Archive through June 03, 2017

Author Message Votan Member Post Number: 793 Registered: 12-2011 Posted on Tuesday, May 30, 2017 - 11:53 pm:        Carolyn Who really knows the truth. Do you.I do not think so. joe Historeed Member Post Number: 142 Registered: 09-2008 Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2017 - 05:05 am:        Carolyn, "I do not believe that Eduard's spirit was in Jmmanuel, who today we call Jesus." What makes you think Billy is lying about this? Matthew Reed Carolyn Member Post Number: 7 Registered: 05-2017 Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2017 - 10:36 am:        Folks, quite simply I know who Jmmanuel is, and he is NOT the SAME person as Eduard Meier. Gosh, Billy can't be EVERYBODY who ever lived and was important, now CAN he? And he MET Jmmanuel, so he himself was NOT Jmmanuel, even if Jmmanuel was his descendant! A time for every purpose under heaven Cpl Member Post Number: 914 Registered: 08-2004 Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2017 - 04:30 pm:        The person today we call Jesus was a fiction or mythological creation made by assembling many of the popular and influential religious and philosophical systems, ideas, religions etc, of the day and combining them into a single mythological being for the then (circa 350AD) hoped for new "universal" (read "Catholic") Church which we know as the Catholic Church. The real person Jmmanuel has nothing to do with the mythological Jesus. Even the name is different. The hard "J" didn't arrive in English until circle 1500. It was still the soft "I" in Shakespeare's time. The mythological name Jesus is the newer version of "Iesu." Again Iesu had nothing to do with Jmmanuel. If you claim the two were the same then such an extraordinary claim requires at least a modicum of evidence. Chris Use to the full both the heart and head and never lose either. Votan Member Post Number: 795 Registered: 12-2011 Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2017 - 08:57 pm:        Carolyn I think you will find that they both had the same spirit form and both could access past lives thru the message bank. joe Joseph_emmanuel Member Post Number: 252 Registered: 05-2004 Posted on Thursday, June 01, 2017 - 04:16 am:        Carolyn, You are correct. Eduard Meier is not/was not Jmmanuel, whose life and teaching was later corrupted to represent the invented religious personality that we know as Jesus Christ. Eduard and Jmmanuel are two completely different personalities. It is a mistake to confuse the two as the same person. That is simply not true. Now with regards to Eduard's spirit form having previously been incarnated in Jmmanuel, we all have no choice but to take this on faith or trust. No one here can prove the validity of this statement by Billy/Eduard. I guess if you accept that he is the prophet of the New Age, then this might not be a problem for you. If I were you, I wouldn't take it so seriously. It isn't important that Eduard's spirit form was incarnated in Jmmanuel. We are told this just so we can comprehend for ourselves the significance of the mission throughout history. That Eduard was able to meet Jmmanuel doesn't mean they didn't/don't share the same spirit form. In fact, Billy was careful to stress that their spirits were the same but different because of their evolutionary level. He gave an example, suggesting that when you look at an old photograph of yourself, although you are the same person, yet you are different because of your evolution. You will have grown and you will have learned and this separates you from your former self. It is the same for the spirit, not to mention that we are talking about the past and not the present, and therefore separate dimensions or time... (something!) Historeed Member Post Number: 144 Registered: 09-2008 Posted on Thursday, June 01, 2017 - 05:03 am:        Carolyn, Of course Billy and Jmmanuel are different people. But the information in the Meier material claims that the spirit-form that inhabited Jmmanuel currently inhabits Billy. Whether or not you choose to believe that is your choice...but please don't claim to know the truth on this unless you have hard evidence to contradict the claims made by Meier which have been backed up with real evidence for over 40 years. Matthew Reed Carolyn Member Post Number: 9 Registered: 05-2017 Posted on Thursday, June 01, 2017 - 09:39 am:        I have from time to time wondered whether the "Father" Jmmanuel prayed to was Nokodemion. And he did say "I and the Father are one (person)". That is where the Christian idea of the Trinity of the Godhead comes from. . . the idea or concept that God exists as three "persons", who are all the same "person": Father, Son and Holy Spirit. In this case, if Nokodemion was the "Father", then what Billy says is true, that they did share the same spirit form, though being of different "personas". Clearly, the Father that Jmmanuel prayed to (see Talmud Jmmanuel please) is NOT the Ischwish Yahweh or Jehovah. A time for every purpose under heaven Joseph_emmanuel Member Post Number: 254 Registered: 05-2004 Posted on Thursday, June 01, 2017 - 02:41 pm:        Without proof, what one person claims in contradiction to the Billy Meier material is as relevant as what another person claims that supports it. Unless a contradictory claim can be refuted it holds up as a legitimate argument. I don't say that to cast doubt on the Billy Meier material. I don't doubt any of it myself. But if there is one thing it is all about besides true knowledge, it is evidence and experience of such knowledge. Tyler Member Post Number: 78 Registered: 03-2017 Posted on Thursday, June 01, 2017 - 05:26 pm:        The proof for Billy having Jmmanuel's spirit form is in the nature of his instruction, because it is a repeat of the old times. Jmmanuel promised that is how we would be able to recognise his return, even though it is technically not him - but just his spirit-form that returned. Billy's instruction is the same kind as Jmmanuel's, because the lessons are exactly the same, only today they are far, far expanded so there is no more room for mistaking their meaning or confusion anymore. There won't be any repeat of Paul. It is not physical proof, you have to figure it out with your brain and your thinking. Actually look at what Billy is teaching, and compare it to what Jmmanuel taught. It is the same teaching, and the effect is the same. It is just that Billy delivers it in the best mode and with the clearest words, and now everything that Jmmanuel explained in parable form is explained fully in expanded texts that have the same meaning. Joseph_emmanuel Member Post Number: 255 Registered: 05-2004 Posted on Thursday, June 01, 2017 - 02:24 pm:        Historeed, Neither can Carolyn claim to know the truth about Billy Meier's spirit form lineage nor can anyone else here who say contrary to what Carolyn is saying. There is no evidence, not of any kind, that shows a connection between Billy Meier's spirit form and Jmmanuel's. She has a right to refuse to believe what she is told, and you have no right to undermine that by suggesting that you know something that she doesn't according to some "hard evidence," because you don't. There is no hard evidence. You take it on faith or trust, just as everyone else here takes it on faith or trust. Kenneth Member Post Number: 686 Registered: 04-2013 Posted on Thursday, June 01, 2017 - 12:32 pm:        Joseph_emmanuel, You hit the preverbal nail on the head with your statement in blog # 252. It would appear that previous conversations between you and Carolyn were intermingling “Spirit Form” incarnations with personalities? Your statement here clears that up as this is only in reference to spirit forms. Just to be clear, it may appear that many on the FIGU forum have swallowed the information from Billy and the Plejaren “hook line & sinker”? It’s perhaps is just that some have studied this information and collaborations for a period of time, consequently many have come to comprehend and recognize the truth in this material. For many, it’s not easy to acknowledge Billy’s information as immediately factual versus previous indoctrinations from various church/bible’s disinformation. For many folks this is a feeling of betrayal and deceit from the church, so to speak. Many of us, including myself had to study long and hard with research of many hours to grasp the truthful significance of Billy’s information. Sincerely Kenneth Joseph_emmanuel Member Post Number: 256 Registered: 05-2004 Posted on Friday, June 02, 2017 - 02:06 am:        Tyler, The proof for Billy having Jmmanuel’s spirit form is NOT in the nature of his instruction. This is not proof of anything. Billy can only prove this fact to himself, through his own inner experiences. He can’t prove it to anyone simply by making this claim. That is not proof. Regardless of Billy’s stature in the FIGU community, there are some things we who have not witnessed and experienced what he has witnessed and experienced must take on trust. The lineage of his spirit form is one, his contact with the Plejarens is another, although there is hard evidence such as photos and footage that suggest he has had “close encounters”. But despite that, I, nor anyone else, can say beyond all doubt that it is true. None of us are witnesses to it. We have no choice but to take it on trust. The hard evidence may be proof of close encounters, but that is all they are proof of. They are not proof of contact, such as we have in the contact reports. Reading material written by him that makes sense to us or to which we feel there is some truth is not proof or evidence of anything. Let’s be realistic about this. Our evolution is not about deceiving ourselves. You said: “Billy's instruction is the same kind as Jmmanuel's, because the lessons are exactly the same.” This is grossly misleading as a statement of proof of Billy’s spirit form having previously been incarnated in Jmmanuel. Again, there is no one here that can prove beyond all doubt that Jmmanuel even existed, never mind whether he is the co-author of the TJ. The only evidence there was of that has been destroyed. We only have Billy’s word of its authenticity. I don’t say that to discredit him. I accept the authenticity of the TJ. But Billy’s word is not proof. People here would do well to have a level of reservation in respect to Billy rather than surrender their thinking to him without question. I don’t see that being done on this forum, despite arguments to the contrary. As for Billy’s instructions being the same kind as Jmmanuel. PLEASE! PLEASE! PLEASE! Let’s be realistic about this. The only written words we have of Jmmanuel was written down by Billy himself. Again I am not disputing the authenticity of the TJ. I accept it as true, but I can’t prove it is true, and neither can you or anyone else. Billy’s instructions are the same kind as Jmmanuel’s because they were written by Billy. That is your evidence. That is all you have to go on. Whatever more you make of it, it is through trust in Billy. That is all. Historeed Member Post Number: 145 Registered: 09-2008 Posted on Friday, June 02, 2017 - 04:40 am:        Joseph_emmanuel, The hard evidence I was referring to are the photos, films & metal samples of beamships that strongly suggest Meier is telling the truth. Of course no one can prove who's spirit form is who...earth scientists currently don't have the technological know how. However, trusting information based on evidence is vastly different than proposing theories based upon one's personal beliefs. Matthew Reed Cpl Member Post Number: 918 Registered: 08-2004 Posted on Friday, June 02, 2017 - 05:31 am:        Interesting question in your post number 9, Carolyn. Gabriel was Jmmanuel's physical father, of course. Then Billy has said, correct me if I am wrong, that all prayers go to the consciousness, rather than the spirit, and Jmmanuel would have known this -- if true. Still, it remains an interesting question with respect to Jmmanuel. Could he have been calling on spiritual power to cope (something the Nokodemion spirit form alone might be capable of), or to Gabriel to help (whom he might have been able to telepathically communicate with?), or to just his consciousness to help him through? It's quite rare for me to find a thought provoking question like this on the forum. Thank you. Chris Use fully to the best both heart and head and never lose either. Carolyn Member Post Number: 13 Registered: 05-2017 Posted on Friday, June 02, 2017 - 05:56 am:        Yes Joseph, so much of ancient records was destroyed on the earth, so that we really have very little "proof" of anything, and even those old records would depend on the truthfulness of the "scribe". . . . the person/s who recorded information. I have often pondered on this: what if all the magical books suddenly just disappeared and we were left to our own devices? What would we do? How would we function? Who would our leaders be? And how quickly would our society disintegrate into senseless barbarism and conformity to the dictates of locals who felt themselves powerful. This is the kind of situation that existed after the collapse of the Roman Empire in Europe. The latin language and everything connected to it collapsed and all that remained of the former glory was retained in a few parchment manuscripts in Rome. The Vatican Library still has some of these most ancient manuscripts and for the most part no one has read them. There is still knowledge extant on the earth to which no one has access, which is not available for the public, and which those who are the keepers of this information guard its secrets. The barbarism of ordinary people is quite clear in the modern times. Their justification of murder in all forms if it serves a political cause: defeat of a foreign government, murder of unborn children for the "rights" of women, exploitation of workers for profit and many more examples. You can never justify mass murder by giving it some kind of "moral" or "ethical" justification, like: We need to win the war against "Nazism" or "Communism" so that we can have "Freedom"! Also, who came up with the myth and the idea that humans are born with "Free Will"? In my own opinion this is a total fallacy. Whatever the "will" is, it is completely bound up with the life of the person, the fragile existence on earth which is fraught with so many perils that an ordinary soul might despair of getting through 50 years of life! And then whatever is "my will" clashes with someone else's "will" and the stronger "will" wins in every case. So it is more about a "test" of wills than any freedom of wills. The human will is bound up with the personality. . . . the more aggressive the personality, the stronger the will. Like my late mother once said, freedom only exists until it clashes with someone else's freedom. Your rights only exist until they trample on mine. You are free only until you make someone else unfree. A time for every purpose under heaven Eddieamartin Member Post Number: 770 Registered: 08-2010 Posted on Friday, June 02, 2017 - 07:52 am:        Joseph_emmanuel, (regarding your post #256) That was an excellent point. What you said is correct and logical. There are some things, such as the lineage of someone's spiritform, or their personal experiences that simply cannot be "proven". Nor is this even necessary. What is up for scrutiny and which can be verified of efficacy or corroboration through recognition in the daily life is the spiritual teaching texts in the Goblet Of The Truth. And just to be clear. The Goblet Of The Truth, which is the teaching of the prophets (all 7 of them) alleges to contain the teaching of the truth, the teaching of the spirit and the teaching of the life. In other words; "The actual reality that actually exists" and not some reality based on religiosity or delusional belief. If there is any charlatanry, it will be exposed in these texts. If indeed these texts are a true window into the actual reality, both from within the mind & consciousness and that of the world and human-interaction then the evidence will present itself. Salome, Eddie In the *Goblet of the Truth* there it says: Live always in love and in peace, foster freedom and harmony on Earth and never forget the real truth. Foster your life always in goodness of heart and live in the true BEING of the Creation. The *Goblet of the Truth* will wake you, not to the bane - but to the boon. (pg.3) Tyler Member Post Number: 80 Registered: 03-2017 Posted on Friday, June 02, 2017 - 02:41 pm:        I really don't get your hostility, or why you feel so hot about this matter, when the proof is in your ability to grasp if you just tried. But to each their own, although all I can say is, you're just mistaken and not aware of all of the factors involved in the whole history of it all that didn't perish just because people have forgotten about it, by the way. But there's probably not going to be any changing your mind at this time, since you appear to be wanting to rally folks up in dissent, so may as well let you, and perhaps we'll lose some of the worst lay-abouts who were never sincere anyway because of your posts, so it should be altogether positive if I estimate rightly. Please continue to tell us in intricate detail why you are certain within your mind that Jmmanuel cannot have possessed the identical spirit-form as Billy's, and we can perhaps have the lay-abouts and aliens finally gone from our place of truth-learning. Tyler Member Post Number: 81 Registered: 03-2017 Posted on Friday, June 02, 2017 - 02:42 pm:        Just know that if you deal with the actual topic someday, and figure out your lapses in understanding and the fill in the holes in your consciousness, you'll still be welcome here again, Joseph, since you are no dummy. Michael_k Member Post Number: 48 Registered: 02-2016 Posted on Friday, June 02, 2017 - 03:06 pm:        Joseph_emmanuel, I'm glad to tell you that it is sooo sweet to observe the clear night sky to get an evidence of the presence of the Plejaren. By luck you can have a daylight evidence. It depend on your inner balance of positive and negative. The presence of our human existence; some losing, some winning!!! Salome Michael Str0323 Member Post Number: 68 Registered: 02-2012 Posted on Friday, June 02, 2017 - 03:49 pm:        Hello, everyone. Billy Meier could offer absolute proof of the truth of EVERYTHING he has taught concerning the spiritual teaching. Yet he has not done this. Why not? The reason can be found in the spiritual teaching. Let's say Billy and the Plejaren decide to pick a human being at random from this forum. They take him or her to the past to meet Jmmanuel. When the trip is over they tell him or her "now go prove to the human beings of earth the truth of your journey". How can he or she accomplish this. Would it matter if the one picked was a world leader or a famous scientist? Salome, Scott Reed. Michael_k Member Post Number: 49 Registered: 02-2016 Posted on Friday, June 02, 2017 - 05:47 pm:        Many people want to fight Billy down, but he said the Geisteslehre folk would rise more and more to conquer the darkness. No matter how hard individuals try to battle it nothing will change the facts. Here is an example how the Creational love and Creational creativity flows through it creations when a person is tune with the Creation Universal Consciousness!!! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-HZrzBHaYtc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2l8Py3Moo5M Put on your headphone and enjoy Creation's creativity. Carolyn Member Post Number: 14 Registered: 05-2017 Posted on Saturday, June 03, 2017 - 07:55 am:        I had a strange experience as I listened to the audio of the contact reports when Eduard went back in time to meet Jmmanuel. I could see the whole scene play itself out in my mind, as if I was there watching too, but looking through a translucent veil as it were. I saw Jmmanuel and his friends walking up a dusty road, sun high in the sky and heard them conversing as they approached, greeting Eduard and his Russian friend who had hitched a ride. . . . saw Asket looking very tense and worried. There seemed to be other people there too, watching, but they like me were behind some kind of translucent veil, so they could hardly be seen. Then in my mind, still watching through a translucent veil, I heard the conversation, little of which I understood. Jmmanuel seemed to greet Billy as an old friend which whom he was well acquainted. Since that time, which is about two years, and working in the Catholic church as an organist and musician, I have spent much thought thinking about that encounter and my vision of it, as if I had been there myself and watched the whole thing. It's kind of like having a memory of a movie you watched in the cinema, which gripped you very strongly. I have not the slightest doubt that Eduard did go back in time and meet Jmmanuel. What vision that was that I saw in my mind's eye I'm still working on sorting out! A time for every purpose under heaven

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