicht zu verstecken und freundlich-nächstenliebend zu erscheinen, um dadurch ihre Gläubigen über ihr tatsächliches Wesen irrezuführen und sie ausbeuten zu können.
506. The Earth humans think it must be just the same as, for example, the Pope comports himself, and therefore many gentleman ministers and sect leaders, who truthfully, however, do nothing other than hide their true faces and appear friendly and neighbor-loving, to thereby mislead their believers about their actual nature, and to be able to exploit them.
512. Die einzigen Gutgesinnten für die Propheten und sonstigen Wahrheitslehre- und Wahrheitsverkünder sind seit alters her nur jene Menschen, die der Wahrheit offen zugetan und für die dargebrachte Wahrheitslehre dankbar sind.
512. The only people well disposed towards the prophets and other truth teachers and truth announcers are, since time immemorial, only those people who are openly devoted to the truth and thankful for the delivered teachings of the truth.
http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/gaiaguys/meierv6p379.htm
In opposition to that is the warning that we all have a responsibility not to “burn” people with the truth. Billy cites this example: when he was a young man talking with an old monk in a Buddhist monastery, after some hours, at their parting, the monk remarked that Billy was very wise and he (the monk) had learnt much about the nature of the spirit from him during their conversation. Billy replied, good naturedly, “I guess even an elderly holy man such as yourself still always has something more to learn.” (or words to that effect). But the monk was deeply offended and profoundly hurt by this off-hand remark which was taken the wrong way, and Billy learnt a valuable lesson. It’s not diplomacy, which is equated with mendacity. It’s tact. I am still trying to learn how to most wisely wield the truth - which is a powerful elemental force – and I suspect it is a learning curve which most us, who have familiarised ourselves with the terrible/wonderful truth, will continue to ascend until we die – if we’re lucky.
Anyway … if you (anyone, not just you, comrade) approach the teaching of the truth in English, you will automatically be 1.) deprived of 95% of it, and 2.) the 5% which is in English will be so castrated that it will almost do more harm than good. This might seem like an exaggeration, but it’s not. That’s why we keep banging on about how lousy English is and how important learning German is.
And, to make matters worse, a good basic grounding in the (German!) texts is needed in order to know how to best translate the words they employ in the first place. Oh, it’s a headache, but you know that already.
But I only grudgingly accept the title of “qualified” (meeting the standards, requirements, and training for a position) you give me, Benjamin, because I’m a complete self-taught amateur. That’s why I can relate to what you’re doing, even if you and I took different approaches to it. When I started this quixotic quest to bring the Meier material into the dark and ignorant English-speaking world, I did it just like you, audaciously, without formal qualifications and as on-the-job training. It was agonisingly slow and difficult, but I KNEW that SOMEONE had to pull the entire debate up and away from the vehicles these ETs zoom around in. (Wendelle, quite a religious man, understandably shunned all the meaty spiritual topics, and wondered aloud if maybe the blasphemous “Pleiadians” might even not be ETs at all but the “antichrist”.) We somehow HAD to share the vital spiritual truths. So I just started doing it, because nobody else was (sound familiar?) and got into it even though I didn’t really know what I was doing. SOMETHING (unslanted and provided in the spirit of truth) HAD to be better than NOTHING! But when Vivienne and I started, there was no reasonable translation software, and we had just spent all our meagre savings on Disclosure Project Information Nights anyway, so we couldn’t have afforded it even if it had existed in 2002. So we did it the old-fashioned way and we think we were largely successful turbo-charging Michael Horn’s presentations with many new selections from the post-Semjase era, and giving the English-speaking world a taste of what was in the German texts. This selection-of-texts is a key to understanding what I can and cannot do for you linguistically, Benjamin.
As much as I would have loved to be able to start at the beginning and work my way through the contact notes, as you are now doing, I still think that selective excerpts form all Billy’s many books (which I’ve read and re-read) is a much more efficient way to go.
This (finally – you still with me, gang?) brings me to the question of providing help for you in individual words, expressions, vernacular, slang, idioms, dialect, regionalisms, abstruse jargon, and what we call “Meierisms”.
Benjamin, here’s a way of looking at it. You’re like a guy who really wants to play the piano, so he teaches himself, his own way, works terribly hard and quickly gets quite good at it, but has lousy technique, curling his fingers and hunching over the keyboard. These bad habits, acquired because of the unorthodox approach, eventually start to inhibit progress. You come to me, a classically trained pianist, and say, “Help me progress.” And I have to explain that you cannot make progress until you laboriously unlearn your bad habits. I KNOW that you – and all the other software translators – will have insuperable difficulties getting where you have to go to make really competent translations worthy of Billy’s precious teachings, and that’s just the way it is. A PRIMARY perception of the German language is a prerequisite. That means, you read it and it goes into your mind without being converted (degraded) into English first.
I have really not had a very close look at your body of work, except to see that there doesn't appear to be an obvious slant or a hidden agenda.
But if the moderators are happy for us folks to use their “Translations” thread for getting/giving help in this regard, that’s fine by me, but I’m concerned that it will quickly attract more hyenas - those who are really only here to cunningly disrupt with bulls..t fake definitions and high-sounding gobbledygook. (21 assassination attempt, right? We’re playing hardball here.) And if I have to spend all my time trying to keep the carnivores at bay, I cannot do what I do, which is the selective translations, etc. If I am allowed to become badly outnumbered here again, as I have been in the past, I am left with no reasonable alternative but to jump ship, and leave the forum to the dogs again. Sorry for my lack of tact here, but I do my best.
I don’t remember the specific word I had a problem with, Benjamin, and I don’t really want to get into that level of detail either, as I’ve said repeatedly. Try searching the forum posts for “sausages”. :-) I'll do what I can.
As your work with the teachings continues, even the way you have decided to do it, they are BOUND to rub off on you a little and help you cope with the heat of the kitchen you’ve chosen to work in with me. I’m glad to have you here with me.
Hope I haven’t neglected anything.
Cheers!
Dyson (der Vorausschauende) |
Gaiaguysnet
Member
Post Number: 874
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 02, 2010 - 11:07 pm: |
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Dear Bob! (Robert_p)
Thank you very much for the welcome and the kind words.
"I hope all is well after your problems." We're very well, thanks, but the nature of consciousness (a.k.a. spiritual) evolution is that the problems never cease, you just get bigger and more challenging ones!
OM 32:1692. Wer viele Feinde hat, der hat auch viele Ehre. (He who has many enemies also has much honour.)
Cheers!
Dyson |
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