Archive through June 15, 2007

Author Message Thomas Member Post Number: 258 Registered: 03-2004 Posted on Friday, May 11, 2007 - 02:34 am:        The time travel section is here. In response to the posts directed at me in reference to time travel, first, bringing something into the past or future is not changing it. If the thing in question was ever going to be brought into the past or the future, it WAS ALREADY going to happen due to cause and effect. The future, for example, is not predetermined completely BUT the actions of the present and the past DO reach into the future. This means that the future is not fixed, but that it does have certain constraints. So if events are going to have to unfold in a certain way, then they will. I know this sounds confusing but basically it means that no law of causality is broken by time travel and bringing things into other times. If doing a specific thing could cause a real paradox, then it would already be made impossible by a cause and effect cancellation. I don't know a better way to say it... Jakes Member Post Number: 117 Registered: 10-2006 Posted on Friday, May 11, 2007 - 12:15 pm:        Hello Thomas, I think I understand what you're saying. For time-travelers from the future to bring a flash light into the past is no big deal as it won't significantly alter the future. But to bring a nuclear bomb into the past to blow up some future enemy wouldn't be permitted, perhaps for two reasons. One being the technology for a nuclear bomb wouldn't be permitted (in the past) before its time is ripe; the other being that no one so insufficiently evolved as to want to go into the past to try and change it would be permitted the technology of time travel. Is this how you see it? Cpl Member Post Number: 249 Registered: 08-2004 Posted on Friday, May 11, 2007 - 10:40 pm:        Time Traveling & Why the Past Cannot be Changed I see no reason in theory why a nuclear bomb couldn't be taken into the past and exploded creating a different global outlook from that point on. But the new global reality would be a new timeline. It would not be the one we are on, because it didn't happen on our timeline. The exploders of the bomb would then have to decide which timeline to return on; ours, where their action is not felt because it did not occur (meaning they have to hop off their newly created timeline leaving it behind, so why bother in the first place?) or the new one they created where the future is actually unknown as to how things will have developed -- very risky, and defeating the purpose of creating a prescribed set of conditions in the future because they will not know how the new timeline actually develops in all details. Also, the time travelers would be the only ones going into that new timeline from where we are. This, of course, again negates the very purpose of taking the bomb back and using it, unless only the time travelers wanted to change the past and create a new timeline for only themselves. This would be like a form of time emigration where the participants only would start anew at that new point in the past (or take a chance on what the future will be like in the new world timeline they created by hopping forward on it). IMO this is the only kind of traveling into the past and changing it that will be encountered, if any. But it’s most unlikely ever to happen. Who would want to start anew in a past time when they think everything through? Perhaps only those with no future hope; those who have come up against some unsolvable problem like the planet is aging and will not be able to support life in the future e.g. Even so my bet is that such advanced beings that could travel through time would rather travel through space than time to find a new home and start anew. Who would want to go back and start life on a lesser-evolved frequency level that an earlier time presents – assuming one could actually incarnate at such a lower frequency which may be another major problem making it a useless venture? It seems to me that traveling back in time with an attempt to start anew would be the dumber move, and one an advanced species would not opt for. Perhaps a species suffering from their own devolution might try to go back, if the cause was related to something in their past. They might then be able to take a different course and timeline in an attempt to overcome their own devolution. But that would not be changing the past; it would just be creating a new timeline for them to live on as emigrants in time. The present timeline cannot be changed by going back. The past of any timeline occurred. Period. All traveling back and doing something would achieve is the creation of a new timeline – if the change were that radical. This is the way I see it, and why we do not see time travelers continuously hopping throughout time attempting to change all the unsavory past events from the past, or tune up their present in their own eyes -- it's simply a useless and impossible venture. There are currently one or two purported groups of travelers from our future coming back here and trying to do things, though for the most part their purposes are unknown -- and, of course, there is no proof of the accuracy of these reports. One group is purported to be interacting to assist our evolution, and philosophically I see no reason why this should not occur. It would though, predestine our future species to return at some point to assist in the evolution of 20th and 21st century humans on Earth. cpl Francofiori2004 Member Post Number: 25 Registered: 03-2007 Posted on Saturday, May 12, 2007 - 02:37 am:        There is no such things as "new timelines". If someone from the future exploded a bomb in the past, this already happened and the present (our present, the ONLY present) is what came from that explosion and all the rest in the past. An amazing invention for natural health: WWW.GETPERFECTBODY.COM Truthseeker Member Post Number: 246 Registered: 03-2003 Posted on Saturday, May 12, 2007 - 07:23 am:        Cpl, YES! you got it, but there is still more too it. Franconfiori2004, YES there is such a thing as "New Time lines" as this was already stated in an answer, in a question to Billy. Savio Senior Member Post Number: 572 Registered: 07-2000 Posted on Saturday, May 12, 2007 - 09:51 am:        Hi James No, Billy never agreed to this "New Time Lines" thing Salome Savio Truthseeker Member Post Number: 249 Registered: 03-2003 Posted on Saturday, May 12, 2007 - 02:47 pm:        Greetings Savio, Actually it was Christian who made reference to it in regard to a question to Billy. Salome, James Truthseeker Cpl Member Post Number: 253 Registered: 08-2004 Posted on Saturday, May 12, 2007 - 06:24 pm:        Hi Francofiori, Can you explain how you "know" there are no such things as other timelines. The Plejaren say they live in a time-shifted reality -- another way of saying another timeline. The Ps also took Billy on a trip to an alternative earth. This might be another timeline for our earth, or perhaps it is just a permanent alternative? It was, if I remember correctly, about 500 years in the future, but slightly different from what we will experience. Even when Billy traveled to the future San Francisco and brought back actual photos that others, including Wendelle Stevens saw, he was told it, the future (San Francisco), would be a little different every time if they were to travel there again. Both these experiences are written up in the English hardcover Contact Notes by Wendelle Stevens. IMO there are myriads of possibilities for timelines. We are creating them all the time with the decisions we make. People have free will, and can therefore choose and decide as they will, which is why when traveling through time one can always end up on a slightly different timeline. It also explains why making a specific future from manipulating the past can be actually impossible (depending perhaps on degree and content): subtle changes (or perhaps even bigger ones) would occur during the time/space between the manipulated past and the future the would-be manipulators came from, because people again can -- and would -- make their own decisions and decide differently; all the time, anytime. You could, therefore, perhaps never guarantee a specific detailed created future outcome 100%. IMO the easiest and best way is creating it from the here and now. BTW FYI I've posted on Predictions, Prophecies, Premonitions, and Presentiments under the Dream section of this forum. It covers seeing into the future rather than traveling there. But perhaps the mind or consciousness does in a sense travel there at such times, or maybe it just looks in. Kind regards, Cpl Jakes Member Post Number: 118 Registered: 10-2006 Posted on Saturday, May 12, 2007 - 07:19 pm:        I would like to suggest that as soon as time-travel technology is developed, the first thing we do is go back before Jmmanuel’s time and smoke the Giza people with a nuclear weapon or something even more deadly. Then the foothold over the earth people that the Giza held and the religions and other havoc they created would never have existed. And in our time we could enjoy a world in harmony with creation. Sweet! Only problem is it can’t happen because it’s against the laws of nature. Cpl Member Post Number: 256 Registered: 08-2004 Posted on Sunday, May 13, 2007 - 06:25 am:        Hi Jakes, I wonder if you could explain for the benefit of others how it is against the laws of nature to do what you "suggest" rather than just saying it is so. It is difficult to know exactly what you are thinking or how you are concluding this and by extension how to discuss it with you. I'd suggest that your proposed action, assuming it could be done, would merely create another timeline different from the one we are on. So what would be the point in doing it? Our past is the experience of Creation and that cannot be erased, our present too, though we can use the present to create a new future to our liking if we get down to it. IMO it is illogical for Creation to have any of its experience erased, but not necessarily so to have it added to. That which “was” always will be a “was”, somewhere. To suggest or propose that that which “was” “wasn't” is certainly illogical and against all reason. The Giza folks were not the only reason we have problems here. They may have created many, but there is still that which we are responsible for ourselves. Then there's the faulty genes that are, and still would be, running amok till we fix them, even without the Giza's history on this planet. The great opportunity we have is to accept the seeming insurmountable obstacles we have in life as our challenges, and then surmount them. That’s real progress. That’s real development and evolution. Blaming others for our plight, though one can always justify that if one wants, short changes us in the areas of challenges, progress, and evolution. The greatest of progress and evolution comes from successfully rising to the most difficult challenges. I think everyone would agree with your implication that we would all be a lot better off had they not been here. We have sure learnt a lot from them though, painful as it was, and those lessons we learnt do serve us in our development. But maybe you're not being serious, just having a little fun or joke here? It does pay to keep a sense of humor. :-) Best, Cpl Francofiori2004 Member Post Number: 29 Registered: 03-2007 Posted on Sunday, May 13, 2007 - 07:28 am:        Cpl, Plejaren don't live in a "new" timeline, but onlu in a "different" timeline. I mean their timeline didn't "pop up" from our because of time travel action. Instead, it simply has always been a different timeline, a different world. So you cannot change the present, the past or the future by time travel, that's the point. An amazing invention for natural health: WWW.GETPERFECTBODY.COM Jakes Member Post Number: 119 Registered: 10-2006 Posted on Sunday, May 13, 2007 - 08:47 am:        Hello Cpl, I think the answer you ask for is here in a recent question to Billy from James. Q: Billy, thank you for answering my previous two questions, although I think they have been misinterpreted. I do not dispute that the past is unchangeable; what I would like to learn is how creations laws work to ensure history cannot be changed. For example, if a human is determined to alter history and gets into their beamship to do a time warp into the past, will the beamship and its occupant be destroyed before they could move through to that time, or will they have another kind of accident such as being killed by lightning or an erupting volcano. So my question is, other than obviously failing in their attempt to change the unchangeable past, what can creations laws do to stop the human from changing the past? ________________________________________ A: As long as human beings are trying to illogically change the past, they are not evolved enough to be able to carry out time travel into the past. It’s the law of cause and effect which makes it impossible to change anything that has already happened. (Note by CF: If you break a pencil you cannot jump back in time for a few seconds and decide to not break it. What could be possible, theoretically, is that you are sitting on a chair and have just decided to break a pencil. In that instant a person appears at your side, from out of nothing, grasps the pencil from your hand and vanishes again. This person was you from your own future, one year ahead when you decided to jump back in time one year in order to take away the pencil from you and prevent you to break it. Note, you did not break the pencil in the past, but you could find the pencil in the future, one year after the incident. Of course nobody who is capable of time traveling would do such an nonsensical and silly act. Therefore this is an experiment that is occurring in our minds only. What do we learn from this? It is important that we have control over our thoughts, feelings and actions, because if a thought has been sent, or a hurting word been uttered, you can never take it back and make it unsaid or „unthought“! Cpl Member Post Number: 257 Registered: 08-2004 Posted on Sunday, May 13, 2007 - 10:10 am:        Hi Franco, I see what you mean and agree entirely. This is also what I said, the Ps live on a timeline, a different one from ours. Sure, it didn't come from ours. I said "If" you could go back and attempt to change something and could do something, you wouldn't be changing anything. It would just be starting something new -- if. Regarding timelines: The Ps have said that each time you travel to the same place and time in the future it will be slightly different. This means there are always different timelines going out from any point of time into the future. The differences may not be radical and only slight, but they show things have evolved slightly differently each time. That shows evolution along slightly different timelines. Otherwise, it would always be the same when arriving. Best, cpl Truthseeker Member Post Number: 250 Registered: 03-2003 Posted on Sunday, May 13, 2007 - 03:31 pm:        And from what I understand and heard, according to Christian and from Guido's book. These other time lines in reference to our own are known as "Artificial Time Lines". Gib_niner Member Post Number: 17 Registered: 06-2006 Posted on Sunday, May 13, 2007 - 04:50 pm:        this is just priceless...made me giggle more than a bit.... http://www.metacafe.com/watch/315818/the_time_traveller/ they don't even tell you how he returns to present time - comical! Still - gets one to wonder about what it would be like to actually encounter yourself like that in real terms - that both spirits can meet up - regardless of the fact that the respective spirit forms inhabiting the bodies are of the same spirit lineage. a mind-boggling possibility - no question about it - Still trying to get my head around it - that this could be possible according to billy's teachings..??? It just seems to somehow rob the an individual spirt form of its own special...'absolute uniqueness' - irrespective of the fact that its the same spirit 'lineage' - thats what i think anyway. ok saalome.. Gib. Scott Moderator Post Number: 1195 Registered: 12-1999 Posted on Sunday, May 13, 2007 - 07:15 pm:        Hi Gib, As I understand it, the spirit form is never the same from moment to moment. So it may be said the spirit form no matter which time period it finds itself in, still has the same origin at the same time it is not what it was or will be what it is. Regards Scott Thomas Member Post Number: 259 Registered: 03-2004 Posted on Monday, May 14, 2007 - 12:00 am:        James, I have have Guido's book Flugreisen durch Zeit und Raum and I don't recall reading anything along the lines of "artificial timelines" so please tell me where that is mentioned... Thanks! Thomas Truthseeker Member Post Number: 254 Registered: 03-2003 Posted on Monday, May 14, 2007 - 07:06 am:        Greetings Thomas, OK thanks for the heads up. I seem to remeber reading the reference for artificial timelines somewhere here on this forum, but for some reason I can't seem to find it again. Thomas Member Post Number: 263 Registered: 03-2004 Posted on Monday, May 14, 2007 - 09:57 am:        For Jakes, the way I understand the prevention of paradoxes is this: If something can cause a paradox later on, then it is prevented before it occurs because of the laws of cause and effect. In other words, if you want to do something now that will set into motion a possible paradox later, even if it is via time travel, then that thing can't be completed because if it were, the "now" wouldn't exist! Even if the future and the present do not exist simultaneously, they DO still affect each other by cause and effect INDIRECTLY. Sorry for the late response... Thomas Member Post Number: 268 Registered: 03-2004 Posted on Saturday, May 19, 2007 - 12:18 am:        Hey everybody, I think I finally found a good analogy for time travel into the past as far as changing the past, etc. Think of a computer. If it is programmed properly, it will carry out its programming completely logically. If you think of a program that takes in information continuously and then processes it to give some kind of output later, then you will have an analogy to time travel. For example, while the program is running, you know that putting a specific bit of info into the running program is later on going to lead to a specific output. Once the input has happened, you can't take it out again even if you stop the program and go back and re-run it with different info. The original output has already happened! The computer is like Creation/the universe. The program is like the laws of nature. The input that you put into the running program is the "present". You can see by this analogy that the output of the program (the future) can already be determined by looking at what is currently being input into the program at the present. The past has already happened (previous input) and so going back to change it will not "undo" it since changing the program will not change the fact that it ALREADY gave a result previously. If you think about this analogy, you will see very clearly why the laws involving time travel ARE logical and not able to cause a paradox. I am not the most articulate person, so my explanation could be better, but I believe the analogy is a great tool to help one understand this topic. Leann Member Post Number: 46 Registered: 08-2006 Posted on Sunday, June 03, 2007 - 05:26 pm:        Hey guys, I think you will all find this very interesting. http://download.rusiriusradio.com/shows/rusirius-004-sarfatti.mp3 Leann Cpl Member Post Number: 266 Registered: 08-2004 Posted on Monday, June 04, 2007 - 08:42 am:        Here's a new time traveller claimant. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OiMEU-PEgHc Easy to fake that, of course. I'd've expected the older version to have someone there filming the whole thing so it could be proven in his future. After all he would know it was coming. No mention of how he might have returned either. cpl Trevor New member Post Number: 1 Registered: 05-2007 Posted on Friday, June 15, 2007 - 06:36 pm:        Hello, I've had a look but couldn't find the answer in relation to my question. What happens to the spirit if someone goes a long way back in a time travel trip and they die there. Does the spirit continue with its spiritual evolutionary course back there, or does it go back to the time from where it originally was from? Another matter is that I also find it extremely confusing and difficult to understand how Billy and Immanuel were able to meet each other given the fact that they were the same spirit form. I find that one hard to understand. Thanks for your help.

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