| Author | Message | ||
    Lonnie Morton |
Hello Jim and everyone, Isn't it interesting to see that what has been going on in the Middle East is exactly what Jmmanuel foretold in his Prophetic Declaration in TJ chapter 30! For many years political leaders have been trying to remedy this hot spot on Earth with little success. No matter what kind of treaty or peace pact they come up with, no matter how hard they try, nothing ever really works. The reason for this is stated at TJ 30:9,10(1996E)when Jmmanuel was on trial before the Jewish Sanhedrin and the High Priest Caiaphas. It reads; Verse 9 "Truly, I say to you, if you beat and mock me, you shall be beaten and mocked by those whom you, since ancient times, have enslaved and whose land you and your forefathers have plundered. Verse 10 "And the time will come in five times 100 years when you will have to atone for this, when the legitimate owners of the land enslaved and deprived of rights by you will begin to rise against you and fight against you into the distant future. So because of the way they treated Jmmauel and the Prophets before him, as well as there unfair treatment of the rightful inhabitants of the land, as Jmmanuel said, there would never be peace in Israel. And, ever since the time of Mohammed the ones responsible have been atoning for there errors. This clearly has been fulfilled. And it looks like the fighting and killing will continue until the whole world is engulfed in a Third World War. In fact it is inevitable, and only a matter of time now. Jim, if you can present the same scholarly analysis with the remaining chapters of the Talmud as you have with the first 17, that would be a tremendous accomplishment and gratefully appreciated. I would like to hear more of your comments in this area. Regards, Lonnie | ||
James Roy Mizar |
Hello all, Lonnie, I think inevitable is a bit to harsh, as it is the future that flows into the past I believe we have the rudder of that ship, I'm sure we could go the path of war or the path of peace. I have hope in us humans, with the help of our extresstrial friends and "Billy" I really do think if we keep at peace we will get peace!! Salome James | ||
Jim Deardorff |
Hi Lonnie, Yes, those prophecies of continuing torment for the Jewish people seem to be still coming true. We can only pray that the worst of what Jmmanuel prophesied -- of a worldwide apocalypse, perhaps including a nuclear exchange -- does not come true. It's disappointing that we can't discuss this much with "outsiders," who would immediately assume that these prophecies, and the whole TJ, were made by a 20th-century hoaxer with the aid of 20 centuries of hindsight. | ||
Lonnie Morton |
Hello James and Jim, While no one wishes for a Third World War, I use the word inevitable because according to the newly released booklet "49 Questions" under question number 23, a quote is made from the "OM", saying that even though universal forces have averted total nuclear destruction since 1974, World War three WILL occur, powerfully and unexpectedly, during mockedly peaceful times. The best thing that we can do to counteract this prophetic catatstophe, or reduce it's ferocity, is by sharing in the Peace Meditation inaugurated by our ET friends. This is getting a little away from the TJ chapter 30, perhaps this can be discussed under the booklet 49 questions. Kind regards, Lonnie | ||
Mario |
Hello all, Regarding the prophecy about Mohammed, there is a reference in the book "Mahomet, la parole d'Allah" (Galimard, 1987) by Anne-Marie Delcambre, which refers to an episody in the childhood of Mohamed, when he made a trip with his uncle Abu Talib to the region of Bosra, Siria. There, a christian monk named Bahira recognized him and told him "You are the prophet announced in my holy book, the Bible", and then asked to Abu Talib to take the boy back, and not trust the jews, because "If they see in him the one I've recognized, they will hurt him in a very bad way". It's evident that the prophecy was removed of the Bible, but it was known to many people in those old times. Maybe the jews removed it, but I can't say for sure. Mario | ||
Savio New member Post Number: 409 Registered: 07-2000 |
Hello I refer to TJ2001 page 217 Entombment In German: 61......Joseph wickelte den Leib in reine Leinwand, die er zuvor bestrichen hatte, so es ein Abbild von Jmmanuel gebe. In English: 61.....Joseph wrapped the body in pure linen, which he had coated so as to form an image of Jmmanuel. Other online translations are: 1. Joseph wound the body into pure canvas, which he had coated before, thus it an image of Jmmanuel gives. 2. Joseph wrapped the body in pure screen(canvas) which he had coated previously, so there is an image of Jmmanuel. My question is that: In the TJ, it seems that the image was intended in the first place; while the other translations seem to tell that the image was a (unexpected) result of the action. Which would be the better translation? Regards Savio | ||
Sb Moderator Post Number: 5 Registered: 07-2000 |
Hello Savio, It would seem since the linen was coated with something, the intent was to preserve the image of Jmmanuel. I would think the linen would have to be placed around the body and head in such a way as to replicate or closely follow all of the contours to get a good representation of his features. The only other thing I can think of is the coating was used to preserve the linen, but for what reason? Interesting observation, thanks Salome Scott | ||
Savio Member Post Number: 410 Registered: 07-2000 |
Hi Sb The other reason I can think of is the coating may bring a bright white appearance to the linen. People used to do this on canvas or canvas shoes even in nowadays. Anyhow, it might be the first time in human history to capture the image of a person in such a way. Regards Savio | ||
Jim Member Post Number: 12 Registered: 07-2003 |
Hello List, Have any of you ever wondered about TJ 35:1, where it says, "It came to pass that Jmmanuel, his mother Mary, and his brother Thomas traveled into the cities at the sea in the north. Since olden times, warrior women inhabited the area, but their descendants were now peace loving." What about those "warrior women"? In looking through the website at www.silk-road.com, it seems they must have been the Sarmatians, who evidently dwelt primarily in the region north of the Black Sea just west of where the Scythians dwelt. These Sarmatians were a matriarchal society during at least the 2nd to 4th centuries B.C., and were probably descended culturally from the Amazons who lived in the region even earlier. Do a google check on Sarmatians! It's very interesting. I wonder if Jmmanuel and party made it around to the north side of the Black Sea, or whether in previous tmes the Sarmatians had invaded as far south as the south side of the Black Sea. Also, if you should learn if Herodotus or other writer had anything to say about the Sarmatians, please let me know of it! On the questionable side, it would seem that these people J encountered there weren't by that time so peace-loving after all, if they threatened to kill him. But then, preaching something to people that don't want to hear of it can incite them into violence, I guess, even if they are otherwise relatively peace loving. | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 354 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi Jim... Yes, I would Agree with you concerning "Warrior Women"...Known to us as The Amazons. Billy did mention in his materials that they did exist. As I had Acknowledged...my self. Seems to me...Today...we are going in That Direction also! More and more...women wanting to be a "Macha"! The Female...of being a "Macho"..male. But let's hope we have no Armies of women....  That is very interesting concerning Jmmanuel wandering into the north side and south of the Black Sea. I have not come across anything yet concerning this...and Herodotus. Maybe some of the people Jmmanuel came across would Indeed be Peace-loving ...I would think. And maybe they would even...Be "Open-Minded" for his Teachings!?? I would think, they would be More Open-Minded...than the Kings and Queens and all other Rulers at the time!?? Thus, the people Jmmanuel came across were still More..surrounded by Nature and it's Elements(and the Night Stars..wooded areas..etc). Thus would Understand his Teachings, but only had to be interpreted into an Understandable language for them to understand his words with Simplicity. But I would think that at some moments...The Amazons may have..a bit of a problem Understanding his view of the "Purpose" of the Female Creature/Gender. As that the Women should Co-exist - side by side - with their Male Creature/Gender..within an "Equal" Framework...to Balance and Harmony. Thus...an "Equilibrium". And thus Not...be Dominated by either gender..separately. Thus, like the Amazons manifest...as Dominating their Male gender...by a Macha Way of being. Thus this point may cause a unpleasant situation...I would think? I would look at it this way..dear Jim: Compare it with Today...and you will notice that the more "Material" individuals become...the further they are from True Creational Truths and Nature...and Nature's Laws. But, the Less...Material..an individual is.., and survives with little One has..; the more One is Open-Minded..for New Things...to Broaden One's Knowledge..to Soften One's Spiritual Pain....so to speak. Edward. | ||
Jim Member Post Number: 13 Registered: 07-2003 |
Hi Edward, That TJ verse implies that at least by Jmmanuel's time these "macha" Amazons were no longer around, or were no longer warriors/Amazons. I don't know which. Whichever way, whether they were by then male dominated or female, if J had preached to them that neither gender should try to dominate over the other it could have been what got him into trouble there. But it might have been any number of other things, quite likely preaching against paganism. Regarding his preaching while on his travels, a question does pop up. Would his listeners have been able to understand the language he spoke in? It would seem to me that he must have preached in Greek, the international language of that day in the Anatolian area. J probably learned Greek during the several years it had taken him to traverse to India and back. But I rather doubt that Greek was known very far, if any, north of the Black Sea, so perhaps this would suggest that he hadn't traveled north of it. | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 355 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi Jim.... Yes, I was approaching concerning the "Macha" Amazons more from the point of view; that the descendants Jmmanuel may have crossed paths with...were still dominating "Women/Females" , but only...more "Passivist" than their fore-Mothers. I may have not made my self very clear on this, my apologies. But I understand..what you mean concerning that they were no longer "Macha" Amazons in any shape or form as their fore-Mothers. But ofcourse, it is still unclear, at the times of Jmmanuel, if the "Women" were still dominating the men? But my point of view, was that, if, they did, indeed, Jmmanuel would may have had friction concerning the Male and Female equalities scenario. And ofcourse, other matters could have arisen, that would sound very uncomfortable to them and the Pagans, and others...without doubt. Truly, what language was spoken; is one good question...you have brought up...also. But concerning today's language(Term speaking): That is what I was wondering also; thus it had to be a language that had to be Understandable for them to understand with Simplicity. Even for myself...when I explain to some people around me, I even try to utilize the most simple terms to make Jmmanuel's Teachings clear to the one(s) I explain it to. Still, even today, One has to take this into account...and in consideration. Hence, there are still people that Do Not know...what a "Consciousness" is! Let alone...a "Spirit(ual)-Consciousness". And we are living in 2003...going to 2004. I think you know what I mean. I can Truly Imagine...what for "Struggle" Jmmanuel had been through in those times to get his Teachings across to the people he spoke to! Thus, what ever language Jmmanuel spoke...I would think he would have had to "Master" it very very well to explain his Teachings...and not to foreget, in Simple- terms. As you may know, today, even with the Teachings, it has to be Translated and Interpreted in it's Correct manner to avoid Error and Misunderstands...that may result into.."Unconscious" Teaching Errors.... etc...etc. Thus, Jmmanuel must have spoken to them in a language he was fully capable of speaking, thus...pretty well...fluently? But ofcourse, you did...bring up a very good and essential question...what language he had to speak at that time. If indeed Greek, I would also agree...it's limitations...where it was spoken. Edward. | ||
Jim Member Post Number: 72 Registered: 07-2003 |
Under chap. 12 Leann was wondering about the warrior women. I had forgotten there were some things about that already written here. I also want to refer her to my discussion on this in www.tjresearch.info/genuine.htm#gen2.5 . Jim | ||
Leann Member Post Number: 16 Registered: 08-2006 |
Thank you Jim. I was curious if these were the very tall women who called themselves Children of Frya that I read about in the Oera Linda. I believe it said Adela was 7 ft and fearless. I found it very interesting and learned quite a bit from reading it. I want to say a special thanks for all your work. Leann | ||
Peter_brodowski Member Post Number: 272 Registered: 01-2004 |
hey leann do you know what these children of frya looked like, what they wore (like what ther clothes looked like)? thanks any specifics would be great | ||
Leann Member Post Number: 17 Registered: 08-2006 |
Hello Peter, Here is the link to the one I read. I can't remember exactly what they wore. Anyone who is interested in Atlantis might find it interesting also. Leann http://cruisenews.net/atlantis/oeralinda.html | ||
Michael Member Post Number: 580 Registered: 10-2000 |
Hi everyone, I might as well put this here unless the moderators wish to move it. The new edition of the Talmud Jmmanuel is finally ready as of July 25! I will have the ordering information at www.theyfly.com within about a day or so. The book is $24.95 plus shipping and I have also created a little Special Offer for those who might enjoy it. Michael Horn | ||
Melli Member Post Number: 345 Registered: 06-2005 |
Although my question is part of the TJ I am not sure this is the right place to post it so please excuse me; In the final Chapter that is the "Predictions of the Prophet Elia" in the latest edition page 276, 9th line from the bottom it says...And the peoples of the earth will interbreed, which causes a lot of harm, illnesses, infirmity and hatred, terror and revenge, as well as many deaths". What kind of "inter-breeding" does it refer to? I recall in Contact 251 there is a reference to inter-breeding but i think that one refers to Organ transplant between human and pigs??? Thanks,b. | ||
Scott Moderator Post Number: 1488 Registered: 12-1999 |
Hi Melli, Your post would be better suited in the "prophecy-prediction" topic area. Regards Scott | ||
Ramirez New member Post Number: 1 Registered: 06-2008 |
Greetings to everyone. My questions concern some areas of TJ most particularly information in chapters 30 - 31 concerning the two Marys but in general the absence of information relating to Mary Magdalene throughout the entire story. Some time ago I found this collection of translations. http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/ After reading various texts particularly those of John, Thomas, Mary, Dialogue Of The Savior, Gospel Of The Savior and several others there appears a substantial body of convesation from Mary Magdalene, between Jesus & Mary plus Mary speaking to others from a perspective of being the second most enlightened person in the group clearly indicating that she was herself one of the apostles often grasping hidden truths & higher realities more readily than the males. There appears no referrence in biblical texts as to how Jesus met her except the "official slanders" perpetuated by various religions. So for someone present at the crucifiction, the first to see Jesus after the resurrection and from what appear to be reasonably reliable old sources (the documents exist) that she was an active participant in his immediate group why is there such scarce mention of her in TJ ? Personally I think TJ would have far more appeal if it gave credit to half of humanity .... females for having sufficient intelligence & spirituality to be equal to males instead of being sprinkled about like extras in a male dominated power extravaganza. Again I am no scholar or expert but it appears a singular intelligence wrote the TJ as a compressed, targeted set of lessons aimed at impressing the average with profound truths though those beyond average will find higher truths. It's just too smooth, flowing, organized, motivated, modern and lacking mention of the role of females to be unquestioningly acceptable .... and I am not a feminist. Hope the good folks here aren't considering gathering firewood ... please forgive as it's my first post.  | ||
Jim Member Post Number: 86 Registered: 07-2003 |
Hello Ramirez, The TJ says more about women than the Gospel derived from it (Matthew). In particular, near the end of the TJ's 12th chapter it speaks of how women should be poperly treated when entering into marriage, and that the old law that subjects woman to man was no longer valid. That's not in any Christian writings, of course. At TJ 31 it mentions mother Mary by name several times, whereas in the parallel verses of Matthew she is mentioned only as "the other Mary." This was probably the way the writer of Matthew expressed his disapproval for Mary having been in on the worst possible sin or heresy -- knowledge that Immanuel had survived the crucifixion. We just don't know what experiences Immanuel had that involved Mary Magdalene. Whatever they may have been, they weren't judged by Immanuel or his writer, Judas, to have been important enough to include in the TJ when it was written several years, or perhaps a decade, later. | ||
Markc Member Post Number: 668 Registered: 06-2000 |
Well Ramirez , the TJ wasn't written down so that it could have 'far more appeal'. It was translated and made public in these modern times as a result of it's more famous falsified version , the NT being predominant with it's erroneous teachings . As far as the lack of mentioning females , it was not produced in Hollywood in the 1990's . It was written in a time ( and a country) when even females were not feminists . The presence of it here and now is not a matter of acceptability . What gave you the idea that it even had a potential of being broadly acceptable ? MC Mark Campbell | ||
Ramirez New member Post Number: 2 Registered: 06-2008 |
Greetings everyone. Jim. Surely none of us were there as witneses to the various gatherings but in response to your last two paragraphs may I quote from the Gospel Of Mary .... chapter 5 then further below from The Gospel Of The Savior which has no numbered paragraphs. ************************************************** "1) But they were grieved. They wept greatly, saying, How shall we go to the Gentiles and preach the gospel of the Kingdom of the Son of Man? If they did not spare Him, how will they spare us? 2) Then Mary stood up, greeted them all, and said to her brethren, Do not weep and do not grieve nor be irresolute, for His grace will be entirely with you and will protect you. 3) But rather, let us praise His greatness, for He has prepared us and made us into Men. 4) When Mary said this, she turned their hearts to the Good, and they began to discuss the words of the Savior. 5) Peter said to Mary, Sister we know that the Savior loved you more than the rest of woman. 6) Tell us the words of the Savior which you remember which you know, but we do not, nor have we heard them. 7) Mary answered and said, What is hidden from you I will proclaim to you. 8) And she began to speak to them these words: I, she said, I saw the Lord in a vision and I said to Him, Lord I saw you today in a vision. He answered and said to me, 9) Blessed are you that you did not waver at the sight of Me. For where the mind is there is the treasure. 10) I said to Him, Lord, how does he who sees the vision see it, through the soul or through the spirit? 11) The Savior answered and said, He does not see through the soul nor through the spirit, but the mind that is between the two that is what sees the vision and it is [...]" ************************************************** Then from The Dialogue Of The Savior. Judas said, "Behold! The governors dwell above us, so it is they who will rule over us!" The Lord said, "It is you who will rule over them! But when you rid yourselves of jealousy, then you will clothe yourselves in light and enter the bridal chamber." Judas said, "How will our garments be brought to us?" The Lord said, "There are some who will provide for you, and there are others who will receive [...]. For it is they who will give you your garments. For who will be able to reach that place which is the reward? But the garments of life were given to man because he knows the path by which he will leave. And it is difficult even for me to reach it!" Mary said, "Thus with respect to 'the wickedness of each day,' and 'the laborer is worthy of his food,' and 'the disciple resembles his teacher.'" She uttered this as a woman who had understood completely. The disciples said to him, "What is the fullness, and what is the deficiency?" He said to them, "You are from the fullness, and you dwell in the place where the deficiency is. And lo! His light has poured down upon me!" Matthew said, "Tell me, Lord, how the dead die, and how the living live." The Lord said, "You have asked me about a saying [...] which eye has not seen, nor have I heard it, except from you. But I say to you that when what invigorates a man is removed, he will be called 'dead'. And when what is alive leaves what is dead, what is alive will be called upon." Judas said, "Why else, for the sake of truth, do they <die> and live?" The Lord said, "Whatever is born of truth does not die. Whatever is born of woman dies." Mary said, "Tell me, Lord, why I have come to this place to profit or to forfeit." The Lord said, "You make clear the abundance of the revealer!" Mary said to him, "Lord, is there then a place which is [...] or lacking truth?" The Lord said, "The place where I am not!" Mary said, "Lord, you are fearful and wonderful, and [...] those who do not know you." Matthew said, "Why do we not rest at once?" The Lord said, "When you lay down these burdens!" Matthew said, "How does the small join itself to the big?" The Lord said, "When you abandon the works which will not be able to follow you, then you will rest." Mary said, "I want to understand all things, just as they are!" The Lord said, "He who will seek out life! For this is their wealth. For the [...] of this cosmos is [...], and its gold and its silver are misleading." ************************************************** Quite a read isn't it ? The papyrus used by whoever wrote these texts has been dated 120-180AD so it's reasonably close to the actual purported events which seem to indicate that Mary Magdalene was more than she is often credited. Worst possible sin or heresy ... maybe she was so intelligent & insightfull it bruised some egos that Jesus would select her as one to be entrusted with the "inner mysteries" After all doesn't Billy have a "core group" & keeps to himself various informations relayed by our friends ? So why has the author of TJ taken signifigant measures to restore the reputation of Judas Iscariot yet seems to have virtually ignored that of Mary Magdalene when tangible & existing evidence reveals the nature of her position within the group ? Mark. If the bible & various religions are defective what is the purpose of releasing TJ ? Isn't it to offer a viable alternative for those not completely satisfied with established religions or those having no particular beliefs but seeking a sensible rational framework to guide their lives. So half your target audience are ...... If you have empowered females established in equality throughout your story isn't that a better recipe for achieving integrated societal harmony than having the ladies portrayed as maids, cleaners & lunatics ? Rameriz, Please limit your quotations, this is not a forum for comparing various religious texts. Thanks Scott |
