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Message |
   
Sparky
Member
Post Number: 31
Registered: 03-2009
| | Posted on Thursday, November 12, 2009 - 02:28 pm: | 
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I have a few questions that are kind of off topic. Why does Billy get sick, is it similar to why the Plejaren get ill when they are near Earth humans? Would someone who is Spiritually advanced suffer from a similar life of constant illness? Do people who live in overpopulated cities make each other ill by living too close to each other?
May you evolve swiftly. |
Earthling
Member
Post Number: 315
Registered: 05-2008
| | Posted on Friday, November 13, 2009 - 08:02 am: |
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Sparky ... my guess why Billy gets sick: he sacrifices the well being of his body for the mission. Maybe comes with the territory of prophet/truth teller on this planet or maybe its a personality's choice. |
Indi
Member
Post Number: 357
Registered: 06-2006
| | Posted on Friday, November 13, 2009 - 04:19 pm: |
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Billy gets sick because his body is at the same level as yours and mine. Billy's body, does not have the dna changes that eg., the Plejaren's have acquired over the many thousands of years of development.
So, even though Billy's spirit is way ahead of ours in its knowledge, his physical body, which includes his psyche, is prone to the same stresses and disorders inherited from his parents and from the psychological and environmental stresses, as everyone elses here on earth.
I would say that in this sense, the stage of development of our physical bodies at this time, is an impediment to our optimal spiritual development and physical evolution, due to its built in obsolescence. Just as we are beginning to develop maturity of thought, our lives are cut short by an early death, with only a life span of 100 or so, instead of the 10 fold more of 1000 like the Plejaren.
On another note, it is my contention that if one is able to maintain a neutral stance to the events that befall one in this life, and if one looks after the needs of the body both nutritionally and psychically/nervous system-wise and achieving balance of all factors, and takes advantage of advances in health science then many disease states can be avoided or lessened or recovered from more quickly than if one did not take the above care.
As we all know from reading the information, Billy regularly has overdone things, staying up all hours, exhausting his nervous system, has developed bad habits such as smoking and has had his fair share of personal traumas, not to mention traveled in space and the many experiences that would have affected his physical status.
Robyn |
Adysor
Member
Post Number: 200
Registered: 03-2008
| | Posted on Sunday, November 15, 2009 - 11:38 pm: |
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Hi everyone,
I would like to ask everybody if they can find an example of a truly selfless act.
I thought about this and all I could find is that the only truly selfless act is to sacrifice the self for the survival or well-being (Or continuity)of another person or thing. In other words, give your life for someone else. That is logically the most selfless act because you cannot benefit at all from that action because you are dead.
Other thoughts?
Adrian.
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Borthwey
Member
Post Number: 136
Registered: 09-2007
| | Posted on Monday, November 16, 2009 - 09:13 am: |
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Adrian,
In that case, it can be said that the survival of the other person was in the sacrificed person's interest.
What serves one's interests serves oneself and is therefore not selfless.
I would say that the only selfless act is the one that you can't be made responsible for, either due to external mind control, mental disease, drug intoxication, etc.
I would not define actions committed under slavery or some other form of coercion as selfless, as long as there is still a choice, even if the choice determines the continuation or termination of one's life.
David
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Patm
Member
Post Number: 14
Registered: 07-2006
| | Posted on Monday, November 16, 2009 - 12:10 pm: |
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Adrian. My understanding....
The act described as being selfless.
First an understanding of what an act or action is...
The (RE)ACT(ion) begins with an INTENT created as a result of an initial thought or re-action to another's action(s).
It is the intent that determines the selflessness of the action.
Everything that can be considered self-centered in focus as the intent is a negative intent while everything that can be considered all-centered in focus as the intent is a positive intent. The course of action is the actual physical action generating of energy of same polarity as the intent. The creator of this energy is responsible only for the energy created during this action.
The resulting re-actions each begin with their own intent, action, and resulting creation of energy that each creator of energy is responsible for. (You are responsible for your own actions and re-actions and the resulting energy created. You are NOT responsible for someone elses actions or re-actions and the resulting energy they created.)
How we RE-act to things is as important as the initial actions themselves.
An initial negative intent will generally result in a chain of negative intent reactions from those receiving the effects of the negative energy created
Creation evolves through each of our actions and reactions by the resulting energy created during each and the sum of all polarity of energies created results in the continual evolution of creation.
The conclusion I have come to: A selfless act is an action created with the intent of other than self, resulting in a positive energy creation and hopefully many other positive intent re-actions.
-PatM |
Adysor
Member
Post Number: 201
Registered: 03-2008
| | Posted on Monday, November 16, 2009 - 03:15 pm: |
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Hi David,
"In that case, it can be said that the survival of the other person was in the sacrificed person's interest.
What serves one's interests serves oneself and is therefore not selfless."
What are the interests of a dead person?
I also want to ask you to elaborate, if you can, how are actions under the influence of drugs selfless.
PatM,
"A selfless act is an action created with the intent of other than self, resulting in a positive energy creation and hopefully many other positive intent re-actions."
Can you come up with an example illustrating your definition?
Adrian.
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Patm
Member
Post Number: 15
Registered: 07-2006
| | Posted on Monday, November 16, 2009 - 03:32 pm: |
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I was once told the difference between "white" and "black" magic is where the focus of a coven generating energy is focused as a whole. If the resulting focus of energy is considered self-centered it is considered "black" magic", if the focus of the energy is considered all-centered it is considered "white" magic.
We create magic(energy) in each of our actions.
These actions and the polarity sum of all the energy our physical existence created through our life-time of actions and re-actions generates. The total contribution we have to make to the evolution of creation is based on each instance we create intents to base our actions on and the resulting energy WE create.
-PatM |
Redbeard
Member
Post Number: 147
Registered: 04-2006
| | Posted on Monday, November 16, 2009 - 05:12 pm: |
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One issue I have about the whole martyr issue is the teachings that we are allowed to kill in self defense. If we can justify ending another person's life just to save ours, which according to the teachings is allowed, then it seems a rational conclusion that it is wrong to consciously give your life for another as creation puts a high price on the individual need to be alive and learn. I have a family and I know there are circumstances where I would go into protect mode for without thought for myself.
To do a selfless act would require that there would be no compensation or benefit for the person performing it. The only way that might be possible, and this only in his mind, is that the person performing the act would have to think that the other person being helped will not at all effect the world around him if he is enhanced, helped, benefited or improved.
A selfless act does not exist in that sense as anything that we do and think affects ourselves and others.
Peace, Matt
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Ramirez
Member
Post Number: 325
Registered: 06-2008
| | Posted on Monday, November 16, 2009 - 06:41 pm: |
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Hi PatM,
However in your explanation comes a point .... subjective evaluation of what is a selfless act seeing everyone is at a different stage of evolution, hence understanding of the meaning of concepts.
Intent becomes clearer as persons become more aware of their subconscious motives and drives which generally only develops slowly and gradually over time.
So over the course of a lifetime the definitions you speak of would change in meaning from person to person depending on perspective so it might be argued that Billy has a more refined perspective than say the holy papa to use one example.
Also comes into the equation delusion, self delusion, various states of mental illness, peer pressure etc so the huge variety of differences between individuals makes for a truly interesting world in respect to your explanation.
What is the accepted benchmark and guideline for creating positive energy ?
Cheers.
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Patm
Member
Post Number: 16
Registered: 07-2006
| | Posted on Monday, November 16, 2009 - 10:22 pm: |
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Ramirez,
The Laws and Recommendations of Creation IS the benchmark and guideline. (Search for "Goblet of Truth" or "Kelch der Wahrheit")
-PatM |
Jgarbush
Member
Post Number: 43
Registered: 09-2009
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 17, 2009 - 02:42 am: |
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Adysor,
I hope I'm answering your question right. My best friend is a great example of selfless acts. Just so you know a little about him. He's about 70, a Vietnam vet, and Mormon. I've known this guy since I was fifteen. This guy is the poorest wealthy man I've ever met. His lifestyle is to only keep enough money to pay the basic bills, the rest goes towards helping people. If you even know this guy he will give you the shirt off of his back. He's put his own body on the line just to help someone in need. He doesn't ever ask for anything in return and if you offer to do something for him, he'll turn you down. This guy will help anyone who needs help just because they need it and he doesn't care what your belief of background is. I've seen him work himself into severe illness just to help someone. One of the more recent things I remember as an example is my wedding. When I told him I was getting married he told me he was paying for the whole thing and I didn't even need to worry about anything. Although the wedding itself on cost the both of us less than a hundred and fifty dollars it was a dream wedding. He knew some people that had a chapel and asked the bishop to marry us. We had the post wedding right there in the chapel. He paid for the food and I paid for the license to get married. |
Borthwey
Member
Post Number: 137
Registered: 09-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 17, 2009 - 05:48 am: |
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Adrian,
"What are the interests of a dead person?"
A dead person is a non-person and as such it has no interests. The interests existed while the person existed (when it was alive). That's when it could conceive the termination of its existence for the sake of another.
"I also want to ask you to elaborate, if you can, how are actions under
the influence of drugs selfless."
The actions are selfless because the person becomes just a dummy or a puppet with no will of his/her own. I know that such drugs exist, under the effect of which a person can be made to do anything. My mention of mental disease was also a reference to a loss of conscious control of oneself.
My main point was that what is usually described as selfless is only partially selfless, at most. Real selflessness means a complete absence of will.
David
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Adysor
Member
Post Number: 203
Registered: 03-2008
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 17, 2009 - 11:07 pm: |
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Hi all,
Thanks all for contributing to this...
Please, persons like PatM, the theories and ideas are really nice and all but if you can support your idea with a small and simple example to help visualize, it would be great. Not that I didn't understand what you were trying to say...but ideas are one thing and real life is another.
Jgarbush,
Thanks for your example. In my opinion, what your friend did, and maybe still does, is quite selfless.
And David:
"My main point was that what is usually described as selfless is only partially selfless, at most"
With the help of other posts from the forum members, I have come to a similar conclusion as you. I think that a selfless act, in its perfection, doesn't exists, because that would mean, by definition, the giving-up of the self. But because the self is you, it seems almost stupid to do such a thing.
I have two things to say about Jgarbush's example: First, even what his friend does is selfish to some point. Although he is probably rich, and he gives away his money, he still keeps some for food, basically for survival. And the example that he helps people for stuff like weddings and such, at the cost of his health and probably his life, to me seems crazy and irrational, even a bit stupid. (I mean no offense to your friend, Jgarbush)
So I think that in our world as it is today, there can never be a truly selfless act, but as David said, only partially selfless, because if everybody was to practice selfless actions, all humans would die or be harmed.
Adrian.
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Kingman
Member
Post Number: 692
Registered: 07-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 18, 2009 - 04:53 am: |
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As the Mayans say when meeting a stranger on a path, "I am another you". We are all connected and will eventually realize this truth. Thus any good deed performed for others will always have an effect on the doer.
Adrian,
Your statement;
"....because if everybody was to practice selfless actions, all humans would die or be harmed."
Seems like an awkward idea you pose. I'm sure you are just imagining something I'm not.
a friend in america
Shawn
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Borthwey
Member
Post Number: 138
Registered: 09-2007
| | Posted on Thursday, November 19, 2009 - 03:14 pm: |
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"a selfless act, in its perfection"... selflessness can be good or bad (and therefore not "perfect").
It is good when it means an affirmation of the self (though this sounds like a contradiction).
It is bad when it means one's alienation from him/herself.
David
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Borthwey
Member
Post Number: 139
Registered: 09-2007
| | Posted on Thursday, November 19, 2009 - 03:16 pm: |
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Life happens for the self; the way one interacts with others is not only an outcome of what one is but a way how self is defined. It is, and can be, a way to create oneself according to one's ideal. A person becomes defined by his/her actions. If you create something good, you will be it. What you are, you receive as well because you are it.
Just another way of saying "you get what you give"...
David
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Borthwey
Member
Post Number: 140
Registered: 09-2007
| | Posted on Thursday, November 19, 2009 - 03:24 pm: |
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Alienation from the self can mean a state of virtual death. You live when there is no life.
I know well what that is. I have recovered from it, over the course of several years. I consider it quite a special achievement of mine, how I was able to recognize the cognitions which came sometimes, as if out of thin air, those building blocks of my own life spirit.
A real work of magic, so to speak.
David
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Mgilbo1
Member
Post Number: 100
Registered: 09-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, November 19, 2009 - 06:21 pm: |
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"I would like to ask everybody if they can find an example of a truly selfless act."
If I had a sandwich and I gave half of it to a co-worker because he forgot his lunch, is it selfish because a good feeling came over me? I didn't do it because it would help me win the lottery, I did it because he didn't have any food and he was hungry.
I would say a selfless act is giving and not expecting anything in return, even though you may get something in return emotionally or physically due to your good deed. But just because I receive a good feeling from my deed, doesn't make it selfish.
I always believed this was a type of question selfish people would ask to reassure themselves of their good deed. Hence the question itself could be construed as selfish.
Mark Gilbo
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Adysor
Member
Post Number: 205
Registered: 03-2008
| | Posted on Thursday, November 19, 2009 - 08:22 pm: |
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Right, thanks for the example Mark.
Why didn't you give him the whole sandwich though?
You would die of hunger if you won't keep some for yourself.
"But just because I receive a good feeling from my deed, doesn't make it selfish."
Well, if you did it for the first time, and had no idea of the feeling you were going to get, thus weren't really expecting anything; then no, it isn't a selfish act in my opinion. But to go around and perform selfish acts for the sake of "helping out people" seems to me like you're hooked to the feeling and recognition.
Also, selfish acts can be very unhealthy for the one "helped" because it may jeopardize it's survivability.
What is the purpose of your act? Why couldn't your co-worker make his own sandwich? Let's suppose tomorrow, he might not have something to eat again(he is sure that you have something to eat and might expect you to share with him). And you, out of your selflessness, would share your sandwich again, and again and again. Would you ever stop sharing your sandwich with the same person almost every single day?
Your co-worker would've probably learned by starving for a day of work, that he must bring some food of his own next time, or else he will get hungry again and suffer. By helping him, he might not learn that(I am generalizing).
I also want to mention, that if I were you... I would've felt sorry for the co-worker. Seeing him suffering, I suffer too. So I want to give him some of my sandwich so that I can stop seeing him that way. My feelings are involved, and maybe by chance, his well-being too. Could that be true?
Also, would you share your sandwich with your co-worker if, let's say, he gets promoted to the job you were supposed to have? It would be damn selfless if he would pass the job to you after all the sandwiches you shared with him
A human can perform selfless acts up to the point where his own survival and, in some cases, comfort is threatened by the very act.
Yes? No?
Adrian.
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J_rod7
Member
Post Number: 1117
Registered: 10-2007
| | Posted on Friday, November 20, 2009 - 12:03 pm: |
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*****
Best Greetings to All in Peace,
LOGIC, my friends, use the Logical Reasoning.
There is no such thing as "a selfless act."
Any action precipitated, enabled, or performed BY the Self = includes the Self.
That to which you seek by this question, is to define actions done from Love, Compassion, or Altruism. Actions from these basis are the greatest acts of the Self which contribute to Spiritual Growth.
Peace -- Salome
*****
TRUTH finds WISDOM finds LOVE finds PEACE
Find What You Seek ~ Rod
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Thomas
Member
Post Number: 763
Registered: 03-2004
| | Posted on Friday, November 20, 2009 - 09:29 pm: |
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Hello everyone, I am writing this here because I think it applies to lessons learned and I hope my mistakes will be a good example of what not to do:
I was, until recently, a member of another forum with the same subject matter as this one. I found myself in the middle of a disagreement with someone there and it actually went so far as to cause at least 2 people to leave that board because of the bickering. Though I wasn't alone in the blame, I see now the reason that BEAM doesn't rebut or argue with anyone. It just doesn't help in any way. I once thought that correcting someone else when I had the correct info and they didn't was the right thing to do. I see now that it can be the right thing when the other party is receptive to it. Otherwise it becomes a battle of wills with no favourable outcome for anyone.
I want to apologize for my part of the stupidity on that other board to those of you here who also are members there and also for the same behaviour I have shown here at times. I always meant well and things just went wrong. I would even like to apologize to the other party in the dispute "over there" because, even if I largely disagree with them, that is no reason for me to push back when it does no good.
I want nothing but good things for us all and I hope you will excuse my using this post to apologize for something that should have never happened to begin with...
Thomas
patricksdadinfrance@yahoo.com
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Jgarbush
Member
Post Number: 46
Registered: 09-2009
| | Posted on Saturday, November 21, 2009 - 04:07 am: |
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I've been reading all these posts on Selflessness. I think you guys are going way out there to say that if someone saves something for themselves and gives what they can as a selfish act. Look at animals in the wild. They are hunting and killing their pray. Does that make them selfish because they aren't willing to starve in order to preserve their pray? No, I don't think so. There has to be a line drawn between selfishness and selflessness. I think that if someone or something has enough to survive with surplus that by giving it away still means they are selfish because they weren't willing to starve. A great example. I was 16. A homeless female came up to me begging for food saying she hadn't eaten in a couple of days. I took my allowance and bought her and her boyfriend McDonald's. Does that mean I'm selfish because my parents provided for me and I decided to help, no. Everyone needs to survive, the difference between selfish and selfless is are you willing to hoard what you have even if it takes away from another when you have enough. |
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