| Author | Message | ||
    Wayne Member Post Number: 18 Registered: 07-2004 |
20 February 2006; To Junior: Yes, I agree; practice and application always helps. The Other Forum is a good idea. If you'd read just some of E.A. Meier's works, (Bulletins, Wassermannzeit, etc..) you'll see him doing subtle acrobatics with the whole lot of his writings,( which are apparently clear to only me). Downright funny plays with the truth...hidden 'round-about targeting' of issues, and not so hard to reveal inuendos seem to abound, the more I read his writings. Lookie here: Right after, say 11 Sept 01, in his Bulletin (english and German version), and after that time, he was all in in the most frantic form of writing...BUT NEVER DO I RECALL him explicitly implicating any ONE PERSON/GROUP soley responsible for that cowardly act! To this day he will not come out with any specifics...just gentle hidden persuasions; hidden within his continual LAMBASTING of us Earthings and our BARBAROUS pre-evolutive condition. That above last statement is horrifyingly apparent more and more each day I continue to live on this Earth! This view of Meier is a most unusual slant to reading into such a person as he, but how else does anyone maintain a sense of sanity, other than with a humor? He also, (excuse me) LIES like a trooper, when needed...but 'lovingly', of course. I find whole swaths of fabricated materials - but not too much in that sense in his more serious works. In a recent Bulletin, he answers letters to readers' questions. I am suspecting he made up the whole lot of these Q/A's this time. One very funny question from 'XXX' in America. Another 'policeman' from Germany, or so on down the list. Listen, the man at times has me laughing so hard it hurts, at what he says. I personally, and mind you with much admiration for this man, suspect only, he makes up some of his recent Plejaran contacts reports. But, in so doing he is uproariously funny. | ||
Claes Member Post Number: 105 Registered: 07-2002 |
Hello Wayne, Billy writes an incredible amount of texts all the time. And there is always someone who feels offended. The truth is harsh and it must be expressed in that way to make people think. there is something for everyone to love and to hate in the info from Meier. You write that Billy lies like a trooper. How do you know? He is certainly very skilled at not saying too much and sometimes only writing as much as he can without endangering himself too much. Giving short answers or no answers is very different from lying. Saying too much can often do more harm than good. Billy is very good at saying just what someone needs to hear and just enough to help and not to harm. I have met several of the people who asked many questions to Billy that are then answered in the Bullletins and they are not made up by Billy. If you get to know Billy you see how honest and respectful he is. He never seems to criticize any personal traits but only negative actions. He is certainly not perfect either and that can come as a shock to many of us after reading some of his in depth clear writings. If a person requests to be anonymous it may only say the initials or xxx. That just shows respect to the one who sent in the question. There is also a policeman in Germany that has known Billy for many years that study the material so he is not made up either. In the Wassermannzeit any member can write something about their thoughts, insights, poems or other. FIGU encourages others to share. It is not about being a better writer but about sharing experiences and learning from each other. Salome, Claes | ||
Anday727 Member Post Number: 6 Registered: 02-2006 |
regarding Wayne's post... To be a suspicious is always better than to be a believer. Purpose of Billy's mission is NOT to make us to believe, but to Think! To say that someone lies, means that someone must to have the reason for that. The leaders of religous and the politicians probably have the reason. But what is Billy's reason? I don't see that he have one. There is only one truth, and it only depends on that does someone can accept it. Many on this planet are not ready yet, unfortunately. Peace in wisdom to all... Dejan | ||
Kiril Member Post Number: 57 Registered: 12-2005 |
Wayne(Ref - PostNo.18): So as to avoid an unnessary conflict between us I wish to clarify with you, before writing my views on your post, some terms and ideas: What do you mean by - "...doing subtle acrobatics with the whole lot of his writings." Further, what do you mean by -"...funny plays with the truth...hidden 'round-about targeting' of issues, and not so hard to reveal inuendos..." Is it your intention to express, in your PostNo.18, that Mr.Meier evades and fabricates facts and does so in an insidious manner? or/and Do you mean that his writings are vague and equivocal? or/and Something different altogether? Thanks, Kiril | ||
Kiril Member Post Number: 59 Registered: 12-2005 |
- Correction to post - With apologies to the 'forum' : Ref - PostNo.57 - Line 2 -> unnessary = unnecessary Kiril | ||
Markc Member Post Number: 290 Registered: 06-2000 |
Would you like your cuisine broiled or LAMBASTED ? Come a little closer , I want to Lambast you . The pork was tender and excellent , but the Lamb was BASTED. I wanted to be a farmer but I was discouraged by that Lamb Basted . The Pot said to the Kettle , you're Black , and then accused him of "continual LAMBASTING " Hey , no problem , it was nothing , really . Anytime , no trouble at all . "If I thought about Earth humans more myself , I might feel like lambasting a little . But comedy is better . It keeps me sane ." Mark Mark Campbell | ||
Barbarotico Member Post Number: 35 Registered: 12-2005 |
Why the Ets and billy always take pictures of the beamships near trees and others things? that see as the ships where nailed to the trees and supported by a bean behind the ships. Hi Barb, The main reason for pictures of the "beamships" being photographed near trees is to give the viewer a perspective as to the size of the ship. Regards Scott-Moderator | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 162 Registered: 07-2005 |
Hey Barb If only people do their homework and root out all the rubbish in their minds from seeing the total picture with all this, then they wouldn't have to ask such stupid question as yours. Plausible deniability? Perhaps to make people REALLY REALLY think for themselves instead of the usual robot like regurgitation of excrement from chicken feed people won't put the effort to digest themselves? Some people just can't help themselves by their own ignorance and be led the garden path on a leash around their necks they willing put on themselves, SUCH IDIOCY! Now that you've got your 15 minutes, why, it's time to pay the admission fee. WORK AT IT! conduit closing Newinitiation, I didn't catch this post until now. If you continue with these type of remarks, your posts will be deleted. Scott-Moderator | ||
Jrosales80 Member Post Number: 37 Registered: 01-2006 |
Dear Newinit. I see no reason to call a person stupid or an idiot for asking a simple question. Barb is allowed to doubt - In fact IT IS HIS/HER RIGHT TO DO SO. If they were not to doubt, it would form the basis of a new religion as you just vulgarly described it. If you don't have the ability to answer Barb's question, then don't try to put them down for doing so. Your actions represent more on you then they do Barb's. If you were to direct such flames at me I would certainly report it. We have to learn to respect each other and it seems you have not gotten the basic message of Billy's teachings of love and respect. I hope my words will trigger something inside of you other than violence. Peace, Newinit. | ||
Markc Member Post Number: 294 Registered: 06-2000 |
I agree with Scott and Jrosales . We are all so far apart , yet right under each other's skins with opinions and critical commentary , which goes in both directions. Of course , most people of Earth will consider this whole thing as being totally mad ....... especially if they have not been paying attention to all world developments and been very curious about the mysterious. We are all at least drawn here by our awareness , perception , even if not by a complete connection to it . So , stop your arguing....... or I'll say "stop" again . I mean it , don't think I won't Mark Campbell | ||
Pudd Member Post Number: 11 Registered: 02-2006 |
It is clear that the ET,s for the most part always leave doubt as to their authenticity.They could easily just present themselves.There-fore there is an attemp to encourage earth human's to search for knowledge on the matter.Now from there, we must apply wisdom towards the knowledge you are able to assimilate.The ET races's are allowing the law's of creation to essentually govern the developement of terra human's as well as collectively desciding when to step in if you will, to prevent certain destruction's from taking place.Remember that Meir had difficultly pictureing and videoing craft.The magnectic waves these craft pump has it's effect's.The trees are a great "ground" as well as the screen built by Quetzal of iron which deflected these wave's so Meier could get better result's.This enabled those close up's of the wedding cake.I hope the stolen video of that ship moving, surfaces some day,as there have been claims by some to have seen this footage.Remember human's have been easily manipulated through the use of this belief system ,however, Aquarius and this age of information is prepairing us all,so my fellow human's we must all unite and continue to gather knowledge.The United Nation's is in the beginning stages of disclosing the truth of ET race's(which have been hear for milleniums I might add)and 2006 could be that very year.Love & Salome,Pudd. | ||
Barbarotico Member Post Number: 36 Registered: 12-2005 |
Newinitiation maybee has taken all this as a religion sect, and dont tolerate a simple question like this. He is a fanatic. By peoples like Newinitiation tha truth becomes a religion when they are the head of a group. | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 163 Registered: 07-2005 |
dear forum members It strikes me odd how people go on about honesty and the nature of truth being worded in an harsh manner and to learn to accept them for what it is but then fail to see why that is. Barbs questions (and this only barb can answer) were not an honest question from an honest ignorance but a maligned veiled undertone of contempt, jumping on the bandwagon of the decrepit tone for which others have ignited from earlier posts. The harshness of the language I used to barbs was to see for his own eyes what response they will get for the contempt and utter disrespect they show. Now nobody on this forum can claim that they are above reproach and judging by the people who have written the proverbial responses to my post I sincerely agree with your words but the subtle facets went passed you guys. Look guys, taken for the fools we already are by another fool doesn't go down too well,for every judgement I make I am likewise judged, For every false judgement I make I will also be judged falsely. This fact hasn't left me but I urge you guys to have another think for truth can be so simple yet so complex according to how you make it to be. Barb if there is one thing I ask of you and I make this with full knowledge of reading most of the posts you have written on this forum, How honest can you be to yourself to say that you didn't know the reason before you've asked the question? sincere peace to you guys | ||
Barbarotico Member Post Number: 38 Registered: 12-2005 |
Hey, I made that question because everybody with common sense think about this posibility. The ships don't appear to one side of the tree, they appear in front of the tree! That makes that some peoples think about the teory that the "ship" would be attached from behind by an arm of iron and that arm would be part of an structure of iron (tower) hidden behind the tree. for Newinitiation, this is the skeptic's corner, this place is for this type of comments. If you don't like what we write here, then the door is open to go out. If you become angry, then double work for you.  I'm not say that Billy is false, but I skeptic about some pictures, specially the picture of the ship in FRONT of the tree. | ||
Tjames Member Post Number: 138 Registered: 12-2004 |
I agree Barbarotico, This picture that has the huge valley behind it and mountains in it, where the silvery ship in sticking 1/2 way out of the branches looks very questionable. I think for this very reason the Plejaren (or so we've been told) allowed such a variation in pictures and the "ships" positions which basically begs one to make this single act, and that is "question". I do everytime I see the vast differences between every type of evidence that exists, from the bi-refringent metal/crystal samples to the higher form of proof, the propheticlly accurate statements of scientific facts and world events to the thousands of picts, with a handful that look like models. The variety of all the types of evidence and all the angles the photos were taken makes me question even harder every time I see the same photos you talk about Barbarotico. This is why I have that exact photo on the wall in my room, to get me thinking, and it never fails because I remember the possibilities. The possibility that it might be fake but also the idea that if one was to fake a ufo photograph why would you make Thousands of them look so realistic in dozens of nearly impossible locations like deep vallys nowhere near any objects and then take several others that look so obviously fake? Why, unless it was done purposely. Saalome, Tim | ||
Kiril Member Post Number: 64 Registered: 12-2005 |
Barbarotico: "By peoples like Newinitiation tha truth becomes a religion when they are the head of a group." Very well epxressed, I agree with you entirely, and espacially in this case. Zealots are a most dangerious breed of mind, made even more-so when dealing with new and heretical systems of ideas. Yours, Kiril | ||
Memo00 Member Post Number: 207 Registered: 03-2004 |
Barbarotico: Billy took hundreds and hundreds of photos of many different plejaren ships, from many different angles, with many different references, in the day and in the night, etc etc, and they are usually series so if there is one with the ship in front also there is also one with the ship to the side, behind etc i could post here many examples, but i think it is better if you find them on your own. . . take care | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 164 Registered: 07-2005 |
dear barb Then fact expressed from honesty is fact of truth. I sincerely apologise for painting a darker picture of your intentions as maligned when simply it was an honest question. I am sorry Now I am passionate but not dogmatic as belief but through thorough searching and studying, I have come to the conclusion that I can claim to KNOW a little. Nothing can be further from the truth with any assertion that somehow all this can become for an individual like myself a fanatically driven religion where logic alone will dictate after some exposure to billy's teaching that somehow can misdirect one's mind in that dark valley of cultish lunacy. In the end the sword of knowledge has been proclaimed aknew therefore it's the religious delusions for the want of the power of truth would thereby eliminate little by little step by step. That is the underlying mission of billy's (to bring to light the truth). At the end of the day the wheat gets sifted from the chaff, the reality here on this forum and elsewhere reflects this view, Likewise we are our own judge and the judge of others in a never ending quest to see bare the essential element of the truth and I guess its a positive thing to have a healthy scepticism no question about that. As for your original question about the picture, I cannot agree more with Tjames and Memo. PS. As for your views regarding the degenerate criminals, I definitely cannot reconcile with your assertions. In the end every spirit must evolve by making mistakes and any form of capital punishment or revenge will not solve the problem. peace to all take care everyone | ||
Barbarotico Member Post Number: 39 Registered: 12-2005 |
To not combat and kill the criminals is possitive degeneration of a society, that is against the nature. The vengeance is a natural feeling. The men that ressist to that feeling is against the nature of his psique and is consumed inside, the result is worst. To kill somebody that you hate is to work in favor of your spiritual evolution and is in favor of the creative laws. To kill somebody because other people ordered you to do that is against the creative laws and is to work against your spiritual evolution. When you kill somebody that you hate you fell good and reach interior peace. When you kill somebody that you not hate you will feel bad and you will not have interior peace | ||
Jacob Moderator Post Number: 465 Registered: 01-2004 |
Hello Barbarotico, You are absolutely wrong in your thinking and feeling about killing, with one exception, the words you have mentioned do not have any bearing on the actual truth whatsoever. 1. There is no positive degeneration, degeneration always means reverting back to a lower level of development. 2. Vengeance is not a feeling, it's an emotion, a totally unbalanced response out of limitless egoism and hatred with just one purpose to inflict hurt or damage to the person(s) who caused the avenger to become vengefull in the first place, unbalanced violence results in violence and destruction, everything in Nature is geared towards justice, which means to bring balance into things which are out of balance. 3. The body of a human is the tool of it's consciousness, it has to do what the personality / consciousness wants. It should never be punished by means of bodily harm, torture or death by execution. The only logical action is to neutralize the aggresor so he/she can not do any harm and remove his/her physical freedom for a determined period of time or permanently in order to allow his/her consciousness to learn from it's wrongdoings. 4. The only allowed exception by natural-creative law to kill somebody is when there is an acute threat to ones own life of that of others and when there is no possibility to convince the aggressor to seize it's actions by any other means or if it is impossible to neutralize the aggressor by non-lethal means, killing a human being is ALWAYS the last action, and only when there is no other option. 5. When a person kills out of hate then that person has serious psychological issues and should be considered a psychopath, such a person requires psychological treatment followed by lifelong imprisonment or banishment. 6. People in favor of capital punishment, torture or any other physical punishment are absolutely at the very least primitive and misguided in their thinking, if not outright psychologically damaged and one step shy of becoming murderers themselves. The only exception in your words which are truthful is the fact that it is wrong to kill when ordered, the person who kills is just as guilty as the one who orders it in equal ways, punishment is always lifelong banishment. I am convinced by your words that you really do not know one iota of the natural-creative laws and I suggest strongly that you study them before expressing those words on a public forum. Salome, Jacob "If you measure the size of your Ego to the size of your knowledge or what you assume you know, then you should always try to remember that your ignorance is infinitely larger, than any knowledge you have." | ||
Barbarotico Member Post Number: 41 Registered: 12-2005 |
I read about the natural creative laws and studied them. But my point of view, what dictates my brain and what I feel is the ultimate law. What I feel is te ultimate law because that law is the law on my consciousness. If you kill somebody in vengeance you will reach peace in your consciousness. If you are a soldier and you kill somebody following orders you will lose peace in your consciousness. The laws of pleiades not work here. What work here is a massive extermination of dangerous criminals followed by a worldwide birth control. | ||
Jacob Moderator Post Number: 466 Registered: 01-2004 |
Then you seriously need an psychologist if this is what your brain tells you. Apperantly you have no clue about the natural creative laws which have universal validity over any human law. Salome, Jacob "If you measure the size of your Ego to the size of your knowledge or what you assume you know, then you should always try to remember that your ignorance is infinitely larger, than any knowledge you have." | ||
Kiril Member Post Number: 65 Registered: 12-2005 |
Barbarotico: Personally I am undecided on this issue and I would like to explore your position - like yourself I am not entirely convinced of Jacobs argument. And so I present to you the following questions : A - What are the essences of human and phsique natures - that is, how do you derive them? - and from this how do you conclude that "vengeance is a natural feeling" and "When you kill somebody that you hate you fell good and reach interior peace. " and "If you kill somebody in vengeance you will reach peace in your consciousness. "? B - "To kill somebody that you hate is to work in favor of your spiritual evolution and is in favor of the creative laws." The Spiritual Teachings say no such thing - this is your own conviction. Also you say - "The laws of pleiades not work here" - since the Plejarens are said to follow 'Creative Laws' you must be referring to a different set of creative laws - what are they - how do you derive them? Note - BEAM's advocacy of the global reduction of human population is at once in line with the Spiritual Teachings and a logical conclusion(based on the environmental issues which are set to face us). C - There is one other question I wish to ask you, it stands separate from the previous two and is far more important."What I feel is te ultimate law because that law is the law on my consciousness." How do you derive the conclusion that your consciousness has primacy over nature/existence? Cheers, Kiril | ||
Junior Member Post Number: 62 Registered: 12-2004 |
Dear Barbarotico, Why do you have to approach this as if you are definite of what you are saying, how can it be that you are so sure of what you are saying. Why not be more open to discussing what your conclusions are… Let me try to take a few scenarios that might help us understand things from a different point. But first of all I wish to ask you have you had someone killed that is very close to you and you managed to find the killer and killed him, and felt satisfaction?? If the answer is Yes then that shows that your conclusion has some evidence, basis, but if your answer is No, then you shouldn’t assume how a person would feel, because for a simply fact you didn’t experience the same. Ok my first scenario, imagine you had a son that was killed by a road accident by a drunk driver, or killed in a school shooting, or was pushed by his friend from a roof, so what you are saying is that it is right and good to kill the responsible, as a creational law! So lets say you found the guy and bought a gun went to the killers house and shot him/her in the head. First of all that’s not going to bring back your son, secondly just imagine the killer has a son, and tried to look for you and found you then had a gun and shot you in the head because that’s how you killed his parent, and so on. Do you really think this is a logic action? As for my second scenario, lets take into consideration that after all that I mentioned above you found out you killed an innocent man? Because correct me if I am wrong if you have so much hate for loosing someone and ready to kill someone for it, you really think you can see the situation in a logical way to find the person responsible? Ok lets take a little different approach or turn, lets say you are reincarnated into a person and the killer of your son in this life time is your son in your next lifetime, do you really think it is logic that you took your hate over to the next lifetime for the killer? I hope you get my point. Peace to all, and one Love Junior | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 790 Registered: 02-2000 |
Of all the things Billy & the Plejarens have told us. I want everyone to list the one thing that they have said, that is the hardest to swallow or most shocking. I'll have to say mine is, that Apollo 11 Moon Landing was faked. | ||
Mhurley Member Post Number: 123 Registered: 04-2003 |
I would agree with your there Norm, that has to be no 1 for me also. Regards Matt | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 596 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi Norm and Matt.... I was not really that surprised that the Apollo 11 Moon Landing was a FAKE..to be frank. There was just TOO Much 'inequalities' in the pictures/ footages that were taken at the time. One whom lets their Logic Analyse the mentioned would come to conclusion...that it was indeed a Fake. So, the ones whom gotten these facts out at the time...should truly have the Credit. And of course, Billy and the Plejarans for Confirming this all. So, it was very healthy to Acknowledge the True Facts of this event made by Billy and the Plejarans. But I have to say: the U.S. government at the time DID manage to FOOL THE WHOLE WORLD!! Just as with '9/11'!! Shows what sort of Criminals we are dealing with in the White House!! They ARE The Criminals Of ALL...CRIMINALS!!! The BEAST in Human format!! They will do ANYTHING to maintain their POWER and Enslave its (OWN) People! Edward. | ||
Technod Member Post Number: 34 Registered: 07-2003 |
Shocker for me was from the questions to Billy on whether or not recent hurricanes katrina/rita were manipulated.hes said nay, but wnder if he would be able to say anything about a supposed climate weapon.? brian | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 146 Registered: 03-2004 |
Hi everyone, There were reportedly FIVE successful U.S. manned Moon landings PRIOR to the Apollo 11 hoax. Please see: www.gaiaguys.net/MEIER.PROPHECIES.1958.htm (excerpt) 14.) "Even next year on September 13th, 1959, using rocket propulsion, the Earth human, respectively the Soviet Union, will make a hard landing of an unmanned object on the moon; and on April 12th, 1961 an Earth human will climb high in the sky with a rocket to orbit around in the Earth's outer space, then on February 3rd, 1966 an aerospace object will make a soft landing on the moon, then in 1968, the outer fringes of Earth's space will be left, and later the first trip to the moon will be undertaken, whereby up until the year 1972, five (5) manned moon landings will take place through the U.S.A., while a sixth moon landing - supposedly the first - on August 20th, 1969 will rest only on a world-wide staged deceit as a result of the political armament race with the Soviet Union." After familiarizing yourself with the Disclosure Project witness testimony, (linked from www.gaiaguys.net/ufology.htm) you will understand that LONG before anything of this nature goes public, it’s been well and truly tested SECRETLY. Please see also www.gaiaguys.net/moontruth.mpg (One of our site’s most popular items!) Cheers! Dyson | ||
Scott Moderator Post Number: 770 Registered: 12-1999 |
Hi Dyson, Has anyone studied the moontruth footage to determine whether it is genuine with respect to the non-genuine landing? Just wonder if any comparisons were made from the aired footage and the piece on your website. Regards Scott | ||
Mhurley Member Post Number: 124 Registered: 04-2003 |
HI Edward All the familiar reasons for the Apollo 11 being hoaxed have been adequately explained on sites like this http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/tv/foxapollo.html e.g. wavy flag, no stars etc So lets say it was hoaxed, a huge Saturn 5 rocket goes to the moon and gets tracked by astronomers and amateurs all around the world. The astronauts also bring back moon rock as well. Edward you will have to do better than that Matt | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 147 Registered: 03-2004 |
Hi Scott, I don't know of any studies of this bizarre footage. Like Billy's beamship images, it seems like a lot of trouble to go through to make a hoax. And the Disclosure Project witness testimony (added to my own personal experiences with the USAF's attitude to UFOs) gives me ample reason to think that that little film clip is exactly what it looks like. www.gaiaguys.net/radar.story.htm And then there was the WTC massacre .... :-( "I,60: My number is 11, as all their numbers who are of us." www.gaiaguys.net/Book.of.Law.htm Dear Matt, For what it's worth, Billy tells us that NASA had already been there five times, hence the rocks, and these guys are famous for setting up straw men and then knocking them down publicly. And I notice in this morning's paper that the CIA told the neocons 6 months before we all went to war on Iraq that there were no WMD. Sounds like the Gulf of Tonkin, Pearl Harbor, WWI, the Spanish-American War, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. ........... www.gaiaguys.net/Armageddon.htm I'm SO glad the Bafath are no longer with us! Salome, Dyson | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 597 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi Matt... You seemed to have Missed..my point!! I do not thing you read my posting as it was??? And Misunderstood what I was saying. I am very very well aware of the facts and even what you have posted. That is Not new to me. I read what Billy had mentioned concerning the events; even what Dyson posted! Well done Dyson...  Edward. | ||
Mhurley Member Post Number: 126 Registered: 04-2003 |
Hi Edward What was your point then? You'll have to explain how a big rocket goes to the moon and returns with moon rock (I'm not referring to the subsequent missions) I'm interested to know your "logic" Edward Matt | ||
Mhurley Member Post Number: 127 Registered: 04-2003 |
http://www.nasm.si.edu/collections/imagery/apollo/AS11/a11facts.htm Please note Edward 21.7 kgs of moon rock collected | ||
Tony New member Post Number: 4 Registered: 01-2006 |
Mhurley said: "So lets say it was hoaxed, a huge Saturn 5 rocket goes to the moon and gets tracked by astronomers and amateurs all around the world." Hi Matt, could astronomers have tracked the small Apollo 11 spacecraft actually landing on the moon or could astronomers only track the huge saturn 5 rocket going to the moon? Mhurley said: "You'll have to explain how a big rocket goes to the moon and returns with moon rock (I'm not referring to the subsequent missions)" Could the U.S. have gotten the 21.7 kgs of moon rocks from any of the 5 previous manned moon landings the U.S.A. took before they took the sixth Apollo 11 moon landing, because the plejarens clearly stated that - "....whereby up until the year 1972, five (5) manned moon landings will take place through the U.S.A., while a sixth moon landing - supposedly the first - on August 20th, 1969 will rest only on a world-wide staged deceit as a result of the political armament race with the Soviet Union." I'm interested in hearing about what type of material proof that you are going by or that you have and could also provide here to support your theory and belief that the Apollo 11 moon landing was not staged and that it actually did land on the moon, when your belief is in direct contradiction to what the Plejarens have said about this particular matter? I'm curious to here what type of material proof you have to support your belief on this matter, because people in the know, know that it's not in the Plejarens nature to ever lie about such trivial things, as well as they also know that the plejarens only speak in truths too??? Also, if the U.S.A. didn't get the moon rocks from any of the previous 5 moon landings they took before Apollo 11, could it be possible that the U.S.A. got the moon rocks from here on Earth, possibly from a variety of Organisations, Museums or private collectors of moon rocks and meteorites? Are you aware of how many private collectors of moon rocks and meteorites there are as well as how big some of their collections are?Could it also be possible that the moon rocks were meteorites? "Meteorite collectors trade pieces of space rock the way boys once traded baseball cards: a slice of Mars for a chip of carbonaceous chondrite, a Moon rock for a new meteorite find from the Sahara.............Mr. Pitt, whose Macovich Collection is the largest private collection of meteorites in the world." http://web.acc.qcc.cuny.edu/SocialSciences/ppecorino/INTRO_TEXT/Chapter%204%20Metaphysics/Meteorite.htm Matt, I'm interested in hearing about what type of material proof you have to support your belief on this matter, which happens to be in direct contradiction to what the Plejarens stated, as well as to better understand to know your logic too. | ||
David_chance Member Post Number: 87 Registered: 03-2003 |
Hi all, I was wondering if anyone here had a copy of the Kal Korff booklet titled "The Meier Incident: the most infamous hoax in Ufology". It was published by W.L. Moore Publications & Research in 1981. I was hoping to get a photocopy, or a brief loan of the booklet in order to scan it for a CD-ROM (which I could send to anyone interested). It is long out-of-print and difficult to obtain. Thanks for any assistance. David Chance chancede@slu.edu | ||
Jo_jo Member Post Number: 113 Registered: 04-2003 |
I respectfully submit that there is an error in the interpretation of the translation regarding the manned US moon landings. Five manned US moon landings occurred before the end of 1972: Apollo 12, 14, 15, 16 & 17. Apollo 11 was a hoax and 13 was an aborted mission. It is totally illogical to think the US would keep 5 successful manned moon landings prior to Apollo 11 a secret when they were in a hotly contested race against the Soviets for world supremacy. Why did they have to resort to hoaxing Apollo 11 if they had already won the race? This makes absolutely no sense. Somebody needs to double-check the translation. | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 812 Registered: 02-2000 |
Where the five previous landings with humans or not? | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 813 Registered: 02-2000 |
JoJo I agree it doesn't make sense. | ||
Mhurley Member Post Number: 129 Registered: 04-2003 |
Tony, You need to learn to think for yourself and not just accept automatically everything the Plejarans say. What evidence have you to support the idea that it was all hoaxed? I don't see any. The usual "evidence" that gets peddled about is all on this site. http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/tv/foxapollo.html We have witness testimony, rock samples, video film,many photos, several hundred thousand staff involved in the project. If your doubting that amount of evidence then why are you believing that the Meier case is genuine? Matt | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 183 Registered: 03-2004 |
Hi everybody, Is there anyone here who does not believe (and I use that word deliberately) that the Apollo 11 (there's that number again!) was hoaxed, who has also carefully read all the Disclosure Project data I've linked off of www.gaiaguys.net/ufology.htm ?? Until you have studied the 500 page DP Congressional Briefing Document, or, at the very least, the 100 page Executive Summary, then your ignorance of the way The Establishment works precludes you from having an adequate understanding upon which to base a logical conclusion about much of anything, let alone the Moon hoaxes. And it is QUITE in keeping with the way things work to have secret test flights to the Moon before public ones. In the more recent German language contact notes, Billy, Quetzal and Ptaah spend a lot of time discussing this hoax, and I – for one – have NO trouble accepting what they say as fact on this occasion. Things are not as they seem on the surface. Remember the WTC Massacre. :-( Salome, Dyson | ||
Eric_drouin Member Post Number: 127 Registered: 05-2004 |
Hi Board: Matt sticks to facts, remains logical and doesn`t get emotional. I also consider this issue as an unproved affirmation. Perhaps one day there will be some information to confirm the possibility that Apollo 11 did not land on moon. It is not the case now. For those questioning Matt, don't you think it would have been in the interest of the Soviets to show that it was as hoax? They had satellites around the moon too. Why they did not challenge the Americans? Think about it. =>This does not invalidate at all the superb spiritual teachings conveyed by FIGU, in fact MAtt is doing precisely what they want (Plejarans) from us: to learn to think as a free human being without preconceived ideas. Sorry for My 2 cents. I couldn't hold my tongue!!!! Salome | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 815 Registered: 02-2000 |
Gaiaguysnet I believe Meier on Apollo 11. I meant that it was on first hearing of it that it was the hardest of all the things that Meier has said to swallow, given the Conspiracy of it. It is a sad state of affairs. What has really been clear is that a bunch of Sicko's are running this world. I wish Meier would start naming names & specific organizations. | ||
Lonnie Member Post Number: 110 Registered: 12-1999 |
Dear Dyson, You stated: There were reportedly FIVE successful U.S. manned Moon landings PRIOR to the Apollo 11 hoax. Please see: www.gaiaguys.net/MEIER.PROPHECIES.1958.htm (excerpt) 14.) "Even next year on September 13th, 1959, using rocket propulsion, the Earth human, respectively the Soviet Union, will make a hard landing of an unmanned object on the moon; and on April 12th, 1961 an Earth human will climb high in the sky with a rocket to orbit around in the Earth's outer space, then on February 3rd, 1966 an aerospace object will make a soft landing on the moon, then in 1968, the outer fringes of Earth's space will be left, and later the first trip to the moon will be undertaken, whereby up until the year 1972, five (5) manned moon landings will take place through the U.S.A., while a sixth moon landing - supposedly the first - on August 20th, 1969 will rest only on a world-wide staged deceit as a result of the political armament race with the Soviet Union." I agree with Jo. You are WRONG! Nowhere in this prophecy is there any mention of "MANNED" moon landings prior to Apollo 11. If you are familiar with the Apollo program, what took place prior to Apollo 11 is exactly what is stated here in the Meier prophecy. There were many flights in preparation for the moon landings, including MANNED flights to the moon. But there was no manned moon LANDING on the moon until Apollo 12. Apollo 13 as we all know was aborted. Apollo 12, 14, 15, 16 and 17 makes 5 successful MANNED MOON LANDINGS up until 1972 as was foretold. The official Apollo account supports what Billy prophesied in 1958 as being fulfilled except for Apollo 11 which had to be kept secret for national security. Where do you get this idea of manned moon landings before Apollo 11? Billy doesn't pay much attention to the Disclosure Project and neither do I. Regards, Lonnie | ||
Janimetso Member Post Number: 24 Registered: 11-2003 |
Hello, I don't see a reason to doubt Plejaren on this matter. Would the conspirators want to tell suddenly to the people that they have been in the moon before? That they would admit to have conspired? As posted above: ..."sticks to facts, remains logical and doesn`t get emotional"; I don't see anyone else doing contrary here, either, on this matter. It is a different matter to believe something and to trust in something. I, myself, have learned to trust the Plejaren, as well as Billy. I really see no reason not to trust them. They have earned my trust. It is interesting, how, again, the Soviets are being pulled into this matter. I am not claiming that "all is good and righteous in the East" but it is surely not so in the West, either. Salome, Jani | ||
Mhurley Member Post Number: 130 Registered: 04-2003 |
To whom it may concern, There was a massive East / West space race back in the 60s. Do you honestly believe the US could hoax Apollo 11 what with all the Russian agents rife in the US? What a massive gamble it would have been if the Russian's had found out. Get a reality check folks Matt | ||
Scott Moderator Post Number: 786 Registered: 12-1999 |
Matt, Do you honestly believe the WTC was brought down by terrorist, and there was no US involvement and Flight 800 had mechanical problems which led to the fuel tanks igniting causing the plane to explode? With many news stations, video cameras trained on the WTC complex bringing to the world minute by minute footage, wouldn't it have been even more of a massive gamble if something had gone wrong and somehow it was revealed that things weren't as they appeared? If you have studied any of the post 911 information you have to at least stand back for a moment and pause…and think wait a minute….Again, Flight 800 with many witnesses stating something entirely different, but the official line contradicts what people observed on their own. Apollo 11 happened many decades ago, how much evidence do we have presently to prove it one way or the other, in my opinion not too much. But, I believe because of 911 and so much post information coming out, that there is a greater chance of deception on the part of the US government when it comes to the legitimacy of a real Apollo 11 manned moon landing..What would be the motivation of the Plejarens informing us of Apollo 11 being hoaxed...I don't see them or anyone benefiting from such a statement, do you? My 3 cents…… Scott | ||
Jo_jo Member Post Number: 115 Registered: 04-2003 |
Matt, I would suggest that back in the late 60’s – early 70’s, the Americans owned the world press even more than they do now. The Soviets had virtually no way of disseminating information world-wide. Most of us saw the Apollo 11 landing on live TV. Of course it happened! It would be sour grapes and laughable for the Soviets to call it a hoax. Who would believe them? NASA was the gold-standard of rocket science and astronauts were rock-stars. Much more a risk for the Soviets to call it a hoax than for the Americans to perpetrate it. He who controls the press controls the “facts”. Same as it ever was. | ||
Hector Member Post Number: 20 Registered: 04-2006 |
I`d never thought the americans could have hoaxed Apollo 11 before i had heard about Billy Meier.I`d never asked myself because there was no need to,(" we are talking about man`s biggest achievement since invention of the wheel").Such achievement could ever be hoaxed?Such manipulation we have?Do we live in an imaginary world?Sometimes it seems like that,although it is difficult to accept.The disasters of columbia and challenger shuttles proved, broadcasting live, that Nasa hasn`t always done their homework well.If they make such mistakes in 2002,i can imagine in 1969..... The Ussr won the first race when they put an astronaut in orbit.I think the russians had no such pressure to attempt the winner moon landing .I don`t want to hail the russians,but their Mir station and their Soyuz spacecrafts have been quite safer than space shuttles. Then some people question also that in comparison to the gigantic amount of fuel (those saturn 5 rockets)that were necessary for launching in Cape Canaveral,the lunar module fuel tanks were ridiculously small for the comeback journey.It`s said that gravity on the moon is 1/6 the earths`s,and therefore you don`t need so much fuel.But i can`t remember Armstrong or Aldrin "jumping" 10 feet as expected :DD, therefore many suppose gravity is much higher than 1/6 and comeback wouldn`t have been possible. I`m sorry if i added some more doubts,but this is the skeptic`s corner,ain`t it? Saalome , peace in wisdom | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 185 Registered: 03-2004 |
Hi everybody, Perhaps I did misunderstand "...up until the year 1972, five (5) manned moon landings will take place through the U.S.A., while a sixth moon landing - supposedly the first - on August 20th, 1969 will rest only on a world-wide staged deceit..." To be blunt, it is not very important to me now in "this post 9/11 world", but I do have two remarks I’d like to make. We run the risk here of obscuring the wood with the trees. My own deep research into the way the world works leads me to the inescapable conclusion that people who actually think that there was no collusion between the USA & USSR in these secret shenanigans (like the internationally agreed upon ET cover-up) has got his head in the sand. ... for whatever reason, upon which I will not speculate here. People who dismisses the collective work of the Disclosure Project do so at their peril, in the same way and for the same reason that if they dismiss FIGU because of the few bits of deliberate semi-plausible deniability in the info they provide simply DO NOT understand the protocols of these unimaginably advanced and loving ETs. www.tjresearch.info/denial.htm My question from my previous posting remains unaddressed so I'll paste it in here again. Is there anyone here who does not believe (and I use that word deliberately) that the Apollo 11 (there's that number again!) was hoaxed, who has also carefully read all the Disclosure Project data I've linked off of www.gaiaguys.net/ufology.htm ?? The skepticism is very healthy here, but the use of the word "believe" is very revealing. Scott, you make some very good points indeed and saved me the trouble. Australian TV is staring to leave the sinking ship and showed Building 7 being "pulled" (in the words of the leaseholder on national U.S. TV!!!!!) in relation to the Moussoui (fitted with a “stun-belt”!!!! in case he said too much!) show-trial last night. Horrifying. “I,60: My number is 11 …” “II,21: We have nothing with the outcast and the unfit: let them die in their misery. For they feel not. Compassion is the vice of kings: stamp down the wretched & the weak: this is the law of the strong: this is our law and the joy of the world.” (www.gaiaguys.net/Book.of.Law.htm ) Or www.gaiaguys.net/Bersson.htm or www.gaiaguys.net/oto.compassionisvice.htm etc. etc. etc. The truth is out there, waiting for you, as soon as you are ready for it, so wakey wakey all you willful ignoramuses out there! The Golden Age of Knowledge is dawning, and as is written in OM, “The dawn breaks even without the rooster’s crow.” Peace in love/wisdom, Dyson "Doubt everything. Find your own light." -Last words of Gotama Buddha | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 817 Registered: 02-2000 |
I'm sure they launched an empty rocket, or even had the crew on it, but the rocket probably made an orbit & then came right back to earth so the astronauts could then take to the fake stage. The public would never know. I'm more shocked that the Space Race was that important that they even were willing to take the risk of faking it. This in itself opens up a can of worms because who's controlling these events. It must be the same group that was able to cover up the Kennedy assassination. | ||
Technod Member Post Number: 41 Registered: 07-2003 |
skepticlly speaking,the apollo 11 deceit seems to fall in line with the special e.t cover-up topic Mr.Meier and the P`s dicussed on sowing seeds of "". I wonder how much one would learn about pupblic intelligence if you got away with a faked moon landing. yep , Nine One One,!? peace in becoming brian | ||
Savio Senior Member Post Number: 544 Registered: 07-2000 |
Hi Dyson I am confused. >""...up until the year 1972, five (5) manned moon landings will take place through the U.S.A., while a sixth moon landing - supposedly the first - on August 20th, 1969 will rest only on a world-wide staged deceit..." Please confirm if there was 5 manned moon landings before August 20th, 1969 the Apollo 11. If it is true, then the total number of manned moon landings before 1972 would be 10 instead of five. The whole sentence is difficult to read and hard to obtain a clear picture, or perhaps it is that English is not my mother tongue. Salome Savio | ||
Janimetso Member Post Number: 27 Registered: 11-2003 |
Hello, It is my understanding (and English isn't my native language either), that the purported, "manned moon landing" in 1969 was just a hoax, while the five others that came after that were real. This is my understanding. Salome, Jani | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 186 Registered: 03-2004 |
Dear fellow skeptics, I went back to www.gaiaguys.net/MEIERPROPHECIES1958.htm and checked our translation very carefully, and couldn’t find any room for improvement. It was one of the more straightforward translations, as these things go, and both Vivienne and I are confident of its accuracy. Yes, it is a little hard to make sense of, but the translation is not the reason for it this time. (I tend to sometimes let confusing particulars pass, in my capacity as a translator, in order to avoid getting hung up on the details, preferring others to then concentrate on these, while I pursue the bigger picture. And I’m glad they get do the close logical scrutiny that they deserve here from you lot. Keep up the good work!) 14) "Der Mensch der Erde resp. der Sowjet-Union wird schon im nächsten Jahr, am 13. September 1959, ein unbemanntes Objekt mit Raketenantrieb hart auf dem Mond landen; und am 12. April 1961 wird ein Erdenmensch mit einer Rakete in den Himmel hochsteigen, um im äusseren Raum der Erde diese zu umkreisen, danach wird am 3. Februar 1966 ein Raumflugobjekt mit weicher Landung auf den Mond aufsetzen, wonach 1968 der äussere Erdenraum verlassen und später die erste Reise zum Mond angetreten wird, wobei bis zum Jahr 1972 fünf (5) bemannte Mondlandungen durch die USA stattfinden werden, während eine sechste Mondlandung – die angeblich erste – am 20. August 1969 aus politischen Wettrüstungsgründen mit der Sowjet-Union nur auf einem weltweit inszenierten Betrug beruhen wird." 14.) "Even next year on September 13th, 1959, using rocket propulsion, the Earth human, respectively the Soviet Union, will make a hard landing of an unmanned object on the moon; and on April 12th, 1961 an Earth human will climb high in the sky with a rocket to orbit around in the Earth's outer space, then on February 3rd, 1966 an aerospace object will make a soft landing on the moon, then in 1968, the outer fringes of Earth's space will be left, and later the first trip to the moon will be undertaken, whereby up until the year 1972, five (5) manned moon landings will take place through the U.S.A., while a sixth moon landing - supposedly the first - on August 20th, 1969 will rest only on a world-wide staged deceit as a result of the political armament race with the Soviet Union." One can indeed logically infer from the above that there were more manned Moon-landings than we were told about. Why am I not surprised? :-( Has nobody noticed this translation we did up ten months ago of Billy and Quetzal at the 30th contact, October 11th, 1989? (Seek and you will find!) Billy is speaking. (please see: www.gaiaguys.net/Meier.Mondv6p70.htm "Auch nimmt es mich wunder, warum die Amis eigentlich nie etwas davon hören liessen, dass es am Süd- und Nordpol des Mondes grosse Gebiete gibt, wo ständiger Tag herrscht, wie ich gesehen habe, als mir in meiner frühen Jugend im Jahre 1946 von Sfath und dann 1975 auch von Semjase die Möglichkeit geboten wurde, den Mond aus der Nähe zu betrachten und den Raumfahrt-Gerümpel zu sehen, den die Erdlinge dorthin transportierten." "Also it makes me wonder why the Yankees actually never let anything be heard, that on the South Pole and North Pole of the Moon there are big areas where permanent daytime rules, as I had seen, as in my earlier youth in the year 1946 from Sfath and then in 1975 also from Semjase (who) would provide the possibility to behold the Moon from up close and to see the aerospace-junk that the Earthlings had transported there." So who the heck were these Earthlings who trashed the poles, and – in spite of the somewhat vague sentence – left construction refuse behind prior to 1975???? (Hint: who trashes Earth?) If and when anybody makes the effort to logically scrutinize the groundbreaking work of the Disclosure Project witnesses (and I am one of those ex-military men who was asked for and provided my personal testimony www.gaiaguys.net/radar.story.htm ) they might have a better understanding that the entire god-forsaken planet has been run by a shadowy supranational untouchable pedophile elite of Bafath puppets since prehistory. www.gaiaguys.net/vic.links.htm www.gaiaguys.net/AYTF-giza.htm And while we’re courteously debating here about the Moon, innocent children are being skinned alive in horrible occult “satanic” rituals by these degenerates. Let’s please 1.) do our homework, and 2.) re-order our priorities. How would you feel if your little boy was raped, and when you went to the police they told you, "F..k off or we'll kill you!" This is what we get here. In FIGU Bulletin Nr. 51, March 2005, from the article Decay of the Society, Billy wrote, “ … die Verkommenheit vieler Erdenmenschen in dieser Beziehung bis in die Reihen der Priesterschaft, der Polizei und Pädagogen sowie der niederen und hohen Staatsbediensteten usw. reicht, die einander mit allen Mitteln und Lügen sowie Verleumdungen usw. untereinander schützen” ”... he depravity of many earth people in this regard in the ranks of the priesthood, the police and teachers, as well as in the ranks of lower and higher public servants etc. extends to them protecting each other with all means and lies, as well as slander.” www.gaiaguys.net/childabuseearth.htm And here's some of that slander: http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread187745/pg1 If and when you find out what the US/Israel & its canine lickspittles are REALLY up to in the world, you will FORGET about the Moon. Salome, Dyson | ||
Savio Senior Member Post Number: 545 Registered: 07-2000 |
Hi Dyson First of all, a big thank you for your effort on the translation works, way to go Regarding the discussions on the number of manned moon landings, it is not a issue on your translation accuracy, it is also not a debate, it is only that we see discrepancies between two pieces of information from Billy. 1. From Contact 30th “…But after the gigantic American swindle with the so-called Moon landing, that would be cinematically faked for suitable countries, we find that, up to 1972, instead, five Moon landings would actually subsequently come to pass. To be able to prepare and accomplish these landings, the Yankees required more time than they had before 1969. For this reason, and also even because of politics, this gigantic swindle would be staged and all of humanity would be shamefully deceived….” 2. From 1958 Prophecy “…then in 1968, the outer fringes of Earth's space will be left, and later the first trip to the moon will be undertaken, whereby up until the year 1972, five (5) manned moon landings will take place through the U.S.A., while a sixth moon landing - supposedly the first - on August 20th, 1969 will rest only on a world-wide staged deceit as a result of the political armament race with the Soviet Union." Now, from Contact 30, we know that USA did not have enough time before 1969, hence the faked so-called 1st manned moon landing. From 1958 Prophecy, it seems to point out that there were 5 manned landings before August 1969. Hence the two pieces of information goes against each other. To this end, I agree with Lonnie, the misleading part is within the 1958 Prophecy. To understand the 1958 Prophecy, I would read/understand it this way: 1. whereby up until the year 1972, five (5) manned moon landings will take place through the U.S.A., (which is true, everybody can confirm) 2. while a sixth moon landing - supposedly the first - on August 20th, 1969 will rest only on a world-wide staged deceit… The tricky part is the word “sixth” which may easily be confused with the “five” in the first sentence; in fact, these two words have no relationship with each other. Sixth moon landing does not mean sixth [manned] moon landing, hence it could be counted together with all the previous hard/soft unmanned moon landing tests by both the USA and Russia. Now, if we understand both messages as above, there will not be any discrepancies between the two, and conclusion is, there is no manned moon landing before August 1969, only five manned moon landing until 1972. The question is: Can anybody confirm that there were actually 5 hard/soft unmanned moon landing before August 1969? Salome Savio | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 190 Registered: 03-2004 |
G'day Savio! Seems to me that there may have not been time - after all the secret test flights - to organise another public one in time. (?) In more recent contacts, Billy & Ptaah bemoan the fact that this hoax will probably never come to light. One feature of these shadowy rulers is their temerity/audacity. It's what wins them status among their peers. Thanks for your kind words regarding our transations, mate, but I think when excerpts are pasted in here it would be better to also include the original German language too. It helps eliminate one layer of distortion. (What's wrong with a courteous debate? Is that word usage just a semantic issue?) Cheers! Dyson | ||
Savio Senior Member Post Number: 546 Registered: 07-2000 |
Hi Dyson Perhaps it is a good idea to ask Billy whether there were 5 manned moon landings before August 1969 I agree that it would be very difficult for that hoaxed 1st manned landing come to light, well, right until we invented the time machine ^_^ Courteous debate is nice, but it is between two parties with oppositive point of view; we, have the same goal in finding out the truths. Please keep on your great translation work, we are thirsty Cheers!! Savio | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 193 Registered: 03-2004 |
Hi Savio! We're busting to slake your thirst, but I spend a full 10 hour day answering personal emails before I start my other unpaid work. I don't know what the solution is. :-( There is much in the works. Stay bookmarked! Salome, Dyson | ||
Tony Member Post Number: 5 Registered: 01-2006 |
MHurley: "Tony, You need to learn to think for yourself and not just accept automatically everything the Plejarans say. What evidence have you to support the idea that it was all hoaxed? I don't see any. The usual evidence that gets peddled about is all on this site." Hi Mhurley, I believe that people in the know, know that the Plejarens are exactly who and what they are, and i don't believe that the Plejarens or Billy would ever lie to us over such matters. This is why I was a bit puzzled before with what you were saying about how you believe that Apollo 11 was not a hoax, (which was in contradiction to what Plejarens had said on matter) which didn't appear to make much sense to me because I thought that you were one of those people in the 'know' about the Plejarens, and as such thought that you would be one of those people who know that the Plejarens don't tell lie's, and also that the Plejarens only deal/speak in truths too, and not beliefs. And with you taking that view over the Apollo 11 matter being geniune, I see as you believing/saying that the Plejarens are liars/lying. This makes little sense to me as I see by your 'post count' that you are not a new forum member, and also read that you met Billy in person too. ???? | ||
Mhurley Member Post Number: 131 Registered: 04-2003 |
Hi Tony Yes I have met Billy and yes I have been reading his material for a number of years BUT that is not to say I will automatically accept everything they say or for that matter what anyone else says. It's important to keep your own critical eye and I'm sure the ETs would want humans to do that rather than become lazy and just automatically accept everything they say. Regards Matt Hurley | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 196 Registered: 03-2004 |
Hi everybody! I have to agree 100% with Matt here (even though not in the specific case of Apollo 11) and if you read the available English language FIGU literature*, you'll see that there are SEEMINGLY indeed deliberate "fudgings" of the truth here and there when the truth about the truth demands it. And - dare I say it? - a couple of bold-faced lies, if you define that nasty word as simply, "a deliberate untruth calculated to deceive". I KNOW it's done grudgingly and goes against their grain, but I also KNOW it's for our own good. We are not ripe for some truths which can badly burn us, and we MUST not worship these good people EVER AGAIN. Our friend Jim Deardorff treats this topic very cogently @ www.tjresearch.info/denial.htm Remember how these clever Plejaren led us all to believe that they actually came "from" the (uninhabitable) Pleiades star cluster? They sucked me in SIDEWAYS with that because I knew about astronomy, but not advanced ET ethics, and it delayed my introduction to the truth for YEARS! D'oh!!! :-( Don't BELIEVE a word of it. KNOW the truth through your own internal processing of the logical study of the material provided. But don't take my word for it. Salome, Dyson *"Those Who Lie About Contacts..." (see FIGU Shop) is VERY informative in this respect. | ||
Lonnie Member Post Number: 112 Registered: 12-1999 |
Dear Dyson, Everyone appreciates the work you are doing in translating the teachings and other FIGU information. However, some of your personal interpretations are very questionable and not really appropriate to publish along side the teachings or prophetic information. Everyone understands things and looks at things differently. If you are wrong with some of these findings, and I think you are in this case, it can be very misleading, especially if you are in a position of influence. This could end up doing more harm than good. Regards, Lonnie | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 201 Registered: 03-2004 |
Dear Lonnie, Thank you for sharing your views, and for your kind words. Could you please elaborate about specifically which of my findings you feel are possibly harmful? I always welcome constructive criticism, but you've provided me with nothing specific and concrete to build with. Thanks & salome, Dyson | ||
Lonnie Member Post Number: 113 Registered: 12-1999 |
Hi Dyson, Thanks for your response. What I mean is that; TRANSLATING is one thing. UNDERSTANDING and COMPREHENDING the information is another. Whether we know German or not, doesn't matter. There is also, even more information/knowledge that is available only to FIGU members. I have read most or all of the content of your website including the Meier information. This website reaches many people. The forum is also an important, if not more important aspect of the mission. Already in this thread some have become confused about the Apollo 11 thing because of your interpretation of a prophecy, which you seem to state as fact. But, you know, anyone of us can be wrong as far as our opinion goes. I know the Apollo 11 story is only a minor example. But it is possible, having such enthusiasm, to get carried away. Salome, Lonnie | ||
Hector Member Post Number: 26 Registered: 04-2006 |
I wouldnt blame Dyson for being so " enthusiastic".There are people that feel they have to stay passive and people that feel they have to take action.I think Dyson has the right to take the action way.He has read all of Billys Books in German therefore he has a "little" understanding of mission and he feels an inner urge to spread that message in a valid way,to peoples which are prepared to understand that message. His language is harsh,just like Billys,trying to explain,not to convince,and after all we have free will and are mature enough to decide/judge if his posts are good for our spiritual health. We have to help him when he probably wrongly interpretes something,exercising our spiritual wisdom/knowledge.If man would make no mistakes,no prophet would have been necessary...! | ||
Der_beobachter Member Post Number: 48 Registered: 05-2003 |
Bravo Hector!! and like the TJ goes... TJ 23:48. Hart und ohne Erbarmen also werden die Worte der Wahrheit sein, und gar mancher wird ihrethalben in Zorn erwallen. TJ 23:48. "Therefore the words of truth will be harsh and without mercy, and many a person will seethe in rage because of them. TJ 23:49. Die harten Worte der Wahrheit selbst werden belehrendes Gericht und Strafe sein für alle, die irren Lehren nachleben und die Weisheit des Geistes erniedrigen.>> TJ 23:49. "The harsh words of truth themselves will be the instructive judgment and penalty for all those who live according to false teachings and degrade the wisdom of the spirit." Dyson is really doing a good job downunder and I support him and FIGU. Keep up with the good work Dyson and Vivienne mates! Der Beobachter Edelweiß _________________________________________________ "Lernen, ohne zu denken, ist eitel; denken, ohne zu lernen, ist gefährlich..." "Learning without thinking is vain. Thinking without learning is dangerous..." | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 202 Registered: 03-2004 |
Dear Lonnie (et al) You are starting to zero in on your concerns with my postings, but I'm still not being provided with anything specific from you in the way of assistance with what I might be doing wrong. Surely me writing "Don't take my word for it" should be more than an adequate indication that I'm not saying that it's all proven facts. If I write "such-and-such happened" when I refer to a prophecy I translated for you, for instance, naturally I'm only omitting constantly repeated qualifiers like, "according to Billy", etc. since I assumed that that would be understood here at FIGU. If I offer a personal viewpoint, like I agree with Matt about not simply unthinkingly swallowing everything Billy & friends say (like the crop circles being done on home computers nonsense) but not about his conclusions about Apollo 11, then my view is based on logic and my personal experience with the USAF, etc., not dogma. If you could be more specific please, Lonnie, in where you think I've gone wrong, I'm all ears. If not, then your criticism cannot fall into the category of "constructive" for me because you've given me nothing firm to go on. Please be specific. As Hector so rightly pointed out, "We have to help him when he probably wrongly interprets something, exercising our spiritual wisdom/knowledge." That’s why we’re all here, isn’t it? Salome, Dyson P.S. Beobachter, danke für die Blumen! :-) | ||
Lonnie Member Post Number: 114 Registered: 12-1999 |
Dear Dyson, Please forgive me if I have been overly critical. This is not my purpose. I simply made an observation and a comment. It is clear to me that some can be unduly influenced by the personal interpretations of others who are influential, such as yourself, if these are published along side important prophecies we all are aware of, and presented in such a way that they are MADE TO APPEAR AS FACT rather than opinion. Besides, if you are not 100% sure about something it is better NOT to give your opinion! As I said, it one thing to translate and another to comprehend. This must be left to the individual and their own thinking to reason out for themselves. Concerning the Apollo 11 debacle. You stated as fact something that clearly doesn't make sense and for which there is no proof. The effect was that several here began to question what source you are trusting in to come to these conclusions and why you are joining them together as if there is some connection we should be aware of. Do you see my point? It was only a minor incident. But something like this could develop over time if not recognized and contained. I hope you understand. Kind regards, Lonnie | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 205 Registered: 03-2004 |
Dear Lonnie, Nothing at all to forgive. I do not think you were being OVER critical. I think you are being UNDER critical, and I still request some more specifics as to the problems you perceive I have with my understanding of the material. In short, I'm asking for your concrete constructive criticism of where you think I’ve misunderstood Billy’s teachings, not just confusing and nebulous observations. I think you’ve been at this Meier stuff a lot longer than I have, haven’t you? (I only STARTED four years ago!) As far as "opinions" go, you write, "... if you are not 100% sure about something it is better NOT to give your opinion!" My understanding of the meaning of that word is consistent with what my dictionaries say: “judgment or belief resting on grounds insufficient to produce certainty.” How do YOU define it? And isn’t a Discussion Board designed to be a place where we can all freely share our opinions, in the hope of maybe eventually learning more and logically firming them into certainties? We’re all friends here, aren’t we? We can agree to disagree, and argue without rancor, can’t we? I wouldn’t want to feel that my opinions about the teachings were unwelcome HERE, of all places. Just out of curiosity, Lonnie, I take it you have read all of Billy’s published books too? I will certainly try to be even more careful to add, "I think" or "It is my understanding" or "From what I can gather" or "In so far as I can ascertain" or "In my view" or "It has been by experience" and so on and so forth, to the fronts of my sentences, but I thought I'd been doing that enough already or I would have done it more. Anyway, could you please tell me what exactly you are referring to here: "It is clear to me that some can be unduly influenced by the personal interpretations of others who are influential, such as yourself, if these are published along side important prophecies we all are aware of, and presented in such a way that they are MADE TO APPEAR AS FACT rather than opinion." And you also wrote, “As I said, it one thing to translate and another to comprehend. This must be left to the individual and their own thinking to reason out for themselves.” Vivienne and I certainly think that our role (and everybody else’s for that matter) rightly extends beyond mere translations, which – as you know – cannot be identified and completed correctly without first possessing an adequate degree of comprehension. We certainly think that we also have an obligation to help interpret them for those that want this interpretation, and we both try very hard to differentiate what is our own personal interpretation and what is not. Is there something specific I've done with the translations pages that has been confusing as to its source? Please don't be so diplomatic with me, Lonnie. I can take it. :-) And I’m really struggling to understand exactly what it is that you are trying to say to me about Apollo 11 too. What did I say? Thanks. Cheers! Dyson | ||
Der_beobachter Member Post Number: 49 Registered: 05-2003 |
Dear Lonnie and Dyson, Sorry for my intromission in this conversation. I am not sure if you Lonnie have ever seen this video named moontruth.mpg. Therefore Lonnie, please enter here: http://www.gaiaguys.net/moontruth.htm Please Lonnie (and other friends of this Figu Forum) read what is written there and watch it too. Download the video that you will find there linked to the page above. I myself found this video on the web. The original website where it was filed just DISAPPEARED like "magic" the same week when I found the mentioned moontruth.mpg video. But at the time I´ve saved the video and sent it to Dyson that now has it to be downloaded by anyone. His website (gaiaguys) is probably the only website which has this video now. Watch the video mentioned and judge for yourself Lonnie. In this regard - Apollo 11 - I trust in the explanations given by the Plejaren to Billy about this particular Flight to the Moon Apollo. was a HOAX made by U.S.A for reasons of competition with Russia. http://www.gaiaguys.net/moontruth.htm Der Beobachter Edelweiß _________________________________________________ "Lernen, ohne zu denken, ist eitel; denken, ohne zu lernen, ist gefährlich..." "Learning without thinking is vain. Thinking without learning is dangerous..." | ||
Scott Moderator Post Number: 791 Registered: 12-1999 |
Hi Jose, I don't know the source of that video. You know it might be wise not make any assumptions about the moon footage yet until it is really examined and compared to the other Apollo 11 footage. Just like the Alien Autopsy and the altered pictures of Asket and Nera by the MIB....they didn’t turn out as we originally thought, or at least as they were presented. My 2 cents…….. Regards Scott | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 206 Registered: 03-2004 |
Dear friends, Has ANYONE here read the Disclosure Project material I've linked off of www.gaiaguys.net/ufology.htm ??? Only after doing so can an INFORMED opinion be provided about NASA, in my informed opinion. This is, I think, the third time I have asked this question of the NASA-believers, with ZERO replies to it. As they say in OM, "Kein Antwort ist ein klare Antwort." (No answer is a clear answer.) And Scott, I think it's prudent to reserve final judgement about the Asket/Nera photographs. I think they actually ARE photographs of ET women. Where and WHO ARE these ladies? I would have thought that The Establishment would have wheeled them out a LONG time ago for us, if they had been able to. And she's clearly NOT Deano's "Ding-a-ling". Do not underestimate how clever these Plejaren are. We are mere chimps in comparison. Salome, Dyson | ||
Scott Moderator Post Number: 792 Registered: 12-1999 |
Hi Dyson, You certainly like to stir the pot..... I thought about your assertion regarding the Asket and Nera photos...I don't really know what the truth is regarding what is the real origin of the photos. On one hand you have Phobol Cheng saying no, that is not a photo of Asket, because of the hair coloring, than you have the emergence of the Dean Martin pictures which are supposed to be the woman who appear in the photos, and now your opinion that they may indeed be real ET woman. If they are real ET woman, who could they be? Possibly Nera is really Asket and Asket is Nera??? There does seem to be some resemblance between the Dean Martin pictures, but maybe not enough? Salome Scott | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 828 Registered: 02-2000 |
I believe that moon landing video is from a commercial. Its way to hooky to be real even the script is lame. Its defiantly not Armstrong's voice | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 82 Registered: 07-2004 |
The video seems to contrived. The short to the point scene creates the instant illusion of what the skeptics are looking for. This to me feels more like a reverse proof created by the originators of the real fake moon landing, the only ones who would really go out of their way to stage this and muddy the waters further. Black ops/ NASA/ Shadow Gov. incorporated... a friend in america Shawn | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 209 Registered: 03-2004 |
Hi Scott, I think we all have a moral obligation to stir the pot, which has thick dregs on the bottom and a layer of scum on the top after eons of neglect. And what did Semjase say? We need controversy – nothing more than “back and forth talking.” (Actually, BEAM mentions this in Bulletin #56, and a brand new gaiaguys’ English translation is IMMANENT! :-)) Go take a look at the Asket / Nera shots, Scott, and then go look at the lady known as "Ding-a-ling". (on the Net somewhere. Search: "Asket") See her hairline (forehead). Clearly NOT the same lady. Ms. Cheng described Asket as appearing Eurasian, “dark”, and with “dark” hair. Billy also said she was a “brunette”, but, in the FIGU sketch by Christian Krukowski (@www.gaiaguys.net/Fermi.htm) Asket is IDENTICAL to the infamous Asket/Nera photographs! Very blonde! When asked, Billy said he hadn't noticed. The contact notes mention that Semjase – at one stage – died her hair red. (“Our women are not without a certain vanity.”- Ptaah) and if their cosmetic advances over us in 2006 are in line with all the other ones, I would imagine that ET women would not have to resort to painful and dangerous surgery to obtain “the Paris lip” or whatever is the latest trend in feminine beauty. When the fashion gurus dictate that “Legs are long this spring”, all the extraterrestrial fashion victims could go off to the beauty parlor for leg-lengthening. Could this explain (part of) the confusion? Yes, indeed! Who ARE these pretty women in these blurry photographs, and WHY have the two originals NEVER been produced by the mockers and know-it-alls??? (Norm ... which commercial? Wouldn't the skeptibunkers have jumped on it by now? Have you read the DP stuff yet? NASA has a photo-touchup department which airbrushes out ET stuff on the Moon.) Cheers! Dyson | ||
Scott Moderator Post Number: 793 Registered: 12-1999 |
Hi Dyson, Ok, I checked the "Asket" photo, compared to the Dean Martin photo, and yes there is a difference. As you said the hair line is different, plus other subtle differences in the eye area, and the curve of the jaw etc...but now where does Phobol's experience come into play? She saw Asket during the daytime and seemed to remember quite well the coloring of the hair....of course as you say the color could be changed, but what about the darker complexion etc...? Who discovered the Dean Martin images, was this done the Plejaren's??...Back in 1997 or 98 when this controversy broke out I found a number of images from that show on a German website..I kept them and then displayed them on the Plejarens are Real website a few years ago..but I have no idea who posted them on the German website, and it is long gone now..If the purported images of Asket and Nera are real, then what would be the motivation for creating this controversy? As you say, maybe the Plejarens are much more clever than we give them credit for, or at least in the instance? This also makes me wonder about the controversy concerning Lee Elders and Billy’s public apology to him??? ….is this as it appears to be??....I’ll be thinking about this for a bit Scott | ||
Mhurley Member Post Number: 132 Registered: 04-2003 |
Hi All Yes i thought the Asket photo bore little resemblance to the TV show photos too. The shape of the face is different Maybe someone can take the Asket photo and change the hair colour to a brunette and then we can see what Asket really looks like lol Matt | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 211 Registered: 03-2004 |
Dear Scott, Don't you just love it? :-) Why not change skin color, etc., too? Seems easy enough compared to all the other stuff they do, eh? I saw the German pix too, might still have them. (Very very silly hoax/photo manipulations.) Cheers! Dyson | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 833 Registered: 02-2000 |
I thought the Asket pictures were doctored by mixing two different pictures together. So you can't prove it with out copies of both pictures. I can't prove the Nasa video is fake, but I bet it is IMO. If I find proof I will post it. | ||
Tony Member Post Number: 6 Registered: 01-2006 |
Lonnie said: "Dear Dyson, Everyone appreciates the work you are doing in translating the teachings and other FIGU information. However, some of your personal interpretations are very questionable and not really appropriate to publish along side the teachings or prophetic information." Hi Dyson, I don't know what's going on here, or who is in the wrong either, but for me, I don't really care either way who is wrong. All I'd like to say here is if lonnie might be right there in pointing out a mistake you may have made (once?), then I'd just like to let you know for me that I do not care if you made a mistake, and to please don't stop offering your personal interpretations of the Billy's/Plejaren material on your website as well as here as I truely value them very much. I don't expect you to be %100 right all the time. Please keep on offering your personal interpretations at your website as well as here, because I think that if you do stop them that it would be mine as well as perhaps probably other readers loss if you do. I appreciate them greatly, so for me, please keep them coming, thanks. | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 216 Registered: 03-2004 |
Dear Tony! Thank you for your kind words and let me reassure you that I have no intentions of cutting back on airing my personal views here unless asked to do so by a moderator! I'm not upset with the idea that I may have got it wrong, aside (of course!) from not wanting to mislead anybody, and I look forward to hearing back from Lonnie where he thinks I've gone off the straight and narrow track. We have learned that mistakes are for learning from, so I don't shrink from them and pretend I don't make them. I want to learn all I can from all those here who are better informed about the content of the massive amount of info available from FIGU, and - since this is such an open and friendly forum - we ALL have an opportunity to learn valuable lessons from each others’ errors, which is better, I think, that holding the philosophy of a guy that lives near me who once stated to me, "We can only learn from the mistakes we make ourselves." (He's a very unhappy man.) Cheers! Dyson | ||
Scott Moderator Post Number: 805 Registered: 12-1999 |
Norm,Dyson, After reading the article about the Asket/Nera photos it seems the photos from the Dean Martin show were mixed in with the real photos of Asket and Nera, which then depicted resemblances of both. The possible hair coloring of the Dean Martin look alike, with certain facial characteristics of Asket which don't match the Dean Martin photo, could be why the photo does not fit either the complete characteristics of either person. Regards Scott | ||
Apple Member Post Number: 8 Registered: 06-2006 |
If you notice the very short answers from the section: your questions to Meier answered, and look how short they have become over the years with many 'I don't knows' in there; and the very recluse nature of Meier for 35 years - It is indicative of what my above posts say: If WE DON'T START LEARNING and questioning EVERYTHING he says for ourselves ... Expect more hermit -like behavior out of ZH... and the master of HEDGING doing his work to get the above MESSAGE out to us! It is to our advantage to not take as gospel every word this man (because HE said so) utters until examined by each peson so inclined. Then it is not a blind faith thing. Take apart everything Figu wrote over the years and put it back together; until it makes itself to be true or otherwise. | ||
Apple Member Post Number: 6 Registered: 06-2006 |
HY Poster: HECTOR: Listen: Meier said ..correct me if I am mistaken, now... 'Always find the truth out for yourself, do not accept ANY person's word because that would be like docile belief and acceptance'. I can tell you Mr. Meier can be a master of hedging as PTAAH said of him... If we do not make ANY effort on our own, you are going to GET MORE HEDGING from Switzerland,.... and more.... and it will be SO boring for all of us ! It takes EFFORT..it isn't that hard to investigate. | ||
Psycloud Member Post Number: 9 Registered: 06-2006 |
I have a question about the authenticity of a man in Vegas called "Prophet Yahweh" who summons ufos into the sky, would like to know if there is any info on this in the billy meier stuff, and any opinions on what you all think about it. Personally, the fact that it is in Vegas casts my doubts on it. Thanks I am truthful to the extend at which I know the truth. | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 896 Registered: 02-2000 |
Lets continue the Paracast debate here. You guys need to admit that if David Biedny has worked for the big effects houses like ILM. We need these guys on our side. We need Billy to bring something that stumps them. Like an original negative. Or something new thats never been released before I'm sure Billy has it already. I can tell you if David gets Dennis Muran against Meier, then the debate over the pictures will be over for a long time in the eyes of the Media Etc, because Dennis Muran is the best in the history of Hollywood! It will be real hard to convince anyone to disagree with Muran. I just looked up David Biedny's bio on the Internet Movie Database & it not that impressive. I don't see the films he listed on his site. But the IMDB doesn't alway list everything. Visual Effects - filmography Grass (1999) (digital rendering) Spawn (1997) (visual effects supervisor: IDIG Inc.) Hook (1991) (digital department) The Rocketeer (1991) (digital compositor) (uncredited) http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0081317/ My Website | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 897 Registered: 02-2000 |
I was reading their forum, David B. Didn't even realize the Wedding cake ship was moving. He's not that good if he missed that.  My Website | ||
Michael Member Post Number: 517 Registered: 10-2000 |
Hi Norm, A couple of things. First, let's remember that the prior film evidence was authenticated by Wally Gentleman and numerous other experts. Also, the owners of Uncharted Territory (Academy Award for "Independence Day") personally told me that Meier's photos and films were not models, that they'd have to go to CGI to duplicate his films...IF they could. They didn't see the light ship photos but really, it's not that important. The friend of mine that I'm accused of not having (Which is really an enormous back-handed compliment) has these credits - and another full page's worth: Editor - filmography (2000s) (1990s) "Tom and Jerry Tales" (2005) TV Series Behind the Mask of Zorro (2005) (TV) Tom and Jerry Blast Off to Mars (2005) (V) "Krypto the Superdog" (2005) TV Series Balto III: Wings of Change (2004) (V) The Chronicles of Riddick: Dark Fury (2004) (V) Van Helsing: The London Assignment (2004) (V) ... aka Van Helsing Animated Balto II: Wolf Quest (2002) (V) "The Mummy: The Animated Series" (2001) TV Series (multiple episodes) ... aka The Mummy: Secrets of the Medjai (USA: new title) "The New Woody Woodpecker Show" (1999) TV Series "Amazing Tails" (1996) TV Series "Casper" (1996) TV Series ... aka The Spooktacular New Adventures of Casper "Weekly World News" (1996) TV Series Man of the Year (1995) Revenge of the Red Baron (1994) ... aka Plane Fear Filmography as: Editor, Producer, Second Unit Director or Assistant Director, Special Effects, Production Manager, Actor, Writer, Miscellaneous Crew Producer - filmography (2000s) (1990s) (1980s) Tool: Salival (2000) (V) (producer) Neon City (1992) (producer) Pretty Smart (1987) (producer) Hardbodies 2 (1986) (producer) Vendetta (1986) (producer) ... aka Angels Behind Bars Hardbodies (1984) (producer) Second Unit Director or Assistant Director - filmography (1990s) (1980s) Revenge of the Red Baron (1994) (second unit director) ... aka Plane Fear Pretty Smart (1987) (second unit director) Hardbodies 2 (1986) (second unit director) Vendetta (1986) (second unit director) ... aka Angels Behind Bars School Spirit (1985) (second unit director) Special Effects - filmography (1990s) (1980s) Munchie Strikes Back (1994) (special effects) Revenge of the Red Baron (1994) (special effects) ... aka Plane Fear School Spirit (1985) (special effects) Production Manager - filmography Pretty Smart (1987) (production manager) Hardbodies 2 (1986) (production manager) Vendetta (1986) (production manager) ... aka Angels Behind Bars He doesn't want to get involved in the debate but maybe later I'll get his comments on the WCUFO and see if he'll allow himself to be quoted. I actually find DB and GS to be strangely obsessed with ridiculing the Meier case and me. Look, if DB was really serious he would have looked at the video he requested, he would have posted the other picture, etc. At this point there's nothing to be gained by interacting with them any more. Let them carry on and make people curious about the case. We know what the core purposes of the case are and these guys are still stuck in the "paranormal" area. No matter what evidence is presented to them, and they know about Gentleman, Uncharted Terrirtory, Froning, etc. they're still going to defend their egos and, frankly, I don't need to be around when that comes crashing down on them. Just the fact that other experts say it COULD be an accidental triple exposure and that it's IMPOSSIBLE to say if it was deliberate is enough to negate his claims of proof, which can ONLY be valid if he can duplicate it...and you know he won't try and can't do it anyway. We really musn't become like these knuckle-headed cybernuts whose frame of reference is now mainly from what they see on their computers and has nothing to do with the realities, the contributing factors surrounding the evidence. All one has to do is travel around the area there and you get an understanding of the impossibility of one man hoaxing all this magnificent evidence. Let's remember that this case has been going on for 64+ years with good reason. And jokers like DB and GS (and TX, etc.) are the perfect poster boys for why the self-styled "smart" people of this world are so painfully stupid. Other than that, I am interested in what the Muran fellow would say about the WCUFO video, I hope DB directs him towards it. Michael Horn | ||
Mhurley Member Post Number: 138 Registered: 04-2003 |
Hi Michael Playing devil's advocate for a moment. Meier didn't have access to Photoshop to create hoaxes back in the 70s, but then it would also follow that the analysts wouldn't have had access to Photoshop either to go through the photos with a fine tooth comb. Therefore if those analysts could look at the photos again today with Photoshop I wander if they would have reached the same conclusions? Matt Hurley | ||
Michael Member Post Number: 518 Registered: 10-2000 |
Matt, I think that my latest post there will help to clarify things, although I didn't particularly want to stay engaged on this point. But you would also have to just ask the common sense questions such as, how did Meier managed to fool the best technology of the day that was used to test his photographic evidence? Read the photo analysis docuement at my site and you'll see what I mean. You'll also see why none of the people, including Ritzmann, who claim to have duplicated one of Meier's photos, will submit their photos to the same standards of testing. Michael Horn | ||
Language_of_the_birds New member Post Number: 3 Registered: 06-2006 |
Hello Skeptics and Know-it-alls of Planet Earth. This is to let you know there is a NEW FIGU BULLETIN SPECIAL NR. 25 ONLINE http://www.figu.org/de/figu/bulletin/index.htm "...In respect to Kenneth Arnold we have found out through our three-year investigations that he did not observe any extraterrestrial flying objects but secret US test flights of one-winged aircraft..." "...The Gizeh Intelligences transposed via teleprojection apparent realities with visionary experiences into a few others, like Dan Fry and Schmidt etc., who then considered these as reality. An Excerpt of the FIGU-Special-Bulletin No. 25: FIGU-Sonder-Bulletin Nr. 25, Juli 2006 2 Das Neueste in bezug auf Belange usserirdischer, UFOs,Plejadier/Plejaren, Kontakte, Entführungen, Examinationskontakte und Implantate Vierhundertvierundzwanzigster Kontakt Samstag, 17. Juni 2006, 17.03 Uhr The Newest In Regard To Matters Of Extraterrestrials, UFOs, Pleiadiens/Plejarens, Contacts, Abductions, Examination Contacts and Implants 424th Contact Saturday, June 17th 2006, 5:03 pm Billy Aha. – Dann noch eine Frage bezüglich der Einflüge ausserirdischer Fluggeräte in den irdischen Raum, die von euch früher einmal auf jährlich rund 3000 beziffert wurden. Muss man davon ausgehen, dass es sich bei diesen Fluggeräten nur um solche eurer Föderierten und von euch selbst gehandelt hat? Darauf habt ihr euch nie näher eingelassen, um eine Erklärung zu geben. Und was war denn mit Kenneth Arnold, der in den Vierzigerjahren bei einem Flug mit seinem Privatflugzeug mehrere UFOs gesehen haben will; und was ist mit Betty und Barney Hill, die von Aliens entführt worden sein sollen, wie auch viele andere, die unter Hypnose von Kontakten und Entführungen sowie von medizinischen Untersuchungen usw. durch die Entführer gesprochen haben? Und was ist mit den Gizeh-Heinis, den Sirianer-Black-Men und ihren Genossen sowie der Brasilianergruppe? Ptaah Nein, das ist nicht so, wie du sagst. Nebst uns und diversen von unseren Föderierten waren es die letzten zwei Jahrhunderte auch wenige andere Erdfremde, die in den irdischen Raum einflogen. Im grossen und ganzen aber waren die jährlichen 3000 Einflüge auf uns und unsere Föderierten sowie auf Asket und in wenigen Fällen auf Erdfremde zurückzuführen, die dann unserer Föderation beitraten. Die Einflüge haben sich in der Zwischenzeit aber gesamthaft sehr drastisch auf wenige Dutzend pro Jahr reduziert, wobei sich diese auch nur noch auf unsere Arbeit und auf die Besuche bei dir beziehen. Bis auf einen Fall sind alle Erdfremden, die in den irdischen Bereich einflogen, unserer Föderation beigetreten, nachdem wir mit ihnen in Kontakt traten, wie ich schon sagte. Was die Gizeh-Intelligenzen, die sirianischen Black-Men betrifft, ist das eine andere Angelegenheit, die auf Tausende von Jahren zurückreicht, während die Brasilianergruppe aus ehemaligen Nazis bestand, die sich eines Objektes der Gizeh-Intelligenzen bemächtigen konnten, wie wir ebenfalls abklären konnten. Diese Gruppe besteht heute jedoch nicht mehr, während die Gizeh-Intelligenzen in Verbannung geschickt wurden und am Aussterben sind. Die sirianischen Black-Men zudem sind seit ihrem letzten bösartigen Wirken gegen dich von Kräften ihrer Heimatwelt aufgebracht und in Gefangenschaft gesetzt worden. Auch sie stellen also keine Bedrohung mehr dar. Hinsichtlich Kenneth Arnold haben wir durch unsere dreijährigen Abklärungen herausgefunden, dass er keine extraterrestrische resp. erdfremde Flugobjekte, sondern damals geheime US-amerikanische Testflugzeuge einflügliger Technik beobachtet hat. Das gilt auch für diverse andere gleichartige Fälle jener Zeit, was sich jedoch nicht nur auf die USA beschränkte, sondern sich auch in anderen Staaten ergab, die futuristische Fluggeräte testeten, was gleichermassen heute noch geschieht. Einige andere, wie Dan Fry und Schmidt usw., wurden durch die Gizeh-Intelligenzen teleprojektiv in Scheinrealitäten mit visionären Erlebnissen versetzt, die sie als Realität erachteten. Ptaah No, that is not the way it is. In the last 200 hundred years, there were also a few others apart from us, and various others from our federation, who flew into earth’s space. On the whole, however, the 3000 flights taking place per year are traceable to us and to our federation, as well as to Asket, and in a few cases to beings foreign to earth who later on joined our federation. The number of flights has decreased drastically to a number of twelve per year since then; and these flights relate to our work with you and our visits. Except one, all the beings foreign to earth who flew into earth’s space have joined our federation after we contacted them as I have already said. As to the Gizeh Intelligences and the Sirian men in black, that is another matter which leads back many thousands of years, whereas the Brazilian Group consisted of former Nazis who were able to take over an object of the Gizeh Intelligences, what we also were able to find out. This group does not exist anymore today, and the Gizeh Intelligences were sent into exile and are becoming extinct. In addition, the men in black were rounded up and taken into custody through forces of their home world after their last evil attacks against you. They also do not pose a threat anymore. In respect to Kenneth Arnold we have found out through our three-year investigations that he did not observe any extraterrestrial flying objects but secret US test flights of one-winged aircraft. This is also true for various other cases of that time, which, however, was not only limited to the USA but also took place in other countries that tested futuristic aircraft, which still happens today. The Gizeh Intelligences transposed via teleprojection apparent realities with visionary experiences into a few others, like Dan Fry and Schmidt etc., who then considered these as reality. NOW READ ABOUT ROSWELL BELOW... ...Ptaah Das ist richtig – wir waren lange Zeit nicht in der Lage, gesamthaft alles an Einflügen Erdfremder zu überwachen. Durch unsere technischen Neuerungen konnten wir nun aber während der letzten drei Jahre das ganze 19. und 20. Jahrhundert sowie auch die ersten Jahre dieses 21. Jahrhunderts lückenlos überprüfen. Das Ergebnis der Abklärungen ist das, wie ich es dir bei meinem letzten Besuch am 10. Juni und jetzt genannt habe. Tatsächlich gesichtete Fluggeräte ausserirdischer Herkunft führten seit dem Jahr 1800 bis heute 2006 ausschliesslich auf uns Plejaren und auf die fünf genannten anderen und nun unserer Föderation angehörenden Erdfremden zurück sowie auf jene, welche wir nicht kontaktieren konnten und die uns fremd blieben. Die Sache mit Roswell ist dabei ein anderer und spezieller Fall, weil dort damals nicht menschliche Lebensformen, sondern bioorganische Androiden im Spiel waren. Auch für die heutige Zeit ist zu sagen, dass wenn Fluggeräte – auch Telemeterscheiben – ausserirdischer Herkunft im irdischen Luftraum gesichtet werden, diese einzig und allein zu uns Plejaren und zu unseren Föderierten gehören. Kontakte mit Erdenmenschen werden dabei keine aufgenommen, und ausser dem Kontakt zwischen uns und dir existieren keine weiteren. Das wird sich erst dann ändern, wenn andere Erdfremde offen auf der Erde landen und offiziell Kontakt aufnehmen werden, was jedoch erst geschehen wird, wenn wir uns zurückgezogen haben. ....Ptaah That is right – for a long time, we were not able to watch altogether everything pertaining to flights of beings foreign to earth. But now through our newest technology, we could investigate the whole of the 19th and the 20th century, and the first years of the 21st century. The result of this investigation is that it is how I told you on my last visit on June 10th, and how I have said it now. The fact is, that since 1800 until now 2006 the flying objects observed from outer space solely belonged to us Plejarens and the five others mentioned who joined our federation and those we could not contact and have remained foreign to us. The thing about Roswell is another and special case, because back then bioorganic androids were found. And one also has to say now, that when flying machines as well as telemeter discs originating from outer space are seen, then these belong only to us Plejarens and our federation. Contacts with earthlings do not take place, and apart from the contact with you, no other contacts exist. That will only change when other beings foreign to earth land openly and take up contacts, which will only happen then when we have left. Read the COMPLETE contact report OFFICIAL TRANSLATION in English made by FIGU. Enter here and spread it all over the planet. http://www.figu.org/de/figu/bulletin/s25/the_newest.htm http://www.figu.org/de/figu/bulletin/s25/the_newest.htm Diejenigen, die das Mysterium erfahren, reden darüber nicht. Diejenigen, die darüber reden, haben das Mysterium nicht erfahren Versuche nicht, über das Unaussprechliche zu reden, "Those who have experienced the Mystery don’t speak about it. Those who do speak about it have not experienced the Mystery." Lao Tse | ||
Steelraptor New member Post Number: 1 Registered: 08-2006 |
I don't know if anyone has seen the studio mishap clip or not, but if anyone wants to see it, e-mail me at SteelRaptor24@aol.com It is a clip pertaining to the 1969 moon landing. I am new here and like to tell everyone hi. I felt after reading the journals that instead of finding the DNA discrepency on our own through evolution after almost destroying ourselves in the process, doesn't anyone feel that just maybe the Plejarens should give us the technology to reverse the process that makes us 'warlike' and 'destructive', and 'evil' and 'age prematurely'? We didn't do this to ourselves, their offshoots did. They have the ability to reverse this process, we are their children. I think most of us as a whole could handle interaction with beings not of this world, especially if they are human. If they still feel it wouldn't be plausible, then they could set up a meeting in a secure place, a certain place at a certain time, say in orbit when they know the space shuttle will be in orbit. You can't get anymore secure than that. have the cameras and recorders, everything we would need. I don't say I do believe but I don't say I don't either. Our history DOES get pretty sketchy and dim before about 5,000 years ago. These Billy Meier journals are something to keep in mind. Besides, I reather like the fact that we have been around for billions of years....lol, it would also explain why no intelligent life had sprung from this planet in the few billion years before us. Before a friend of mine gave me a link to the Billy Meier journals, I had been working on a fictional novel, not too deep into it yet, but these journals do let me play with my story a bit. As of now, the title is "Time Aggressive" but don't expect it to be out anytime soon, i still have to splice all my ideas together to finish a good story line. I don't want this one to end stupidly or suddenly. Thanks for letting me blab. | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 956 Registered: 02-2000 |
I felt after reading the journals that instead of finding the DNA discrepency on our own through evolution after almost destroying ourselves in the process, doesn't anyone feel that just maybe the Plejarens should give us the technology to reverse the process that makes us 'warlike' and 'destructive', and 'evil' and 'age prematurely'? We didn't do this to ourselves, their offshoots did. They have the ability to reverse this process, we are their children. Steelraptor, I said the same thing a few months ago on this forum. Before a friend of mine gave me a link to the Billy Meier journals You mean figu.org? My Website | ||
Cpl Member Post Number: 170 Registered: 08-2004 |
It might be a rational argument to request the Ps give us this gene-unblocking technology; but just think of the benefit to us when we discover and mend it for ourselves. We are that close to it now that it would be a shame in one way if they were to rob us of this great goal that has taken us more than millions of years to reach just as we reach the threshold of solving it for ourselves. IMO we have to, and are close to being able to, prove ourselves capable, and not in need of having the answers handed to us. cpl | ||
Klausmaus New member Post Number: 3 Registered: 07-2006 |
The top priorities are to reduce the world’s population and to reduce the aggressive tendencies of the people. It doesn’t help much to extend the life span before those issues are resolved. We don’t need 15 billion people on the planet competing for increasingly depleted resources. In our present state it’s a Catch-22. The Religions, governments and big business all advocate growing the population. Maybe if the aggressive tendencies could be eradicated, people would be more reasonable in approaching the overpopulation problem. | ||
Hector Member Post Number: 87 Registered: 04-2006 |
15 billion people overpopulating this small beautiful blue planet and human life expectancy of about 400 years? Ough,what a terrible future! I think any human being should be given the opportunty to live that long if he is aware of the problems of his community,country or even the world.He should follow natural/creational laws first. There are also some disadvantages.There are some people that just cause problems in their lifetimes,and their recovery from error o their learning is non existent or is stagnated.Bush,Blair main example. Do you imagine people like these living 400 years? We as species are not mature enough,it`s sad to say.Just watch todays Lebanon conflict. Please,P`s don`t give us the solution to the aging gene until we`re ready.Thanks! | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 966 Registered: 02-2000 |
Just think how many people would learn the error of their ways after a few hundred years & learn to correct them. Rather than start from scratch every 50-70 years in a new body with no memory of what they did the last time. I would rather we all had the lifespan Creation created for us than what these past scum Ets did to us. My Website | ||
Klausmaus Member Post Number: 6 Registered: 07-2006 |
They might learn the error of their ways if the bad seeds were banished to a desolate continent devoid of any technology to prevent further war-mongering (much like the history of Australia). Short of that, the bad seeds like Bush, Cheney and Blair would just have more time to concentrate their power and domination. Isn’t that why political terms are often limited? | ||
Vestri Member Post Number: 49 Registered: 02-2006 |
yes, good point Norm. So many other things would be better if we all had a long lifespan too, like we all would be able to educate ourselves much better, and other things like scientists in every field would have much longer time to live so that they could extent their learning and studies of their scientific field so much further then what they could take it too now with their current short lifespan lives of 80 years. We could build spaceships and have space travel in shorter time and migrate to another planet and this would fix the overpopulation problem. We could also learn much more of the spirit teachings too if we had hundreds of year lifespan bodies. | ||
Scott Moderator Post Number: 850 Registered: 12-1999 |
This topic area is intended for those who may not feel the Billy Meier contacts are real and/or would like to clarify and resolve related issues | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 984 Registered: 02-2000 |
All these years I believed that B & B Hill were telling the truth because of the Meier information & they may still be but. The Plejarens simple explanation just doesn't cut it. Anyone thats studied the Betty and Barney Hill case knows Barney Hill never wanted to admit he was abducted by a UFO or that he even saw a UFO. To think that "electromagnetic fields" caused them to be so delusional is a little hard for me to buy into. I will admit I am no expert in that area. I would except Giza influence more easily. Also didn't Billy confirm that there were extraterrestrials from Zeta Reticuli??? Where did the star map come from? How did Betty know of amniocentesis? Was it a procedure widely used in the early 1960s? There are just too many question marks regarding this case the Plejarens need to explain it better. Also The Bill Hermann Zeta Reticuli case, didn't Meier confirm that case as well or was that Wendelle Stevens making the link? My Website | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 261 Registered: 07-2005 |
G'day Norm Check this out Norm, it may be of interest to your queries. 196. This Earth human already stands under the influence of these malicious beings. 197. Oftmals wird er durch sie in einen Trancezustand versetzt, und dann werden ihm die Bilder übermittelt. 197. Often he is transferred into a trance state by them and then the images are transmitted to him. 198. Er empfindet und fühlt dabei alles genauso, als wenn er es in Wirklichkeit hören, sehen, fühlen und erleben würde, obwohl er nur irgendwo liegt und schläft und ihm alles als Traum eingedrängt wird. 198. He thereby perceives and feels everything exactly as if he hears, sees, feels and experiences it in reality, although he only lies and sleeps somewhere, and everything is impressed into him as a dream. 199. Im Wachzustande werden ihm dann ebenso wie seinen Freunden und Bekannten Bilder von Raumschiffen vorgegaukelt, die sogar so wirklichkeitsgetreu projiziert werden können, dass sie jedermann auf Filme zu bannen vermag. 199. In the state of being awake, he will be just as much tricked as his friends and acquaintances by images of space ships which indeed can be projected so true to reality that anyone can catch them on film. 200. Diese Erscheinungen sind aber ausnahmslos nur nebelhafte und holographische Gebilde, die keine eigentlichen Konturen aufzuweisen vermögen. 200. These appearances are, however, without exception, only nebulous and holographic pictures which are not able to exhibit actual contours. http://www.gaiaguys.net/meier.v1p312,313.htm Just as I believe that maybe the UFO sighting I had about a week and a half ago could have been an holographic projections, especially the ones that flew very close in front of me in clusters like swarms of bees. Maybe our logical reasoning has its limits when it comes to ET technical abilities and thus my only conclusions to the betty and barney hill's encounter would be that through electromagnetic means, they may have been influenced by either the Gizeh intelligences as you've alluded to or that simply an unknown ET races were involved in it. From reading their account, I was also of the firm belief that they had had a real abduction encounter and was surprised by Ptaah's response. So theres a bit of question mark hanging over this issue somewhat. Anyway just a suggestion, none that I can irrefutably answer. Cheers Norm. | ||
Truthseeker Member Post Number: 163 Registered: 03-2003 |
Greetings Norm, I figured you'd comment on this sooner or later. I have to admit that I've thought the same thing as yourself, because even-though it became clear that Semjase herself had error-ed in a number of her statements with Billy, I am still of the impression and feeling that the Betty and Barney Hill case did still in fact happen despite the Plejarens now saying otherwise. Besides, both Billy and Semjase not only had extensive conversations concerning the Zeta Reticuli, but I seem to remember Semjase having stated herself as to having met these beings in person along with Billy asking her to draw a sketch of them, which she later describes as the resemblance of a comic book Character known as "Fantomas". However I am quite aware that Betty Hill did continue to later make false claims of her still being in contact with these ET beings in and around her home for years after, so I can see how such embellished claims from people can and do still in-fact trip up the Plejarens in their investigations, since we have to remember that the Plejarens are or appear to be people who think in absolutes, unlike most Earth human ways of thinking. I've wondered about this myself concerning Betty Hill. I see the Plejarens and Billy did correct their statements regarding... -Daniel Fry; when considering his time of contact beginning in 1952 along with his wife Tahahlita who later filmed a UFO that were both reminiscent of the GIZA & X-German Haunebu II. (Film frames later stolen by Fritz Van Nest) -Kenneth Arnold did in fact see UFOs that were not saucer shape but rather resembled pre world war II X-Nazi flying wing jets known as the The "Ho-IX", which were exceeded twice their speed by the Americans resulting in a skipping motion. I personally wondered about this concerning a former incorrect statement made by James Gilliland, which he obviously took from Semjase's former incorrect statement found in "Messages from the Pleiades, book 2". -A statement about Reinhold Schmidt by Semjase was finally corrected to Asket's earlier statement. Now Billy and the Plejarens have yet to correct one more statement regarding Artur Berlet and his UFO contact from planet Acart (K=German spelling), which details quite extensively years before the Plejarens made their obvious same comparable statements regarding such a planet to Billy years later. Finally, I'm also under the impression that the false claims made by George Adamski may will have being further still reinforced by the hypnotic influences of the GIZA. Peace in being, James Truthseeker | ||
Kiril Member Post Number: 100 Registered: 12-2005 |
Topic : The "Paracast" debacle ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Many of you will not appreciate the re-surfacing of this subject, however I ask that you please consider what I have to present below. Shortly : I attempted to perform an independent analysis of the image in question, by following the exact steps Biedny took to analyse the image in 'Photoshop' - some months ago I sent a request to Biedny for these steps but I have not received a response. I thus attempted to produce his results without these steps : At this point, after having reproduced nearly every characteristic of his images - that is, hue, contrast, 'levels', .etc AND my own combination of settings(I am an experienced user of photoshop), I have not been able to reproduce the line at the top of the image which was revealed in his analysis(there is another person at the paracast forums who found s/he could'nt reproduce it) - that I consider the most damning of his findings. Also during my analysis I came to the conclusion that due to the JPEG-compression-artifects it would be very difficult to distinguish between a line of a film superimposed and a line of an artifact:  Note - Although this image shows the red channel(which like the green channel tends to reveal fine details) of the image in question the same artifacts are revealed when one begins to increase the color levels of the green and blue channels(most prominent in the red and green) - which is what he has done in his analysis of the image. As to the other problems with the image pointed-out, there is only one which stands out - the extension of the footpath over the car wheel instead of behind - which requires further investigation(much more-so then that carried out by Biedny) for a proper conclusion to be made. In conclusion, what I wish to show here is that those who have claimed the image in question is a hoax don't really have a solid base for argument. If however the line revealed in his analysis was shown to exist on the original image, I would be deeply indoubt of the authenticity of the image. PS. I've been playing with anumber of the night-time images of the 'wedding-cake ship' and found very unusual hidden features(features that are not a product of JPEG artifacts). Is anyone interested to view them? ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Kiril | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 160 Registered: 07-2004 |
Biedny was a one trick pony and really sank himself early on in the discussion, when he claimed a WCUFO was a "cardboard cutout" in one of Billy's movies. His moment as some type of authority vaporized when he repeated that claim a second time. As if a pro would miss a clearly obvious movement and just as well deducing that the distance would have the cut out being some monstrously huge size. I think it's great you pursued the truth and have armed yourself with some of your own research materials to counter the kooks and paid debunkers with their "easily reproducible " claims. But I'm not interested in beating a dead horse with a stick. Biedny is very much dust, (strictly my opinion) and doesn't deserve to be mentioned, except in the occasional chuckle... You could try creating a program that breaks down the questionable pics and build a little database to quickly access and put out the fire of the next "pro" that asserts their expertise. I'd like to see something like that for sure... a friend in america Shawn | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 643 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi All... Well, that the Plejarans mentioned that Kenneth Arnold encountered: NOT Disc-shaped crafts but Wing-shaped, is not really that of a surprise to me! I once saw on an image-drawing (from a magazine): Him and "Delta-Shaped" crafts/objects, rather than what was said all these years: the so-called "Disc-shaped" crafts/objects. It got me a bit confused back then, but this could have been the first True (Image) Facts...of the crafts being the - Delta-Winged -. And that the illustrator was up-to-date with these facts!? And thus, drew the drawing to those True specifications. And concerning - Hypnosis -: Billy did always mentioned to be "Cautious" with Hypnosis...which I fully agree with. A Hypnotherapist can easily address a question that may generate what is being asked, rather than something that is generated with Truth, of an/the incident...etc. Thus, in this manner a Scenario can be "implanted" which would have NO Truthful value what so ever. But, this does not mean that Hypnosis is not of good use, though. There was once someone murdered in the city I live in, and thanks to Hypnosis the police did managed to let a Hypnotherapist hypnotize some witnesses, way back...to seeing the getaway vehicle, and to see the license plate(even though it was at night), and through seeing this license plate the police managed to arrest the killers. Edward. | ||
Rarena Member Post Number: 62 Registered: 10-2005 |
Hi Norm, As to the BB Hill case, have spoken with the lead investigator when he has come to my neck of the woods on previous UFO seminars, Stanton Freidman. Betty Hill was hynotically regressed and was conscious the entire time of the incident. Barney was terrified and had to be kept "under". He remembered some of the first initial sighting but was "under" most of the time. Betty, under hypnosis was given the suggestion to recreate the star map that was drawn by her after she was shown by her "investigators" where they came from. Do you know where you are in this map they asked, and she said she did not know. Later after the map had circulated several years a third grade teacher had a copy of the "brookings" (I may be incorrect about this) star maps and recreated a map in her living room that was a six foot by six foot cube with pearls suspended by thread as "m class" star systems (capable of human inhabitation). She concentrated on the 5 to 20 light year distances. She and her friends looked for a similar pattern as the Betty Hill regression drawing, but alas no cigar... It was not until a few years later that a new star map came out indicating the previous one was incorrect and this lady again corrected this error in her living room model. This is common as the triagulation is very slight on distant stars, magnitude vs distance errors. At that time she found a match to Betty Hills' regression drawing in the southern hemisphere (not visable from where she lives). It was the Zeta Reticuli four light years away. If you require further reading Stanton Freidman a very intelligent and interesting man... will most likely provide you with a copy of: "The Zeta Reticuli Incident" for a nominal fee providing a more in-depth analysis for your perusal. Randy ô¿ô | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 990 Registered: 02-2000 |
Randy, I've studied enough of the B&B case. Stanton Freidman thinks the Meier case is a fake so I don't trust his opinions. He thinks the reason there's no UFO disclosure is that each country doesn't want to unite. Which in my opinion is completely nuts. My Website | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 161 Registered: 07-2004 |
Norm is right about Stanton, he's only a mouth piece for the people who truly fear Billy's message. Namely the Roman Catholic Church who would suffer the most if Billy's story became mainstream. Stanton's able to remain a viable Ufologist by backing the Roswell incident. He can do this because the church doesn't care about the governments need for secrecy regarding that event. Stanton sounds realistic, but thats just because he's had so much practice and he sticks to what he knows he can get away with. He should rate a big zero for his avoidance and debunking of Billy's case. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Truthseeker Member Post Number: 165 Registered: 03-2003 |
I find Stanton Freidman is notorious for accusing so many other Ufologist for not having university credentials, because he prides himself so much on his own nuclear physicist credentials . | ||
Rarena Member Post Number: 63 Registered: 10-2005 |
Stanton Freidman is a typical scientist yet he is a friend of mine. He studied my father's involvment in NASA/JPL and Stanford very thoroughly. In order to communicate with this section of our community (I.E. the human race and people of Earth) we have to educate them whether they/we feel it is needed or not. There are many just "the other side of the veil of truth" who may benefit from this and cross over, closer to our way of thinking. If they are overly religious, or set in their ways,or not able to see beyond "the way things are" our guidance may be a lost cause and other directions more advantagously traveled. Billy said the truth was harsh and many have defense mechanisms/systems which don't allow them to see it quite as easily as others. We are all in this thing together, the Plejaren, scientists and those like us; who research the fringe areas of science. We all also have our foibles and faux pas (excuse my French) and the Plejaren are so highly advanced comparativly... that our own technology and spiritual attitude towards truth seems juvenile. Stanton... for example, is aware, and able to produce, with known Earth materials, a craft able to reach the speed of light and reach Zeta Reticuli system within four years. Not many others can make that claim. He is also aware we are not alone which...in itself, is very open minded. People also change, but it is my philosophy for example, to make decisions quickly yet change my mind slowly. According to Billy, the BB Hill case was a true encounter situation and Stanton was lead investigator being inquisitive and open minded enough to report it throughly and accurately. That speaks for itself. Many people will not allow themselves to discover this amazing information for many years to come. Many will take this information and use it against us, it is only human nature... at our stage of evolution. Only someone without clouded judgement, able to see clearly... the truth... can educate the majority of people who are unwilling to learn. They will eventually, but in the meantime... it is our creational responsibility to help them by relating our knowledge and wisdom of the Meier case without opinions or labels about their behavoir. This information is an amazing journey of knowledge and discovery and it is a pleasure to learn it along with you. With Love... Randy ô¿ô | ||
Hector Member Post Number: 100 Registered: 04-2006 |
Friedman`s problem can be common to many physicist/scientists.We tried to show the people of the paracast a few truths about the Meier case and the UFO`s.(Billy's work is almost entirely dedicated to the spirit lessons,UFOlogy is secondary). But they just wanted the REAL pic.They tried to ridicule Michael Horn to the extreme,because he could not bring " a real pic".With Photochopz and 10 minutes of free time they could easy debunk and ridicule Billy`s 60 years of hard work.That is plain stupid,as well as not fair. Stanton`s mind will be programmed with variables such as Einstein,Newton,speed of light,energy,matter,celestial bodies,all kind of equations,physics,time,space and theories.That`s ok,but exactly that is limiting him from discovering the rest of the truth.His perceptions of the world are shrinked into physics.Billy`s statements or truths clash with modern/classic physics.That is why nobody pays attention.Faster then light? Whoh? And what do we do now with that smart relativity theory? We know,thanks to Billy,that UFO`s and other human beings in the universe are not just plain physics and extreme technology.And 95% of UFO researchers out there concentrate only on technical matters. It is self-evident that if a race is capable of interstellar travel,they are also 1000s of years ahead in their consciousness evolution.They cannot have a monkey`s brain.Why does nobody pay attention to that? Skeptic answer => denial => why ? we are alone in the universe,why worry about that,races with a superior intellect... Why so many skeptics? I have few reasons. - On the one hand,the government hides us UFO existence proof.=> non existence. - UFO`s contradict science (acceleration,speed of light)=> denial - The way to the truth is full of obstacles(religions,secrets,dangers).=>weariness - Fear of the unknown => denial. All these factors summed up prevent,hinder the human being`s consciousness leap, spiritual and technical evolution. Stanton Friedman must set him free from the "pure scientific deterministic" trap,and the average earthling must set him free from the religious trap.Once freed,we will see and understand clearer then ever. Saalome... | ||
Tony Member Post Number: 64 Registered: 01-2006 |
I saw Stanton Friedman give a UFO lecture here in Melbourne Australia about 10 years ago now. He was Ok, but most of his talk was repeatitive, about how 'UFO are real' and that 'there is a government and military conspiracy going on'. During question time at the end, I asked him the question why is it that he is being allowed by the powers that be to disclose top secret information on the reality of the UFO factor, when many before him were either ridiculed, sacked or silenced. He didn't have much to say about that, and what he did say about that, didn't really answer that question either. | ||
Paul Member Post Number: 12 Registered: 08-2006 |
I have a real problem with contact 323 in which semjase orates like Joseph Gobbels about Aryans and Israel. Sounds like a bunch of National Socialist propaganda to me. I think this nullifies all that this is about. All humans are souls incarnating many times for progression in spiritual development. I cannot believe that Jews or Israel is the only problem on this planet as made out to be. There is no talk of Mohammad being a pedophile, rapist and plunderer that he was just a free pass and attack the Jews. What of the other progressions of other groups of people on the planet at the time. Were not the Egyptians warring. Were not the Babylonians warring. Oh just describe the Jews as pestilent beings always causing trouble. Never allow them to get a place in the world to live. Also the Talmud JImmanuel thing. Show documents that this is real and credible. All I know is that this information is gotten from beings following a convenient code of Creation conduct and secrecy allowing the spewing of this vile information without challenge or proof. All this is suspicious. Why would advanced beings contact a farmer uneducated individual such as Meier. I would have suspected someone like Miku Kaku or Stephan Hawking to better contact if information is credible. To pass all this National Socialist propaganda get a dirt farmer in Switzerland to advance the Father Land. Sorry guys I don't buy this at all. On a different note check and see what Israelis have to offer in regard to helping humanity. Even the very Arabs that are trying to annihilate them, Israelis are working on a solution for some genetic defect that kills Arab infants. Stem Cell research is phenomenal in regards to repairing and regenerating organ tissue in patients. Wow these sound like people who are vile sneaky humans out to disrupt world politics. Thank you for your time. | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 269 Registered: 07-2005 |
To Paul Patience Paul, real patience As it has been repetitively beaten to the bone, on the outset by those not familiar with Billy's materials beyond the cursory, the mistake is actually not knowing enough or having the necessary grasp of the totality of the jigsaw puzzle weaved and put together to form a complete picture of many things that encompasses the information, that people grudgingly oppose or impatiently conclude with what little information they'd managed to scrounge that we see the same old broken record of objections being uttered again and again. And as it is befitting of such situation, those that in the know always have one avenue of response. That is, you must do your homework, read, read, and read and then think, think and think some more and then, question, question and question and then search, search and search for the answers before you make your mind up and object to it. use these tools man- WHAT, WHEN, WHY, HOW, WHERE, WHO | ||
Markc Member Post Number: 370 Registered: 06-2000 |
Hi Paul ; You are a whiner . I can sympathize with at least some of your concerns , however , it has been said before on this forum that the Plejarens make no racial judgements or against anyone , Israel as a GOVERNMENT is cited as having a particular leaning which will always in their own mind make them right ,or at least more important than others . A choice on their part which will either make them choose to diminish respect for their neighbors and others or to eradicate their neighbors completely . So in effect this is not about the people , but their government , and of course their religion has played a large part in their world view of singular importance . If they are the Chosen and any others are not , then think for a moment what that means in terms of equality , which they obviously don't believe in . In terms of prejudice , it reads clearly against those who are not chosen . Your insulting comment about Meier being a dirt farmer reveals your ignorance concerning him and his work .Who farms dirt , genius ? Does it grow ? So you don't like something about the way this is presented , and you resent the Talmud Jmmanuel . If Isreal was such a holy miracle of a place then why are they so aggressive and committed to revenge? I am talking about their government , not the American Jewish people , not the Israeli innocents that are trying to go to work everyday in Tel Aviv , not the children who are trying to go to school . I'm not going to recommend that you read this material further , because you show very little potential for understanding , or none at all. Others who find some basis in your comments however should read on . If it were not for true insight , Billy Meier as well as the Plejaren would not go through the incredible inconvenient unpleasant effort of their task . This letter after all was not for you , but for others , since you show a will to detract . So have try to show some respect , Paul and don't come back here with such imprudent GARBAGE. Mark Campbell | ||
Junior Member Post Number: 105 Registered: 12-2004 |
Dear Paul, Incase you are still on the forum, do you really think you are the first one to make such claims or assumptions, this kind of proves that you didn’t read enough as all these points have been discussed in one form or another, even by Billy himself. It is quite obvious that you got here with a preconceived idea about how something “should be” rather then just being open to what is being reveled. That’s why you are making such baseless assumptions, that why is it a farmer why wouldn’t it be some one important or known. And when you say the prophet Mohammed is a pedophile or a rapist, do you happen to have any evidence to your claims!! And for your information Billy and the Plejarens didn’t only target what you claim “Jews or Israelis” they warned us about many people and many faiths. Why? because they are a danger to any future peace on earth. I totally agree with somebody being skeptic, and hope that you will be sticking around to discuss your assumptions, so maybe you might learn the truth behind your claims. Or you can do it like others just write a few baseless thoughts and disappear. Regards, Peace to all, and one Love Junior | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 164 Registered: 07-2004 |
Hi Paul, While I won't be able to answer your total post, I can offer a little of my perspective that you may be able to use for your research. When you highlight the issue of the Jews/Israel always being referenced as the trouble makers, and then you state, ' why not also mention other groups as well ', and arbitrarily mention Egyptians or Babylonians as examples, is weak at best. Israel, as a country, has a very recently drawn border and didn't exist in that form in the past. The nomadic reality that was a major element of the Hebrew's(understood to mean Ôone from the other side (of the river)/Jews, describes an important missing facet in what your posting and what I, myself, see as a critical, and repeatedly omitted, piece of info in this type of discussion. The races of the ancient historical Tribes of Israel were made of the same elements that are also found in Palestinians, and many of the different people that populate that part of the world. The border of a country(present or historical) that we use to call someone a Jordanian or a Babylonian, are frameworks of differing ways of living, agreed upon by the simple choice of the citizens to live where they live. A line drawn between two farms is a poor tool when used to describe the two separate dwellers in these farms. Yet the nomadic trait that has been a part of the historical Israeli tribes, denotes a gypsy-like lifestyle that I see as exposing them as the troublemakers. The roaming through other homelands, whether being pursued or not, allows for opportunities and dealings for the travelers that don't carry the same consequences if shortcomings, or eventual discovery of a worthless transaction becomes evident. Local business folks are less prone to dirtying up their own regular sources in dealings. That nomadic/transient label was a previous, and still even today, inferred trait that I see as what adds to the problem of Jewish people being described as "troublemakers" in a general term. Another is the posture that Israel holds. In the middle of the holy land, armed with the best and deadliest technology available, yet often being run by spiritually empty ruling parties, they repeat the same mistakes as the Pharisee's(separated ones) in the time of Jmmanuel. Israel's image is an unbalanced, heavy handed, land grabbing, untrustworthy neighbor. Your quote... "There is no talk of Mohammad being a pedophile, rapist and plunderer that he was just a free pass and attack the Jews." If this type of statement is representative of your thinking or believed knowledge, you'll need to offer links to reputable sites to back them up. The Talmud Jmmanuel thing and documents...search and read the postings in the archives like you've been asked to. And to describe this book with,"spewing of this vile information", tells me you are not really here for any true beneficial research. This along with the rest of your post and I can smell an over kindled design for fire starting and inciting others. Hopefully your only being zealous in your researching. I'll wait and see what kind of smoke gets going Paul before I use anymore of my time on your post. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 165 Registered: 07-2004 |
Mark....I appreciate your clear expression, and fully agree. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Markc Member Post Number: 372 Registered: 06-2000 |
Hi Shawn ; We are choosing to clarify a sensitive subject , and in all such indirect communiques , some people choose to read only part of the post . I hope everyone who reads this thread understands that in seeing things as they really are , it will appear as if some prejudice exists , when in reality , these statements have been brought to attention so that all may have the chance to correct their course , attitudes , posture and actions . Billy's hard work is to educate and warn all people of earth , including the Israelis . Any leader or nation worthy of the title should give an ear to criticism , or else fall prey to their own blindness ignorance and egoism . With the incredibly applicable alignment with ancient prophecies in plain view these days , you would think that an inner movement within said countries would exist to self-check themselves against complete injustice on their own part . Thanks , Mark Mark Campbell | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 656 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi Paul.... I noticed that you have not truly 'Studied' Billy Meier's Materials and his ET 'Face To Face...Contacts'. I think you are truly....'Pre-Judging' Billy without...truly knowing the man. Your outlets are very premature, if I may say so? I have studied Billy's Materials from the Mid-70ties and up till today, and man...IT GETS MORE INTERESTING....BY THE DAY... So, as you can notice: I Speak From Experience. Would a man that has been assaulted by assassins more than half a dozen times.. being lying!?? OF COURSE NOT!!! An average individual...would have already stopped at the first couple of shots...fired upon him! The above mentioned goes to show...How 'Driven' Billy is to the/a cause to help all mankind, no matter even...if his life is in jeopardy! Think about that! I am not here to convert you, or to serve under your nose...the Billy Meier Experience, but please do....some 'Thorough' Study and Research of your own..and with an 'Open Mind'. Billy NEVER attacks/criticizes one group of people(s): but all peoples and their country Leaderships, all over the globe! Do not see the Light....is such a Dim manner, if you please?? Give your Spirit-form the opportunity...to Thoroughly 'Explorer'...ALL THE FACTS OF TRUTH...Billy and the Plejarans...have to offer you? Do not let the slightest...'Misunderstanding' of any interpretation..done by your own reading...delude you. Concerning Mohammed: Well, as I have seen on television and read in many books, Mohammed is ALWAYS made out to be some kind of crook...WHICH HE IS NOT AND HAS NEVER BEEN! He was a TRUE PROPHET...out to fulfill his Destiny, and to Assist MAN..in any way or manner he could. And Deliver us human beings from the 'Distorted' Religious LIES...generated by the so-called/wannabee..Jewish/ Catholic/Christian priests, and what ever they would like to call themselves. THANKS to Mohammed, WE ARE STILL ALIVE...AND KICKING! If Mohammed were not sent..to Earth humanity....WE all would have 'Perished' over some 500 years ago! By the Fanatic Fundamentalist False Religions: Joden-dom, Katholieken-dom...and last but not least: Christen-dom. And yes, even they would Battle against one and other...just to Dominate man on Earth, and would eventually...direct themselves to their own 'Abyss' of Destruction! Take note: that even many centuries back... THEY...DID...Battle against each other! One saying...their Religion...is better...than there others! So, the Option....was to generate an Highly Advanced and Intelligent Spirit-form, to Reincarnate on Earth...to 'Curve' the 'Insane' Religious Fundamental MADNESS of the: Joden-dom, Katholieken-dom...and Christen-dom. Joden-dom, Katholieken-dom...and Christen-dom. In the country I live in... 'dom' is 'DUMB'! I will let you solve that yourself!? We are truly NOT picking on the Israelis, but the Leadership(if One can call it that!). Take in account that some thousands of shells were bombarded on Libanon; and each with it's hundreds of miniature 'Cluster Bombs'! And when Cluster Bombs are against War-time rules...when utilizing in populated civilian areas! The Israeli Forces should know better! Of course, when the war is over the civilians will eventually return back to their homes. But what are they confronted with...when they get home? YES.....''THE CLUSTER BOMBS'! I would Truly agree...with what the Plajarans mentioned: The Israelis are executing WAR...LIKE: BANDITS! THEY JUST DO WHAT THEY PLEASE!!! And their high rank officers...DO NOT GIVE A HOOT! Paul, please to not think I am picking on you; I just want to Open Your EYES...to the Facts with what we are dealing with today. Thus, please.. Upgrade your Studying...concerning Billy Meier....and All events in the world. Just to note: "WE ARE ALL...INNOCENT"...when it comes down to the point!! Do not let your 'Ignorance or Un-knowingness' dominate your Consciousness! Do not limit your Insight possibilities to a minimum! You have the Whole of CREATION to Explore...and to Gain Knowledge and Understanding. And whom is to stop you? NO ONE, only YOURSELF! So, keep these words in mind...if you will. Pleasant Studying...and may Creational Knowledge be with you one day... Edward. (PS: Moderator..Sorry for this long one... ...) | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 168 Registered: 07-2004 |
Hi Mark, It is hard to fathom that a country that finds itself surrounded by it's 'enemy', isn't using every means available to make peace with them. It seems since Israelis inception, the ones in power have always had their steady conflicts as an excuse to arm and maintain an army that holds the ability to destroy the whole region. The Mossad has their motto as "War by way of deception", and have been clearly caught in several operations where they pose as the enemy, create incidences of conflict and then claim these acts are more reasons they can maintain their military's intrusive actions against their neighbors as they see fit. The government of Israel is not involved in healing anything. They want the region to remain as a ulcerous lesion that can be irritated and weakened at their whim. While some attempts have been made to open peace doors, elements that won't allow that are always ready to incite more hate reminders and defeat the will for peace. The majority of the Jewish community are vocal in the belief in peace with their neighbors, but it only takes another violent reminder to keep the movement off balance with an emotional response to the fear feeding. Power, madness and domination are the ideals of the criminals that rule over that region, and they exist in all of the groups where religion became the foundation for their actions. a friend in america Shawn | ||
Junior Member Post Number: 106 Registered: 12-2004 |
Dear All, It is a shame that yet again another person would write something in the “Skeptic's Corner” and not even staying long enough to discuss things!! From Pauls old messages he seemed to be alright, but his last post is very different in tone then the previous eleven posts. “strange” Just a thought… For any one that was wondering what Billy and FIGU’s position on the topics of Jews see English Bulletin No. 2. I was waiting that some one might mention or find it but I guess it might be of help for some. Regards, Peace to all, and one Love Junior | ||
Markc Member Post Number: 373 Registered: 06-2000 |
Thanks Shawn and Edward ; The Jewish people that I've known are really likeable people . As individuals families and communities , I've enjoyed their friendship and working situations . It's just that governments on this planet are so backward , like so many disjointed companies who have to answer to a new concept every four to eight years ( in the USA). In the next few years we can only hope by trying to express what we know in terms of non-sectarian truth ,which is only based on respect , real consideration . All these officials always seem to degenerate into children fighting over toys or at best , high school level football teams . No disrespect to children or football teams , just to be clear . Edward ; As always your posts are right on the spot , worth reading twice . Cheers , Mark Mark Campbell | ||
Edward Member Post Number: 660 Registered: 05-2002 |
Hi Mark.... 'Dank je voor de bosje bloemen'... (Thank you for the bouquet of flowers) I enjoy your posts aswell! Edward. | ||
Jplagasse Member Post Number: 340 Registered: 09-2000 |
Hi Kiril, I would be very interested in seeing what you found in the WC pictures, as mentioned in your post on August 19, 2006 - 05:19 am. Perhaps contact me by email (if you wish): jpl@jparchives.com Regards, JP | ||
Future_cats New member Post Number: 3 Registered: 09-2006 |
Much of what the topics the Meier Contacts consist of include some of the most obvious things and then other parts don’t, to me. Whether Billy and the Plejarens say so or not, most conscience and open-minded people living plugged into 21st century technology on planet Earth, see a human overpopulation problem, the ills of being locked into beliefs instead of seeking knowledge, or the fact that higher technology exists beyond the neat toys they have today. One thing the skeptics say about the Plejarens to question reality, why don’t they reveal themselves publicly to the planet Earth. I’m sure a lot of people frequenting this forum would really, really love to see a beamship or something to contribute to their understanding of all of this. How many participants at this here forum would go mad if he saw an ET flying disc? Anybody go mad if he sees a terrestrial? NONE, right? We would go ‘mad’ all right! We would achieve a state beyond our ability to see the future…we would have seen or photographed a BEAMSHIP! I was surprised to hear in the 2006 UFO Congress DVD “The Meier Case Update,” about the recent incident where Ptaah shows his ship to three men living in Switzerland who questioned Billy’s contacts, not to mention highly religious men (i.e. not open-mindedness, thinking in superstition). Two of the men are brothers in which one of them had gone mad and attempted suicide twice. According to Mr. Frehner description in the film, Ptaah had to wipe the memory of the man so that he could stabilize his living. And once again the Plejarens serve up this example why they can’t make contact with Earth humans; out of this ‘mistake’ we get… “see what happens when we contact Earth People” as an example of further non-interference. I understand Billy does not read this forum; however there is a questions to Billy answered section. But do the Plejarens read this forum? If they do… I would say to them, “hey Ptaah if you are going to land for the earth people, why don’t you show your SHI* over a “Star Trek” convention audience -- a much larger control group living in a larger open-mindedness flux -- I would say that the likely hood of survivors would be almost 9999.9999% And we are talking sometimes thousands of people!!! Then let’s see what happens when people go mad for the Pleiadians! Anthony J. Alagna | ||
Kiril Member Post Number: 110 Registered: 12-2005 |
Hello Jplagasse, I will post them in this forum, with some comments, over the coming weekend - Atm my time is overstretched with work related responsiblities. Cheers, Kiril | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 1018 Registered: 02-2000 |
Anthony, I agree they use a fanatic as an example. The truth hurts isn't that what they say all the time. Let them freak out I say. From what I understand they do keep an eye on the forum. My Website | ||
Michael Member Post Number: 537 Registered: 10-2000 |
Newinitiation, Just noticed all the nonsense that's being hurled at you over at that Black Vault forum. For what it's worth, this statement is a lie, "...On the second show, my co-host David Biedny, a noted expert in digital media, gave Horn an analysis of one of the Meier photos. The analysis...demonstrated that the picture was made via a composite, by superimposing two negatives in an enlarger." The picture in question, of one of the energy craft, was an admitted IN CAMERA multiple exposure. In fact, while Biedney claimed it was a double exposure, a friend of mine with far more experience pointed out that it's a triple exposure and that it was extremely unlikely that it was deliberate or done out of camera. FACT: Meier NEVER possessed an enlarger. By stating that he did and that he superimposed negatives, Biedney and Steinberg lower themselves to plain old idiot status, though they didn't have far to go in the first place. We know that Meier didn't possess the equipment (or the manipulative skills) from interviews with the photo shop owners who not only sold him the only equipment he used (cameras, tripods and films) but also processed every photo and film that Meier took - and who attested to Meier's not having faked or manipulated ANY of them. There also was NO wire in the photo. And my friend (with 50 years experience in filmmaking) also said that it would be up to Biedney to DUPLICATE the photo to prove his theory, something which Biedney refuses to even attempt. Also, for the knuckleheads who are still arguing about the WCUFO photos (and video) you can point them towards this page: tjresearch.info/Wedcake.htm where James Deardorff has two diagrams (plus photos and a detailed explanation) that they will have to be able to credibly dispute. Further, there is also a debunking of the "garbage can theory" on that page. These poor idiots don't know that a professional model was also made of one of the beamnships for photographing and testing and that it sits today in plain view in Meier's study! All they are doing is parroting nonsense that they can't substantiate. My hat is off to you for even attempting to penetrate into the dense, dark minds of these fools. Michael Horn | ||
Alan Member Post Number: 61 Registered: 06-2006 |
Norm "From what I understand they do keep an eye on the forum." I too wondered if the Plejarens might read this forum from time to time, perhaps just to see how we are going or something. Norm, can I ask how you came to the conclusion in your understanding that they do keep an eye on this forum? | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 1020 Registered: 02-2000 |
Sorry Alan I don't have a link. It may have been on http://www.gaiaguys.net/meier.htm My Website | ||
Future_cats Member Post Number: 6 Registered: 09-2006 |
Hi Norm, Nice to hear from you. I hope you don't mean that the closed-mind or religious should "freak" out seeing a saucer. All I was saying above is that the Plejar made a mistake flashing his ship to an unstable and closed-minded person. But Ptaah should not make another mistake by thinking that at least some earthlings are more than capable to see a ship, and probably even learn to fly it! Anthony J. Alagna | ||
Future_cats Member Post Number: 8 Registered: 09-2006 |
Dear Michael, I hafta admit that following your internet 'cat' fights around the UFO sites is most fun. However, when you look at it from the skeptics side you are fighting to show them the truth when all they want to do is challenge you no matter what. In other words, going nowhere. Usually at this point it gets ugly (however most entertaining not only with your arguments but also your clever writing skills.) Don't get me wrong, or anything. I'm a fan and I just love your DVDs and website; and hope that someday we can all buy a new Billy Meier film with interviews and new beamship footage or whatever else might be cool to see. But I'm not holding my breath.... But really, why are you even trying "...to penetrate into the dense, dark minds of these fools?" First of all, being foolish is relative and a point of view. And secondly, the truth is the Truth. People will eventually figure it out over the long-run (many lifetimes). And the some that don't just yet see the value for their own good, why make it your problem to help (read: force) the light if they are fighting it? Intro to Spiritual teachings on Figu site, Semjase says there in line 136, there is "...proof then that ignorance is nothing that cannot be changed for all times." So all people eventually get it if it is true; so just wait for a time when these same are more receptive, and have gained enough wisdom to see their former selves as foolish. If they want to evolve (and really survive among the competition) they will grow! I think most people view spirituality as something that just benefits you spiritually. But finding mistakes and correcting them in your life, a big point that Figu talks about in their spiritual teachings, also makes one a more physically productive human being; and the more one works at finding the truth and applying it spiritually, makes sense the more one gains control over the material world. In my mind, taking personal responsibility for one's life, a another figu idea, is enough to make one materially rich. Many business success books talk about "personal power." Even Semjase further states on this same page on line 149, "The more clear his spiritual intelligence becomes through it (Ed: looking for the truth, ongoing attempts at recognizing and understanding the Universe), the more his personality gains power, and the more blessed will be his life. I this enough motivation or what? Anthony J. Alagna | ||
Michael Member Post Number: 538 Registered: 10-2000 |
Hi Future_cats/Anthony, Sincere thanks for all of your perceptive thoughts and I also hope to one day have that new Meier film. As for my little love letter over there, well, it's Saturday night, I'm still unpacking from moving and I thought I needed something to pep me up a little. I saw that newinitiation was waging an ongoing battle with folks that, for some bizarre reasons, thought that we were the same person. Actually, I hadn't visited that site for a number of months but I have to admit I did find it irresistible to counter some of the lies being told there. Of course it's probably to no avail, which is why I'd stayed away so long. However, I do think that it's okay to try and set the record straight every now and then, in the event that other, more objective, people read the info at the site. So I didn't consider that forcing the scoundrels there to see the truth, more like putting them on notice about what it is. Certainly most of the progress comes from work in other, more important, areas. But since newinitiation is the one who's chosen to do battle over there, I at least wanted to give him some ammunition. While I agree that things and people, in essence, blossom in their own time, I think that an occasional application of fertilizer also can be beneficial to growth. In addition to knowing that we all make mistakes, sometimes I really want to enjoy the ones I make. I guess this was just one of those cases! Michael Horn | ||
Vestri Member Post Number: 53 Registered: 02-2006 |
Michael "I saw that newinitiation was waging an ongoing battle with folks that, for some bizarre reasons, thought that we were the same person." Hi Michael, at Above Top Secret forum, the same thing happened to me as had happened to Newinitiation. I was talking about the validity of the meier case and I was accused of being you. -------------------------------------------------- quote: Originally posted by Vestri In light of all the material proof supporting the Billy Meier UFO contact case, I believe without a question of a doubt that the Billy Meier UFO contact case is definetly %100 legit. I think that anyone who doubts the validity of the Meier case, only does because they simply haven't yet researched the case enough is why. Just my two cents. quote: Originally posted by hoeon hi michael, did you finally find out how to use proxys to create multiple membernames? to the mods:please close this hoax-promoting thread, thx. quote: Originally posted by Vestri What makes you think that I am Michael Horn?? You only need to go and have a look at FIGU forum to see that I (vestri) have had a few discussion with Michael there! Somehow I don't think Michael has any sort of mental problems which would cause him to get off on talking to himself under two identities names on a forum! I can't be Michael you dipstick! quote: Originally posted by hoeon No thank you i wasted too much time already to discuss with deluded people like you. But once again i would like to ask the mods to close this thread because we all know that the old swissman is a hoaxer, dont we? http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread158184/pg6 | ||
Future_cats Member Post Number: 9 Registered: 09-2006 |
MH: "While I agree that things and people, in essence, blossom in their own time, I think that an occasional application of fertilizer also can be beneficial to growth." Dude, do it for 'plants' that are wilting and showing signs of life, not the temporarily 'dead.' MH: "In addition to knowing that we all make mistakes, sometimes I really want to enjoy the ones I make." Very cool.... Anthony J. Alagna | ||
Michael Member Post Number: 539 Registered: 10-2000 |
Vestri, It seems like they're all suffereing from a real-life version of the fictious book title, "I'm Schizophrenic and So Am I". I didn't know there were so many of me out there, though I don't dispute being a bit out there myself. Anthony, I do see the wisdom in the "let the dead bury the dead" approach. Kind of reminds of a joke that went something like: A guy calls 911 and says: Help, I think my friend just shot himself to death accidentally! What do I do?" Operator: First, make sure that he's actually dead... The guy puts the phone down, silence, then a gunshot. He comes back to the phone: Okay, now what do I do? As I said, it went something like that. Michael Horn | ||
Kiril Member Post Number: 111 Registered: 12-2005 |
Hello Jplagasse, Here are the pictures as per your request. Some interesting features to note: 1 - There are wire-like features around the discs on all 3 images. 2 - The most obvious, vertical-parrallel-lines appearing across all three photos. Not so obvious however is the fact that when the edges of the images are lined up(as I have done in the below images) these lines are co-linnear across all three images. 2.1 - Speaking of the vertical lines further, it may be observed in images 'B' and 'C', at the left/right-most of the disc, that the said lines appear infront(lie on-top). In other tests I've performed, and especially visible in image 'B', the lines become more prominent over the entire image. I can't say for certain that this is the case for images 'A' and 'C' because they did not show this property(or at least to the same extent). 3 - Some cloud-like features which seem to have definit shapes - not stars or star systems. The image below shows a composition of three enhanced images of a disc-like-object - originally photographed by BEAM. -------  ------- | ||
Kingman Member Post Number: 180 Registered: 07-2004 |
Maybe it's also an aspect of the, 'Use it or lose it' design. Gotta keep those claws sharp you know Future_cats. lol! a friend in america Shawn | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 276 Registered: 07-2005 |
Dear Michael. Sorry Michael, I missed your posts here, just checked your recent post 537. It's the same old rut Michael but hopefully there are saner minds amongst that dark valley full of children. btw do you have any plans on coming down under to Australia for any conventions? I missed going to Brisbane. If not, hopefully not in the too distant future. Cheers Michael regards Matt | ||
Savio Senior Member Post Number: 558 Registered: 07-2000 |
Hi Kiril Your copy of photo is highly distorted. I boost up both contrast and brightness on my copy, it is all clear without any vertical lines at all. I think you can obtain better quality ones from Wendelle Stevens, he got those photos directly from Billy Meier back in the 70's. Regards Savio | ||
Savio Senior Member Post Number: 558 Registered: 07-2000 |
Hi Kiril This is my photo enhancement for your interest:  Contrast +50% and Brightness +100. | ||
Kiril Member Post Number: 111 Registered: 12-2005 |
Greetings Savio! Thanks for taking the time to post your results. I enhanced your image using the same method I used on the images in my original post(Check below). I discovered absolutely none of the artifacts I found originally! Furthermore its seems to me that the images were deliberately altered - I'm referring here to the wire-like features (around the disc!). I have found that there exists some new interesting features in this new image - mainly the diagonal lines: 1 just below the top of the disc and moving across the entire photo and two below it, this time incomplete(segmented). I find them interesting because they're characteristic of the film-superimposition technique mentioned by Beidny. With the goal of trying to understand what they are, would it be possible if you sent the un-edited,uncompressed(image compression) version of the above image to me?(my email:k_man_mango@hotmail.com) I have the feeling that what we are seeing in those lines is the outline of a roof - can anyone confirm the vantage point from which this image was taken? Note: A brief explanation of the image enhancement method I employ: - Take into photoshop and increase the size of the image, this is done with a specialised photoshop plugin - so as to make the process non-destructive to the image. - Since the images were shot in the dark I used another specialised photoshop plugin to naturally remove shadows and darkened areas. - Here I usually apply contrast and levels curves, in photoshop - I export the image as a .tif so as not to loose any detail to image compression. - The image is imported into a specialised image analysis program called Lucis Pro. It uses an algorithm to re-focus, enhance very fine details and remove-further darkened areas in the image. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Regards, Kiril | ||
Savio Senior Member Post Number: 559 Registered: 07-2000 |
Hi Kiril Thanks for sharing your image enhancement method Yes, I am aware of those horizontal lines as well. Yet, please understand that un-edited, uncompressed photos are very rare if not impossible to locate. The best possible way is to pay a visit to Billy and/or Wendelle Stevens. My copy of photos are from Wendelle Stevens' mini photo CDs, It seems he scanned the photos directly from his photo album!! And, those horizontal lines are scratches that is commonly found among these polyester photo albums. I can locate these kind of lines among other set of photos as well. Please take a look at the photo below, and you will understand the story This is part of an original photo from the mini photo CD (30% compressed to save server space)  . | ||
Michael Member Post Number: 540 Registered: 10-2000 |
Hi Newinitiation, Unfortunately that forum is filled with people who simply have a mad dog attack way of behaving. It can't be called thinking or even a mindset, since there is no mind present. If you look at their criticism, for instance, of the WCUFO next to the tall tree, they focus on what they want to call a "handle" from some presumed garbage can lid - rather than the established facts of the actual tree height, whcih completely rule out any such nonsense. I used to think that there might be some point in hanging in with these kinds of people but Anthony is right, it's simply a waste of time. When someone there claims to have spent 30 years "researching", one has to wonder just what he even means by that! Perhaps the good news is that such idiocy is attracted to, and somewhat contained, in those forums. And I think that one can sense quite a bit of anger, frustration and a profound lack of inspiration, joy, life and love in the interactions of the people there. I would now just say, save yourself the energy and time, don't cast your pearls before the unworthy (the other word would have rhymed). Let their blindness and rage consume itself...but not at your expense. Michael Horn | ||
Newinitiation Member Post Number: 277 Registered: 07-2005 |
G'day Michael You are absolutely right Michael, you get to a certain point where the dirty broth becomes too big to contain with a lid and these festering bacteria like people just keep firmenting their lies and confusion the more you feed them with the truth. You've got know when to leave the wrong playing field and when to quit worthless causes, but then again, there are too many such forums with the same festering infections. It looks like vestri has taken up where I had left off. Maybe he just needs to hone his verbal skills which we all need to do from time to time, seeing so much irrationality out there. There is absolutely no cure for it other than self recognition. btw Michael, did you happen to read my post #276 back above this thread. Anyway at least we have our lair here to come back to for much needed respite. Thanks as always, I am always learning, it helps to have such likeminded people as yourself around and hence TJ chapter 32:31 As for those lemons TJ 26:21 Cheers Matt | ||
Kiril Member Post Number: 113 Registered: 12-2005 |
Hello Savio, I've tested the picture again - there have emerged no new findings, which goes to suggest that these lines are not the edges of a roof. "I can locate these kind of lines among other set of photos as well." Yes indeed, very interesting point - if we refer back to the image analyzed by Beidney, it may be the case that what he found(and I wasn't able to reproduce) were these marks from the album. Then again, if as you say, you've noticed these lines on other scanned photos there are two possibilities(unless you've actually compared two instances of a single photo - one being the original and the other a scan): 1 - They are marks from the album OR 2 - Multiple examples of superimposition of film(or some other related method).......done by Billy or the MIB or 'Giza Intelligence'..(or better still, the......)? And with that I hope our exchange will come to a close, on this topic. I also hope that the above illustrates why my major interest in the Meier case is philosophical in nature - unfortunately I am a 'sucker' for any type of detective work and I've managed to involve me self against my better judgement. All the best Savio, Kiril Note to Mr.Horn : If you don't mind me suggesting, I think a focus towards the proper validation of philosophical ideas(which requires no special instrument other then reason) rather then photo and prophetic evidence, is a more effective way to move forward with project No.1 - "Make Aware". This suggestion is based on the respective ideas' utility to mans life qua life. | ||
Kiril Member Post Number: 114 Registered: 12-2005 |
One slight addition which I think deserves its own post. It relates to the above images and their toy-like qualities: http://www.metropolismag.com/cda/story.php?artid=1760 Yes these are all real photographs(referring to the above link)! Kiril | ||
Vestri Member Post Number: 54 Registered: 02-2006 |
Newinitiation - "It looks like vestri has taken up where I had left off. Maybe he just needs to hone his verbal skills which we all need to do from time to time, seeing so much irrationality out there." After reading the 8 stupid replies I got back after posting my post there, I too agree with you that its a lost cause and won't be posting anything there again. If michael and yourself couldn't talk some sense into them, I doubt I ever could because my verbal skills are not that good. | ||
Tjames Member Post Number: 219 Registered: 12-2004 |
Yes, that is a very good point Kiril. How real objects can look fake due to "fuzziness" or "lighting" in fact are real solid objects properly proportioned to its surroundings. Salome gam nan been urrda gan njjber hasala hesporona! | ||
Future_cats Member Post Number: 13 Registered: 09-2006 |
Hello Dyson, To try and be balanced I would first like to say that I am very thankful for all your Figu translations. I certainly like to follow your Meier section on your GG website. From what I read here and there, you are definitely a very sharp fellow with many talents; I certainly hope that you and your family continue to focus much of your efforts to Figu translations. But what’s up with your beating up Randy Winters? It’s ironic that you should mention the moderator’s process at the Figu forum as “…coping admirably with a task that would try the wisdom of Solomon and the patience of Job.” So the forum is a mess, right? Sure there is still a lot of religion on this board (people making mistakes here and there) along with the truth we have learned from Billy Meier and the Federation. So shut the figu forum down too then if you want to be so strict with the Randy example! To call Winter’s participation in the Meier case “criminal” is like calling all of us here, including your self, the same thing! I would be so bold (and more than happy to debate here) to suggest that Randy Winters Meier material has no more of religious impact than your whole GG deal. Mate, you are not perfect ya know. Also, I have read, seen, heard most of Winter’s stuff and I do NOT remember him calling figu a cult. Please show me the money. As far as I understand it, Randy has dropped out of the whole UFO scene and is not trying to be a ufologist or Billy Meier expert. He has been defeated. Please stop kicking him and give him a chance to get up and fix his mistakes! Anthony J. Alagna | ||
Gaiaguysnet Member Post Number: 306 Registered: 03-2004 |
Hi Future-cats, Please follow the links provided on our Meier page to our Randy Winters exposé, where I spent several hours transcribing his calumny for you and those like you, evidently because nobody else could be bothered. Seek and you shall find. I won't chew your food for you. Have you read all of BEAM's openly published (German language) material? If not, then how can you claim to know it? Now please tell everybody exactly which religion you apparently believe I am pushing, but don't expect me to dignify your gross ignorance with a reply. YOU may be "more than happy to debate here", but not ME, Mr. Pseudonym. You waste my time ... and the future does not look good for cats either, if you read the data. Peace in wisdom, Dyson | ||
Norm Member Post Number: 1022 Registered: 02-2000 |
GG, In the 80's I & others still here had nothing to go on but the TJ and Winters/Stevens stuff & it didn't hurt me. All I said was that I thought it was ok for beginners. & I think that was in response to a question about it being better than nothing at all. My Website | ||
Future_cats Member Post Number: 14 Registered: 09-2006 |
"Have you read all of BEAM's openly published (German language) material? If not, then how can you claim to know it?" Dude, relax I don't know anything. I'm sorry I wasted your time. Anthony J. Alagna | ||
Future_cats Member Post Number: 15 Registered: 09-2006 |
Dyson said: “Now please tell everybody exactly which religion you apparently believe I am pushing, but don't expect me to dignify your gross ignorance with a reply.” An Interview – Spiritual Teachings from Figu site: “Humans who are deprived of knowledge fall prey to religions and sects and are turned into meek puppies (Ed: as opposed to cool cats) as they lose their freedom of thought (Ed: become dependent on one source or one language)…This predicament leads to an intolerance toward other people, the others' lifestyle and modes of thinking, and the hoodwinked believers become bogged down in a rut of doctrines (Ed: for example that knowledge, wisdom, spirituality, etc., can ONLY be accomplished by reading ALL of Billy Meier’s books) and can only see "red" when their own doctrines are critically evaluated by people…with different opinions.” Anthony J. Alagna | ||
Alan Member Post Number: 64 Registered: 06-2006 |
Future_cats "Randy has dropped out of the whole UFO scene and is not trying to be a ufologist or Billy Meier expert. He has been defeated. Please stop kicking him and give him a chance to get up and fix his mistakes!" If Randy Winters has dropped out of the whole UFO scene and is not trying to be a ufologist or a Billy Meier expert, as you say, then what is this - Randolf Winters last UFO/Meier Video - "UFO Video about Flying Saucers from Billy Meier: UFOs, Reincarnation, Astral Travel, Levitation..." 1 hr 41 min - 22/03/2006 http://video.google.com.au/videoplay?docid=-58090947832434855&q=Pleiadian Hi Alan, You have been misinformed. That video was made in April 1998, I know because I was there, and a friend of mine is the one who filmed it. I shared this video with someone, and since then I have found it all over the internet with different titles etc....I regret ever releasing it  Scott-Moderator I do not know why you are attacking Dyson for his stance on Randy Winters, because there is nothing wrong with Dyson's stance there with him. Have you read the names listed on the Figu critics list? --------------------------------------------------------------------------- An information to the readers: Due to legal reasons we have deleted information about certain persons in this Web-Site section. Nowadays it is not possible anymore, unfortunately, to name the truth in its entirety. When we know that, as an example, a person consciously says an untruth, we are not allowed to say (according to a court's decision): "Person such-and-such is a liar." As a form of assistance for the readers it may be said that we, FIGU and "Billy" Eduard A. Meier, dissociate ourselves from the machinations of and certain claims by the following persons: Randolph Winters http://www.figu.org/us/figu/critics/index.htm ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- There is nothing wrong there with Dyson's stance against Randolf Winters, because it is the correct stance according to Figu, and i think if you want to attack someone for their stance against R.W., that you should be attacking FIGU and not Dyson. There is a good reason why FIGU/Billy put Winters on that list of all people who should not be listened too, and its obvious that you are not aware of it, or else, if you did, I don't think you would have said that (crap) about Dyson's stance against Randolf Winters. also - Future_cats "Mate, you are not perfect ya know." this is bit of insult, because as if Dyson thinks/acts to everyone here that he is perfect and without mistakes, and as if Dyson of all people doesn't know that nobody is perfect. If you read through past forum posts here and also at Dysons website, you will see the many times that Dyson publically corrects himself and addresses any mistakes his made - and if anything, Dyson would usually always be one of the first people here that would address and point out to others any past mistakes they may have made. | ||
Jo_jo Member Post Number: 192 Registered: 04-2003 |
Anthony, Don't feel bad about the insulting response you received from Dyson and his apologists. It's been going on here for quite some time. Scott's one of them himself. Life isn't fair. He who controls the moderators post controls the dialogue. | ||
Future_cats Member Post Number: 16 Registered: 09-2006 |
“There is nothing wrong there with Dyson's stance against Randolf Winters, because it is the correct stance according to Figu…” AA: Yeah I know. I consider Figu a heavy source of information; I especially like the beamship movies. But I only give it consideration. I don’t let figu decide what and how I should think. I weigh this stuff against other sources and come to my own conclusions – hence the stirring of the bees. Frankly I could give a comment deleted what Figu says; I either agree or disagree with Figu. Put me on figu’s critics page! “…and i think if you want to attack someone for their stance against R.W., that you should be attacking FIGU and not Dyson.” AA: It’s strange that you see this as an “attack” against Dyson. I really like the guy and feel hurt that he does not think enough of me to at least enter into a discussion with me. It was not my intention to piss anyone off; I attempted to be neutral. However, I was going for figu all the way. I only hope that I am wrong about all of this; and that I’m a complete idiot. I respect very much everyone on this list including the moderators, figu and Meier. However, don’t expect me to pussyfoot anywhere; I come to this board to learn something. Otherwise the mods can ban me right now. "Mate, you are not perfect ya know." ”this is bit of insult, because as if Dyson thinks/acts to everyone here that he is perfect and without mistakes, and as if Dyson of all people doesn't know that nobody is perfect.” AA: Funny, I thought it was a compliment. I find his reaction to this whole discussion very strange (and highly religious), as all I wanted to do with this space is open up some contrary ideas instead of the usual cheerleading. In other words, I wanted to talk about something different. Anthony J. Alagna | ||
Hector Member Post Number: 114 Registered: 04-2006 |
Hi guys remember this is a UFO/ spiritual teachings forum not a place for personal attacks. Ignorance and lack of responsibility is the enemy, not the lack of written skills or the lack of diplomacy. We should never try to label/classify any forum user into any category like " dyson apologist" or "911 conspirators" and many of us don`t make a hard effort to keep our minds in the neutral/positive/balanced region. In my opinion, Future_Cats should be given some credit as he is a newcomer and still does not master the Billy Meier information and needs some time to do so, like the rest of us in the past. On Winters, I think he admired Billy and Figu`s mission, but he sold his soul to the devil because many people started to ridicule Billy and he had to choose between defending or slandering and defamating him.He chose the easy way, the latter.It seems that he poses no other media threat to Billy than calling him a liar, but other people like Richard Boylan and similar brainwashers are a real danger. Regards and remember, today is peace meditation day.. | ||
Scott Moderator Post Number: 913 Registered: 12-1999 |
This topic area is intended for those who may not feel the Billy Meier contacts are real and/or would like to clarify and resolve related issues. The goal here is to allow a place for critical inquiry regarding the Billy Meier/FIGU material in a respectful, mature and friendly manner. Any posts that are attacking or that attempt to defame another will either be rejected in the message queue or they will be immediately removed. In my opinion, the remaining posts in the queue are a continuation of this same discussion by the same individuals. If I post them, there will be an increase in aggressive responses, which is not the intent of this section. NO ONE is being deemed a favorite, contrary to what some people think. After further thought, this section will be temporarily closed off until things cool off. Scott-Moderator |
