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Archive through April 27, 2010

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Indi
Moderator

Post Number: 413
Registered: 06-2006
Posted on Thursday, March 04, 2010 - 08:59 pm:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Re the sentence Thomas offered for reflection upon:

This sentence, is from a section in the book that is discussing the difference between the type of love that man feels, 'affective love', and his desire for it and to have it fulfilled and 'effective Love', which has nothing to do with desires and wishes in any way. It is only the individual who desires love to be fulfilled.

Here is the sentence in German, and my translation, not necessarily correct, but more to show how different to the one in Thomas' post.


Wahrliche Liebe hat keinerlei Wünsche, sondern nur das Bedürfnis, sich selbst zu erfüllen.

'Indeed love has nothing to do with desires/wishes, only the individual has need for it to be fulfilled.'

From this it can be seen how easily different interpretations can be made if words are taken out of context.

Robyn
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Thomas
Member

Post Number: 852
Registered: 03-2004
Posted on Thursday, March 04, 2010 - 10:28 pm:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

That isn't the same sentence Robyn though it has the same idea.=A0 The sent= ence I refered to was shorter :-)
patricksdadinfrance@yahoo.com
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Indi
Moderator

Post Number: 414
Registered: 06-2006
Posted on Thursday, March 04, 2010 - 11:51 pm:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

hmmm

The page I found that sentence in 'Die Art zu Leben' is p.35

Maybe you could double check that, as the Promt machine translation of that sentence I posted is:

'Wahrliche love has no wishes, but only the need to come true.'

and yours was:
'True love has no wishes, but only the need to come true.'

That is the only reason I posted about it.
We should move this to the translation section to discuss further if need be.

Robyn
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Thomas
Member

Post Number: 853
Registered: 03-2004
Posted on Friday, March 05, 2010 - 12:17 am:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

OK everyone, without wanting to sound testy, I made it clear in the first post that this was a point to meditate upon. I only said that it was from that book because I didn't want to take credit for having the idea myself spontaneously. I am no expert in german as I have clearly stated and so I will not be posting any translations as such. Anyone that sees ANY of my posts from now on please consider them info and not as translations. That way there will be no confusion. If my posts are not wanted in that manner, I will stop posting the information and only put my opinions on the forum as I did before. I am only trying to help those who do not have access to the information yet I want to avoid giving out more than is appropriate. I merely want to give incentive to those who are serious and who wonder, like I used to, if the information is even worth pursuing.

To make this a post pertaining to meditation, here is something to meditate on:

If someone offers the truth and it isn't accepted, was the person wrong to offer it in the first place?
patricksdadinfrance@yahoo.com
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Indi
Moderator

Post Number: 415
Registered: 06-2006
Posted on Friday, March 05, 2010 - 12:49 am:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thomas
I did ponder or meditate on your offering, and it didn't sound right to me, so I went to the source to find out why it ddidn't sound correct, in order to get more clarification. Instead I discovered it was not exactly translated and that led me to understand what that sentence really had to offer.

I thank you for that opportunity to focus on it, however, there is no need to be bothered by my clarification of the sentence, instead maybe you could see that I was extending your suggestion even further for others?

We all make errors, and should welcome those who offer clarifications or corrections. It is all in the light of learning and growing.

Salome
Robyn
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Thomas
Member

Post Number: 854
Registered: 03-2004
Posted on Friday, March 05, 2010 - 05:46 am:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

As I said, I didn't want the last post of mine to sound testy but I wasn't offering a translation. Even if the idea I proposed was not correct, meditating on it would likely cause insight one way or the other. I didn't mean to sound ungrateful for the clarification and I can see how a post can be misinterpreted.

Jumping away from the translation issue, the idea I mentioned as opposed to the translation you offered still make it appear to my limited view that love just needs to be fulfilled and does not have any extraneous requirements. I can see big differences between what I said and what you wrote and I do not disagree. To me though, they appear to have the same resulting implications that love is more of a pure idea or thing, even if the statements are different.

Thanks for the clarification at any rate. It really was appreciated. I just felt that the point was being missed as a result of the book title being mentioned and that the idea was being lost. I see now that this wasn't the case. To be honest Robyn, I never doubted that you in particular would think it through. I just don't know anyone else here personally and so I can't be sure how they might be taking my posts. I hope you understand what I mean :-)
patricksdadinfrance@yahoo.com
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Gaiaguysnet
Member

Post Number: 1034
Registered: 03-2004
Posted on Friday, March 05, 2010 - 07:05 pm:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi all,

From my point of view, for what it may be worth, I think it's unwise to lose sight of the fact that only a very tiny percentage of the overall texts have been translated and even those few translations are - according to Billy - inadequate by their very nature. So the sorts of difficulties we encounter, above, in sorting out the English points-to-ponder kindly offered by Thomas suggest that misunderstandings will probably outweigh understandings, particularly if we lack Robyn's German-language resources. And even they are short of the mark (no offence, dear Robyn).

So Thomas, while I do appreciate your intentions and sincerity - since you asked - I think it's much better to refrain. No offence intended, OK?

:-)

Salome,
Dyson
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Indi
Moderator

Post Number: 416
Registered: 06-2006
Posted on Friday, March 05, 2010 - 07:09 pm:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I am first in line to acknowledge my limitations in this regard!
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Indi
Moderator

Post Number: 417
Registered: 06-2006
Posted on Friday, March 05, 2010 - 09:53 pm:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I am not inclined to shut someone down when they offer to share info with the forum. Everyone here has something to offer, some more in quality and quantity than others, however, as long as those who share are prepared to take feedback or to be corrected when correction is due, and handle it in a mature neutral-positive manner, I personally think it should be encouraged.

It is important to clarify though with offerings, as to whether they are one's own or whether they are from the Figu material. If they are from the Figu material, then it must be so that if it is incorrect, then it is corrected or commented upon. And, if from the Figu material, then it should be fully referenced, with page numbers and location so others may go to the source in order to adequately glean.

If they are one's own comments, then the author has to be prepared to be moderated if what is said does not satisfy the moderators' agreed standards.

Robyn
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Sitkaa
Member

Post Number: 212
Registered: 10-2004
Posted on Saturday, March 06, 2010 - 01:51 pm:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"...we must all never lose sight of the fact that these words of wisdom are just that, and NOT dogma."
-Dyson

Thought that was worth reiterating.

With many wisdoms that we can determine them, learn them over and over again (and again) until it is embedded into our innateness. Especially with 'love' we can discuss the concept until we are pink, purple, blue in the face, and yet it can come to naught. Love is something which we can point out to others, but it is always found inside ourelves ; )

Any infant knows what love is, so how can we inspire an infant how to find and project love? How can anyone dogmatize an infant? Love is innate, while dogma is authoritative. No matter how hard you tries, wisdom cannot be derived from dogma.

It is fun to discuss properties of love, and how it woven into our consensual realities, and how it guides life and growth and all things good, but such discussions have a limit. We cannot get you to emanate love, that is something you decides to do on your own, in your own time, in your own way, with your own flavor, for your own audience, etc. And I hopes you do; it makes for a much more fun and pleasant atmosphere.
Love is always the way
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Gaiaguysnet
Member

Post Number: 1040
Registered: 03-2004
Posted on Saturday, March 06, 2010 - 03:14 pm:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Dear Frau Moderatorin Robyn! :-]

Your 417th contribution is the best sight for my sore eyes I've EVER read on this forum!

If ONLY it could stand at the top of every single page of every single thread! Or at least be adopted as some sort of formal forum guidelines, recommendations, or whatnot.

Oh, what a happy, peaceful and instructive forum we would have! I would gratefully retreat in peace to my translation work! :-D

Peace in love/wisdom,
Dyson
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Gaiaguysnet
Member

Post Number: 1041
Registered: 03-2004
Posted on Saturday, March 06, 2010 - 03:50 pm:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Dear Sitkaa (et al),

Thanks for your welcome thoughts. :-)

I have just a couple of observations, if I may:

Readers of the material will be aware that the word "fun" (Spass) never appears in a positive sense, but conveys the idea of trivial and shallow diversions. This is more than simple semantics. Words are very important, as pointers to ideas, and the power of ideas/thoughts is enormous. When one experiences TRUE (deep and lasting) JOY, then the idea of "fun" really comes off as a poor second best. "Fun" as the goal of life seems to be part of the language conspiracy (by the Dark Order).

http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/gaiaguys/meierv5p50-52.htm

And discussion/debate/argument is important.

"Tatsächlich ist das Gros der Menschen in ein Stadium verfallen, in dem sich das kommunizierende Sichauseinandersetzen mit dem Nächsten sowie das Diskutieren ebenso kaum oder nicht mehr finden lässt wie auch nicht das Sichauseinandersetzen mit den globalen Geschehen, denn diese Notwendigkeiten sind bereits vielen verlorengegangen."

(Actually, the majority of humans has fallen into a state in which disputes participated in with neighbors, as well as discussions, are just as rarely or no longer to be found, as neither are quarrels with global events, because these necessities have already been mostly lost.)

http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/gaiaguys/meier.56.ratgeber.htm

And it's the power of the written and spoken word allowing us to communicate complex consciousness/spiritual concepts/ideas which distinguish us from the rest of the animal kingdom.

Semjase also says, (250) "Only the unrestricted spirit and Creation itself represent true freedom, true perfection, true cognition, power, LOVE [my emphasis], knowledge, truth and wisdom."

http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/gaiaguys/meier.contact10.htm

This 10th contact is such a jewel. As is OM's Kanon 49 http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/gaiaguys/OM.K49.htm

Love is always the way, but we have to make sure we know what love actually is, and discussing it is an important way of obtaining the ideas necessary to understand how to experience and share it.

Again, these two articles are valuable.

http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/gaiaguys/Humandoesnotknowlove.htm

http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/gaiaguys/loveisnotallyouneed.htm

Cheers!
Dyson
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Justsayno
Member

Post Number: 165
Registered: 10-2009
Posted on Sunday, March 07, 2010 - 07:33 am:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Who knew I was such a Spass loving gal? Puts a whole new meaning to it when you say it like that, lol. I need shallow diversions to counteract the long hours spent on taxes. I need to laugh and have fun at least some part of the day. We can't all be serious all the time. I noticed Billy teases Ptaah a little, I find that refreshing.
"How the hell would you know what my line looks like, it's imaginary." - my Dad, after being told by the police to walk a straight line.
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Sitkaa
Member

Post Number: 214
Registered: 10-2004
Posted on Tuesday, March 09, 2010 - 07:30 am:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"What is the point of life? Why are we here?" Sometimes people have looked to me (God only knows what they were thinking...) for the answers to life, the universe, and everything. Here's my answer.

Why do we live? What is the point of life? The answer is really simple. To be happy. Not much more to it than that. To be happy. If ya wanna flow into the growth paradigm, you can maximize your happiness - to learn to be as happy as possible in all circumstances you run into, but truth is, it is just a simple thing - to be happy, joie de vivre.

I just don't k'now, don't k'see how fun is a bad thing. Just like self-discipline, light-hearted fun has it's place, nothin wrong with it in my view. Call me spasstic if ya want, I'll just find it funny.
Love is always the way
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Gaiaguysnet
Member

Post Number: 1062
Registered: 03-2004
Posted on Tuesday, March 09, 2010 - 12:06 pm:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi Sitkaa,

This is a language thing, I think, to some extent.

Now don't get me wrong, Sitkaa, anyone who knows me knows I'm a fun-lover! ;-]

But - according to Billy, and also in my own personal experience - the real point of life is not "fun", it's learning.

The Plejaren tell us that human beings do not generally emotionally mature until about the age of 70. Remember that Earthlings have been genetically modified to have progeria, so we are playful children.

As years pass, your fun will wear thin for you, unless you are perhaps profoundly intellectually challenged, and you quite obviously are not. But true joy - gained through love/wisdom, peace, spiritual poise, freedom, and a deep conscious awareness of reality, etc. - endures, and continues to deepen, when "fun" does not.

Of course learning is the reason for life in general, but free will demands that each of us can choose her/his own individual path. Some people's reason for life is to stay as drunk or stoned as humanly possible, amass the most things (or power) possible, have sex with as many different attractive people as they can, cover their bodies with tattoos and/or piercings, climb the highest mountains, run the fastest 100m, etc. etc. The list is endless.

I'll take joy through learning, thanks.

Have fun! :-)
Dyson
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Sitkaa
Member

Post Number: 215
Registered: 10-2004
Posted on Wednesday, March 10, 2010 - 07:43 pm:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Every person views maturity uniquely depending on what they are engaged in learning.

As for me, I can't wait till I reach 70 to actualize my maturity - and I have certainly already had shallow judgments passed upon me about my conformity with someone else's picture of maturity or wisdom or respectability. Instead, I want to drink lemonade and chase skirts till I die of too much fun. And then who knows, but at least I will have learned to be happy.
Love is always the way
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Bronzedesk
Member

Post Number: 76
Registered: 01-2009
Posted on Thursday, March 11, 2010 - 07:02 am:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Dear one's,

Ever heard of, it often gets lost in in the translation?

Most people are about as happy as they make up their minds to be. ~ Abraham Lincoln

And 70 is no peaches and cream !!!

When I was a boy of fourteen, my father was so ignorant I could hardly stand to have the old man around. But when I got to be twenty-one, I was astonished at how much the old man had learned in seven years. ~ Mark Twain

> A fallen one...
First you forget names, then you forget faces. Next you forget to pull your zipper up and finally, you forget to pull it down. George Burns
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Bodhran
Member

Post Number: 74
Registered: 08-2008
Posted on Friday, March 12, 2010 - 10:46 am:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hey Gaiaguys,
I love that explanation of humans being playful children as our life spans are so short, explains very well why some people find it so hard to grow up, I never thought of it like that! Where did you get that from if you don't mind me asking, I'd love to read exactly what was said.
Thanks.
Salome

Tony.
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Justsayno
Member

Post Number: 175
Registered: 10-2009
Posted on Saturday, March 13, 2010 - 04:46 pm:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi Sitkaa, how do you manage to chase those skirts without spilling the lemonade?
To me, the people who never age are the ones who still have child like curiosity and wonder. You can see it in their eyes, they have a twinkle in them. It has nothing to do with being responsible.
Once you wake up and realize you've spent most of your life worrying about what other people think of you, now is the time to be your own person. You can never please all the people all the time, and there will always be those who dislike you for no good reason (or maybe a good reason, lol). You can only go forward.
"How the hell would you know what my line looks like, it's imaginary." - my Dad, after being told by the police to walk a straight line.
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Indi
Moderator

Post Number: 424
Registered: 06-2006
Posted on Saturday, March 13, 2010 - 04:54 pm:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This area is for the discussion of Meditation with particular regard to the information in the Figu material. Please get back on topic.


Robyn
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Sitkaa
Member

Post Number: 223
Registered: 10-2004
Posted on Sunday, March 14, 2010 - 04:26 pm:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Sometimes I get depressed and think about why we are here, with only momentum to carry me from one lovely moment to the next. Should this momentum cease, how will I find my way?

In the history of the universe, has this ever happened before? Is there ever, is it even possible, a point at which self-existence can cease? I have a sense that we can be unraveled, but can the core of what makes oneself alive be snuffed? Sometimes I feel it can be, but usually I choose to doubt it.

We all know that life is precious. Life is in fact so, so, so precious, that everything that is alive is precious. And yet we human beings as a people continuously choose to ignore this. Is there ever a way to shock every human being at their core into either an unrecoverable degeneracy of utter psychopathy or love? Perhaps with some kinda consciousness bomb? Perhaps should one human being who is full of common sense consciously choose to completely and utterly commit suicide for all eternity, then everyone else would be shocked at their core into assessing their value of the process of life, consciously choosing between psychopathy and love. Is this thanatos capable enough to be able to threaten life as we know it?

Ask yourself this, Dear audience: 'Can my death have any impact upon the people who have impacted my own life?' If your answer is yes, then by all rights we should all be very concerned, anything else is insanity. And if your answer is no, then we need know no god, for life is truly valueless. To simultaneously meditate so deeply on both connection with everyone, and absolute psychopathy, would it have any impact upon the Jews, or the CIA, or any of the other capricious groups that consider human lives to be their tools - or are they spiritually so far outa touch that nothing can have any impact upon them. Is human life meaningless? You may find your answer in the eyes of a psychopath.

Moment to moment, in every situation, all we can do is find the little bit of love that avails itself with infinite patience, and sometimes only the habit of momentum carries us through.

--------------
Sitkaa, I don't wish to detract from the 'yearning' expressed in your post, and I do think that it is an important issue to be contemplated, I feel the need to mention that this section is for the discussion of meditation practice as taught in the Figu material and the issues that surround its practice.

I would like to give you the opportunity to copy and repost to another more suitable location.

Although the moderators can move posts, it is a finicky process, and it would be nice to think that in the very least regular posters would be more thoughtful about where the content of their posts can be found for the present and future readers/students of the material.

I too am guilty of this oversight, and have the same need to be mindful of where posts are placed.

Robyn


(Message edited by indi on March 14, 2010)
Love is always the way
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Silence
Member

Post Number: 12
Registered: 09-2009
Posted on Wednesday, April 07, 2010 - 03:10 am:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Has anyone noticed how what Billy calls the neutral positive attitude is intertwined with meditation?

It's as if they are one. If one meditates regulary then it's only natural that he may show this sort of correct thinking and approach. At the beginning though , if one just started to meditate it may take time to show this in daily life. So the goal is to not only be able to meditate correctly , but also bring the fruits of meditation to our work place, school, family and so on.

I now see that what Billy means by neutral - positive thinking is what in the far east they called "not-clinging" , or "wu-wei". Do you agree? Of course in a more understandable manner. At least for me.

I find it very joyful that you can actually easily try out or find out for yourself what this term means. It's not something "out there" that you don't know when will happen to you, but rather a state that everyone may experience themself. Not something that is "secret knowledge" or obtainable only for the few. Or only under a certain "master".
It's very refreshing.

Actually I also like to write that in my experience meditation is absolutly crucial in understanding the teachings of spirit, in a sense that thanks to meditation you get to know the real meaning of what is written. Because words are one thing - they are only sounds, wich may be interpreted in a slightly or more different manner by someone else. So to get into this reality one must explore deep into their inner life in order the for the true meaning of what is written to emerge. So a sort of individual adventure into the unknown is needed.
Which is enormous fun.
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Thomas
Member

Post Number: 931
Registered: 03-2004
Posted on Tuesday, April 27, 2010 - 12:47 pm:   Edit Post Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hello everyone, I have something I find interesting to share. I once wondered why in meditation, all of the brain frequency ranges, such as alpha, beta, gamma and so on, seemed to lean toward lower frequencies as the brain was calmed, then suddenly in meditation when gamma is reached, the frequencies are much higher.

I just read a report about something unrelated (at least not directly) and it mentioned that neurons (which are the cells that let us think) tend to spontaneously emit around 40Hz when they are in vitro (out of the body in samples). I also found out that this is the exact frequency out of a broader range that is the prototypically used frequency of the gamma range. To me it clicked that maybe all the "chatter" of our daily thoughts overpowers the basic 40Hz signal all together. As the chatter slows down, the stronger signals tend to reduce in frequency and in strength until finally only the basic signals emitted by the neurons exists, giving the characteristic 40Hz approximately signal as the output even though this signal is much weaker than normal brain activity. This in turn made me think of how BEAM and Semjase said that all the wisdom of previous lives is stored in coarse material form in the cells of the brain. If that is the case, then maybe that is why silencing the stray thoughts of the day might be the secret to bringing subconsciously available info forth to the conscious awareness. The info in the cells is in such a weak form that only by "unmasking" their signals can we hope to access them directly in an aware form.

Does this make sense or ring any bells with any of you???
patricksdadinfrance@yahoo.com

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