| Author | Message | ||
    Archandel Member Post Number: 18 Registered: 01-2008 |
Kingman, I disagree that it's patronizing for me to maintain the stance that information that cannot be directly verified and is only flowing from one source (therefore cannot be substantiated through corroboration by other sources) is questionable. I have in fact been reading Bob's posts carefully and I'm not trying to insult anyone by remaining skeptical of the information conveyed by Meier as a whole for the reasons I just laid out. Whether he is voicing his own opinions, conveying something he says is from a higher spiritual entity, or simply writing verbatim what he says the Plejarens told him, the fact remains that all of the modern information from the Plejarens comes through Billy (he even dug up the TJ) and it is by no means out of line to question information that cannot be checked through multiple sources. That is the nature of skepticism and this is the Skeptic's Corner so I have a right to voice those concerns here. I'm not as inclined to question that some sort of visitation by advanced entities (be they really from another star system or possibly from here on Earth, having hidden themselves, as Winter's speculates) has occurred multiple times involving Meier since harder evidence and multiple eyewitness accounts exist to help substantiate those claims. I'm not sure such substantiation exists for the contact information (other than perhaps for some of the accurate predictions). | ||
Phi_spiral Member Post Number: 211 Registered: 03-2007 |
Hi, Archandel Yes, I knew what you probably meant but I couldn’t resist myself. Regarding the philosophies you mentioned, they have spoken highly of Theravada Buddhism and the practice of “mindfulness” as being beneficial. | ||
Archandel Member Post Number: 19 Registered: 01-2008 |
Bob, thanks, I was aware that Billy spent time in India but haven't gotten a clear picture of what he was taught and how he reacted to it. One of the issues I've had is that I've read (or maybe heard Winters say) that the Plejarens declared Billy to be the most spiritually advanced person alive (at whatever time they said this to him) on the planet. Now, of course I've never met him so I can't say based on direct experience, but "very spiritually advanced" to me (based on my background of study) is something along the lines of the historical Buddha, Shankara Acharya (who founded the school of the Vedanta), or my personally favorite philosopher, the 20th century American sage Franklin Merrell-Wolff. One of the common factors of these people seemed to be that they resided much of the time in a consciousness beyond dualistic distinctions of self and other (subject and object). They had really transcended the manifest, both in this universe and even in higher dimensions, and gone on to something else that is impossible to describe with langauge as we know it (something along the lines of the Buddhist nirvikalpa-jnana if you're familiar with the terminology). I can't say as I've not read much of the deeper philosophy within the contact notes or Billy's own personal essays, but this is the kind of thing I would be looking for as a hallmark of very advanced spiritual/mind evolution. I'd also look for the Plejarens to acknowledge that some Earth humans have indeed gone down the path of extremely highly evolved consciousness so we aren't all "spiritually backward". | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 1038 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi Archandel.... Mohammed was given the teachings of The Spirit, which in turn became known as the Koran. It was dictated to Mohammed properly, but is was his cousin home 'altered' it in such a fashion which it is known, today. [which I read in the past and watched in a number of documentaries: Billy Confirmed this fact for me when I came across it in his materials, later on] The cause, why he did this, is because he could not cope with the Truth that even the Writings of Mohammed(which is Creational Teachings based, in essence)..foretold even, that the Islamic Religion would Clash with the other remaining Religions as Judaism and Christianity, mainly; thus, contribute even in Bloody Wars, to come, in the near future. But, as we know: the Birth of Mohammed was an Effect of the Causes created by the Israeli/Hebreons/Jewish/Catholic/Christian Religions. Thus, Mohammed's Presences...was to 'Bend' the above mention's ways of ruling Man on Earth, at the time; but, eventually, will/would continue further into the future. Edward. | ||
Melli Member Post Number: 317 Registered: 06-2005 |
Hello Edward, Maybe you can fill in some missing links for me in regard to Mohammad's teaching: I may be wrong but as I understand Mohammad knew who he was, just as Jmmanuel knew that he was- a celestial son, and a Prophet who came to "bend" the ways of the ruling Man on Earth. Therefore being who he was he knew already that religion only creates human servitude and extended bloody conflicts that increase in severity as time goes by and so my question is: Who "up there" decided on creating another religion that may pave the way for future conflicts? And if our ancestors could see the future why then did they choose that path for Mohammad. Why was it necessary for Mohammad to form yet another religion knowing that it will create bloodshed why not a prophet with Neutral ideals? And I can't understand what you mean when you say "it was his cousin home"? Thank you, bianca | ||
Indi Member Post Number: 148 Registered: 06-2006 |
Dear Archandel I guess you will just have to study all the material that is here and for free on other sites espec. http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/meier/index.php/Main_Page If you do this, then you will discover Billy's and the Plejaren's lessons on what is spiritual evolution, how it occurs, and what it is not. You will also find out from these teaching's perspective, what is possible and what is not, with regard to so-called ascended masters, saints, gods of all types, Buddha types, and many other mythical and self-proclaimed highly spiritually evolved people. There is an interesting chapter at the end of Guido Moosbruger's book, which is in English and not very expensive, that shows the breakdown for the late 1970's, of the material brain quotients and spiritual quotients of the population at that time. However, this information only really has meaning if one has already comprehended the information about spiritual evolution that is in the earlier contact notes and other books of Billy's writings. I think you will be quite pleased if you embark on reading more, and then you can ask questions of others who have also read the material, and get their opinions. With regard to Billy's spiritual level, that can only be understood when knowing about the Nokodemjon and Henok line of incarnations -- which you can investigate on this forum -- there is info here as well as in the later contact notes. Winter's did not have the info on that when he did his series of tapes. I would suggest you look further, as it seems you have some motivation to find out more. There are many here who will help you once you have read the material. Robjna | ||
Michael Member Post Number: 618 Registered: 10-2000 |
Archandel, The definitions that you provided for a "spiritually advanced person" still seem to rely on your belief that these definitions in fact are accurate, though they are sourced from someone else's criteria. They may well be attributes of spiritual development...or they may not. Maybe knowing both the distinction and non-distinction between self and others is equally valid. What I'm saying is that you've accepted criteria from a belief system and are using it as a barometer, which may not be entirely accurate. And it's possible that we are not advanced spiritually enough ourselves to know or understand what it really means, is all about, or how to define it. Michael Horn | ||
Mqhassan Member Post Number: 31 Registered: 06-2006 |
Edward, Melli, As a person coming from a Moslem background, one may conclude from what was written that it was Mohammed's Cousin with whom Mohammed lived together in a single home ( being his uncle's home ). He was Ali bin abi Talib who eventually had two sons who were then considered to have the status equivalent to saints ( in Christianity ). Eventually Ali's younger son Hussein became a martyr in a tragic event which then led to the creation the 12 Imams in Islam ending with the last 12th Imam the Mahdi, all coming from his lineage. ( According to Shiite Sect Belief ) In Todays Iraq , Hussein is mentioned more than Allah or Mohammed and anyone who dares to question his credibility can easily be killed. They believe in the re-appearance of the Mahdi who dissapeared when he was only 10 years old, at any time even though 1200 years have passed. What is confusing though is that in a previous comment on Islam , it was a distant relative with the name Omar who was responsible for the falsifications. Omar ( being the second caliph) is much hated by the Shiite sect that appeared later, who have the belief that it was Ali who should have ruled right after Mohammed, and resulted to a split in the Islamic nation. Actually there appeared an extremist sect who began worshipping Ali, but that let him to fight them because it was considered as a heresy. Salome Mohammed | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 335 Registered: 07-2004 |
Dear Archandel, My apologies on my back to back post to you that were partially unnecessary, and somewhat lacking. I can see that as a good researcher, your allowing certain non-beneficial statements(mine) to deflect past and your case is becoming more defined with what you think. You seem to have gathered some good responders to help in your quest. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 1042 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi Bianca.... Nice to hear from you! I though some of you may see further, when I wrote - home -. 'home' was misspelled! I meant: Whom. Yes, you have your information correct. Yes, of course 'bending' the Israeli/Herbreaon/Jewish/Catholic/Christian Religions which were Lies, as we know. And Mohammed trying to put them on the right track again, if you will, with the Spiritual Teachings, but...alas, as we can acknowledge: "back fired", just as it did with the previous mentioned; attempts through previous Prophets. I guess, the role of his cousin...was some way not directly taken into account? We come into the same scenario similar as to that of Jmmanuel's brother Jacob and Paul/Saul; which altered Jmmanuel into - Jesus Christ -; than, One would ask the same/similar like question, as you did. Do not misunderstand, though. Mohammed DID NOT create another Religion, nor was it the intent by, let say..forces above. Again: he incarnated to bring the Spiritual Teachings anew, and attempted to Direct Man in the correct Direction but alas, was 'altered'. Creating it into a Religion, was due to the Altering of his Spiritual Teachings(cousin, Ali, and through time..by others, misinterpreting); and as we know: Followers tend to make it a Religion, through their Ignorance. The Teachings of The Spirit is NOT a Religion. It is the Teachings of The Creation. Mohammed's posting gives some additional interesting insight, though. Edward. | ||
Mehraein62 Member Post Number: 33 Registered: 12-2007 |
HI Edward I dont agree with some of your view points about Mohmmad...I will put a comment here.soon .and would be glad if i can receive your idea Best Regards Salome | ||
Mehraein62 Member Post Number: 35 Registered: 12-2007 |
Hi Edward some points about your recent comment: 1_ you say: <<It was dictated to Mohammad properly, but is was his cousin home 'altered' it in such a fashion which it is known, today. [which I read in the past and watched in a number of documentaries: Billy Confirmed this fact for me when I came across it in his materials, later on] >> 1- I say: this is completely wrong , you need maybe read and study more about Islam and its history if your knowledge about Islam is only comes from some material in the past and some documentaries!! 2_you say:<<The cause, why he did this, is because he could not cope with the Truth that even the Writings of Mohammad(which is Creation Teachings based, in essence)..foretold even, that the Islamic Religion would Clash with the other remaining Religions as Judaism and Christianity, mainly; thus, contribute even in Bloody Wars, to come, in the near future. >> 2_ I say this is really your idea about Islam ( and in such a false perception?!! every ordinary Muslims can say that you are wrong here because Mohammad,s cousin was the most and for a long life supporter and warrior of the Mohammad teachings so he couldn't and wouldn't any privet interest to intend or to want to change the Spiritual Teachings Text(Koran)...and also beside already the clashes between 3 Abrahimic religion has took place at Mohammad , s life 3-you say:<<Thus, Mohammed's Presences...was to 'Bend' the above mentions ways of ruling Man on Earth, at the time; but, eventually, will/would continue further into the future. >> what dose it mean by that? will you make me more clear? 4- you say:<<I guess, the role of his cousin...was some way not directly taken into account? We come into the same scenario similar as to that of Jmmanuel's brother Jacob and Paul/Saul; which altered Jmmanuel into - Jesus Christ -; than, One would ask the same/similar like question, as you did. >> 4- I say you are again completely wrong and say false expression about Islamic history that such things never happened in Islam, and you only guess?! as yourself say here? 5-you say:<<he incarnated to bring the Spiritual Teachings anew, and attempted to Direct Man in the correct Direction but alas, was 'altered'. >> 5- I agree , yes right but altered by whom? Ali? this guess make laughing any Muslim. so be careful in any expression not for Muslims love to Mohammad or Ali but because these comments maybe would be without any reasonable and logical documented conclusion. 6- you say:<<Creating it into a Religion, was due to the Altering of his Spiritual Teachings(cousin, Ali, and through time..by others, misinterpreting); and as we know: Followers tend to make it a Religion, through their Ignorance. >> 6_ I say: Mohammad Himself declare new religion from the beginning from the start of his mission ( you can study more and see yourself) 7-you say:<<The Teachings of The Spirit is NOT a Religion. It is the Teachings of The Creation. >> 7-I say: The Teaching of the Spirit named Religion because Man had need to worship in the past ( and now yet) Best Regards Salome | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 1044 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi Mehraein..... One will have to Acknowledge, that...: the more you become acquainted with Billy Meier's and the Plejaran's materials, the more The Truth can/will Hurt! Thus: A Bitter Pill, To Swallow (for ALL)! Every Cult Religious body on Earth today has been Altered: it be Consciously or Unconsciously, Directly or Indirectly. This includes: Judaism, Catholicism, Christianity, Buddhism, Hinduism...etc...etc., and even the Islam. Non of the mentioned are in their UR(original) state of being, as how they were Transmitted to the Prophets, or like-wise. Through the centuries, ALL...have be changed. Every individual had their way of Interpreting what was transmitted: due to their Lower Evolution state of being. And when Ignorance has a greater hand here...as obvious, as it can be. There is a saying here:'Making a mountain from a mole-hill'. And this has been the case, in many cases...in their work. Well, in many cases this has been the case in the above mentioned Cult Religions. Still, Mohammed had a significant role he fulfilled, with Positive Out-come/ Effect("bending" the mentioned Cult Religions mentioned in my previous posting, amongst others; as the Plejarans mentioned). As the Plejarans have mentioned, that he was a True Prophet, and proceeded very well in his Mission; and if it were not for him: the Earth would have already cease to exist some 500 years, ago. Due, apparently to the then leading and Ruling Cult Religions - Judaism, Catholicism and Christianity -. Striving each for Dominance over the Peoples and the Earth. Thus: Mohammed's presence was well appreciated and well rewarded. And this we all have to thank him for: a True Prophet he was! Thus: WE thank him, that WE are well, alive and kicky, today! And now, let us all live in Peace and Harmony, together; as is intended, by (The) Creation. Edward. | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 1157 Registered: 02-2000 |
Mohammad was not taught the same info about Creation as Billy was. It was taylored differently for Mohammed & his Followers.  My Website | ||
Melli Member Post Number: 318 Registered: 06-2005 |
Norm, thank you for the excerpt it really answers my questions as to why he was teaching 'half truths' the way he did. I don't have this booklet, is it still available? Edward,I would like to say that you amaze me with your Patience and calmness!!! thank you! Cheers, bianca | ||
Mehraein62 Member Post Number: 36 Registered: 12-2007 |
Thank Edward, I love Truth the same as every one. I respect Billy and P,s friends ( from my heart). yes I admire that all Ruling Cult Religions have changed by humans from the real and core truth.but also I think Your viewpoints about history of Islam need to alter to some extent. Norm Thanks for your comment. 1- Mohammad needed to do his mission in such a way that the people of the time could undrastand , belive and accept it as Ptah says here . so I think the way of all true Prophets is the same (as Billy) 2- You see the amazing close similarity in two words <<allah>> and <<jshwjsh>> in fonetic Best Regards Salome | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 1157 Registered: 02-2000 |
Bianca, Its from this Those Who Lie About Contacts booklet. It still available.  My Website | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 1045 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi Mehraein and All.... Mehraein: The info I mentioned was from Billy's materials! It is not "viewpoints", or such but: based on Facts, told to Billy by the Plejarans. Thus, I need not alter my view points...or thoughts in any shape or form. If you look further into the concerning, you will one day encounter it...in Billy's materials.[as Billy would say: People are Ignorant because - They Have Not Been There yet!] And I would agree, with Norm, and purchase the booklet - Those Who Lie About Contacts -(which I have); which has some very interesting detailed information...concerning Mohammed. Edward. | ||
Matthew_deagle Member Post Number: 84 Registered: 08-2007 |
I find it disappointing, quite frankly, that so many who are ostensibly interested in Billy's teachings seem to essentially still be Christians and Muslims in attitude, behaviour, and beliefs--they are focussing on Jmmanuel and Mohammed, who lived thousands of years ago, instead of focussing on Billy, the living Prophet who delivers the message for us today, and whom one can ask questions, etc., and whose information, because it is more detailed and modern, does not always correspond to the more primitive explanations of Jmmanuel and Mohammed. What does it really mean to cease to be religious? What does it mean to become a student of the Spirit-Teachings? What does it mean to live in "Freiheit"/Freedom? What does it mean for you? Does it imply that one should simply hold on to some grounded, static, false belief? Does it mean that someone should worship and obey anyone? What is more valuable: belief, or understanding? Which honours Creation? Which blinds one from the Creative Laws and smothers awareness of dem Geist? Salome, - Matthew | ||
Bass_boy Member Post Number: 9 Registered: 03-2007 |
Mathew an excellent point, I think I might be able to add to. When my heart truly converted out of lies and in to the light, I already "knew" spirit teachings. I read them every day. But yet my heart was not fully there and I think it had to do with past as well as present life times of forced religious falsified teaching most likely christian teachings. I found it hard to let go of the fact that there is no salvation as the religious teaching would have one believe and that the spirit dissolves into creational energy for the resting period. Eventually after persevering through it, it just clicked. The light went on and my heart rejoiced with the truth that the reality of the physical energy's that make us and combine with our spirit to form the human entity just dissolve into creation. This meant to me I could live through every thing and was not restricted. But none the less I still remember that feeling right before. It almost felt like leaping off a cliff blind folded but while in the air only to be caught by the life force of everything and nothing all at once. It was quite magnificent. So I imagine it is much the same for others. They may know and understand the words but the heart has not yet let go of the lies.... | ||
Mehraein62 Member Post Number: 44 Registered: 12-2007 |
Edward , 1-I wonder if i can find the materials you mentioned in the said above booklet? 2-I remember exactly that Billy,s reply about the same question (who was exact and most responsible person for divert the Islam from its true goals or its direction? ) was another name (Omar, or Amr ebin -e- Moghyre) exactly another person - and another name , that you can also see it in Question to Billy,s Answers. so it is make me and any body confused. 3- I will try to get and read the said booklet but also I think apart from only acceptance any thing with mere justification that IT IS COMING FROM Billy OR P,s, any body need more persuading enough documented points not only asserting some thing that it goes from heaven (creation) and we must accept it without saying why and what? we need to believe the New Religion? without asking what is the proof of this allegations? Matthew 1- thanks for your comments , but i thinks every body is here to exchange and learn much more, so also thanks for your patience and reading my foolish questions. 2- yes unfortunately most of us am)yet have religious directions and we need all Material of Billy and Pliadeins in spiritual improvement (thanks to Billy and Pliadiens that pull me out from ignorance) 3- But when P,s themselves Help Billy and Rashid to find TJ (religious related text)and introduce it to to the world people so it means that Man in this world needs one by one put aside that one (old beliefs) and get more wise , truthful materials. the more clear and perfect , the better result can be obtained. 4- I need to persuade other my fellow friends (and also myself) if they put serious question marks or if to mention some contradiction points because of this I and maybe others insist to get any point clear enough. Best Regards Salome | ||
Markc Member Post Number: 588 Registered: 06-2000 |
Hi Mehraein ; Much respect to you , and your people . Coming from my nationality , which is the west , a country that is predominantly christian with a side order of judaism , I trust Billy's opinion . It has to be based on trust . After that , everything has to make sense to you , it has to seem logical . If you harbor suspicions that someone form outside your religion is a perpetrator of lies , then everything seems like an insult . From my perspective , having learned what I have learned , it seems that people of the local faith here in my country are not accustomed to thinking about their religion . It's blind faith , and faithful thoughtlessness . They dare not question , and obviously never thought to question the shaky , fairy-tale-like factors of the belief and supporting stories .I can't follow behind Billy in a beamship to discover him observing Jmmanuel or anything for this kind of proof , so it's a matter of trust , if it seems logical . A real explanation is what he offers . A real explanation is what I accept , because I do question , and I do notice when something seems like a weak explanation . Since you see his information as being 'allegations' , it appears to me by your skepticism that you are suspicious of the entire matter of the geisteslehre . That's fine , because you come here repeatedly to discover , even if you 'kick' a little on the way , fighting it . That's OK . Sometime the truth of the matter just comes to you after being shown some few simple things . I mean no offence , but the geisteslehre is for all people , not only people of the west .Keep showing up , hard questions are welcome . Kind Regards , Mark Mark Campbell | ||
Mehraein62 Member Post Number: 45 Registered: 12-2007 |
thanks Mark, 1- No I don't see to Billy,s work by skepticism. I like and admire him. I respect his long time years hard work. I do like the advanced P,s works and their presentation of truth, Spiritual Lessons and so on. 2- you talk about Trust, but this word most related to the Believe conception and Believe it means accepting new Belief and new religion that Billy and P,s several times rejected and denied of introducing new religion to this world ( although some of us here are trying to say all materials from Billy and P,s are absolutely true , yes I do i think so, but also I think we must make attention to another point that Billy and P,s also want anybody accepts the material with knowledge and wisely scrutinize 3- we all love truth , and I am myself super - interested and thirsty always about FIGU materials but also willing can answer to any question mark about my new finding absolute Truth - and of course our time is very short , and we need a tremendous efforts to find the answers to a lot of endless questions that have remained beyond all of this luminous works. 4- (also to Matthew again) Isn't it so normal about any human mind here(in this world) to compare any new thought to the old ones and find out the privileges of new one? Best Regards Salome |
