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Message |
   
Bianca
Member
Post Number: 36
Registered: 03-2009
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 16, 2009 - 06:38 am: | 
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Thanks Robyn, what an interesting collection of articles, if only more people read this site? I will surely pass it on. [how do you find those interesting websites?]
BTW, for those who live in OZ, I would like to suggest to write to the PM as he has a website and an area where people can write their ideas/gripes/suggestions etc. I already did and naturally mentioned the problem with Over Population and its current and future consequences. The more people write cordially the more ripples will be created. |
Sanjin
Member
Post Number: 48
Registered: 06-2009
| | Posted on Thursday, September 17, 2009 - 11:35 am: |
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Borthwey,
According to the excerpt, the 12 persons per square kilometer takes into account the preservation of animals. What I don't understand is how arable land should be calculated, if the current organizations are doing it properly, and also if we should take into account the potential arable land.
I really don't think that eliminating the rain forests to create arable land should be counted in the figure. But animal and plants should also not be overpopulated, so there has to be a certain balance between all the life-forms and their needs.
It looks to be quite important to have this AA excerpt translated, so I'll work on it this weekend.
36.The human is another person, when, surrounded by the rays of the heavenly creational sunrise, the pure delight of awakening nature streams through him.
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Stephen_moore
Member
Post Number: 158
Registered: 01-2009
| | Posted on Saturday, September 19, 2009 - 08:18 pm: |
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Hi All,
The impact of Overpopulation and the results are as follows:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/datablog/2009/sep/02/world-population-growth-resources-control
Excerpt-
It's intuitive that more people require more resources and use more energy, but when you consider many countries are still developing, it explains why the relationship between the two isn't linear. For example, China's population rose by 15% between 1990 and 2005, yet energy usage nearly doubled.
While China is currently the most populous country on the planet, projections show that it will be overtaken by India in 2028. Both countries will account for around a third of the global population.
Water shortage threatens two million people in southern Iraq -
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/aug/26/water-shortage-threat-iraq
Excerpt -
A water shortage described as the most critical since the earliest days of Iraq's civilisation is threatening to leave up to 2 million people in the south of the country without electricity and almost as many without drinking water.
An already meagre supply of electricity to Iraq's fourth-largest city of Nasiriyah has fallen by 50% during the last three weeks because of the rapidly falling levels of the Euphrates river, which has only two of four power-generating turbines left working.
If, as predicted, the river falls by a further 20cm during the next fortnight, engineers say the remaining two turbines will also close down, forcing a total blackout in the city.
Nile Delta: 'We are going underwater. The sea will conquer our lands' -
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2009/aug/21/climate-change-nile-flooding-farming
Asia facing unprecedented food shortage, UN report says -
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/aug/17/asia-facing-food-crisis
Excerpt -
Asia faces an unprecedented food crisis and huge social unrest unless hundreds of billions of dollars are invested in better irrigation systems to grow crops for its burgeoning population, according to a UN report published today.
India, China, Pakistan and other large countries avoided famines in the 1970s and 1980s only because they built giant state-sponsored irrigation systems and introduced better seeds and fertilisers. But the extra 1.5 billion people expected to live on the continent by 2050 will double Asia's demand for food, says the report from the UN's Food and Agriculture Organisation (FAO) and the World Bank-funded International Water Management Institute (IWMI).
A combination of very little new land left for cultivation, an increasingly unpredictable climate and water supplies stretched to the limit means the only realistic option to feed people in the future will be better management of existing water supplies, according to the report.
"There is no new land or water to develop so we have to make more use of what we have. Existing irrigation systems are often 50 to 70 years old. They are leaking and water is evaporating. We urgently need a new generation of irrigation. That is the only way we are going to feed everyone," said Colin Chartres, who is the director general of IWMI.
Droughts and floods threaten China's economic growth, forecaster warns -
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jun/30/china-climate-change-warning
Excerpt -
China faces an increase in weather disasters which will threaten crops and economic growth, the country's most senior forecaster has warned.
He Lifu, of the National Meteorological Centre, told the China Daily newspaper that events such as droughts, floods and storms had become more frequent and severe since the 1990s and the trend was likely to continue.
"Extreme weather will be more frequent in the future due to the instability of the atmosphere, and global warming might be the indirect cause," the forecaster told the English-language paper. He said his agency responded to 16 emergencies last year, the most since its foundation in 1949.
-- I have more --
My new Website address - www.ufofacts.co.cc
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Phenix
Member
Post Number: 297
Registered: 07-2008
| | Posted on Saturday, September 19, 2009 - 11:38 pm: |
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Greeting the forum and our moderators,
Stephen_moore,
Thanks for your research and for sharing.
With your permission, we shall insert the highly relevant information and links you provided on the issue of water/drought in the response we are currently preparing - in the framework of the overpopulation awareness campaign and world wide democratic birth control promotion - to the stance of the Ministry of Environment and Water Resources of Singapore, the officials of which half agree with us, but argue that the growth of the population is necessary to the growth and overall sustainability of their national economy.
Salome. |
Stephen_moore
Member
Post Number: 159
Registered: 01-2009
| | Posted on Sunday, September 20, 2009 - 12:45 pm: |
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Hi Phenix
Yes, by all means you can use the information/links I have posted on here. Listed below is some more links/info you might find use full.
Australia's largest river close to running dry - http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/apr/16/australia-river-murray-drought
excerpt -
Australia's biggest river is running so low that Adelaide, the country's fifth-largest city, could run out of water in the next two years.
The Murray river is part of a network of waterways that irrigates the south-eastern corner of Australia, but after six years of severe drought, the worst dry spell ever, its slow moving waters are now almost stagnant.
Water levels in the Murray in the first three months of this year were the lowest on record and the government agency that administers the river, the Murray-Darling Basin Authority (MDBA), said the next three months could be just as grim.
With meteorologists predicting another year of below-average rainfall, the MDBA, is bracing for worse to come.
Bolivia: water people of Andes face extinction - http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/apr/24/andes-tribe-threat-bolivia-climate-change
excerpt -
Its members belong to what is thought to be the oldest surviving culture in the Andes, a tribe that has survived for 4,000 years on the barren plains of the Bolivian interior. But the Uru Chipaya, who outlasted the Inca empire and survived the Spanish conquest, are warning that they now face extinction through climate change.
The tribal chief, 62-year-old Felix Quispe, 62, says the river that has sustained them for millennia is drying up. His people cannot cope with the dramatic reduction in the Lauca, which has dwindled in recent decades amid erratic rainfall that has turned crops to dust and livestock to skin and bones.
"Over here used to be all water," he said, gesturing across an arid plain. "There were ducks, crabs, reeds growing in the water. I remember that. What are we going to do? We are water people."
The Uru Chipaya, who according to mythological origin are "water beings" rather than human beings, could soon be forced to abandon their settlements and go to the cities of Bolivia and Chile, said Quispe. "There is no pasture for animals, no rainfall. Nothing. Drought."
India prays for rain as water wars break out - http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jul/12/india-water-supply-bhopal
excerpt -
In Bhopal, and across much of northern India, a late monsoon and the driest June for 83 years are exacerbating the effects of a widespread drought and setting neighbour against neighbour in a desperate fight for survival.
India's vast farming economy is on the verge of crisis. The lack of rain has hit northern areas most, but even in Mumbai, which has experienced heavy rainfall and flooding, authorities were forced to cut the water supply by 30% last week as levels in the lakes serving the city ran perilously low.
Colorado river running on empty by 2050 - http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2009/jul/28/network-usa
excerpt-
In 2000 reservoirs fed by the river were at 95 per cent of capacity. In 2009 they had dropped to 59 per cent of capacity.
If climate change results in a 10 per cent reduction in the Colorado River's average stream flows, as some recent studies predict, the chances of fully depleting reservoir storage will exceed 25 per cent by 2057.
Almost 4 million Kenyans on food aid as drought deepens - http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/sep/17/kenya-drought-cattle-deaths
excerpt-
There is also a serious water shortage, with some neighbourhoods in Nairobi going without for weeks at a time. One reason is drought, but the destruction of water catchment areas – in some cases with the encouragement of the authorities – has not helped. With the electricity supply largely dependent of hydropower, low dam levels have also led to widespread power rationing.
----
I have other links to climate change, ice melting, food shortages etc. I dont want to clog up this forum with loads and loads of links so I think I will put them on a seperate page on my website.
Its somewhat good that "the officials of which half agree with us, but argue that the growth of the population is necessary to the growth and overall sustainability of their national economy" but of course money is still what drives every country. Convincing them that the Earth is more important then money is a hard part.
Thanks
My new Website address - www.ufofacts.co.cc
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Phenix
Member
Post Number: 298
Registered: 07-2008
| | Posted on Sunday, September 20, 2009 - 01:00 pm: |
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A hard part, indeed!
Thanks, Stephen; i shall drop by.
Salome.
Adam(aepsilonm@hotmail.com) |
Earthling
Member
Post Number: 291
Registered: 05-2008
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 22, 2009 - 04:45 am: |
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http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=CNG.506b7104e85d35fc4f8355e566ab5fad.261&show_article=1
Population growth driving climate change, poverty: experts
Sep 21 01:41 PM US/Eastern
Unchecked population growth is speeding climate change, damaging life-nurturing ecosystems and dooming many countries to poverty, experts concluded in a conference report released Monday.
Unless birth rates are lowered sharply through voluntary family-planning programmes and easy access to contraceptives, the tally of humans on Earth could swell to an unsustainable 11 billion by 2050, they warned. |
Syn
Member
Post Number: 224
Registered: 04-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 22, 2009 - 08:31 am: |
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then again we have poverty because of money.
They must find it difficult...Those who have taken authority as the truth, rather then the truth as the authority
-Gerald Massey
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Bronzedesk
Member
Post Number: 38
Registered: 01-2009
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 22, 2009 - 11:37 am: |
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Funny,
I find that the hardest part of all this, is to finally come to the conclusion/realization that we are the only Planet in this whole solar system that cannot afford or even share it's own prosperity!
Go figure....
First you forget names, then you forget faces. Next you forget to pull your zipper up and finally, you forget to pull it down. George Burns
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Sanjin
Member
Post Number: 54
Registered: 06-2009
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 22, 2009 - 12:14 pm: |
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Cpl was right when he noted that "arable" was not the proper wording used in the AA excerpt. The proper term is "fertile".
But even though a rain forests can be considered fertile land, one can not create arable land from it, as evident in many of the deforested areas. The land basically becomes a wasteland.
So, I don't quite understand how this fits in with the calculation, yet...
My current guess is that fertile is meant as in "possible for cultivation", which is basically what arable means.
36.The human is another person, when, surrounded by the rays of the heavenly creational sunrise, the pure delight of awakening nature streams through him.
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Cpl
Member
Post Number: 495
Registered: 08-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 22, 2009 - 08:02 pm: |
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"Fertile" means "abundantly productive" and "capable of growth."
"Cultivated" land is land "prepared and used for growing crops or gardening."
It may help to see cultivated land as very fertile land.
There is plenty of fertile land that will never be cultivated for various reasons. One example: heath lands are fertile but not suitable for cultivation. Another: the African savanna, some of which may be cultivatable while other areas are not. They are not that fertile. Cultivatable land is abundantly fertile, so much so that it can be cultivated.
Bogs, and as Sanjin points out, forests, and even greener slopes of mountainous terrain, are fertile but not suitable for cultivation.
Also anywhere where plants or animals can live and grow is fertile land. The forests are very fertile but we would all be dead from eating ourselves out of house, home and life long before we cultivated it all, even if that were possible, which, of course, it is not.
A vast amount of fertile yet uncultivated land is necessary for the ecosystem. This fertile yet uncultivated land still produces essential gasses like oxygen to maintain our and the planet's proper health and eco-balance and supports the life of other fauna.
Smaller lifeforms are also essential to the ecosystem. It is the life of the entire planet that is under consideration, not just we humans, who actually make up a pretty limited part of the planetary living organism. We are not the only living ones with the capability of traveling and moving around that have a right to existence, though the work of our hands and feet carry the biggest impact.
I'm looking at Billy's wallpaper UFO pic right now and it examples again that there is fertile land on these Swiss slopes, acres and acres of it, but it is not all cultivatable.
This photo shows what appears to be fertile natural grassland together with cultivated woodland which is also fertile.
Here's some more fertile but uncultivated land.
So, it's not at all just about what we can cultivate.
"Fertile" should keep this discussion on track. Hope this makes it a little clearer.
Thank you for checking up the vocab Sanjin.
Chris
Use to the full both your heart and your head; and never lose either.
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Phenix
Member
Post Number: 299
Registered: 07-2008
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 23, 2009 - 02:02 am: |
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Good day,
Earthling,
You might want to take a look at this thread: http://www.projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?t=12538&page=7
The information '"Population growth driving climate change, poverty: experts"', which you kindly provided on tuesday - and which i posted there - is being passionately discussed there.
It is located at about 2/3 of the page.
In my opinion, participant 'KathyT' is doing fairly good.
Thanks for sharing,
Salome. |
Ramirez
Member
Post Number: 280
Registered: 06-2008
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 23, 2009 - 09:55 am: |
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Oh yes, the gang seem to be there 
This series as Phenix indicated Kathy T recommends is a classic ...... Part 1 0f 8 linked below.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-QA2rkpBSY&feature=related
Cheers.
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Stephen_moore
Member
Post Number: 162
Registered: 01-2009
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 23, 2009 - 01:11 pm: |
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J_rod7,
When sending you a email with the other overpopulation group (Adam etc)your email bounces back to me. I have looked into this and for some reason the IP address for tampabay.rr.com was blocked in my ISP.
I have requested the IP address be removed from the block list of my ISP. This could take up to 10 hours.
Sorry, you obviously not receiving any mails from me when I am contacting the whole group.
Thanks
My new Website address - www.ufofacts.co.cc
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Michael_horn
Member
Post Number: 42
Registered: 07-2009
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 23, 2009 - 02:59 pm: |
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Interesting correlation, worth thinking about:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB125356566517528879.html?mod=yhoofront |
Tjames
Member
Post Number: 310
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 23, 2009 - 09:37 pm: |
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Hey Mike,
Very interesting! Obama baby boom just what we need! I have noticed this trend as well.
Salome gam nan been urda gan njber hasala hesporona!
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Rarena
Member
Post Number: 483
Registered: 10-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, September 24, 2009 - 10:23 am: |
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Ramirez,
Albert A. Bartlett's video makes some clear,compelling and succinct logical explanations, the eight videos are very interesting and logical.
As to overpopulation his idea that oil production peaked in 1970 and that agriculture is the science of producing food from oil, that coupled with overpopulation... cannot, under *any* circumstance maintain sustainability... a frequent buzzword of the bike path promoters wanting to save the world...
He quotes Gallileo: given sense, reason and intellect which must be adhered to and why would any god want us to do otherwise?
Audious Huxley in that the facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored.
H. L. Mencken in that humans reject what is true but unpleasent... yet, embrace what is obviously false, but comforting...
Also interesting his idea that:
The chief source of our problems is their solutions...
He makes the conclusion that population and overpopulation is one of the main causes of nearly every problem we must now endure.
There is not much to dissagree with here.
Thanks for posting the link. |
Eric
New member
Post Number: 3
Registered: 06-2009
| | Posted on Thursday, September 24, 2009 - 10:00 pm: |
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Hi Ramirez
Wow!
Thousands thanks for your link of Dr Bartlett video.
This is a truely REMARKABLE exposé, inescapable in it conclusions.
To claim Sustainability without zero population growth is INTELLECTUALLY DISHONEST.
To promote sustained population growth is profondly STUPID.
The economists are the most IMBELISTIC and IDIOTIC humans on earth.(i can`t find strong enough words to describe them)
Eric |
Edward
Member
Post Number: 1478
Registered: 05-2002
| | Posted on Friday, September 25, 2009 - 01:58 am: |
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Hi Michael....
Still....a very interesting insight!
Well, there are couples whom literally Calculate to the birth month of their
child to be...before they start their act of conception. So, they know...when
about, the child will be born.
Perhaps, the above mention could become a good habit for couples??
But than perhaps, there is no passion, love, spontaneity or whatever...in
their conception act, here.....?
Edward. |
Sanjin
Member
Post Number: 57
Registered: 06-2009
| | Posted on Friday, September 25, 2009 - 01:37 pm: |
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Cpl, thanks for bringing up that information, because that got me to do more research. By including all that land, it throws off the calculation, and I came to the final conclusion that there is no exact English word for "fruchtbar". Although most dictionaries translate it as fertile, and it was previously used on this board as "fertile", it is not the same. The German word fruchtbar expresses -able to bear many fruits-, kind of like fruit-able.
The intensity of the word is somewhere between fertile and fruitful. So as initially noted, arable is actually the closest English word to use for this. One difference is that this word expresses plow-able, but it mostly refers to the same kind of land.
PS, the translation for the AA excerpt is about half way done.
36.The human is another person, when, surrounded by the rays of the heavenly creational sunrise, the pure delight of awakening nature streams through him.
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Peacelovefreedom
Member
Post Number: 8
Registered: 04-2008
| | Posted on Friday, September 25, 2009 - 02:38 pm: |
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Thanks a lot for the information about the relationship between the maximum population per area. I found the biointensive method of farming accomodates 4000 sq feet per person. The link:http://www.growbiointensive.org/grow_main.html, and on the page you would like to click "grow soil and grow food in the smallest space."
I don't know if this information goes with 12 people in one kilometer square. But that is the data some people on earth found only concerning with vegetable food production. Thank you.
By the way,knowing what Mr. Meier and his allies are telling us the method to decrease population, how do you discuss with this issue with your friends who do not know about this overpopulation issue? And how do you tell what is the best solution to this issue?
Have you found any good strategy to discuss with people who is skeptical about overpopulation and also it's solution proposed by Mr. Meier?
When my friends ask a lot of questions how I arrived that conclusion Mr. Meier's approach is right, I am not sure I can explain it well.
Please give some advice on this issue, and share your experience with talking about overpopulation issue with your friends who do not know Mr. Meier or being skeptical about information transmitted from extra terrestrial human beings. |
Michael_horn
Member
Post Number: 43
Registered: 07-2009
| | Posted on Friday, September 25, 2009 - 04:16 pm: |
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Would fructable work?
Is it recognized as a real word? |
Cpl
Member
Post Number: 495
Registered: 08-2004
| | Posted on Friday, September 25, 2009 - 10:10 pm: |
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Hmm "fructable " is not an entry in the Shorter EOD.
The word for "able to bear fruit" would be fructiferous, which is a correct word meaning "Bearing or producing fruit" (Shorter Oxford English Dictionary).
There is also fructuous which is probably the better word, including as it does, the meanings "Of a plant bearing much fruit, prolific;" and "fertile (of soil)".
Fructuous then, or possibly fructiferous, looks the best candidate to me.
Chris
Use to the full both your heart and your head; and never lose either.
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